View Full Version : The Essentials & Weight? Input needed.
Planning to be a 2007 hopefully, if not 08, thru hiker "Northbound" of the AT. I have hiked alot before but not much backpacking. My size is 5 foot 10 inches 140lb. I do tend to eat quite a bit more if i'm active.
While a 20-25lb pack would be nice and some of you can do that it doesnt appear to be a possability for my first time ;). I know things change when you're out on the trail where you start to take things out to gain those valuable ounces. So within the next month or two i'd really like to have a good idea of what i will be hauling which i'll take either over to Western Mass or up towards Franconia NH to hike around with to get a feel for 5 days or so.
Right now i'm scraping around 40lb for everything (including whats worn) and am looking to get that down. I am factoring in 2.5lb of food per day for 5 days as well which is already included in that 40lb estimate plus 7lb saved for clothes again already factored in.
What i am pretty much settled on is the following, please scrutinize if needed but please dont do so without alternate suggestion.
Tent: Mountain Hardwear Spire 2; This is a newish model so i'm taking a chance. Looked nice for 3 seasons and the weight seemed acceptable.
5 lb 2 Ounces packed
Sleeping Bag: Marmot Hydrogen (good for 30+; uses 850 Fill)
1 lb 8 Ounces. (Possible to get away from Sping-Fall with this?)
Sleeping Pad: Exped Downmat (700 Fill)
2 lb (my back is sorta sensative to hard surfaces, suggestions especially welcome considering the pads weight)
Stove: MSR DragonFly
16 Ounces
Backpack: Osprey Aether 70 4 lb
12 Ounces
Headlamp: Petzl Myobelt XP LED
10 Ounces
Cookware: Titanium Pot, cup, and utensils.
4 Ounces
Water Filtration: Katadyn Hiker PRO + Polar Pure for backup
11 Ounces
Hiking Poles: Leki Ultralite Carbon SLS
16.6 Ounches
So far thats what i'm pretty much settled on to start for gear and if things get the okay i'll start buying.
Also, boots! Whats the best to get? Would like to break them in on my little practice run if possible.
SGT Rock
06-05-2006, 03:40
Tent: Mountain Hardwear Spire 2; This is a newish model so i'm taking a chance. Looked nice for 3 seasons and the weight seemed acceptable.
5 lb 2 Ounces packed
If you are going solo this is a lot of tent. You could go smaller and save a couple of pounds. Some ideas range from a Sil-nylon tarp (less than a pound) to a Henry Shires Tent (less than 2 pounds) to A MSR Zoid at about 2.5 pounds, to even an Eureka Zeus at less than 3 pounds.
Sleeping Bag: Marmot Hydrogen (good for 30+; uses 850 Fill)
1 lb 8 Ounces. (Possible to get away from Sping-Fall with this?)
Should do you fine. You may need to wear some clothing in the worst of weather.
Sleeping Pad: Exped Downmat (700 Fill)
2 lb (my back is sorta sensative to hard surfaces, suggestions especially welcome considering the pads weight)
There are lots of other pads. I just don't know how much you feel you need based on your back.
Stove: MSR DragonFly
16 Ounces
Overkill. Go with a canister stove like the Coleman Exponent F1 ultralight or an alcohol stove. Save yourself quite a bit of weight and money.
Backpack: Osprey Aether 70 4 lb
12 Ounces
Headlamp: Petzl Myobelt XP LED
10 Ounces
Petzl Zipka Plus 1.9 ounces if you use AAA Lithium batteries.
Cookware: Titanium Pot, cup, and utensils.
4 Ounces
Water Filtration: Katadyn Hiker PRO + Polar Pure for backup
11 Ounces
Just use the polar pure and save a half pound
Hiking Poles: Leki Ultralite Carbon SLS
16.6 Ounches
So far thats what i'm pretty much settled on to start for gear and if things get the okay i'll start buying.
Also, boots! Whats the best to get? Would like to break them in on my little practice run if possible.
You may want to post your entire list here to see what else you can save. It was my experience when cutting down weight there were a lot of redundant gear items and overloaded consumables that could be reduced to get my weight down.
5 lbs of tent is a lot of tent!!!!! that and I also agree that 1lb is too much weight (and money) for a stove
Alligator
06-05-2006, 14:57
I think the weight is off on your cookware. The listed headlamp is overkill. Too expensive, too heavy.
If you're committed to white gas, go with an MSR simmerlite. Cheaper, lighter, and QUIETER than the Dragonfly. Or follow Sgt Rock's advice and go with a canister or alcohol stove.
I have the marmot bag and love it. I sleep pretty cold and I've taken it down to near the 30 deg. mark comfortably with clothing on. Should work for you if you are a normal/warm sleeper.
I second Rock's idea of putting your entire list up here - people will help you cut out a lot of redundant gear.
I am factoring in 2.5lb of food per day for 5 days as well which is already included in that 40lb estimate plus 7lb saved for clothes again already factored in.
That's over 12 lb of food for 5 days...eat hardy befor you leave and plan on dinner when you finish. If you boil 6-8 0z of pasta every night and spice it up with your favorate seasonings you might be able to save a little weight. A 12 oz Jar of peanut butter and some flat bread could last a week for lunch. Excluding water, you may be able to trim a couple of lbs or more. My last few trips have been with less food 1 to 1 1/2 lb a day.
Also, boots! Whats the best to get? Would like to break them in on my little practice run if possible.
Lots of folks are going with running shoes or trail shoes instead boots. Your slight build may be happerer in shoes. Merrell is one of many that are making lighter weight trail shoes.
Good Luck and have fun.
bigcranky
06-05-2006, 15:48
You're getting some good advice. I'll add some minor stuff:
1. Your tent is pretty heavy for a solo shelter. It's possible to get a very protective shelter like the new Tarptent Rainbow or Virga for 30 ounces packed weight.
2. Good sleeping bag. The pad is, as you say, heavy (and not cheap!). You could look at similar pads from Big Agnes -- thick and cushiony. I use a Thermarest Prolite 4, which has enough cush for my old bones.
3. Stove is a little heavy for white gas, you could save some weight on a lighter stove, or save a lot of weight using a completely different fuel (alcohol, canisters, esbit tabs).
4. The Aether 70 is a great pack. It's also fairly large -- and if you have extra room, it's human nature to fill it up. The Aether 60 has been a popular thru-hiking pack for several years. It's lighter, and smaller -- so it saves weight two ways.
5. Headlamp. Petzl Zipka is less than 3 oz. You could easily do a whole thru-hike with a Photon Micro Light, at about 1/2 ounce. Seriously. We're not climbing Everest here.
6. Food. I, too, eat a lot when I am active. However, I tend to eat *less* in the first few days of a long hike. Then, when my appetite kicks in, I eat about 1.5 pounds of food a day. That's mostly dry or dehydrated food, with some treats like fresh cheese and gorp, but it's always plenty. I do look forward to eating well in town, but I'm generally not starving on the trail.
Your test hike is a great idea. Have fun, enjoy it, and try to plan your gear purchases so you can trade something that doesn't work out. (Hint: R.E.I.) Remember that your gear doesn't get you to Katahdin; you have to carry all your gear to Katahdin.
hikerjohnd
06-05-2006, 16:03
I see you have considered water filtration - but have you considered the weight of water you are packing???
Stoves - I love to cook - but the dragonfly really is overkill. The simmerlite (http://mountainsafetyresearch.com/stoves/simmerlite.asp) is a great stove - I took one for 300+ miles in 2005. I have switched to a cannister stove (http://mountainsafetyresearch.com/stoves/pocket_rocket.asp), no priming, instant heat. Very convenient. I just can not make the switch to alcohol - although I carry Sgt Rock's ion stove in my daypack in case I plan a hot snack while out hiking.
And your tent can definitely be smaller. If you are committed to a two man tent, look at Six Moon's Europa (http://sixmoondesigns.com/shop/shopexd.asp?id=40) or Shires Squall (http://www.tarptent.com/squall2.html).
Just some thoughts!
I'd like to caution folks on not eating enough while doing a long distance hike.
Most backpacking food has around 100 calories per ounce. So, for someone only eating 1 1/2 pounds per day, that's roughly 2400 calories. No where near enough for someone doing serious exercise all day long. Thru-hikers typically need around 4000 calories per day. So, on that basis, 2 to 2 1/2 pounds per day is a much better figure to plan on.
If you don't eat enough, then you will not have the energy to continue. I suspect poor nurishment is one of the major reasons why people drop out.
As mentioned above, that tent is major overkill. If you want to try a tarp, look at the suggestions already given. If you're dead set on a tent you can still cut the weight in half and save quite a few bucks by looking at the Tacoma-4-Two from Dancing Light Gear or the Evolution 2P from Big Sky Products.
The Marmot Hydrogen is a highly rated bad, but the 30 degree rating may not be low enough, depending on how you sleep (cold or hot) and when you start.
With a 30 degree bag the down mat is probably also overkill. Big Agnes rates their non-insulated air mattress at 35 and it'll save you 10 ounces.
The Dragonfly may be a good stove, but that 16 ounces doesn't include the fuel bottle. Add 3-5 ounces depending on size. If you really want a liquid fuel stove the MSR Simmerlite is half the weight. And if your cooking doesn't involve anything more elaborate than boiling water you should really give an alcohol stove a try. You can carry a soda can stove and a very small amount of alcohol along on a practice hike in addition to your other stove for very little weight penalty.
The Aether 70 is a LOT bigger (thus heavier) than what is typically used by an AT thru hiker. Can't give you a specific recommendation here as I use an external frame (it's still 16 ounces less than that Osprey), but read around a bit, you'll find plenty of other choices for an internal frame pack.
Personally, I have used a Photon II light for years and never really felt the need for anything more. But my wife uses a head lamp and wouldn't give it up. You should be able to get the weight down on that to a couple ounces.
You probably won't find many people on here recommending the Katadyn filter, but my wife and I use it and like it. Probably your best choice for a filter (look at pumping rates in addition to weight). We're considering the AquaStar UV purifier, saving 3 ounces (including the Nalgene bottle we don't really need but would have to have to protect the UV tube).
Really appriciate everyones responces. Going to definitely look into that Europa tent. Having camped at sites for so many years you just get use to a 2 or 3 person tent with 4 walls so thats naturally what i went looking at.
If it matters at all the Spire 2 does have an Ultralite option like most of the Mountain Hardware tents which actually reduces weight to just over 2lb if i were to use that. Not sure if thats better or worse or comparable to something like the Europa.
For boots looking at Merrell Mesa Ventilator II Mid Hiking Boots. Look like they're about 2lb 3oz (pair) for my size. Problably what i'll go for unless someone knows better. I have great experiances with Merrel in the past. A sturdy pair of sandals (kind with the velcro straps) was going to be my secondary pair.
Pretty sure i'm gonna look into more pads, mostly what was suggested here, as 2lb really seems much too high.
Headlamp replaced.
Either the Simmerlite or Pocket Rocket will be fine as well. I assume white gas would problably be alot cheaper correct?
As far as only Polar Pure, suppose that will be based mainly on taste. Will get some and use it on my test run see if it actually bothers me. I suppose thirst is thirst heh. Taste was the only reason i opted for a filter. I hear AquaMira actually has very little taste so maybe i'll take both that and Polar.
Water amount is another question. I usually drink about 2-3 pints on a 8 hour hike. Adding the weight of the pack though consumption problably goes up a bit since i'll be sweating more plus whats used on a max of 2 meals per day. 6 pints or so between sources make sense?
To be honest i'm still working on a complete list since i'm still planning. What i'd like to leave with on the actual hike is about 30lb or as close to it as possible. I figure the easiest way to do that is to set weight limitations such as 7lb for a functional wardrobe or 10lb for a 5 day supply of food and then buying based off those weights so i dont end up with things i shouldnt have. I hope to have a complete list done by the end of Summer. I like to research quite a bit and have been using the search function quite alot here as well so i dont ask too many questions that have already been beaten to death.
A few months before i take off i'll post exactly what i'm taking for the real deal to see if theres anything that can be cut back but right now i just want to get the bulk of the stuff and get out with it for a feel.
You ought to be able to put your weight well below 20 pounds without sacrificing comfort or security. Check some of the gear lists at SGT. Rocks site or at backpackinglight.com (lots of gear lists there). Otherwise, there are lots of practical suggestions here by folks who have been there and back. You would do well to trust them before Backwhoosit Mag or some outfitter's salespeople.
I generally fine in colder weather, the only thing that has problems is my feet for some reason have their own idea for what temperature they like and can get uncomfortably cold quick which isnt too great. I'll just wear socks.
I generally fine in colder weather, the only thing that has problems is my feet for some reason have their own idea for what temperature they like and can get uncomfortably cold quick which isnt too great. I'll just wear socks.
pertaining to sleeping that is ^
(wheres my edit function!)
Skidsteer
06-05-2006, 20:33
(wheres my edit function!)
Are you a donating member?
One of the perks of donating to WB is an edit button on all of your posts. :)
http://www.whiteblaze.net/index.php?page=atdatabase
LostInSpace
06-05-2006, 22:51
Tent: Mountain Hardwear Spire 2; This is a newish model so i'm taking a chance. Looked nice for 3 seasons and the weight seemed acceptable. 5 lb 2 Ounces packed.
The Mountain Hardwear Skyledge 2 is the same design as the Spire 2, but weighs less, 4 lb 9 oz package weight, because a lot of the canopy is made of mesh instead of being all ripstop. Otherwise, they seem to be identical.
The specs for both models indicate a welded window in the rainfly, which they do not have. Mountain Hardwear said this is a typo and there is no window, but they have not corrected either their Web site or their catalog.
Chetah,
Sgt. Rock is on the mark. Shires' TarpTent Squall2 (room for you and gear) is 28 ounces. An alcohol stove is one ounce. I'm thru-hiking in 2007, recently did three days on the Benton MacKaye Trail, and my weight for everything, except water and food is 19 lbs. And I think I can shave more!
And give serious to dumping the hiking boots. I'm going with Vasque Velocity trekking shoes. No Goretex either.
take-a-knee
06-05-2006, 23:15
If I planned to sleep on the ground, which I don't, I'd use a full length Z-rest with a shorty ultra-light thermarest, so when the thermarest poops the bed, you'll at least have something so sleep on, and the two are lighter than your single pad. If you carry a thermarest, carry the repair kit, you'll probably need it.
SGT Rock
06-06-2006, 03:30
Check out this article to make a packing list: http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/article.php?p=132311&postcount=1
Then take this article and use it to stock the list with what you already have: http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15329
Then post a list of what you plan to carry.
If the tase of iodine water bothers you, get some Vitamen C and add it to the water to nutralize the iodine. Only wait at least 30 minutes before you do this otherwise the iodine can't do its job.
Alligator
06-06-2006, 11:10
...
Water amount is another question. I usually drink about 2-3 pints on a 8 hour hike. Adding the weight of the pack though consumption problably goes up a bit since i'll be sweating more plus whats used on a max of 2 meals per day. 6 pints or so between sources make sense?
...I drink 3 liters for that amount of time, 4+ on a hot day. But if you're sure about that rate, 2 liters would be fine for the day. It would be rare and/or a very dry year to not hit a water source sometime during the day. Usually at least two. Provided your hiking about 12+ miles.
Check out this article to make a packing list: http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/article.php?p=132311&postcount=1
Then take this article and use it to stock the list with what you already have: http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15329
Then post a list of what you plan to carry.
If the tase of iodine water bothers you, get some Vitamen C and add it to the water to nutralize the iodine. Only wait at least 30 minutes before you do this otherwise the iodine can't do its job.
Thank you, and everyone else for their help. Got the list copied and am in the process of replacing things. Will be back at some point with the completed one for review. Thanks again!
If the tase of iodine water bothers you, get some Vitamen C and add it to the water to nutralize the iodine. Only wait at least 30 minutes before you do this otherwise the iodine can't do its job.
i had no idea it took that long to neutralize... i'd just go with the Aqua Mira. it has no taste to me. my brother, on the other hand, says he can taste it...
i've been told that once you start using iodine, you quit tasting it after a couple days, as your body gets used to it... don't know from personal experience if that's the case, but i do know it happens with over-chlorinated water. the stuff we had in somalia burned my throat for the first couple days... you could shake your bottle and get a head of foam on it like a beer. but when i got home, i 'missed' the sweet taste of chlorine...
SGT Rock
06-08-2006, 14:48
No, the Vitamen C starts working right away, it takes the Iodine 30 minutes to do it's job. Same thing with Aqua Mira except before you can use it you have to mix the chemicals and then wait I 5 or 7 minutes as I remember it. Either way, the longer you give your treatment to act, the better job it does. As to getting used to it, I agree. I get use to it fairly fast.
No, the Vitamen C starts working right away, it takes the Iodine 30 minutes to do it's job. Same thing with Aqua Mira except before you can use it you have to mix the chemicals and then wait I 5 or 7 minutes as I remember it. Either way, the longer you give your treatment to act, the better job it does. As to getting used to it, I agree. I get use to it fairly fast.
"duh" ok, now i gots it... been a loooong day... i just need to read a little slower... sorry rock. thanks for the clarification.
Just Jeff
06-08-2006, 23:44
i've been told that once you start using iodine, you quit tasting it after a couple days, as your body gets used to it...
I don't really quit tasting it, I just quit being grossed out by it. The first few canteens are pretty hard to swallow, but after that it's just part of the day.
I can't taste AM until the last few swallows of each bottle. Interestingly, this is the last few bottles in the platy, which drains from the bottom, AND from the bottle, which drains from the top. No idea how that works out.
I've been to some places with pretty gross tap water, too - San Angelo, TX was the worst, but Orlando and Tampa were right up there with the sulfur. The water here in Monterey is pretty heavy, too. At first I only drank bottled water - in San Angelo they actually have filter stands on the side of the road where you bring your own jugs and pay like $.25/gallon. But I got tired of having to plan my water during the day when the fountains were all over, so I just started drinking from the tap. It was pretty bad for about a week, but then I barely gave it a thought.
The best I tasted is probably what dripped right out of the rocks on the Foothills Trail - no treatment or anything - it was sweet and cold.
Alligator
06-09-2006, 10:49
I don't really quit tasting it, I just quit being grossed out by it. The first few canteens are pretty hard to swallow, but after that it's just part of the day.
...I've said this many a time, but I find that the iodine from Polar Pur is not nearly as strong as that from the tablets such as Potable Aqua.