View Full Version : Poison Ivy Prevention
Thumbing thru the lastest (Aug 06) edition of Adventure magazine, there is a small spot on preventives and treatments for poison ivy. As a person who is highly allergic, I find this info very interesting and may have to try them...
Prevention:
IvyBlock - they say they slathered on the stuff and walked thru ivy wearing sandals... NOTHING! "its the only FDA approved barrier on the market." $12 for 4 oz... ouch!
Spray Deodorant - testers only got 1 tiny bump after 24 hours... cheap... but took 1/5 of a can to cover 2 legs completely.
Ive been thru the gammut of treatments, but once its set in, there's really nothing you can do, but ride it out...
Time To Fly 97
07-05-2006, 15:30
I didn't get poison anything through an entire thru-hike...but strangely, now I get it pretty badly every once an awhile. I started using Tecnu and have not once had a reaction to poison ivy using it. So I recommend it and hope it helps you.
http://www.teclabsinc.com/products.cfm?id=1F5604C8-9D05-4675-56129F6D83DF2417
Many old timers say that eating poison ivy/oak early in the year helps your body build a resistance. But just the thought of poison ivy in my throat... 8 |
TTF
If you want to avoid hauling lots of Technu or other store-bought treatments/preventives, learn to recognize jewelweed. It grows almost everywhere you find poison ivy on the AT. Break off some of the pulpy stems and leaves, rub them vigorously between your palms and smear the gelatinous goop anywhere that may have come in contact with the ivy -- or anywhere that might possibly come in contact with it. Rinse it off at the end of the day. The same treatment works if you already have a poison ivy rash - or any other rash except jock itch, for that matter.
Mr. Clean
07-06-2006, 18:19
I'll also tout the good effects of treating poison ivy with jewelweed, also known as spotted touch-me-not. It grows all over the place, mostly in damp, shaded areas. You all have seen it. Do a search on it and learn what it looks like. It also works well on itchy bug bites. Simply crush the leaves and stems of one plant and scratch the cr*p out of the itch.
-- scratch the cr*p out of the itch.---
Don't, please. The chance of infection is too high on a long trail.
What you CAN do safely to bug bites is press them hard with a fingernail, first one way and then another, making an X. This breaks down the barrier layer the skin creates in response to the bite, presses the anticoagulant out, (that's what causes the itch.) and feels as good as scratching. The difference is 1) it gets rid of the itchy bump; 2) It doesn't break the skin inviting infection.
calamine lotion works great
Calamine
Yeah, but it don't grow by the trail. And it doesn't work as well as jewelweed against poison ivy. Rilly.
making a simple paste of baking soda is supposed to work wonders for all sorts of skin rashes/insect bites/etc.
Baking soda. Yep, and if you carry it as a dentifrice you'll have it with you. Warning though, baking soda may irritate some rashes. It dries the skin. Jewelweed won't irritate or dry the skin. But if the weed isn't handy, baking soda works somewhat on poison ivy as long as you have washed all of the residual resin off with soap. Otherwise the drying soda particles can spread the resin to unaffected skin.
I'm highly allergic to poison ivy and have never had problems with it when using jewelweed.
Frolicking Dinosaurs
08-01-2006, 07:57
The male dino is highly allergic to poison ivy (hospital visit allergic). We carry a 2 oz travel bottle of regular dishwashing soap and he washes any portion of skin that might have been exposed from two to several times a day depending on just how bad the poison ivy is on a trail. He hasn't had more than a couple of bumps since he began this practice. In areas with little or no water, he uses alcohol prep pads (those things the doc wipes you with just before giving a shot). Washing with alcohol gel and rinsing with water also works.
Poison ivy is caused by an oil emitted from injured leaves or stems on the ivy. Dissolving the oil with a solvent (like detergent, baking soda paste or alcohol) before the rash starts is the best way I've found to prevent the rash from forming if a barrier was not applied before exposure.
Jewelweed sap smeared on before exposure has kept me poison ivy free for over a decade. We haven't tried it with the male dino because he reacts so violently to poison ivy that we prefer overkill to taking the risk.
Two Speed
08-01-2006, 09:43
Not slamming the jewel weed concept, it’s a great natural remedy, but there is another way. There is a homeopathic remedy called “Rhus Tox,” essentially a poison ivy extract. At the beginning of the season you take one pill a day for one week, then one pill a week after that. It won’t make you completely immune, but will greatly improve resistance to poison ivy and will significantly shorten the healing when you do.
I used to work on a survey party, was immune but got sensitized after getting a little too brave around that crap once too often. Now, unfortunately, I’m tremendously sensitive to poison ivy, poison oak and poison sumac. As I said, Rhus Tox won’t make you immune but it sure improves the situation. Anyway, it made working outdoors in the woods a lot more comfortable for me.
Here in Marietta the local health food store carries homeopathic remedies and you can buy Rhus Tox over the counter. It shouldn’t cost more than $5.00 for a bottle that’ll last you until the greenery dies off in the fall. If you can’t find it at a local store it’s pretty easy to find on the web, along with more detailed information.
Tha Wookie
08-01-2006, 09:49
Not slamming the jewel weed concept, it’s a great natural remedy, but there is another way. There is a homeopathic remedy called “Rhus Tox,” essentially a poison ivy extract. At the beginning of the season you take one pill a day for one week, then one pill a week after that. It won’t make you completely immune, but will greatly improve resistance to poison ivy and will significantly shorten the healing when you do.
I used to work on a survey party, was immune but got sensitized after getting a little too brave around that crap once too often. Now, unfortunately, I’m tremendously sensitive to poison ivy, poison oak and poison sumac. As I said, Rhus Tox won’t make you immune but it sure improves the situation. Anyway, it made working outdoors in the woods a lot more comfortable for me.
Here in Marietta the local health food store carries homeopathic remedies and you can buy Rhus Tox over the counter. It shouldn’t cost more than $5.00 for a bottle that’ll last you until the greenery dies off in the fall. If you can’t find it at a local store it’s pretty easy to find on the web, along with more detailed information.
hmmmm... interesting! I use jewelweed with good success, but this counds like an interesting option as well. Thanks for passing it along bud....
Not slamming the jewel weed concept, it’s a great natural remedy, but there is another way. There is a homeopathic remedy called “Rhus Tox,” essentially a poison ivy extract. At the beginning of the season you take one pill a day for one week, then one pill a week after that. It won’t make you completely immune, but will greatly improve resistance to poison ivy and will significantly shorten the healing when you do.
I used to work on a survey party, was immune but got sensitized after getting a little too brave around that crap once too often. Now, unfortunately, I’m tremendously sensitive to poison ivy, poison oak and poison sumac. As I said, Rhus Tox won’t make you immune but it sure improves the situation. Anyway, it made working outdoors in the woods a lot more comfortable for me.
Here in Marietta the local health food store carries homeopathic remedies and you can buy Rhus Tox over the counter. It shouldn’t cost more than $5.00 for a bottle that’ll last you until the greenery dies off in the fall. If you can’t find it at a local store it’s pretty easy to find on the web, along with more detailed information.I suggest doing a google search for what exactly "homeopathic medicines" are. I also suggest talkign to your doctor about why homepathic treatments fare no better than placebos in any double blind medical test.
A homeopathic remedy is not "essentially a poison ivy extract". It once was, but the process of making it involves dilluting it down until only a few molecules are left and the rest is simply water (or another inactive ingredient). Homeopathy is based off of two main tenets: 1) like cures like (as in poison ivy extract will prevent/cure poison ivy), 2) molecules retain a memory of the subtance they were mixed with.
Basically, homeopathy boils down to bad science and magic. I would suggest replacing the Rhus Tox with sugar water. It is way cheaper and will work just as well.
Homeopathic products are made from minerals, botanical substances, and several other sources. If the original substance is soluble, one part is diluted with either nine or ninety-nine parts of distilled water and/or alcohol and shaken vigorously (succussed); if insoluble, it is finely ground and pulverized in similar proportions with powdered lactose (milk sugar). One part of the diluted medicine is then further diluted, and the process is repeated until the desired concentration is reached. Dilutions of 1 to 10 are designated by the Roman numeral X (1X = 1/10, 3X = 1/1,000, 6X = 1/1,000,000). Similarly, dilutions of 1 to 100 are designated by the Roman numeral C (1C = 1/100, 3C = 1/1,000,000, and so on). Most remedies today range from 6X to 30X, but products of 30C or more are marketed.
A 30X dilution means that the original substance has been diluted 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 times. Assuming that a cubic centimeter of water contains 15 drops, this number is greater than the number of drops of water that would fill a container more than 50 times the size of the Earth. Imagine placing a drop of red dye into such a container so that it disperses evenly. Homeopathy's "law of infinitesimals" is the equivalent of saying that any drop of water subsequently removed from that container will possess an essence of redness. Robert L. Park, Ph.D., a prominent physicist who is executive director of The American Physical Society, has noted that since the least amount of a substance in a solution is one molecule, a 30C solution would have to have at least one molecule of the original substance dissolved in a minimum of 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, 000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 molecules of water. This would require a container more than 30,000,000,000 times the size of the Earth.
source: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/homeo.html
Two Speed
08-01-2006, 11:39
Fella, I don't know how to break it to you, but many homeopathic cures DO work. Homeopathy is looked down upon by the medical establishment in the US but is widely practiced in many foriegn nations.
I'm here to tell you that Rhus Tox does work. Won't make you bullet proof, but will offer substantial help. If you don't want to use it, hey, it's a free country.
blackbishop351
08-01-2006, 11:46
Homeopathy is crap....at best, it's a psychological remedy. At worst, it's dangerous.
And I think I'm immune to poison ivy anyway. I've rolled around in patches of the stuff while playing paintball and every gotten it. Sorry, guys! :D
Footslogger
08-01-2006, 11:48
[quote=Two Speed]Fella, I don't know how to break it to you, but many homeopathic cures DO work.
======================================
...darn tootin !! Reason traditional medicine tends to frown on it is that they do not teach it and do not understand how it works.
No disrespect or offense intended toward any traditional medical professionals here at Whitblaze or anywhere else but there is more to maintaining health than that which is taught in traditional medical circles or regulated by government agencies.
That said, the fact that we don't necessarily understand how these things work means there is always some risk involved in using them. Some work and some don't and when they do work we may not even know why. Then again, there are things that originate in traditional medicine and have been approved for use on humans by the FDA that have caused health issues too.
'Slogger
Tha Wookie
08-01-2006, 11:54
Homeopathy is crap....at best, it's a psychological remedy. At worst, it's dangerous.
And I think I'm immune to poison ivy anyway. I've rolled around in patches of the stuff while playing paintball and every gotten it. Sorry, guys! :D
Your loss.;)
blackbishop351
08-01-2006, 11:56
Your loss.;)
Yeah, yknow....I really feel left out, too? LOL
Two Speed
08-01-2006, 12:00
Personally I believe another reason homeopathy isn't taught in the US is that the homeopathic medicines tend to be cheap; no massive profit margins to be had.
Anyway, this looks like getting contentious and drifting WAY off of methods to treat poison ivy. I suggest that those folks who want to continue discussing poison ivy be allowed to do so here and anyone who wishes to debate the merits of alternate practices of medicine do that on another thread. Any takers?
Fella, I don't know how to break it to you, but many homeopathic cures DO work. Homeopathy is looked down upon by the medical establishment in the US but is widely practiced in many foriegn nations.
I'm here to tell you that Rhus Tox does work. Won't make you bullet proof, but will offer substantial help. If you don't want to use it, hey, it's a free country.
I suggest that since you have so much faith in a medicine that CANNOT and HAS NOT passed any double blind testing, you should contact the James Randi Educational Foundation, and apply for their $1million challenge. I am not sure, but I think that homeopathy fits with their criteria, at least it is discussed a lot on their forums. You do not have to make the cure, you do not even have to know how it works, all you need to do is prove that any homeopathic medicine works by means other than what is actually known by medical science. Don't believe they have the money? You can call the bank and ask, the trust information is available to the public. Don't believe they will give it to you? You sign a legally binding contract, and they have more to lose than $1million if they break that.
I never doubted that Rhus Tox worked, I only said that it works no better than taking a sugar pill (placebo).
Also, I think you would agree that drug companies suck. They overprice their medicines and they tend to screw people over. That being said, there is no big-pharma conspiracy helped by all real medical doctors, trying to discredit homeopathy. Other countries practice voodoo and female genital mutilation too, that doesn't mean that we should.
It is indeed a free country, and you are able to use a non-medically tested cure that doesn't make medical, mathematical, or physical (as in the field of physics) sense, but I simply wanted to warn others of your glowing recommendation. The only good thing about homeopathic medicines is that they tend to be completely useless and therefore cannot cause anything bad to happen. Eschewing professional medical help for homeopathic remedies, on the other hand, could be very dangerous, possibly fatal.
Once again, I implore you, TALK TO YOUR DOCTOR. I assume that you have a personal physician (a REAL MD) that you trust with your health. Have him/her explain why it is that homeopathic medicines do not work better than placebo. I suggest that you also read that link I posted. It explains what homeopathy is (it's probalby a little different than you think), and it explains why it does not work.
If you still believe so highly in homeopathy, where is the research that convinced you? You are welcome to post the names of peer-reviewed journals and papers that helped you come to your conclusion.
Two Speed
08-01-2006, 12:16
And I think I'm immune to poison ivy anyway. I've rolled around in patches of the stuff while playing paintball and every gotten it. Sorry, guys! :DSeeing as we're getting back to poison ivy I'll emphasize that I used to be immune, too. I don't pretent to understand the biochemistry, but I think it's pretty similar to bee stings. A lot of folks start out with either immunity or a normal reaction to the irritating oil or venom but can become sensitized. I don't know if you want to take advice from an older hiker who believes in crap, but if I were you I'd do my best to stay out of the stuff. Usually the first episode after becoming sensitive is a cast iron pain in the butt. My first real episode with poison ivy required a hydrocortisone injection to get it under control, after 25 years of either mild or no reaction at all to poison ivy.
Or you can ignore my advice and take a pretty good chance on being truly miserable one day. Either way it's OK with me.
I take a different approach - avoidance and post exposure treatment. I get poison ivy, oak, sumac very badly.
As a kid I learned to recognize and avoid at all costs. Sometimes it means a trail detour. Sometimes it means slow progress through an infested area, stepping verrrry carefully. During a recent section through the NJ farmer fields, I took long times to get through heavy patches (successfully).
My other approach is stripping the oils from my skin if I've been exposed. At home I use laundry brown soap and lots of water, which I can represent works well. On the trail, I use my alcohol based cleanser to do the same. The object is to get the oil (ushriol?) off your skin before the allergic reaction begins.
My wife and kids use Tecnu and Stokogard successfully. Both companies make a post exposure cleaner and a blocking cream.
Two Speed
08-01-2006, 12:18
OK, I was a little too quick. Opqdan, or whatever you name is, let's try to keep the subject on poison ivy on this thread and take the long winded debate about medical practice somewhere else.
blackbishop351
08-01-2006, 12:23
I never expose myself to it unless I need to...it's not like I go rolling around in the stuff for fun :D But when it's a choice between crawling through some ivy and getting plugged in the $ss with a paintball........I'll take the ivy ;)
Incidentally, I'm usually wearing a ghillie anyway. Not much skin exposed. But I've gotten enough oil on me when I was younger that I gave it to my mom when I got home! Still never got it...
Two Speed
08-01-2006, 12:29
Suggestion: wash that ghillie suit, if you can. It'll get the irritating oil in it and will increase your exposure unless you take steps to get it out.
Can't comment on the relative merits of getting shot in the kiester with a paint ball vs. poison ivy seeing as I haven't indulged in that paint ball, but I can see the motivation. Personally I'd probably take the paint ball; poison ivy kicks my butt.
OK, I was a little too quick. Opqdan, or whatever you name is, let's try to keep the subject on poison ivy on this thread and take the long winded debate about medical practice somewhere else.
Agreed. Sorry, I must have been writing my response while you posted yours.
Anyways, the only effective way that I have prevented poison-ivy is to simply wash all exposed areas as soon as possible. Urushiol (the bad stufff) is an oil and will not dissolve in water without the help of an emulsifier like soap. Wikipedia tells me that urushiol will bond with skin cells in as little as 15 minutes, so maybe even washing would be inneffective unless it was done immediatly. Of course, washing would remove the chance of spreading the irritant over larger areas of skin and would explain why the posters who said they washed, never had more than a few bumps. Due to the nature of urushiol (an allergen) people do develop sensitivity over time. Conversely, there are papers in PubMed that discuss increasing exposure to urushiol as a way of lessening the reaction (this is called hyposensitization, and I saw a news report that they are starting to use it for peanut allergies too).
Does anybody have any suggestions about what to do when the irritant is on your clothing? I could see this becoming a problem until you were able to wash them, which doesn't happen too often on the trail.
blackbishop351
08-01-2006, 12:43
Suggestion: wash that ghillie suit, if you can. It'll get the irritating oil in it and will increase your exposure unless you take steps to get it out.
Can't comment on the relative merits of getting shot in the kiester with a paint ball vs. poison ivy seeing as I haven't indulged in that paint ball, but I can see the motivation. Personally I'd probably take the paint ball; poison ivy kicks my butt.
I do wash it as often as I can....but probably not as often as I should, mostly because my wife yells at me every time for leaving the washer full of jute :rolleyes:
And like I said, the ivy doesn't really affect me, so it definitely tends to be the lesser of two evils :D
Getting shot with a paintball, btw, is fairly unpleasant, even through a few inches of burlap :D
hopefulhiker
08-01-2006, 14:14
gaitors....
Just Jeff
08-02-2006, 13:00
Nat Geo Adventure just had a blurb on PI prevention. Ivy block worked great, but I was surprised at the spray-on deodorant. They put it on their legs, put on some sandals, and walked through the PI. One tiny bump. Pretty effective.
Personally, I now carry Ivy Block, Tecnu and Zanfel in my pack. This junk out West isn't something to play around with!
RockyTrail
08-02-2006, 15:49
Does anybody have any suggestions about what to do when the irritant is on your clothing? I could see this becoming a problem until you were able to wash them, which doesn't happen too often on the trail.
From the Tecnu website:
"Urushiol oil can also spread from contaminated clothing, shoes, gloves, tools and pets. Since the oil does not evaporate, it can remain on these items for months or even years at a time. Use Tecnu to remove the oil and avoid a rash from secondary contact."
Pretty interesting website, it has some FAQs about poison ivy. The Technu link is posted above in post #2 or #3.
nyushka42
08-05-2006, 15:22
While on the trail in GA back in early May, I was exposed to A LOT of poison ivy. It was all over my arms. Since I had extremely bad reactions as a kid, I paniced & called my mom, who gave me a (God forbid) home remedy that worked really well. I was already starting to get red spots by the time I reached the Hiker Hostel (I was beat & the weather sucked, so I hitched from Suches to Delonicus to spend the night... great place to do so, btw). I boiled black tea, and let it steep until it was cold & the water a murky black. Then, I took the tea bag & smeared the tea all over my arms. Something to do with some kind of acid in the tea drawing the oil out. Then, in the hiker box I found Gold Balm foot powder, and for good measure doused my arms with that. The next morning, there was still a faint red rash that disappeared over the next couple days, but the itch was completely gone.
I don't know if it works on full blown poison ivy, but in its first stage I would highly recomend it as a cheep preventative measure.
While on the trail in GA back in early May, I was exposed to A LOT of poison ivy. It was all over my arms. Since I had extremely bad reactions as a kid, I paniced & called my mom, who gave me a (God forbid) home remedy that worked really well. I was already starting to get red spots by the time I reached the Hiker Hostel (I was beat & the weather sucked, so I hitched from Suches to Delonicus to spend the night... great place to do so, btw). I boiled black tea, and let it steep until it was cold & the water a murky black. Then, I took the tea bag & smeared the tea all over my arms. Something to do with some kind of acid in the tea drawing the oil out. Then, in the hiker box I found Gold Balm foot powder, and for good measure doused my arms with that. The next morning, there was still a faint red rash that disappeared over the next couple days, but the itch was completely gone.
I don't know if it works on full blown poison ivy, but in its first stage I would highly recomend it as a cheep preventative measure.
I've never heard of tea being used to treat poison ivy, but I assume that it would be the tannins in the tea that sooth the rash. Tannins are an astringent and a major component in witch hazel, which can be purchased in any drug store. The tannins in which hazel are it's major active ingredient, and witch hazel is used to treat psoriasis, eczema, carcked skin, insect bites, poison ivy, and even hemorroids (Tucks pads are soaked in it).
Witch hazel should grow all along the northern part of the trail (not sure on its exact range, but it grows in in PA) and while I do not know how to make an extract of it, I assume that it would work better than the tea (plus you don't have to carry it). But then, if you are going to treat it with wild plants, you may as well find some jewel weed, which is all but guaranteed to sooth the rash, without any special preparation (other than crushing it).
sherrill
08-07-2006, 15:20
Hear, hear.
I'll try it, what the hell for 5 bucks if it works for me. I got poison ivy bad on my calves and ankles last year before I left for Ireland. My Irish guide was astonished as he had never seen someone afflicted (evidently the plant doesn't grow in Ireland).
nyushka42
08-07-2006, 20:16
Evidently, it doesn't grow anywhere but North America... not sure about South... There were some Brits on the trail when I was on saying that in England, all they have is mad cow, while we have poison ivy, other poison plants, poison snakes, poison spiders, etc etc. However, luckily we don't live in Australia (fun place to visit though), which is considered the most poisonous place on the planet.
Need to add in a plug for Tecnu here.. as someone who has been on prescription steroid tablets to get rid of my poison ivy since I'm so highly allergic. Once even had one eye swollen shut as it was all over my face.
Tecnu works really well and if I know I am exposed to poison ivy, I wash with Tecnu and I either don't break out or it's severely toned down.
I'd suggest Tecnu wash & gel, gauze pads, medical tape.
Also would like to say that Jewelweed is a great remedy for poison ivy, and I'm not sure the availability of it on the AT but I know it grows in my backyard on the bank of our brook. Usually found in places near water.
Dr. Nancy Malik
06-10-2008, 04:47
· Homeopathy is a system of medicine that treats diseased individuals on the basis of using medicinal substances capable of producing similar changes in the health of a person as that of the diseased person. The term Homoeopathy is derived from the Greek words - homoios, meaning similar, and pathos, mean suffering. Homoeopathy is based on the principle - like cures like. Dr. Samuel Hahnemann, the founder of homeopathy, himself an allopathic doctor (M.D.). Homeopathy was established it in the late 18th and early 19th century by Dr. Samuel Hahnemann. He realised his own school of medicine (allopathy) wasnt helping the patients and spent years researching on homeopathy. The basic principles of Homeopathy are: -
a. A substance that causes symptoms in a healthy person can be used to treat these symptoms when they occur in an ill person.
b. Diluting the homeopathic medicine increases it collative powers and avoids unwanted side-effects.
c. Homeopathy treats the whole person and not just the illness. The totality of the symptoms is considered: Your complete symptom profile is taken into account, including mental, emotional, and physical aspects.
d. Like cures like: Substances that produce symptoms when given in large doses can clear up those symptoms when the substances are given in micro-doses.
e. A single remedy is given: One homeopathic medicine is chosen to perfectly match the totality of your symptoms.
f. A minimum of doses is given: Only a small stimulus is needed to stimulate your innate healing powers.
Rain Man
06-10-2008, 13:10
That said, the fact that we don't necessarily understand how these things work means there is always some risk involved in using them.
And I thought you were talking about "traditional medicine" (as you used the term, that driven by profit motives and big advertising budgets)!
Hell, sometimes the placebos work better than the "real" medicine.
Rain:sunMan
.
WalkingStick75
06-10-2008, 13:27
Learn to recognize the stuff and stay away is best.
I use to be immune too, then I turned 50 so I stay away from the stuff.
The Cheat
06-10-2008, 13:32
I never expose myself to it unless I need to...it's not like I go rolling around in the stuff for fun :D But when it's a choice between crawling through some ivy and getting plugged in the $ss with a paintball........I'll take the ivy ;)
Off topic, I know, but I've played paintball and gotten poison ivy. I'll take paintballs on bare skin over a bad case of poison ivy any day.
Appalachian Tater
06-10-2008, 13:46
Learn to recognize the stuff and stay away is best.That's the best advice.
Rain Man
06-10-2008, 14:45
Learn to recognize the stuff and stay away is best.
Very good advice, ... but you can get it from dogs that have gone where humans wouldn't go, and for that matter from clothing and other people.
YIKES!
I once hiked with a "kid" (a young man who didn't always think before acting) who was about to throw the pack I had lent him down into a big patch of poison ivy. I told him "stop" and he said it was okay, he wasn't allergic. I told him I was and it was my pack! So, then he set it down where he should have in the first place, away from the handy poison ivy patch.
Anyway, it is possible to get poison ivy from the conduct of others. As I said ... YIKES!
Rain:sunMan
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