Hey GoLite- Seriously, why not an ultralight pack with a real hip belt?

[dloome]

Here's the deal. I love my GoLite Jam. It's more than big enough for me to stay out for a few days in any season, inexpensive, absurdly light and (usually) comfortable, amazingly durable, and perfectly designed except for it's craptacular hipbelt.

It just sucks when I'm full up of water or food because the hip belt is just a webbing strap. The rest of the pack feels perfect but with a significant water or food load my hips just get trashed and I can feel my spine compressing.

Now I realize that with an ultralight pack you sacrifice features for weight, it's just frustrating because I find that the Jam lacks nothing else, it's otherwise the perfect pack. Seriously, how much could adding a half decent hipbelt to an ultralight pack (Jam, Gust) weigh, GoLite? Probably about an ounce. (I think I remember Squeaky making a similar comment on Trailcast) I don't think people are going to be upset if a pack weighs 1 lb 6 oz. instead of 1 lb. 5 oz. Trim off the excess webbing, drawcord and zipper leashes and you've lost that weight anyway. I would LOVE to use my Jam on the PCT next year, but I know with the water loads I'll be miserable, and I really don't want to have to spring $200 for an Intuition or something like that. Arg.

Time to dust off the sewing machine I think. :(
Others thoughts on this?

[Just Jeff]

You can buy hip belts separately. Sew one to the Jam.

[Frosty]

Here's the deal. I love my GoLite Jam. It's more than big enough for me to stay out for a few days in any season, inexpensive, absurdly light and (usually) comfortable, amazingly durable, and perfectly designed except for it's craptacular hipbelt.

It just sucks when I'm full up of water or food because the hip belt is just a webbing strap. The rest of the pack feels perfect but with a significant water or food load my hips just get trashed and I can feel my spine compressing.

Now I realize that with an ultralight pack you sacrifice features for weight, it's just frustrating because I find that the Jam lacks nothing else, it's otherwise the perfect pack. Seriously, how much could adding a half decent hipbelt to an ultralight pack (Jam, Gust) weigh, GoLite? Probably about an ounce. (I think I remember Squeaky making a similar comment on Trailcast) I don't think people are going to be upset if a pack weighs 1 lb 6 oz. instead of 1 lb. 5 oz. Trim off the excess webbing, drawcord and zipper leashes and you've lost that weight anyway. I would LOVE to use my Jam on the PCT next year, but I know with the water loads I'll be miserable, and I really don't want to have to spring $200 for an Intuition or something like that. Arg.

Time to dust off the sewing machine I think. :(
Others thoughts on this?My thoughts are two:

1. A hip belt weighs much more than an ounce. The webbing you have weighs more than an ouce.

2. If you keep your pack weight under 15-20 pounds, you really only need a hip belt to reduce swaying, not to transfer load. Pack it properly and it will perform okay.

Consider a Gossamer Gear Mariposa. It weights 17 ounces and has a wide wbbing belt. But the benefit is that it has two ultralight stays (fiberglass arrow shafts) in the pack which help it maintain shape. I've had up to 30 pounds in mine and it felt fine.

http://www.gossamergear.com/cgi-bin/gossamergear/Mariposa-Standard.html

Or just add a hip belt as you say. You can buy them at most outfitters or take one off an old pack.

[fiddlehead]

I learned to hike without a hip belt and won't go back.
I saw the Sherpas in Nepal carrying 40-50 lb packs with the hip belts unfastened and hanging. Over a long period. Anyway, i have a breeze and love it. No hip belt, nice and light. just the right size.
of course go-lite can't make the perfect pack for everyone. So, simply sew the hipbelt of your choice on to the pack you love so much. If you can't do it, take it to an upolstery (sp?) shop. And tell them to use strong thread. Have fun.

[Almost There]

This also depends on your body type, gait, etc. Some people have to have them. I find as a bigger guy, most of my weight is in my torso that straps loosen on their own. For me I have found bigger, heavier packs are actually more comfortable, they ride better. I had moved to a lighter pack and load, but will be going back unless I can find a pack in the middle. Skinny people seem to do better with lightweight packs.

[berninbush]

My personal theory is that hip belts may be more helpful to women than to men. It's simple biology: men carry a lot of strength in their torso, while women have strength primarily in their legs. I'm female, and find that I have an easier time carrying a heavier load with a hip belt than a lighter load with no belt, because it transfers the weight to a stronger part of my body.

But hey, whether you're male or female, if you need the belt, add it to your pack!

[The Solemates]

I'd have to disagree with most of you. I think it may be personal preference, because I like a hipbelt. Mine does not have to be that beefy, but even if I am only out carrying 10lbs on a dayhike, I have to have my hip belt fastened. At these loads simple webbing does me fine, but at higher loads I like a little bit more. I do not necessarily have to have a huge hipbelt, and in many instances webbing will do, but it is always more confortable with one made of more than just webbing. Carrying any load (even if only 10lbs) on your shoulders for extended periods of time really puts a hurting on your neck, spine, and shoulders, whether you feel the immediate effects of it or not. Down the road as you age, I would imagine this would be more pronounced. Placing that weight on your hips is more anatomically natural...and ergonomically sound.

[Just Jeff]

I like hip belts b/c when I'm hot, I tighten the belt and loosen the shoulder straps. The pack rests on my hips and I get an inch or two of ventilation between my back and the pack. It's harder to do on level ground, but helps me stand more upright on the climbs and descents...but mainly it helps me stay cool when I'm working hard on a climb.

My Speed has a webbing belt, probably 2" wide. It's plenty for most weights but can be a little skimpy if I approach 30 lbs...which is what the pack is rated at so it's pretty accurate, IMO.

[mingo]

here's the solution: get yourself a milk jug or any other bottle (preferably one with a handle) and carry it in your hands as you hike. then you get the weight of the water off your back and you won't need a bigger hip belt. i hiked with a guy in '03 name of jug who hiked, not coincidentally, with a half-gallon milk jug. he picked up the habit while hiking the PCT as a way to carry a lot of water without breaking your back. i do the same thing now, only i use a quart bottle with a handle. it's great. you stay better hydrated that way because you can drink whenever you want (just as if you had a hydration bladder in your pack). you do have to throw away your hiking sticks if you use them. but that's no loss. they are crutches for the weak.

[aroth87]

get yourself a milk jug or any other bottle (preferably one with a handle) and carry it in your hands as you hike. then you get the weight of the water off your back and you won't need a bigger hip belt.
I think that's the concept behind the bottle carriers that attach to your shoulder straps, like the one's ULA (http://www.ula-equipment.com/options.htm) sells as options on their packs. I think they are designed to act as a counter-balance to the pack so it's not pulling back on your shoulders as much. I think I have seen them a few other places too. It also frees up your hands for poles, umbrella, or whatever else you may need your hands to do for you on the trail.

Adam

[fiddlehead]

you do have to throw away your hiking sticks if you use them. but that's no loss. they are crutches for the weak.

Right on! Whoever marketed those things is someone i want on my team. What a concept: hey hikers buy all kinds of stuff but what do they do with their hands while their out there walking? Let's think of something they can put in them! And guess what? the hikers bought it. Hook, line and sinker!
I agree Mingo.

[Rough]

I used a Golite Breeze (no hip belt) when I thru hiked the Long Trail a few years ago. After resupplies, my pack weighed at least 25 pounds and my shoulders and back muscles really felt it. After that hike I switched to a Gregory G (pack weight of 2 lbs 9 ounces v. the Breeze's 14 ounces) and I now pack my 25 lbs very comfortably. I recovered the weight difference between the 2 packs with a lighter weight sleeping bag and by switching from a tent to a hammock for shelter.

For me the hip belt/harness has been a big plus. I agree with the previous post in that, at less than 20 lbs, the Golite Breeze or Jam should be fine.

[stranger]

The reason pack manufacturers don't put proper hipbelts on their packs is because there is no suspension. A hipbelt does not transfer weight, an internal suspension system transfers weight, so if you are carrying a frameless pack there is no effective suspension to transfer weight from your shoulders and back to you hips.

The hipbelt is just there to support whatever weight ends up there. If you are having issues with your weight you should consider carrying a pack that actually can support it, this is one of the most common problems with carrying ultralight packs, they have no substance.

[Just Jeff]

Understand your point, stranger, but...

My Speed doesn't have a frame, but the way I pack it transfers the weight to my hips just fine. I often loosen the shoulder straps so the pack hangs off my back and rests completely on my hips...the pack stays stiff, there's an inch or three between the pack and my back, and the shoulder straps only keep it from falling off and don't really support any weight.

As with most things, it just depends on how you use it and whether it fits your style. I'm pretty happy with my frameless hip-belted pack as long as it's ~25 lbs or less. As I approach the upper limit, I do wish it had a bit more padding on the hips, though.

[EarlyBird2007]

Here's the deal. I love my GoLite Jam. It's more than big enough for me to stay out for a few days in any season, inexpensive, absurdly light and (usually) comfortable, amazingly durable, and perfectly designed except for it's craptacular hipbelt.

It just sucks when I'm full up of water or food because the hip belt is just a webbing strap. The rest of the pack feels perfect but with a significant water or food load my hips just get trashed and I can feel my spine compressing.

Now I realize that with an ultralight pack you sacrifice features for weight, it's just frustrating because I find that the Jam lacks nothing else, it's otherwise the perfect pack. Seriously, how much could adding a half decent hipbelt to an ultralight pack (Jam, Gust) weigh, GoLite? Probably about an ounce. (I think I remember Squeaky making a similar comment on Trailcast) I don't think people are going to be upset if a pack weighs 1 lb 6 oz. instead of 1 lb. 5 oz. Trim off the excess webbing, drawcord and zipper leashes and you've lost that weight anyway. I would LOVE to use my Jam on the PCT next year, but I know with the water loads I'll be miserable, and I really don't want to have to spring $200 for an Intuition or something like that. Arg.

Time to dust off the sewing machine I think. :(
Others thoughts on this?

It's been done IMHO. Take a look at the Granite Gear Vapor Trail. It's extremely light, like the GoLite Jam, but has a much better hip belt.

[SGT Rock]

Two points on this.

While some packs do not have a "frame", if packed correctly they can have what BPL termed a "virtual frame" - a term that describes what happens better than my old way of trying. Your load can have a ridged structure inside the pack and your hip belt can help carry some of the weight and leave the shoulder straps to provide some weight support but mostly some load control. This is one reason I really really like my Gearskin. It has load lifter straps on the shoulder straps and a well padded hip belt. Packed correctly this frame less pack has carried 50 pounds just as well as my much heavier Lowe Alpine backpack.

The other point in this is how it can also be a preference to want a hip belt even though it may provide absolutely no weight support. I tested a super light GG pack with an absurdly low base weight around 5 pounds and a couple of days food - so total pack weight was below 10 pounds. But the pack didn't have a hip belt and I hated the way it rode on my back. I just like the maneuver control when scrambling over blow downs, climbing rocks, and doing other things when you have even a simple hip belt. Packs without hip belt options just don't interest me.

[peter_pan]

Gossarmer Gear Mariposa has a great hip belt...a ton of other features and is only 17 oz...easily trimmed to 16 oz.

Pan