Pads vs. Underquilts

[Johnny Swank]

Cross-posting this from another post, so bear with me.

"I can't decide if I like the underquilt thing or not. I'm going to at least carry a torso pad no matter what, and I almost think the weight/warmth is a wash regarding a CC pad compared to a sewn-through underquilt. For me, I really thing the hammock sock is the key to everything by cutting off a bunch of that convective loss from underneigth. I almost always carry a space blanket in the cool months, and might as well use it between the hammock and sock as to leave it in the pack. Could even get all crazy and do a Garlington taco-like setup for a few nights if need be with leaves and empty stuff sacks/trash bags."

Here's the deal - I have a sewn-through underquilt that I slapped together before my recent trip down the Cape Fear River http://sourcetosea.net/CapeFear/overview.html

I played with a bunch of different things, and carried a 24x36x1/4" pad, a mummy-shaped inflatable(in theory, pad has a leak) pad, underquilt with probably about 2.5 inches of loft (sewn through, 8" wide tubes), space blanket, and hammock sock. I used a Golite Featherlight ( wildly optimistic 40 degree down bag that I cut down one side to use as a quilt) and a 100 weight fleece liner. Have a MH Phantom down jacket as backup but never used.

I chickened on on the really cold nights and just slept on the ground as it was already dark and I didn't want to have to climb out of the hammock if things weren't working out. Used the hammock sock as a bivy on top of a groundcloth with great success.

Now, after all that babbling, I'm still not sure if I like the underquilt thing or not, or if it works out weight-wise compared to the warmth of a couple of CC pads. Granted, I haven't weighed by quilt yet, but I'm considering making a 2-layer hammock like Risk's Zhammock out of 2 layers of 1.1 oz nylon and seeing what happens.

I think in the end, the best combination for me might me a Warmhammock with about 3" on insulation, a couple of pads (1/8" and 1/4" inch) and a hammock sock. That would still leave me with the overstuffed underquilt that I could use as a top bag. My only concern with intergrating the down into the hammock itself is if it gets wet from water coming down the lines. I haven't been in a real rainstorm yet while hanging and am waiting to see how well that works out.

Any thoughts?

[Hana_Hanger]

My only concern with intergrating the down into the hammock itself is if it gets wet from water coming down the lines. I haven't been in a real rainstorm yet while hanging and am waiting to see how well that works out.

Any thoughts?

I have been in some really bad rainstorms here on island...heck almost everytime I camp here I am in rain each night and early morning.

If you use drip lines on both sides of your support rope and I use large cotton shoestrings to really soak up the water and funnel it down out of the way it should be fine. I put two on each side if it is a really bad rain and have not gotten wet inside yet.

If you lower your top tarp over your hammock low enough you should also be fine. Back splash up onto the bottom of the hammock can become a problem if your location is not on say a hill side or slope....so you could invest in JRB weather shield or make one of your own depending on which is best for you. I did that as well but found if you have a good spot to hang it is not necessary to use the splash guard.

I know you probably already know these things but that is my thoughts...hope it helps a little

[highway]

An option:
Speer SPE:
http://www.speerhammocks.com/Products/SPE.htm

I have not tried it as it is still so warm here but others have given it decent reviews. I opted for it since I wanted a pad/ground/shelter use if I wanted that option. Plus I'll only use it 3-season above freezing (hopefully)

I just cut 8 ea. 1/4" wings for it and it folds up into a small package quite nicely against the back of my gearskin pack. That was a plus.

One cant have too many options-but there can be too few:cool:

[hammock engineer]

Hana, on the drip strings on my HH I just use the inner strains of para cord. It only takes a little bit of string.

[Johnny Swank]

The SPE is kind of where I was heading with all this. It's either that or, or wrestling with a 40" wide pad and trying to pack that into my Gearskin knock-off. I might sew something up real quick and see how I like it.

I like the comfort of the underquilt, but am still paranoid about getting it wet to some degree. I'm a big closed cell foam guy, and don't mind sleeping on top of it. It just seems far simpler to toss the pad in the hammock and call it a day. I would then have my new quilt as a top quilt that'd be good down to at least freezing or better with some clothes and a hammock sock. I don't mind tossing a space blanket into the mix (garlington taco-like) or throwing some leaves in a trashbag for a night or three if need be.

[Just Jeff]

A pad is simple to set up - you just throw it in. But it's more complicated to sleep on b/c you have to get it positioned "just so" during the night, and then you roll over and a knee/butt touches the hammock and gets cold, and you get condensation b/c it's not breathable, etc.

An underquilt takes more care to get it situated, but once it's set right you're generally good all night, don't have condensation, don't have to worry about resituating it after you roll over, etc.

But CCF pads are light and durable and you can get them wet and muddy and they'll still work. And cheap.

They both have their places in the grand scheme of things. I still use a down inflatable sometimes, but it's much more comfortable than CCF in my opinion. Saved me a lot of trouble on one trip when I went to ground b/c of snow blowing under my tarp and on top of my PeaPod.

[FanaticFringer]

I've got a SPE and it requires a fair amount of wraslin:D
If your concerned about getting an underquilt wet, you could invest in a weather shield from Jacks r better. On sale now. I'm gonna get one for that purpose as well as it adding 6-10 degrees of warmth.
In colder weather, sub 40, I use the Nest underquilt as well as a pad. The colder the temp, the thicker the pad.

[hammock engineer]

I have been thinking about what I want to use as a pad. I want something that will lay flat for packing and for use as a sit pad. I am thinking about getting one of the oware pads that are really wide but thin and add another layer of insulation underneath my torso with no extra at the shoulders. The first layer should be warm enough for my shoulders and legs. I can always put my pack underneath my legs if needed. I want to them do something similar to the pad on Rock's site to get it to lay flat.

Of course I haven't tried it yet.

[arkwater]

I have this (http://cgi.ebay.com/30-x-60-Hi-Dense-Closed-Cell-Foam-Upholstery-Foam_W0QQitemZ170048893928QQihZ007QQcategoryZ41200 QQcmdZViewItem) & this (http://cgi.ebay.com/1-4-x-30-x-60-Hi-Dense-CLOSED-CELL-Upholstery-Foam_W0QQitemZ170047323827QQihZ007QQcategoryZ47121 QQcmdZViewItem). They work well in a hammock together or separately.

[altut]

i used a oware pad on my last 2 trips. i decided that a underquilt is most likley the way to go. the thin pad buckles real bad and i sweat alot so condensation was a prob. finally you stick to the pad and cant slide around alot. i like to roll around. just my 2 cents.

[Rambler]

the Zrisk double layer works well. just slip in the pad (3/4 thermarest) and you're done. It stays in palce all night.

[Johnny Swank]

I'll probably sew one of those this weekend or next. I wish had enough floor down to go ahead and sew another quilt as well.

So many projects, so little time to use them.:o

[Doctari]

So far, I have only used the pad. When I have tried to put it inside the hammock with me, the term "Nightmare" comes to mind, because of the gyrations I have to go thru to get it under me. HOWEVER, when I turn the hammock upside down (I have the skeeter beeter recomended by Neo) & put the pad inside the bug netting, it's way comfy.

What I use: a truck windshield sunscreen ($7.50 at Biglots) which kept me warm easily to about 50 degrees. It is hard, and noticable so I added 3/16" CC foam, ($2.50 at Biglots) cut to fit. It's very wide, so I stay warm (ie on top of the pad) no matter how I sleep. The CC foam makes the pad softer, & adds minimal weight. I do not know how coold I can get, but I'll likely be using it Saturday night & it's supposed to be 35 deg where I'll be camping (near Charlotte NC) so we shall see.

Someday I'll get an underquilt.

Doctari.

[saimyoji]

If you have a full zip sleeping bag, you can use it as an underquilt, or as a sock. It takes some phanagling (sp?) but can be very comfy. I'm working on rigging one as an underquilt with a mod. so the hood can still be used.

CCF from Wallyworld worked fine for me.

[Fiddleback]

The only pad I've used in a hammock is the one put out by Oware. As Altut points out, it does 'buckle' (wrinkle) but I find a little care when first lying down on it solves most of the problems.

I believe all CCFs will have issues with condensation. Initially I clipped a light fleece throw to the pad to mitigate condensation but humidity is so low in my backpacking range I'm not sure the throw does anything for me. In any case, I haven't had condensation problems. If I was back on the AT I'm sure things would be different.

I remain impressed by the insulation provided by the 7oz Oware and it's served me well down to the mid-20s. But it was a bulky bear to pack until I got the Luxury Lite with an extra large cylinder.

FB

[hammock engineer]

Man, am I the only one the Luxury Lite Pack did not work for? Great pack, it just set on my back wrong.

[K-Man]

I posted my opinion on this here:

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showpost.php?p=272411&postcount=15