In ROTC they were telling us how we could make a military issue poncho into a shelter much like the tarp idea. Has neone tried this on the AT and does anybody have any idea on how well this works?
C/CPL Wilson

To answer your first question, that is the method Earl Schaeffer used for almost all of his "Long Cruise" in 1948. Just in case you haven't heard of Earl he was the first thru-hiker. I've used a 5' x 8' sinlnylon poncho on a couple of short trips, but I haven't had any severe weather on those trips so I'm reluctant to offer an opinion.

The female dino sent me over here to comment as I'm retired military. A military poncho will keep you alive and somewhat sheltered, but unless you are fairly short, it really isn't an adequate shelter for an extended hike IMO for the reason noted by the previous poster - it isn't really large enough for comfortable use in severe weather.

Female dino here - if you want to consider using a poncho as your shelter, consider something like Roy Robinson's poncho (http://royrobinson.homestead.com/PonchoPlans.html) or Six Moon Designs' Gatewood Cape (http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/shop/shopexd.asp?id=45) or SgtRock's Poncho (http://hikinghq.net/gear/poncho_tarp.html)

I believe the origins may have been from the term "shelter half" whereby two soldiers, each carrying one half each "shelter half", could team up, snap their two together to form a larger tarp and make an "A" frame shelter, open at each end, for the two.Alternatively, use it for one as single, albeit smaller, tarp. Canvas tarps were not very lightweight before the advent of all the lightweight nylon products.

Here is a better idea for a poncho shelter where one can go considerably lighter as well as solo:
http://www.integraldesigns.com/product_detail.cfm?id=728&CFID=8690868&CFTOKEN=51070808&mainproducttypeid=1

It works, but it should be pitched low to ground and is more than adequate if used with bivy. Except for one correctable drawback, that pocho is my favorite rain gear.

There's a picture in Pmag's collection that looks like a poncho-tarp. Six Moons Designs has a commercial product, the Gatewood Cape.

Hey Flyspy, AYCE's got a good article on Thru-hiker.com: The 5 x 8' Poncho as Shelter and Rain Gear (http://www.thru-hiker.com/articles.asp?subcat=3&cid=80). I think the short version is for the bulk of us folks a poncho could pass as an emergency shelter, but probably not the best idea if you can find/afford something better.

BTW, I forgot to say :welcome . If you try the poncho thing out let us know how it goes.

I use nothing but a 5x8.5 poncho (actually, a cape) for both hammock and ground shelter. I use it in a long A over the hammock because it gives complete, generous coverage. On the ground, I set it up as a half pyramid which gives a secure dry area of 8.5X2.5 and two "vestibules" for gear, shoes, etc. The half pyramid is much drier and more storm proof than other setups and has generous headroom. This is my primary shelter, even in nasty weather. I rarely use the AT shelters.

Hi CPL,

The Army poncho will work and keep you dry. I've used it already in some very bad storms and was fine - I work currently as a Drill SGT. The problem with a poncho is to hot for summer and weight is heavy compare to a rain jacket and tarp.

Wolf

Flyspy,

When I was in the Army, we left our shelter halves behind, preferring to use a poncho.

We stayed out for long periods, hiked good distances daily, and had to carry everything we needed, so weight was important.

We set up camp, broke camp, and hiked further several times most nights with sound and light discipline. The faster you set up, the more sleep you got. If you didn’t get out quickly, you had to play catch-up in the dark, so simplicity was appreciated.

Winter in the mountains was always sub-zero and windy; we didn’t stake out a poncho, becoming burritos instead. Wind, fairly constant at night in high mountains, ventilates a lot of perspiration even in burritos.

In warm wet weather, most of us didn’t bother wearing a poncho moving along; you’re going to get wet anyway, and rain water feels cleaner than sweat.

We were not having fun. We were always cold in winter. We were always wet when it rained.

I hike the AT for fun. I use a silnylon poncho and a silnylon tarp. A poncho can augment a tarp end when greater protection is desired.

You need to experiment and determine your own comfort level. Hike comfortably or camp comfortably.

We were not having fun. We were always cold in winter. We were always wet when it rained.

I hike the AT for fun. I use a silnylon poncho and a silnylon tarp. A poncho can augment a tarp end when greater protection is desired.

You need to experiment and determine your own comfort level. Hike comfortably or camp comfortably.

Good advice, even great advice. I like the sober perspective "We were not having fun". It is all too easy to get all sorts of fancifull ideas when haunting forums from comfort of the living room.

a poncho works just fine for a shelter. get some of your older cadets to show you, then experiment on your own time.

one pitch i've not seen mentioned... tie a 1' piece of 550 cord to each corner of the poncho (they won't interfere too much when you have to wear it either). spread out the poncho and stake the corners down by the 1' ties. bend a small sapling or tree branch down and tie the hood drawstring to it. gently release it. takes practice to find sloping ground, just the right size branch to apply the right tension, the proper distance to stake out the ties, and there's little headroom, but it's very dry on the proper ground (non-pooling).

a US army shelter half is not a poncho, nor can it be used as one (though other armies have models that work that way). it is a piece of canvas, pointed at both ends, rectangular in the middle (sort of like this: <=> ). when you assemble it, the pointy parts become the ends of the pup tent, closing it off. there are two rows of snaps, so the canvas overlaps and is water resistent. two military ponchos can be snapped together along their long sides to make something like a shelter-half pup tent, but with open ends. the poncho will also snap between two shelter-halves, creating a wider shelter (though you need a support in the middle or the rain will cause it to cave in. we used to use a c-ration can over a stick or rifle. helmet works too, anything to prevent poking a hole through.)

original issue poncho coated rsnylon = 24 ozs.
sgt. rock's poncho and other commercial poncho's = 10 oz.s
even tho the new ponchos are nowhere near as attractive - my milspec poncho is an anachronism and now covers up my lawnmower...
justjeff referred me to a site for a $30 model tarp that can be converted...as i said last night - milspec is combatproof - commercial ponchos are recreation-proof...imho - the less you carry the better your pilgrimage...

In ROTC they were telling us how we could make a military issue poncho into a shelter much like the tarp idea. Has neone tried this on the AT and does anybody have any idea on how well this works?
C/CPL Wilson

Using just your issue gear here's how I did it. BTW, I am 6'2+ so there is no easy fitting under one poncho. Use bungees to tie out to trees or stake down. Put your ruck at the head end. If its a lg alice pack you can have it upright with the poncho partly draped over it. Use the kidney pad for a pillow. Put the foot end of your fartsack into the wet weather bag you keep the fartsack in during transport. Your feet may be close to or even outside of poncho hooch coverage but will stay dry. The ruck will protect your head from blowing rain.

If you use bungees ( http://www.rangerjoes.com/camouflage-bungee-cords-p-286.html ) you can wrap them around the lower frame of the ruck. You can stow small items here securely too, sitting on the frame between the pack and kidney pad. For example I would keep the days food stuffed there in 2 MRE bags (we stripped all extraneous stuff from the MREs).

Stow the poncho reverse stuffed in one of the out pockets with the hood at the top. You open the pocket, grab the hood and it pulls out easy, the same way every time. As Vi+ said, you can do it in the dark. In fact everyone in your squad should have the cho in the same spot so they can be easily found for use as a stretcher.

Good grief, I need to go to bed:o . Probably a little more than you were asking for. Can you say sleep deprived rabbit trailing?

What size poncho is best for doubling as a shelter. I use an Outdoor Research "regular" which I believe is 50" x 84" and it seems rather small to use for a shelter. However it does have tie outs.

A poncho can augment a tarp end when greater protection is desired.I have a question about this procedure - did you use the poncho burrito style or pitch it as sort of a bivy tarp inside a normal size and pitched tarp or use some other configuration? The idea is intriguing to us DIY designers :D

Frolicking Dinosaurs,

You ask (Post #15), “... did you use the poncho burrito style or pitch it as sort of a bivy tarp inside a normal size and pitched tarp or use some other configuration?”

I’m unsure what you’re asking. You may be mixing too different periods, each with a different hiking style.

Years ago, things were different. The military didn’t have ground pads, as a simple example. If it was raining, I tried to find a dry spot and threw the sleeping bag on the ground. I stood over it, wearing my poncho splayed out, as if an umbrella, to keep it from getting soaked. It became trickier, taking off the poncho, draping it over the sleeping bag, and getting inside "dry."

Wind velocity determined whether rocks covering one or both sides, and either or both ends would suffice. No wind, no rocks. Howling wind, the “burrito” treatment.

Snow usually meant it was cold enough not to use any cover. When snow doesn’t melt, you don’t get wet. Shake snow off the bag and re-pack.

That was when speed (simplicity), pack volume, and weight were major deciding factors.

Things have changed significantly.

I have a ground pad, and better and lighter weight equipment. Now >I< decide: when and where I stop; how long I sleep; what I eat; how, when, and where I resupply.

I decided I would have fun. I carry a WARM sleeping bag. I carry a tarp large enough (8 x 10) to cover me and provide good ventilation without much artful pitching. luxuries to some.

If there isn’t a threat of precipitation when I go to sleep, I just put down the ground pad and lay the sleeping bag over it. If the weather seems uncertain, the tarp will be nearby. Responding to a surprise rain, I have resorted to the “Burrito Effect” when I didn’t plan to sleep much longer.

When there is a threat of precipitation, I pitch my tarp. If I wake to find rain blowing in one end of my newfound “wind tunnel,” I change the pitch of my tarp, or drape and twist or tie my poncho over the end of the tarp or over as much of my sleeping bag as is needed.

Something which may intrigue a “DIY designer.” The eastern U.S. is a bit humid for the “Burrito effect,” given a choice for me. I have a tent made of Gore-Tex. It doesn’t work well, since there is too much humidity here and the fabric is too far away from me. If I leave the tent pegs and tie-out lines behind and just crawl inside with my sleeping bag (ground pad beneath it all), the “burrito effect” is excellent.

Gore-Tex is heavier than Silnylon.

I have a Gore-Tex bivy sack. For emergency use, it’s quite tolerable. For long term use in rain, the “Casket Effect” becomes tedious. Putting a tarp over a bivy sack seems excessively redundant. I view the bivy sack as unnecessary volume and weight.

A lot of words, and I’m not sure I answered your question.

VI+ - sorry, I misunderstood what you were saying -- I thought you had a method of basically making an impromptu 'double wall tarp-tent' using a standard tarp and poncho with tie-outs. What I was asking was did you pitch the poncho as a tarp or just wrap it around you buritto style.

Frolicking Dinosaurs,

Reference my posts (#9 & #16), all this occurred near the end of the first third of my life, so far. I’ve forgotten much of the fine points.

We were issued air mattresses, which lasted me but a few precious days. An air mattress becomes surprisingly heavy once it becomes virtually useless. I stopped carrying an air mattress.

A simple arrangement, when the ground is wet, is to place your poncho on the ground, lay your sleeping bag on the poncho, then cross your poncho over top of you to keep relatively dry.

As Greentick pointed out (Post #13), you can use your pack to support one end of your poncho; or the side opposite you. A branch, with one end placed on a pack or downed log forms a rib over which you can lay your poncho; center yourself beneath the rib. There are all sorts of permutations of the wickiup which provide endless sources for poncho/tarp supports.