View Full Version : Art Loeb Trail in Pisgah NF
Greetings,
Little Bear and I are planning to hike the Art Loeb trail in the Pisgah NF, just southwest of Asheville, NC. Looking at a topo of the trail, water sources along the trial look sparce. Anyone who has hike this trail, please respond to this posting about the availability of water on the trail. Thanks! :confused:
Backpacker magazine has a short article on this trail in the current issue. Looks like a really nice hike and has a reputation for being pretty mean in spots. Link to water sources... http://www.ncultra.org/article.php?story=20041118143320296
Have fun
mantiss
I've hiked this trail with a group of scouts a few times. Wonderful hike the only real water problem is the first eight miles from Davidson River to Butter Gap Shelter. After that water is pretty readily available. Once you cross the Blue Ridge Parkway and get into the area of the balds water is very easy to find.
I hope to be practicing for my thru-hike in that area when I can get off work. Nice area.
little bear
03-22-2007, 23:17
Anyone else care to join us, so far its me takoda and Phreak. Camping Thursday night and leaving first thing friday morning, from the cold mountain end. Should be nice weather for the hike.
Johnny Swank
03-23-2007, 15:30
That's an awesome trail. You're going to have a blast! Last night about midnite I decided to sneak up to Mt. Rogers after work myself.
Are there any campsites between Davidson River trail head to Butter Gap shelter? We are extremely familar with the Davidson river area and the Cat Gap loop trail, but do not know of any feasible sites between the two!! Thanks for the help!!:-?
Ron Haven
12-12-2007, 18:37
I've hiked this trail with a group of scouts a few times. Wonderful hike the only real water problem is the first eight miles from Davidson River to Butter Gap Shelter. After that water is pretty readily available. Once you cross the Blue Ridge Parkway and get into the area of the balds water is very easy to find.How do you get to the trail heads at each end?
How do you get to the trail heads at each end?
You can get to Davidson river trail head from Brevard on 276. The Daniel Boone Boy Scout camp is the other trail head. You can take the parkway to hwy 215, before Devils courthouse, from what it looks like on a Pisgah Ranger district, pisgah national forest map. It looks like after you get on 215 you go a little ways and there is a road to the right that will take you to the trailhead-not for sure. Of course it also looks like you can take 276 to 215 also. I don't know. Most people I've encountered go from Davidson River access. Sorry for the confusion-hope some of this helps.:)
wilconow
12-12-2007, 19:11
I'm looking to do this trail this spring. I've yet to get a map, but is there any good loops you can do so you don't have to do out and back?
The National Geographic Trails Illustrated map for Pisgah is the best, it includes all of the connecting trails as well. Lots of loops around Shining Rock.
Ramble~On
12-13-2007, 06:28
I'm looking to do this trail this spring. I've yet to get a map, but is there any good loops you can do so you don't have to do out and back?
Many loops. You also have the option of hiking either direction on the Mountains to Sea Trail. The Shining Rock and Middle Prong Wildernesses each have a good selection of trails
Ron Haven
12-13-2007, 10:26
You can get to Davidson river trail head from Brevard on 276. The Daniel Boone Boy Scout camp is the other trail head. You can take the parkway to hwy 215, before Devils courthouse, from what it looks like on a Pisgah Ranger district, pisgah national forest map. It looks like after you get on 215 you go a little ways and there is a road to the right that will take you to the trailhead-not for sure. Of course it also looks like you can take 276 to 215 also. I don't know. Most people I've encountered go from Davidson River access. Sorry for the confusion-hope some of this helps.:)I had someone call me from Dallas last hear wanting info on the Art Loeb.I told him "I wished I could help him but I never had been on that trail".
There is an excellent book entitled "Trekking The Southern Appalachians" by Jack Igelman.
http://www.biggerbooks.com/bk_detail.aspx?isbn=0898869668
I had two copies of this book, including a signed copy, and damned if I can't find either of 'em! Drat!
It includes excellent information about the Art Loeb Trail. Anyone interested in the trail might consider picking up Jack's book. Nice guy. He's from Asheville and part owner of Second Gear, a used outdoor gear shop in Asheville. http://www.secondgearwnc.com
I was going to hike the Art Loeb Trail next month, but had a sudden infusion of common sense. I'm not interested in freezing my tail off over 6000' in January. I am hiking 90 miles on the Florida Trail instead, and will save the Art Loeb Trail for a warmer season.
Tennessee Viking
12-13-2007, 15:47
I have only hiked it around the Graveyard Fields/MST junction section. You should be able to jump off it, either by MST or BRP, and had down to the Graveyard to gather water at Yellowstone Prong.
Last weekend had a steady rainfall, so you should have some moderate water. But during the summer, it was dry.
You heading in from Boys Scout/Cold Mountain or south end? Be sure to record all your SB6000 ascents.
Jan LiteShoe
12-13-2007, 16:35
I was going to hike the Art Loeb Trail next month, but had a sudden infusion of common sense. I'm not interested in freezing my tail off over 6000' in January. I am hiking 90 miles on the Florida Trail instead, and will save the Art Loeb Trail for a warmer season.
Oh darn.
I had just decided to take you up on your offer to hike it again, not.
;)
Have fun in :sun Florida!
Jan LiteShoe
12-13-2007, 16:41
Also, sounds like Takoda is set with this, but in case anyone else wants to hike this shrt, testy little trail, here's some info I assembled a couple years ago:
"You can get maps from the rangers station just inside the 276 entrance to the Pisgah, or order them from national Geographic maps. Part of the Art is an alternate route for the Mountains to Sea trail, The Art being blazed in white blazes.Jump-off point is Davidson River Campground off 276, accessed from Brevard in Transylvania County; think Highway 64 and Highway 276 intersection.
Looking Glass Outfitters is located near the entrance to Pisgah National Forest, you pass right by it. It's a possible shuttle connection or place to leave a car. Phone: (866) 351-2176, Email: info@lookingglassoutfitters.com
I cribbed this info from their website:
Art Loeb Trail, Section 1
Distance: 12.3 miles
Blaze: White
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Shining Rock, Sam Knob
Access: Turn onto the road to Davidson River Campground, 0.2 mile south of Pisgah District Ranger Station on U.S. Highway 276. Park in the Art Loeb Trailhead parking lot. The other end of this section is at Gloucester Gap on FS Rd. 471, where overnight parking is not recommended.
Attractions and Considerations: The Art Loeb Trail, 30.1 miles long, is a national recreation trail and named after a local hiking enthusiast. Most of the Art Loeb Trail is overlapped by the Mountains-to-the Sea Trail which is blazed with 3-inch white dots. Section 1 begins at the Davidson River and climbs steeply to Shut-in Ridge.
Art Loeb Trail, Section 2
Distance: 7.2 miles
Blaze: White
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Shining Rock, Sam Knob
Access: Start from Gloucester Gap, which is 4.5 miles west of the State Fish Hatchery on FS Road 475. (It is not recommended to leave cars overnight here.) See Access to trail #21 for directions to the other end of this section.
Attractions and Considerations: From Gloucester Gap the trail climbs to Pilot Mountain, a former fire tower site with a 360-degree view. There is a shelter and spring at Deep Gap. The trail then climbs to the Blue Ridge Parkway, winding through a mature upland hardwood forest. From the Parkway it is a steep climb to Silvermine Bald where there is a transition from a hardwood forest to a spruce-fir forest. Near Silvermine Bald the Mountains-to-Sea Trail splits to the west while the Art Loeb Trail follows the ridge northeast to FS Road 816.
Art Loeb Trail, Section 3
Distance: 6.8 miles
Blaze: White
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Shining Rock, Sam Knob, Cruso
Access: From U.S. Highway 276, travel 8 miles south on the Blue Ridge Parkway and turn onto FS Road 816. Go 1 mile to the crest of the hill, where the trail crosses.
Attractions and Considerations: The first half of this portion of the Art Loeb Trail is perhaps the most spectacular. Black Balsam and Tennant Mountains both exceed 6,000 feet in elevation. A beautiful 5-mile loop may be made by combining the Art Loeb Trail with the Ivestor Gap Road. At Ivestor Gap the Art Loeb crosses into Shining Rock Wilderness. This section of the Art Loeb Trail ends at Deep Gap.
Art Loeb Trail, Section 4
Distance: 3.8 miles
Blaze: None
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Cruso, Waynesville
Access: Access is from the Daniel Boone Boy Scout Camp, off of U.S. Highway 215 four miles south of Bethel, NC. Please notify camp staff if you will be leaving a vehicle at the camp.
Attractions and Considerations: This is a short, but very steep section of the Art Loeb Trail. Because it is in designated wilderness, you will find no signs or trail blazes."
wilconow
12-18-2007, 19:40
There is an excellent book entitled "Trekking The Southern Appalachians" by Jack Igelman.
http://www.biggerbooks.com/bk_detail.aspx?isbn=0898869668
I had two copies of this book, including a signed copy, and damned if I can't find either of 'em! Drat!
It includes excellent information about the Art Loeb Trail. Anyone interested in the trail might consider picking up Jack's book. Nice guy. He's from Asheville and part owner of Second Gear, a used outdoor gear shop in Asheville. http://www.secondgearwnc.com
I just got this book in the mail. It looks INCREDIBLE! Even the photos alone are worth the very reasonable price. It's also so nice to find a book with BACKPACKING routes, and not family day hikes!
You should start a thread on this book. It's awesome! I had no idea it existed beforehand.
Thanks!
Ramble~On
12-18-2007, 20:01
I'd never heard of the book until reading this thread. I spent a few summers guiding backapcking trips for the Boy Scout Camp below Cold Mountain. This is a great area and a really nice trail.
I was able to find a "new" copy on Ebay a minute or two ago and will be watching the mailbox for it.
Almost There
12-18-2007, 22:06
Alright, this trail I thoughtwas way OVERRATED!!! I ended up hiking it with Takoda, last April as Little Bear got sick and had to bail after 2 hours, and Phreak was supposed hike in from the opposite direction but had his water bladder explode in his bag before he even started. We hiked from the Boy Scout camp end back to the town parking area.
So why did I think it sucked? The elevation gain is crazy and hiking it from the direction we went we essentially hiked uphill all day the first day. The trail is not marked well and it is easy to lose as the Nat. Geo map has the trail plotted but doesn't really do a good job of representing the trail. It is a bunch of trails linked with a portion of the Mountains to Sea trail. We managed to get lost at the point where the Art Loeb leaves the Mountains to Sea, from what we can figure we were supposed to take a left turn and head down a Blue Blaze in order to cross the Blue Ridge Parkway. The problem is the map did not show the trail turning onto a Blue Blaze, but it had to be the way to go as we continued to follow the White Blaze of the Mountains to Sea. It was getting dark at this point but we figured we had to be coming to where we would cross soon as the trail appeared to go over a bald on the map...it doesn't! We figured that it skirts the bald later on. Anyways, we continued to hike and I am pretty sure at this point that we went to far, but Takoda never having night hiked is starting to get real nervous. I was thinking, ok, if we come to the Blue Ridge again, we definitely have gone too far. Well, at almost 10pm we come out on the Blue Ridge and we have come too far. Luckily, Takoda, was able to get a local to stop who hitched up back up the parkway to where the trail crossed the trail and we had to hike about a half hour before we could find somewhere to camp. The second day we though surely we'll get to go down hill. Nope, somehow we had ended up on Satan's trail to hell as the trail kept finding a way to to go up and over everything. Water sources also became scarce. The only reliable water source I can remember from that day was near the only shelter on the trail. We had been told by locals that we only had 7 miles to go earlier in the day and so loaded up with enough water to cover the distance that day, well, we figured when we hit the seven miles that we had been told wrong as we were almost out of water and still had about 2-3 miles to go. I took off ahead of him and made it back to the car probably 40 minutes before him and went to get gatorade for both of us as we were both dehyrated as the weather had decided to turn warm with temps in the 80s.
There were a couple of neat views, but there are better hikes in the SE, regardless of what Backpacker or any other publications had to say. Takoda and I discussed this quite a bit on our second day as we were seeing nothing that was that spectacular. I would choose to hike around Damascus or the area around Overmountain shelter any day of the week over the Art Loeb. I can say I hiked it...and I will never hike it again.
That all being said, if you really want a challenging, short, trail...then go for it!
Yes, I have hiked tougher sections of the AT, but I was in trail shape for most of that. It also will be admitted that we did the Art Loeb in 2 days, perhaps 3 days might have made it more enjoyable, I don't know, but neither of us thought it was that great. If someone wants, pm me, and I'll try to upload my pictures of the hike onto WB.
Ramble~On
12-18-2007, 23:59
If you thought it was tough from the scout camp...be glad you didn't hike it the other way.... For a 30 mile trail I really like the Art Loeb and it has plenty to offer..especially scenery. Although a good chunk of it is inside a wilderness area and not blazed or signed it is well used enough to be easy to follow. Some people do get confused around Shining Rock as there is a spiderweb of side trails branching out in all directions but a look at the map pretty clearly shows where the trail goes. There is an pretty insane section of elevation change coming down to the parkway...another reason to be glad you didn't have to climb that...but I still don't think it's that bad of a hike...it is rated as strenuous but aren't most trails in the mountains?
humunuku
12-19-2007, 13:44
I think its a good trial, I'll do it again. I suggest not doing it in 2 days, give it atleast 3 full days and it will be much more enjoyable.
There is an excellent book entitled "Trekking The Southern Appalachians" by Jack Igelman.
http://www.biggerbooks.com/bk_detail.aspx?isbn=0898869668
I had two copies of this book, including a signed copy, and damned if I can't find either of 'em! Drat!
It includes excellent information about the Art Loeb Trail. Anyone interested in the trail might consider picking up Jack's book.
make me the third person that ordered the book. I also picked up a good wildflower book http://www.alibris.com/booksearch?qwork=8810857&matches=14&title=wildflowers+of+Tennessee&cm_re=works*listing*cover
humunuku
12-19-2007, 18:55
All I have to say is my library is bitchin! it has like every trail book...i shall check out Trekking The Southern Appalachians too.
Almost There
12-19-2007, 20:28
Yeah, I've thought about the 2 vs. 3 day thing, getting lost and running out of water might have also colored my view of it. But I decided to join them on the hike the day before we were to leave, and so I broke one of my rules and didn't have my own map, but I still thought the map sucked. BTW, this was the first time I have ever gotten lost on a trail. That being said I have friends who love the Long Trail and friends who despise it. Some of those who despise it have thru-hiked both the AT and PCT, so they aren't newbies by any sense. I guess as in all things some of us just prefer certain trails to others:D
BTW, I know many people think Georgia is rough, but I never really felt that way, so just goes to show...aw, maybe I'm just crazy!:banana
Ramble~On
12-20-2007, 01:13
:rolleyes: Sometimes the voices tell me I'm crazy.
I thought Georgia was rough and I've been lost more than once...
I've taken many a Boy Scout on all or parts of the Art Loeb and some of them didn't make it:D ...I mean they had to be picked up!
I often wondered what people from south Florida were expecting when they signed up for a backpacking trip in the mountains and freaked out when they realized they had to walk uphill carrying a backpack. Hiking up Pilot Mountain can play tricks on you even when you've done it before...you think you're at the top....nope...you think you're at the top.....nope.
That climb seems to go on forever.
Then there are friends who dayhike the entire Art Loeb for fun.
Jan LiteShoe
12-20-2007, 09:16
I think its a good trial, I'll do it again. I suggest not doing it in 2 days, give it atleast 3 full days and it will be much more enjoyable.
And take the side trip up Cold Mountain.
The Solemates
12-20-2007, 11:42
And take the side trip up Cold Mountain.
Coldest outdoor experience I've ever had. -12 degrees between Christmas and New Years without the 30-40mph winds. Had to be colder than that with the wind chill. We had a blast!
Jan LiteShoe
12-20-2007, 12:03
Coldest outdoor experience I've ever had. -12 degrees between Christmas and New Years without the 30-40mph winds. Had to be colder than that with the wind chill. We had a blast!
Not for nothing it's named!
:sun
Good refuge in August. Christmas ... brrr! :)
humunuku
12-20-2007, 18:41
and actually, the last time i was up there, maybe in October, there was some blazes added around shining rock (even though it's all wilderness like and not supposed to have any)
Almost There
12-20-2007, 19:26
Yeah, I'll be honest we got up towards Cold Mountain, looked at the side trail, Little Bear had to bail from being sick and Takoda and I said screw it and kept going. Looking back on it I think we were also in a hurry to meet up with Phreak and that may have led to us getting lost, especially when he told us he was going to meet us at a certain place and so we thought maybe we'll run into him. Later on we realized maybe we wouldn't have gotten lost if we knew he wasn't coming and could have stopped sooner.
Being the size I am I always remember a hike where I run out of water as being a bad hike. 2-3 miles without water is all it takes for my big, bad body to start to feel run down!
Wow, you all are starting to make me reevaluate that hike:-? ....but I still have no desire to hike it again!:eek:
There is an excellent book entitled "Trekking The Southern Appalachians" by Jack Igelman.
http://www.biggerbooks.com/bk_detail.aspx?isbn=0898869668
Mowgli, thanks for recommending this book. Mine came in today. I just browsed thru it and so far it looks like a good book.
Ramble~On
01-03-2008, 04:31
Mowgli, thanks for recommending this book. Mine came in today. I just browsed thru it and so far it looks like a good book.
I second that. Mine arrived ? a week ago. I have a good many trail/hiking books for the same area covered and basically all are pretty much the same. This book's different. It's way more detailed, the maps are really good and the treks give all the info I want to know for any given route including other options from the mainstream.
Being the size I am I always remember a hike where I run out of water as being a bad hike. 2-3 miles without water is all it takes for my big, bad body to start to feel run down!
Two or three miles without water? My God how did you survive? :eek:
Mowgli, thanks for recommending this book. Mine came in today. I just browsed thru it and so far it looks like a good book.
Good deal! I think it belongs on the shelf of any hiker who likes hiking in the SE.
Almost There
01-04-2008, 00:35
Two or three miles without water? My God how did you survive? :eek:
Ha! You're a funny, funny man! Actually, a couple years back I had to go about ten miles w/o it after misreading a map. Kept thinking it had to be coming up. 85 degrees and no water messes me up pretty quick, after ten miles, I finally hit a creek, set up my tent, filled up my bottles and went to bed at 6pm. Couldn't eat, that was probably the worst I have ever been on the trail.
Remember, I am still young and spoiled by my wife, I ain't old and made of leather like yourself!:D
All of my experience with the Art Loeb has been great. I have taken several scout groups up there and have really enjoyed it in all seasons. The only low points were it being dry the first 8 miles out of Davidson River and Pilot mountain seemed like it was a 10 mile climb in itself.
Ramble~On
01-04-2008, 15:50
:D Scenery ! This trail has plenty of that. Water...the maps don't show all sources and anyone doing this trail the first few times wouldn't know exactly where to look-yes, that can be a PITA..The stretch through the Shining Rock Wilderness isn't blazed or signed and there is a spiderweb of trails in places...par for the course in wilderness hiking and part of whatever adventure you make it into.
-----I wonder if Creepy Uncle will chime in and talk about his joy of dayhiking the entire Art Loeb from Davidson River to Camp Daniel Boone.
I've dayhiked it once. I will never do it again and thats something you bet the farm on.
humunuku
01-04-2008, 18:26
I've dayhiked it once. I will never do it again and thats something you bet the farm on.
You day hiked the whole Art Lobe in one day? I agree, I wouldn't want to do that again. But multiday adventures are quite fun up there.
wilconow
03-05-2008, 23:08
I'm doing this sometime in late May. If someone else is interested, let me know and maybe we can do a shuttle/key exchange
Thanks
Jan LiteShoe
03-05-2008, 23:10
I'm doing this sometime in late May. If someone else is interested, let me know and maybe we can do a shuttle/key exchange
Thanks
The outfitter in Brevard might also do shuttles if you don't get a key exhange going. Call around. The raingers might also know where to call.
wilconow
03-05-2008, 23:24
The outfitter in Brevard might also do shuttles if you don't get a key exhange going. Call around. The raingers might also know where to call.
Yep, the outfitters is my second option. Thanks!
Roots and Gungho live in that area. If you need help finding a way to get the trailhead, they may be able to offer suggestions.
I'm doing this sometime in late May. If someone else is interested, let me know and maybe we can do a shuttle/key exchange
Thanks
If we are around (lots of hiking plans) we would be glad to help. Send me a PM about your date. We will be gone from May13th thru the 18th. :)
I second that. Mine arrived ? a week ago. I have a good many trail/hiking books for the same area covered and basically all are pretty much the same. This book's different. It's way more detailed, the maps are really good and the treks give all the info I want to know for any given route including other options from the mainstream.
I will even third that, I actually was able to find a copy in a bookstore here in Brevard. It is a great book. Can't wait to start taking out all 25 of the treks:)
Earl Grey
03-07-2008, 22:44
I was thinking about going to Shining Rock around Easter. Of all the times Ive been there I have never done the whole Art Loeb. Would it be possible to get a shuttle around that time? Also whats the name of the outfitter in Brevard?
wilconow
03-07-2008, 23:07
this is from Jan's earlier post
Also, sounds like Takoda is set with this, but in case anyone else wants to hike this shrt, testy little trail, here's some info I assembled a couple years ago:
"You can get maps from the rangers station just inside the 276 entrance to the Pisgah, or order them from national Geographic maps. Part of the Art is an alternate route for the Mountains to Sea trail, The Art being blazed in white blazes.Jump-off point is Davidson River Campground off 276, accessed from Brevard in Transylvania County; think Highway 64 and Highway 276 intersection.
Looking Glass Outfitters is located near the entrance to Pisgah National Forest, you pass right by it. It's a possible shuttle connection or place to leave a car. Phone: (866) 351-2176, Email: info@lookingglassoutfitters.com
I cribbed this info from their website:
Art Loeb Trail, Section 1
Distance: 12.3 miles
Blaze: White
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Shining Rock, Sam Knob
Access: Turn onto the road to Davidson River Campground, 0.2 mile south of Pisgah District Ranger Station on U.S. Highway 276. Park in the Art Loeb Trailhead parking lot. The other end of this section is at Gloucester Gap on FS Rd. 471, where overnight parking is not recommended.
Attractions and Considerations: The Art Loeb Trail, 30.1 miles long, is a national recreation trail and named after a local hiking enthusiast. Most of the Art Loeb Trail is overlapped by the Mountains-to-the Sea Trail which is blazed with 3-inch white dots. Section 1 begins at the Davidson River and climbs steeply to Shut-in Ridge.
Art Loeb Trail, Section 2
Distance: 7.2 miles
Blaze: White
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Shining Rock, Sam Knob
Access: Start from Gloucester Gap, which is 4.5 miles west of the State Fish Hatchery on FS Road 475. (It is not recommended to leave cars overnight here.) See Access to trail #21 for directions to the other end of this section.
Attractions and Considerations: From Gloucester Gap the trail climbs to Pilot Mountain, a former fire tower site with a 360-degree view. There is a shelter and spring at Deep Gap. The trail then climbs to the Blue Ridge Parkway, winding through a mature upland hardwood forest. From the Parkway it is a steep climb to Silvermine Bald where there is a transition from a hardwood forest to a spruce-fir forest. Near Silvermine Bald the Mountains-to-Sea Trail splits to the west while the Art Loeb Trail follows the ridge northeast to FS Road 816.
Art Loeb Trail, Section 3
Distance: 6.8 miles
Blaze: White
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Shining Rock, Sam Knob, Cruso
Access: From U.S. Highway 276, travel 8 miles south on the Blue Ridge Parkway and turn onto FS Road 816. Go 1 mile to the crest of the hill, where the trail crosses.
Attractions and Considerations: The first half of this portion of the Art Loeb Trail is perhaps the most spectacular. Black Balsam and Tennant Mountains both exceed 6,000 feet in elevation. A beautiful 5-mile loop may be made by combining the Art Loeb Trail with the Ivestor Gap Road. At Ivestor Gap the Art Loeb crosses into Shining Rock Wilderness. This section of the Art Loeb Trail ends at Deep Gap.
Art Loeb Trail, Section 4
Distance: 3.8 miles
Blaze: None
Difficulty: Difficult
USGS Maps: Cruso, Waynesville
Access: Access is from the Daniel Boone Boy Scout Camp, off of U.S. Highway 215 four miles south of Bethel, NC. Please notify camp staff if you will be leaving a vehicle at the camp.
Attractions and Considerations: This is a short, but very steep section of the Art Loeb Trail. Because it is in designated wilderness, you will find no signs or trail blazes."
Earl Grey
03-09-2008, 20:14
What is the parking like at Davidson River Campground? Is it safe?
What is the parking like at Davidson River Campground? Is it safe?I can't quantify an answer for you, but I will say it's one of the larger parking areas and is as close to the Ranger Station as any. It's also very close to Brevard itself. I'm not sure if that is a positive or a negative.
Birdstar07
03-09-2008, 20:29
My friend and i just got done hiking that trail! Theres alot of water on the trail! I think the longesty stretch was maybe 4 miles? But depending how fast you hike it should take you two hours or so to get from water source to water source on that one stretch. The views are AMAZING so have plenty of film!!! I took over a hundred picture over the 30 mile stretch! Hope you had as much fun as I did!!! HAPPY TRAILS
What is the parking like at Davidson River Campground? Is it safe?
The area is well used and patrolled,so yes it is very safe. Roots and myself park their all the time,you have many miles of trails at your disposal. Nothing like having a place like this in your backyard.:)
The area is well used and patrolled,so yes it is very safe. Roots and myself park their all the time,you have many miles of trails at your disposal. Nothing like having a place like this in your backyard.:)That's right, keep rubbing it in GungHo. You're making me jealous. No fair! :D
That's right, keep rubbing it in GungHo. You're making me jealous. No fair! :D
Alrighty then my work here is done. On to the next thread:D
wilconow
05-13-2008, 09:52
What's the side trail up to Cold Mountain like? I read in some guide that it's rough and not well-marked, but this was just a generic guide to asheville and not geared towards hikers
Thanks
It is rough and no trails in the Shining Rock Wilderness are marked (how dumb is that? Like small trail signs are going to ruin the "wilderness experience?"). I haven't been to it yet, but in Shining Rock Gap there are about 10 trails leading out of the clearing . . . take your pick, er uh guess! :eek: Be prepared for lots of "sucker trail" backtracking in SRW. Next trip I'm taking a better map and a compass.
wilconow
05-13-2008, 12:42
Regarding the trail up to Cold Mountain, I wonder if it is unmarked but still obvious and easy to get up/down, or having good nav skills is essential.
Regarding the trail up to Cold Mountain, I wonder if it is unmarked but still obvious and easy to get up/down, or having good nav skills is essential.Once you reach Deep Gap the trail going up to Cold Mountain is easily followed. Getting out of Shining Rock Gap in the right direction heading to the Narrows and Deep Gap is the tricky part. Good thing is that when you hit the Narrows you will be certain you are going the right direction. There are at least 5 or 6 footpaths you can take within an eighth of a mile or so of the small feild in the middle of Shining Rock Gap. The dead end trail to Shining Rock itself seems to cause the most confusion.
wilconow
05-13-2008, 13:37
Thanks Ed Bell. I will be starting at Daniel Boone, so I will not hit Narrows on the ALT until after the spur to Cold Mtn, right??
Also, in your first sentence, do you mean the entire way up/down Cold Mtn is easily followed? I want to go to the top
humunuku
05-13-2008, 13:39
and actually, last fall I noticed some blaze marks painted on the ALT in the wilderness area. They aren't really needed if you have a topo map.
Cold Mtn trail is easy to follow, its pretty well worn in.
Thanks Ed Bell. I will be starting at Daniel Boone, so I will not hit Narrows on the ALT until after the spur to Cold Mtn, right??
Also, in your first sentence, do you mean the entire way up/down Cold Mtn is easily followed? I want to go to the topComing from Daniel Boone you will rise up to Deep Gap and the Cold Mt. spur is on the left. The ALT continues to the right headed out of Deep Gap heading for the Narrows.
The spur headed up Cold Mountain is easily followed all the way up. You will hit a few fasle summits after you reach the saddle between the two higher points. (the taller summit and best trail heads to the right out of the saddle.)
Pardon my using lefts and rights for direction. I can't reference a map right now.
wilconow
05-13-2008, 14:34
Thanks again Ed, and Hum.
Should be starting Tuesday of next week, can't wait!
wilconow
05-26-2008, 23:54
A big thanks to those who provided information about the Art Loeb Trail
I was out this past Tuesday to Thursday (May 21st to 23rd), Southbound.
Photos are in my gallery..
Here's my informal & scattered report:
This is the third straight year I've ventured to the Southern Appalachians (first time by myself). Two years ago it was the Roan Highlands..last year I went from Spivey Gap south to Davenport Gap (Big Bald, Firescald, Max Patch)..
While those were great hikes, I enjoyed this one the most. That's not to say that the Art is necassary a better trail than the others, but I got the most out of this hike.
Solitude.. First day I saw a group of college students @ Deep Gap. That was it. Second day, I had Tennent all to myself, which was glorious. There were another college group on Black Balsam and a lady walking her dog . Around the Forest Rd there were a few people about, but not a crowd. I didn't see another soul until I got near Butter Gap, 7 hours later. Last day I didn't see anyone until I was within a half mile of the finish.
The "Wilderness" from Daniel Boone to Ivestor is really special (keep in mind, the vast majority of my hiking has been on the AT). Such little sign of human activity (no roads, farms, signs, houses, buildings). I suppose I was very fortunate to see very few other people as well. Perhaps this is a big part of why I enjoyed the hike so much. The views at Tennent and Black Balsam helped. The balds go on for a long time..
The diversity you encounter at 5000/6000 ft and then back down is amazing. I love the fir trees, especially coming down from Black Balsam. Down from Pilot, you get back into the familiar forest.
Difficulty.. it's a pretty rough trail in spots, rocky, lots of blowdowns. Most of the climbs are switchbacked (especially Pilot). It's not easy but not extremely challenging either. The trail is maintained pretty well. All of the blowdowns were passable, so I was thinking maybe the maintainers get the real problematic ones out of the way? Not sure. Climbing up, down and around those limbs wear on you a bit.. but part of the rugged charm of the trail
Water.. no problem. Coming from Daniel Boone, there was plenty before you reached Deep Gap. From the Narrows to Ivestor Gap, it's pretty dry, but that's not that long. There's some near Shining Rock Gap and off the trail at Ivestor. Then, there's plenty at the Deep Gap Shelter. Butter Gap has a ton and then a few miles from Davidson is a very short detour on a fire road to Joel Creek
Navigation.. The lack of blazes from Daniel Boone to Ivestor shouldn't be an issue for anyone. I had the excellent Trekking the Southern Appalachians (http://www.rei.com/product/730026) book and the National Geographic map. The book helped some, but with the map it's no problem. The only part where you really have to pay attention is at Shining Rock Gap. There are a lot of trails criss-crossing all over the place, but the key is to just ensure you're going either due south or north. I kept on looking at my compass and also using some process of elimination (the other trails either ended quickly or crossed a stream a few times).
Also, on Black Balsam there are a lot of paths, but that's out of the wilderness and there are some posts up. Unless the weather is horrible, you won't mind wandering around a bit up there anyhow. Just walk towards the fir trees
As far as getting confused with the Mountains to Sea split, I don't quite understand that one.. unless the post with arrows clearly identifying each trail was not there then
Incidentally, has anyone been able to find the plaque dedicated to Art Loeb on top of Black Balsam? The book mentioned that it's not easy to find.. I couldn't spot it
I had a bit of a quandary at about 5pm on my first day. I was near Ivestor Gap and the sky turned really dark. It was pretty windy too. I know that it wasn't a good idea to go over the balds in bad weather, but it was only 5pm. I reasoned that I had plenty of time to complete the trail and I may as well set up my tent before the sky explodes.. didn't quite make it before the storm, but stayed mostly dry. It came down pretty hard, and being up at 5500 feet probably made it just a bit more intense.
So then the storm passes and it's 6pm and the sun is out. I already set up my tent and was considering breaking down camp and taking advantage of a few more hours of sunlight. However, the wind was howling like crazy so I just hung out. It was tough falling asleep that night with my tent flapping in the wind, but eventually it died down.
Morning.. no wind. Over Tennent and Balsam with no clouds, no wind, or people. It worked out perfectly
My shuttle was provided by a local outfitter in Brevard (PM if you're curious). He told me that Looking Glass Outfitters and the other outfitters in Brevard don't do shuttles anymore...which is odd considering this article (http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20080319/NEWS/803190334/0/WEATHER), but oh well
Here's an interesting article on Mr. Loeb
http://www.hikertohiker.com/writings/art-loeb/
Thanks for reading. If you have want a lot packed in a 30 mile hike, do the Art Loeb. Davidson CG is nice, and I liked the town of Brevard (great Mexican place with outdoor seating provided a perfect post-hike meal). Cool CD Store right near there too
Ramble~On
05-27-2008, 06:33
The plaque to Art Loeb is placed into the rock outcropping the trail passes on Black Balsam..it is not the highest point but the most obvious of the rock outcroppings....
:-? It's 5:30 am...I wonder if I can make the sunrise from Black Balsam?
Your trip report was a good one...so good in fact I'm putting on my boots!
:D Photos to Follow
Great report winconow! I'm headed out Thursday to do part of the "ALT" as I'm doing a big loop in Shining Rock. So I'll be doing from Shining Rock Gap down to the parking lot near Black Balsam Knob section. Sounds like you had a great hike!
Hey Wilconow, thanks for sharing. I am so glad your trip went well. Gungho and I are wanting to hike the whole Art Loeb this fall. We've only done bits and pieces. Your report makes me want to put on my shoes and go, too. Maybe I can catch SpiritWind.:D
Thanks again for sharing.
wilconow
05-27-2008, 08:34
Hey Wilconow, thanks for sharing. I am so glad your trip went well. Gungho and I are wanting to hike the whole Art Loeb this fall. We've only done bits and pieces. Your report makes me want to put on my shoes and go, too. Maybe I can catch SpiritWind.:D
Thanks again for sharing.
Thanks for your offer for the shuttle.. hope you had a good time at Trail Days!
There is an excellent book entitled "Trekking The Southern Appalachians" by Jack Igelman.
http://www.biggerbooks.com/bk_detail.aspx?isbn=0898869668
I had two copies of this book, including a signed copy, and damned if I can't find either of 'em! Drat!
It includes excellent information about the Art Loeb Trail. Anyone interested in the trail might consider picking up Jack's book. Nice guy. He's from Asheville and part owner of Second Gear, a used outdoor gear shop in Asheville. http://www.secondgearwnc.com
I was going to hike the Art Loeb Trail next month, but had a sudden infusion of common sense. I'm not interested in freezing my tail off over 6000' in January. I am hiking 90 miles on the Florida Trail instead, and will save the Art Loeb Trail for a warmer season.
I went to Second Gear today after getting Pizza and Beer at APB. There were about 6 copies of this book at around 20 bucks (19 and change). Jack wasn't there, and the employee didn't know that Jack had written the book until I showed him the author's name. My quest for a much cheaper copy of this book is underway.
wilconow
05-27-2008, 18:09
It's worth $20. This isn't a Falcon family hiking book with poorly researched two mile hikes with few details. This lays out great itineraries with a lot of information, maps and excellent photos too.
Yep, "Trekking The Southern Appalachians" by Jack Igelman is the best of my several trail suggestion books in my library. His "Trek 4 - Bartram/Appalachian Loop (NC)" is on my short list - maybe spring of '09! ;)
Much better than the run-of-the-mill "100 Hikes for whimps" typical hiking books! :D :eek:
Ramble~On
05-28-2008, 04:58
I picked up a copy of that book when I read MOWGLI raving about it..it's a great one.
Anyway... almost 24hrs later..
I went up to Black Balsam for the sunrise but missed it on the summit..I caught it on the BRP on the way up. I was happy to find that a new trail with swithbacks now climbs up to the ridgetop and joins the Art Loeb from the gate in the parking area. This is a MAJOR improvement over the old rutted trail that ran straight up!
There's a good reason Wilconow wasn't able to find the Art Loeb plaque !
It's been stolen!
I'll post some photos.
--I spent the morning hiking around and headed down to some waterfalls further down the BRP..I figured I'd go to Craggy Gardens but the BRP is blocked Northbound past Asheville and the detour on I40 runs the whole way to Marion...so I went to Chimney Rock and hiked around there and Lake Lure. An infant recently died at Chimney Rock and I'm still wondering how that could have happened..
So..sad news for me at two places I hiked yesterday.
http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/2/7/8/5/missing_plaque.jpg (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=25116&original=1&c=member&imageuser=2785)
Here's a shot of the rock on Black Balsam. At 1 o'clock of center you can just barely make out the square cut in the rock that the plaque used to fit inside. If you didn't know what to look for it would be very easy to walk right by and miss the cut out- it blends in. Who would steal a plaque off a mountain? I'd imagine a replacement will be installed soon. That's Pilot Mountain in the background.
wilconow
05-28-2008, 08:06
Thanks for the info Spiritwind.. can't believe someone took the plaque
Yeah, I read when I came home that the BRP is closed because a retaining wall failed
You're very fortunate to live down there!
The plaque was stolen a little while back from what I understand. I receive newletters (via email) from Carolina Mountain club and they were talking about it. It is shameful that people feel the need to destroy something people worked hard to do.
Thanks for sharing your photo, it is amazing!
wilconow
06-03-2008, 00:11
okay this is kind of lame but I put some of the 360 degree views on the You-Tube
360 degree view from Tennent Mtn (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjOn4i7k5D4)
Jan LiteShoe
06-03-2008, 16:19
okay this is kind of lame but I put some of the 360 degree views on the You-Tube
360 degree view from Tennent Mtn (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjOn4i7k5D4)
I like it! Takes me back.
I noticed there are other Art Loeb videos on You Tube. The new way to research a trail's high points?
wilconow
06-03-2008, 16:22
oh yeah here's the video from black balsam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIbq5Cl07Z4
oh yeah here's the video from black balsam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIbq5Cl07Z4
My video from Black Balsam's right below yours on the "related videos" Small world, huh :D
I just got back from a two-day trip. We hiked Art Loeb to Shining Rock Gap, then back on the Ivestor Gap Trail. Trail is very dry. The water source on the road at the wilderness area boundary is dry. The spring at the gap was flowing pretty well. The Ivestor Gap trail was completely dry until about a mile from the parking lot, where there was water seeping across the trail (we had a pretty strong thunderstorm the night before).
Blueberries were great! While I heard they aren't as good as prior years, now is the time! We picked about half a gallon in about thirty minutes... Everything within a mile or so of the roads was picked out, but there were plenty once you hiked in for an hour or so.....
wilconow
08-02-2008, 12:02
I just got back from a two-day trip. We hiked Art Loeb to Shining Rock Gap, then back on the Ivestor Gap Trail. Trail is very dry. The water source on the road at the wilderness area boundary is dry. The spring at the gap was flowing pretty well. The Ivestor Gap trail was completely dry until about a mile from the parking lot, where there was water seeping across the trail (we had a pretty strong thunderstorm the night before).
Blueberries were great! While I heard they aren't as good as prior years, now is the time! We picked about half a gallon in about thirty minutes... Everything within a mile or so of the roads was picked out, but there were plenty once you hiked in for an hour or so.....
So you started at the Boy Scout camp? You didn't go to Black Balsalm & Tennent?
So you started at the Boy Scout camp? You didn't go to Black Balsalm & Tennent?
No - we hiked north on the Art Loeb from the paved access road off the Blue Ridge Parkway - up Black Balsam, over Tennent, etc...had to get in the views! We went to Shining Rock Gap on the Art Loeb Trail, then back to the truck on the Ivester Gap Trail....
We came out on Friday. There were at least 20 vehicles in the parking lot, and we passed quite a few trucks with packs in the back (one older van had 4 packs strapped to the top) as we went south on 215...looked like it would be crowded this weekend!
wilconow
08-02-2008, 23:24
cool! sounds like a great trip.. love to see photos if you got them
I met someone camping a couples miles before butter gap (I started at the scout camp and went to davidson river) who only had time to do an out and back overnight.. was trying to convey how nice the balds are, and to take an extra day, but I guess he really didn't have time!
chuckle...had a great time - my son said, "dad, this has been a really good trip." ...and I forgot the camera! He got to see (again) the views from Black Balsam, Tennant, and Shining Rock....
wilconow
09-22-2008, 22:42
I just updated the Wikipedia page for the ALT - it was a stub before, with just a brief description and the photo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_Loeb_Trail
Let me know what you think, thanks!
I just updated the Wikipedia page for the ALT - it was a stub before, with just a brief description and the photo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_Loeb_Trail
Let me know what you think, thanks!WTG wilconow! I like it. BTW does your username have anything to do with the band Wilco?
Jan LiteShoe
09-22-2008, 23:34
I just updated the Wikipedia page for the ALT - it was a stub before, with just a brief description and the photo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_Loeb_Trail
Let me know what you think, thanks!
Oh good, you got the webcam worked in there - one of my favorites to "check up" on the mountains during the day, see what weather might be blowing my way.
:sun
Nice pics and nice basics. Maybe some links to this thread? To
And you'll have to work "heath balds" and "ridgeline hiking" in there somewhere!
;-)
I have an Art Loeb Trail photo essay on my trailjournal here:
http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?trailname=4575
Thanks for posting - one of my favorite "secret-little" trails.
It deserves a little respect!
:)
wilconow
09-23-2008, 10:44
WTG wilconow! I like it. BTW does your username have anything to do with the band Wilco?
Thanks! Yeah, I don't like Wilco's recent albums but I created this username 5 years ago. One of these days, I'll change it
Nice pics and nice basics. Maybe some links to this thread? To
And you'll have to work "heath balds" and "ridgeline hiking" in there somewhere!
;-)
I have an Art Loeb Trail photo essay on my trailjournal here:
http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?trailname=4575
Thanks for posting - one of my favorite "secret-little" trails.
It deserves a little respect!
:)
My pleasure! I added your photo journal. After all, that's where I got "pluton" from
As far as Heath Balds, according to this Wikipedia page, Black Balsam Knob is actually a Grassy Bald
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appalachian_bald
I didn't realize that it's apparently the highest bald in the Appalachians
Thanks! Yeah, I don't like Wilco's recent albums but I created this username 5 years ago. One of these days, I'll change it
My pleasure! I added your photo journal. After all, that's where I got "pluton" from
As far as Heath Balds, according to this Wikipedia page, Black Balsam Knob is actually a Grassy Bald
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appalachian_bald
I didn't realize that it's apparently the highest bald in the Appalachians
Great job!!! I love the Art Loeb and look forward to every fall and spring to take advantage of it. I've never done the whole thing but hopefully here in the next year we can get it finished. Especially since it is in my backyard. :)
OldStormcrow
09-23-2008, 16:13
The plaque was stolen a little while back from what I understand. I receive newletters (via email) from Carolina Mountain club and they were talking about it. It is shameful that people feel the need to destroy something people worked hard to do.
Thanks for sharing your photo, it is amazing! Unfortunately, this area is just so close to the road in Ivestor Gap that you get all kinds of vandalism, litter, frat parties, unethical hunters, people burning trail signs in their campfires, etc. Wish I had stumbled across whoever did this while they were in the act.....they (the authorities) might have never found the bodies!
I am planning to head up there this weekend. I am driving up on Friday night and will likely try to sleep in the car at the trailhead Friday night. I just want to make sure there is overnight parking here and whether it is relatively safe to leave a car there overnight. I wanted to see the highlights of the Art Loeb Trail and gain some knowledge of the area so I can come back in the Spring. I plan on hiking a 12-15mi loop using this as a starting point.
http://www.localhikes.com/HikeData.ASP?DispType=0&ActiveHike=0&GetHikesStateID=&ID=4849
Also, are there good campsites near the summit of Balck Balsam or Tennent? I am looking to camp near the bald so I can catch some of the Lenoids.
Thanks in advance!!
If you're talking about parking in the parking lot at the base of Black Balsam Knob, or along the road where the trail crosses the road, you should be fine. I've parked there many times with no problems.
I'm a hammocker, so haven't camped on the peaks, but have seen several campsites on the knobs there.
humunuku
11-11-2008, 13:40
Also, are there good campsites near the summit of Balck Balsam or Tennent? I am looking to camp near the bald so I can catch some of the Lenoids.
Thanks in advance!!
I don't think there any on Tennent, but there are plenty in the area with great wide open views
wilconow
12-29-2008, 14:09
Here's a good report of the annual Winter solstice ALT run. Mentions David Horton and Jennifer Davis
http://mohammednc.blogspot.com/2008/12/8th-art-loeb-adventure-trail-run.html
OldStormcrow
12-29-2008, 15:09
I'm going to be doing the whole Art Loeb starting at Daniel Boone on 1/10. I'm hoping that the weather will cool back down a bit before then. Hiking in 34 degrees and rain is not nearly as nice as about 20 degrees and snow!
NCYankee
12-30-2008, 13:04
Am I correct that the general consensus is to go NOBO on this trail? Obviously both routes are strenuous, but which direction is more so?
wilconow
12-30-2008, 14:26
I went south. There are tough climbs throughout (Pilot Mountain!) but I would think the biggest climbs are at the beginning. Coming from the Boy Scout camp, it really wasn't bad.. maybe because I was fresh. The descent down to the Davidson River seemed like it was longer and involved more feet.
An advantage of going south is that you're starting off in the wilderness, where there are no signs, blazes, etc, and for me it was good to begin with that.. more alert, patient and all.
Jan LiteShoe
12-30-2008, 22:50
Am I correct that the general consensus is to go NOBO on this trail? Obviously both routes are strenuous, but which direction is more so?
Coming up from the Davidson River is more strenuous, I think, because you are climbing out of the river bottom into 6K territory.
You get a good workout though, and crosing the Blue Ridge parkway is a real milestone. Then, the trail just gets really great from there, lots of balds, deep fir forests and interesting terrain.
There are photos of a 2006 NOBO here: (http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?trailname=4575) Hit the photos button on the left.
OldStormcrow
12-31-2008, 09:30
I have to confess that I am going to "cheat" a bit and come up from Daniel Boone on the Little East Fork trail, rather than the Deep Gap trail. I've hiked the Deep Gap trail section of the Art Loeb in both directions more than once and found it to be tedious and pointless with little or no decent views. The Little East Fork trail follows the river/creek for a good way, is much more scenic, and is much better graded.
I have to confess that I am going to "cheat" a bit and come up from Daniel Boone on the Little East Fork trail, rather than the Deep Gap trail. I've hiked the Deep Gap trail section of the Art Loeb in both directions more.
Sounds smart. Despite what some will tell you on the AT, there is no such thing as cheating in hiking. :sun
OldStormcrow
12-31-2008, 16:16
I figure that I'll at least be able to say that I've "done" the whole Art Loeb trail, since I've already done the Deep Gap section so many times. What I'm not looking forward to is the long downhill after Black Balsam......lots o' pounding on the old knees and hips. I'm making this a fairly leisurely 3-nighter.
Jan LiteShoe
12-31-2008, 16:48
I figure that I'll at least be able to say that I've "done" the whole Art Loeb trail, since I've already done the Deep Gap section so many times. What I'm not looking forward to is the long downhill after Black Balsam......lots o' pounding on the old knees and hips. I'm making this a fairly leisurely 3-nighter.
That's why the Creator made ibuprofen, OldStormCrow!
:)
OldStormcrow
12-31-2008, 17:34
Yep, nothing a little ibuprofen and Bushmills Irish whiskey can't cure!
My wife and I are planning to do a 2-3 day backpack, and then some day hikes on and around the Art Loeb trail in mid Oct..
Could anyone recommend lodging in the area? We will be coming in from the east, so lodging on the Brevard / Asheville side would be preferred.
Nothing fancy, just clean, and not too far from restaurants / groceries.
Thanks in advance!
Bill
wilconow
10-07-2009, 18:26
I think there's a Hampton Inn right near the Davidson River Campground in Brevard.
Chaco Taco
10-07-2009, 19:01
For the north end of the trail, there is an Inn on top of Pisgah, bout 10 miles from an intersection of the Art Loab. If you are starting at the Boy Scout camp you will have to come in from I40 to 215 to SR 1129 that goes to the camp. Its about a 45 minute drive from Asheville. There is an intersection of the Blue Ridge Parkway near Graveyard Fields. There are a couple of places to stay that are cheap. the Hampton Inn as mentioned. Look for places on Tunnel Road. There is an Ingles across the street from Hampton Inn and Black Dome Outfitter is right down the street too.
The Mountain To Sea trail is a good trail. Park at Graveyard Fields and jump up on the M2S and you can turn right onto the Art loab and go up to Balsam.
Santino12
02-23-2011, 21:58
I am planning on doing the Art Loeb next week after reading this forum. Any general advice for my dog and I? I have done some overnight backpacking, but am certainly not an expert. I do plan on getting the map and trying to arrange a shuttle. Am currently debating about going N--S or S--N.
Thank you.