View Full Version : Hiking the Smokey Mountian Park
Doughnut
11-17-2007, 08:43
I am planning to hike the GSMNP in April, during my spring break. I see where I can make reservations up to 30 days in advance, and, since I will not be thru-hiking, I need to register in advance. These things I know.
My reason for this posting is to seek advice about accomodations, I saw where you cannot tent near a shelter (What's "near" - in sight of?)
Should I tent (preference) or shelter? I plan about 12-15 per day for the 70 miles, and NOBO or SOBO makes no never mind to me.
I figure the park will be crowded with the NOBO's at that time?
Thoughts? Suggestions?
Thanks, Dough Nut
Frolicking Dinosaurs
11-17-2007, 08:47
Info here
http://www.nps.gov/grsm/planyourvisit/backcountry-regs.htm
Doughnut
11-17-2007, 08:50
Yeah, I have that Dino, I am looking more for "experiences" and recommendations.
Thank you
Lone Wolf
11-17-2007, 08:50
if it were me i would just get the permit at either end self-registration kiosk and fill it out as THRU-HIKER. Nobody would care. there's so many thru-hikers going through there then.
Yeah, I have that Dino, I am looking more for "experiences" and recommendations.
Thank you
My suggestion is to go to trailjournals.com for 2007. Look at journals with dates starting around April 1 to around April 14. That seems to be the average dates that NOBOs arrive at the Smokies. It surprises me how much I have learned just by reading entries. Good Luck!:)
Doughnut
11-17-2007, 09:13
if it were me i would just get the permit at either end self-registration kiosk and fill it out as THRU-HIKER. Nobody would care. there's so many thru-hikers going through there then.
You don't reckon I'd offend anyone portraying what I am not yet??
I have been foloowing trail journals, a friend of mine here was in that late storm last year, ended up spending 4 days in Gatlinburg due to the storm - he sectioned Springer to Damascus
Lone Wolf
11-17-2007, 09:16
[SIZE=3][COLOR=red]You don't reckon I'd offend anyone portraying what I am not yet??
no because nobody that gets there from springer is a "thru-hiker" either.
Doughnut
11-17-2007, 09:29
I read where they consider a "thru-hiker" as someone who has started 50 miles or more prior and will finish 50 miles or more after.
so, self register and tent? sounds great, thanks.
Lone Wolf
11-17-2007, 09:33
I read where they consider a "thru-hiker" as someone who has started 50 miles or more prior and will finish 50 miles or more after.
so, self register and tent? sounds great, thanks.
"they" say that but nobody checks. trust me.
BlackCloud
11-17-2007, 10:28
Why the Mountains are Smoky and the Bear is Smokey, I'll never know......
Rain Man
11-17-2007, 11:59
I section-hiked the AT through the GSMNP a couple of years ago with my nephew on his Spring Break. Had no problem at all honorably getting the necessary legal reservations. I just called 30 days ahead.
Yes, there were plenty of thru-hikers in the shelters and in tents at the shelters. Spirits were high and it was a lot of fun.
Have a great time!
Rain:sunMan
.
Went up and section hiked the smokies last year around the end of March. Tons of spring breakers and thru's. Shelters were packed and so was Cades Cove. Never made it all the way to clingmans due to weather and a friend of ours was still dealing with a broken toe. Had a blast though.
I prefer the self registering "thru-hiker" permit that comes with the option of tenting if the shelter is full.
I agree with Lone Wolf here. If I were to hike just the Smokies, I'd self register as a thru-hiker, especially if it were thru-hiking season. Nobody cares. Also, people at shelters would probably be glad you were tenting . During that time, it's six of one, half a dozen of the other anyhow. Meaning, you're going to be at shelters along with many, many others. What difference does it make who stays in a shelter and who stays in a tent. Abide by the rules of the park. If the shelter has room in it, you have to stay in the shelter. If you're in a full shelter and someone comes along that has a reservation, you may need to be the one that vacates the shelter for them. Sounds to me like this wouldn't be a problem for you, seeing as how you want to tent. I know I'd gladly give up my spot to someone in a crowded shelter in order to tent. Thank-you.
Hiked the Smokies two years ago starting March 1st. Was 65 degrees at Fontana Dam. Within two days it was 15 degrees at night, cold and windy. I froze my butt off. Up near Clingmans Dome it was still a lot of snow and Ice. Only met a handful of Thru hikers on this hike so room in the shelters was plentiful. Most of the Thru hikers don't start at Springer until April 1st anyway.The weather can change so fast up there, so pack heavy..............have a good hike:)
Doughnut
11-19-2007, 18:40
I must be missing something, because I read in the NPS pages that you are not allowed to camp except in established shelters or camgrounds (NO campgrounds on the trail, according to my map) and no tenting at the shelters, Basically, the way I read it is "On the AT, you may only stay in shelters"
Now, If I make reservations 30 days in advance (which I will) what happens if the shelter is over filled due to self registering thru hikers? Is it ok to go next to the shelter and tent?
I am not trying to be picky or anything, I somply do not want to give hikers a black eye because I didn't follow the rules.
thanks,
Dough Nut
Lone Wolf
11-19-2007, 18:43
if you have a reservation for a shelter and arrive there and it's full of thru-hikers then someone has to move out and give you the space.
if you have a reservation for a shelter and arrive there and it's full of thru-hikers then someone has to move out and give you the space.This is one of the reasons the rules for the shelters in the Smokys are terrible. Seems like the legit reservation holders are always the ones left trying to secure their rightful spot. I've seen it before and have altered my use of the AT in the Smokys because of it. Not saying I have a remedy, but the shelters are a zoo when they are packed to capacity and the reservation holders are late in arriving. Never a relaxing evening when hikers are being moved after they are set up. Bad vibes and attitudes suck when one is trying to unwind in the woods. Before anyone jumps on me for this, I have seen it even outside of "thru hiking" season.
Lone Wolf
11-19-2007, 19:13
that's why Dough should just register as a thru-hiker
I must be missing something, because I read in the NPS pages that you are not allowed to camp except in established shelters or camgrounds (NO campgrounds on the trail, according to my map) and no tenting at the shelters, Basically, the way I read it is "On the AT, you may only stay in shelters"
Now, If I make reservations 30 days in advance (which I will) what happens if the shelter is over filled due to self registering thru hikers? Is it ok to go next to the shelter and tent?
I am not trying to be picky or anything, I somply do not want to give hikers a black eye because I didn't follow the rules.
thanks,
Dough Nut
Of the 12 spots in shelters, 8 are by reservation, leaving 4 for thru-hikers. Once the shelter is full thru-hikers are allowed to camp. Personally, I'd like to see it the other way around in April and May, but then I'm cosidered a thruhiking elitist! :p
john gault
11-19-2007, 20:03
I must be missing something, because I read in the NPS pages that you are not allowed to camp except in established shelters or camgrounds (NO campgrounds on the trail, according to my map) and no tenting at the shelters, Basically, the way I read it is "On the AT, you may only stay in shelters"
Now, If I make reservations 30 days in advance (which I will) what happens if the shelter is over filled due to self registering thru hikers? Is it ok to go next to the shelter and tent?...
That was my understanding also, until I got there and saw the notice at the registration station. If the shelter is full, Thru-hiker(s) must pitch a tent near the shelter. I agree with LW, just register as a thru, it's much less hassel.
john gault
11-19-2007, 20:08
...
Now, If I make reservations 30 days in advance (which I will) what happens if the shelter is over filled due to self registering thru hikers? Is it ok to go next to the shelter and tent?...
If you do decide to make reservations and you get to a shelter that is full, then you tell one of them thrus to get the hell out of your shelter.
Flush2wice
11-19-2007, 20:10
that's why Dough should just register as a thru-hiker
Maybe that's why Dough should think about hiking another stretch of the AT in April, OR if he wants the Smokies, another trail rather than the AT.
Seriously, the Smokies are great, but April is the worst time on the AT. There's thru hikers, and spring breakers at the same time. Also the mudsnakes are thawing out.
Unless you are specifically looking for an AT experience, you might actually prefer the Benton MacKaye Trail through the park. It is lower in elevation, so snow and ice are less of an issue. It gets less traffic as well. It's nearly 100 miles, but you could break it down and hike from Smokemont to Fontana and have a hot shower waiting at you vehicle at the end of a 62 mile route.
You could easily get shuttles from Standing Bear Hostel (http://standingbearfarm.tripod.com/) or the folks at the Hike Inn (http://www.thehikeinn.netfirms.com/). Standing Bear is usually a little cheaper, though it may not be the case since they are on the opposite side of the park in this case.
But the BMT would make a great alternative to the AT at this snowy, yet busy, season in the park.
Frolicking Dinosaurs
11-19-2007, 20:46
Reminding everyone that suggesting illegal solutions is not allowed under the TOS of the site.
Frolicking Dinosaurs
11-19-2007, 20:52
A question for those brave enough to go in the GSMNP on the AT during tourist & thru infestation season :D : If someone with a shelter reservation arrives at the shelter to find his spot taken by a thru, can he legally elect to tent rather than throw the thru out of his space? Given the crowding during April, if a person with a shelter reservation can legally do this, then this is the answer.... the shelters will be full every single night.
Of the 12 spots in shelters, 8 are by reservation, leaving 4 for thru-hikers. Once the shelter is full thru-hikers are allowed to camp. Personally, I'd like to see it the other way around in April and May, but then I'm cosidered a thruhiking elitist! :pDo you know the timetable the Park service uses for this? Biggest problem with your plan that I see is that weekend/ overnighters with legit shelter reservations will be even more likely to be put in a tough spot while they are obeying the rules. After all, if you have a legit shelter reservation, why would you carry anything more than emergency shelter in your pack? Thru hikers should have more than that. Combine that with a rainy night and you have friction that shouldn't be there in the first place. The AT in the Smokys or anywhere else is not there for anyone more so than anyone else. I understand the problem with reservations in a fluid situation like a thru-hike, but the hikers who take MONTHS to plan a short hike on the AT in the Smokey's shouldn't have to worry about securing a reserved space. Tough issue.
john gault
11-19-2007, 21:03
A question for those brave enough to go in the GSMNP on the AT during tourist & thru infestation season :D : If someone with a shelter reservation arrives at the shelter to find his spot taken by a thru, can he legally elect to tent rather than throw the thru out of his space? Given the crowding during April, if a person with a shelter reservation can legally do this, then this is the answer.... the shelters will be full every single night.
The thru-hiker must pitch a tent, not the guy with the reservation, this would be a violation of park rules. I've heard many reasons for this, but the one which I believe may be true is that a thru-hiker is more likely to observe LNT practices, therefore the GSMNP officials want the thru-hiker to camp.
The thru-hiker must pitch a tent, not the guy with the reservation, this would be a violation of park rules. I've heard many reasons for this, but the one which I believe may be true is that a thru-hiker is more likely to observe LNT practices, therefore the GSMNP officials want the thru-hiker to camp.In a perfect world....but, if we had a perfect world, we wouldn't have to worry about the impact of a few overflow backpackers. Not trying to refute john. He is 100% correct about the Park regulation.
Lone Wolf
11-20-2007, 07:17
The thru-hiker must pitch a tent, not the guy with the reservation, this would be a violation of park rules. I've heard many reasons for this, but the one which I believe may be true is that a thru-hiker is more likely to observe LNT practices, therefore the GSMNP officials want the thru-hiker to camp.
most people attempting a thru-hike have never hiked long distance before. when and if they make it to the Smokys they're still wet behind the ears. their LNT practices are no better than anyone else's. LNT is non-existant at shelters anyway. especially in the Smokys.
john gault
11-20-2007, 10:10
most people attempting a thru-hike have never hiked long distance before. when and if they make it to the Smokys they're still wet behind the ears. their LNT practices are no better than anyone else's. LNT is non-existant at shelters anyway. especially in the Smokys.
I agree. Just an attempt at explaining the bureaucracy's reasoning. Besides, if they really cared about LNT, why are there so few privies?
.
Flush2wice
11-20-2007, 10:13
Besides, if they really cared about LNT, why are there so few privies?
.
Because they get filled up with trash.
john gault
11-20-2007, 10:28
Because they get filled up with trash.
All I know is that it's dangerous to walk through the "toliet area" of the shelters; would be good training for walking through a mine field.
whitefoot_hp
11-21-2007, 10:49
is the BMT through the smokies comparably as scenic as the AT?
is the BMT through the smokies comparably as scenic as the AT?
Weekend before last my husband and I hiked a little section from Mt. Sterling to Big Creek. It was gorgeous. A very good view from Mt. Sterling. We could see Max Patch, Mt. Cammerer, etc. Then the BMT went into a magic fir forest. It was a great six-mile stretch. I'm looking forward to hiking more of the BMT in the Park.
Flush2wice
11-21-2007, 11:10
is the BMT through the smokies comparably as scenic as the AT?
I've only done portions of it so others will know more than me but....
It stays lower than the AT so you don't have as many huge vistas. However it does go through some spectacular areas with lots of creeks and streams. Some people think of "scenic" as big views from high places. I think of scenic as beautiful places. So IMO the BMT is every bit as nice as the AT. Maybe moreso because it's not as trashed from the crowds and you get to tent more instead of sheltering. In fact theres only 1 shelter but about 30 campsites. It's a particularly good option during dry spells and thru/tourist seasons.
If your hiking all the way through and wish to resupply- you take hwy 441 to Cherokee NC at about the halfway point. It should be an easy hitch from the Smokemont campground. If more AT thru hikers start to choose the BMT route I'll predict that Smokemont becomes Yogi Central.
Chaco Taco
12-06-2007, 23:05
Did this hike back in MArch and was with 2 Ridgerunners the first 3 days and was never asked for my permit. If you dont like shelters, just pre reg as Thru. The runners were more interested in the kids on Spring break just coming up to get drunk and stoned. Great hike though. I got 60 degree days and really clear visibility. PLan an extra day and do the Boulevard Trail to Leconte, totally worth it.
Tennessee Viking
12-07-2007, 00:17
I am planning to hike the GSMNP in April, during my spring break. I see where I can make reservations up to 30 days in advance, and, since I will not be thru-hiking, I need to register in advance. These things I know.
My reason for this posting is to seek advice about accomodations, I saw where you cannot tent near a shelter (What's "near" - in sight of?)
Should I tent (preference) or shelter? I plan about 12-15 per day for the 70 miles, and NOBO or SOBO makes no never mind to me.
I figure the park will be crowded with the NOBO's at that time?
Thoughts? Suggestions?
Thanks, Dough NutAll or most of the shelters in the Smokies are gated for bears. If you are wanting to tent, you will need the latest National Geographic map of the Smokies or a park map. It will list camp sites along the AT and park trails.
AT Trail guide will also list camping opportunities.
All or most of the shelters in the Smokies are gated for bears.
Is this still true? I thought that the park was eliminating this practice. A response to the reverse zoo principal. I'm pretty sure Icewater and LeConte didn't have fenced entries the last time I stayed there, but had them in the past.
Is this still true? I thought that the park was eliminating this practice. A response to the reverse zoo principal. I'm pretty sure Icewater and LeConte didn't have fenced entries the last time I stayed there, but had them in the past.
Neither of those shelters have the fences. The new Cosby shelter doesn't either. I think the Mt Collins shelter still has a fence.
Frolicking Dinosaurs
12-07-2007, 06:35
As the shelters are being re-done in GSMNP, the fences are being removed. A ranger told me this was being done because people were keeping their packs / food in the caged shelters instead of using the bear cables provided and it was fostering the rodent problems shelters are renowned for having. He also said that some people had teased bears from behind the caged area and this is certainly not a behavior the park wanted to encourage.
As for the AT versus the BMT: While there are a few other very popular trails that are nearly as trashed as the AT, virtually any trail in the GSMNP is nicer than the AT IMO. The BMT is a beautiful hike thru old-growth forest and has many more options for camping. Since it is lower, you don't get the views, but you see far more things like wildlife, the diverse fauna and flora of the GSMNP, cascades, waterfalls and far less trash, people and horribly abused campsites & treadway. The lower elevation also means water is more readily available.
nitewalker
12-07-2007, 09:04
"they" say that but nobody checks. trust me.
trust him!!! i have done the same, pick up permit at the "kiosk"...nice wording on that one.......peace
p.s. lonewolf; did you ever hook up with good ol roy?? peace, nitewalker
Lone Wolf
12-07-2007, 09:25
trust him!!! i have done the same, pick up permit at the "kiosk"...nice wording on that one.......peace
p.s. lonewolf; did you ever hook up with good ol roy?? peace, nitewalker
matter of fact i spent last night at Abingdon Gap shelter with Roy and 3 other SOBOs
Lone wolf I hiked w R one day in the carter range,we stayed at rattle river shelter.I loved his cooking style.
nitewalker
12-07-2007, 09:41
matter of fact i spent last night at Abingdon Gap shelter with Roy and 3 other SOBOs
you have got to be kidding...im supposed to hook up with the group. i had hiked with them up in the shenandoahs..im heading to florida on monday then north to wherever they may be..at least that is the current plan......peace, nitewalker
Lone Wolf
12-07-2007, 09:43
on monday they will be around 19E/Hump Mtn. area
nitewalker
12-07-2007, 09:46
i will not see them till maybe on wed or thur sometime. i need to drop off a car in ocala. was burt still with that group[the older guy]?
Nitewalker things are looking good.
Lone Wolf
12-07-2007, 09:48
burt went home from damascus yesterday. his wife is ill.
nitewalker
12-07-2007, 09:51
burt went home from damascus yesterday. his wife is ill.
thats horrible! i am going to give him a shout a little later on. when i hiked with these guys i seemed to develop a bond with R and burt[closer to my age]. most the other hikers in that group were 10 to 15 yrs younger than i and im 40...i hope to meet you on the trail someday....
Dough,
Unless you are set on hiking the AT thru GSMNP, you might want to consider the Benton MacKaye Trail... This is a great option, water sources are very good and campsites are not as congested...
nitewalker
12-07-2007, 09:55
Nitewalker things are looking good.
the ? is will the dog be free to roam or will the unbreakable leash be too tight:-? ??
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm:-? nitewalker
I'm about half way thru my chain. Nitewalker more good news.