View Full Version : Dehydrating jerky - raw meat ??
My husband is trying to tell me that you put the steak in the dehydrating machine raw to make jerky .... ??????
Is this right ?????
Jerky always seems very over cooked to me in the store......raw meat sounds gory.
wrongway_08
02-17-2008, 14:41
Starts with raw meat..... just dry it out with a dehydrater....... Old bay seasoning is really good!
I usually buy the thin sliced meat, then spice it up, let it sit in the fridge over night, then lightly pound it with a small hammer to get it a even thickness and then just toss it in a dehydrater for a while.
wrongway_08
02-17-2008, 14:44
You want the meat to be about 1/4 to just under 1/2 inch thick so it dries evenly in each batch.
Test out different spices. If you over dry it a little, no biggie - just dont under-dry it if you plan on storing it for a while.
Oh yea, best to use real meat, not ground beef - just taste/looks a lot better.
john gault
02-17-2008, 14:49
I do. I even put poultry in raw. Many books I've read say to cook it first, but I never have. And it's kept for about a year, probably longer, but that's how long it took to eat.
One thing I do is marinade it overnight in a simple marinade of soy sauce or the like. You can get really elaborate, but I just keep it simple when I'm doing large amount for my hikes. I also add about a tablespoon of salt for every pound of meat, probably an over kill, but that's why it stay good for so long.
Dehydrating uses heat like cooking (I dehydrate about 145 degrees F), but it's not cooking per say. You are removing moisture so bacteria can't grow. When you cook you don't want to remove the moisture because then the steak won't melt in your mouth.
Just tell him to remove as much fat as possible, but don't get obsessive about it, you'll never remove all of it. Fat does not dehydrate, so for the fat that you can not blot away with a napkin because it won't all liquifiy, will remain and be a source for bacteria to grow - another reason I use so much salt.
john gault
02-17-2008, 15:02
Like Wrongway said the thickness of the slice is important. I also forgot to says that I heat up my marinade so the salt disovles, but I don't put the meat/poultry in the marinade until it cools down a little so I don't "cook" the meat.
I would recommend getting a dehydrator, if you don't already have one. They usually come with a cookbook. An oven is not an efficient way to dehydrate because of the power issue and a dehydrator blows air over the food, carrying away moisture quicker.
Wise Old Owl
02-17-2008, 15:36
My husband is trying to tell me that you put the steak in the dehydrating machine raw to make jerky .... ??????
Jerky always seems very over cooked to me in the store......raw meat sounds gory.
Yes that is right. The only risk is grinded meat, such as hamburger and recently the handling of chicken. London Broil is one of my favorites, I will buy a package and I have a cheap home use slicer, I slice it all up and soak it in light soy with barbecue sauces and pepper. 15 minute soak takes a very light flavor, overnight in the refrigerator is a stronger flavor. Then off to the "Ronco Dehydrator" I can't handle all that salt & natural sodium so making my own is the way to go.
Avoid anything that looks like Chuck
I brown the burger before it hits the dryer as a precaution.
Chicken I am still playing around with but small thin strips are essential so I start with a washed Chicken Breast meat that I run though the slicer after frying in Olive Oil / Soy cook before drying.
bigcranky
02-17-2008, 18:38
London Broil, sliced very thin, marinated overnight in soy sauce, fresh lime juice, and honey. Place it on the dehydrator trays and grind on some fresh pepper.
Use the highest heat setting.
hammock engineer
02-17-2008, 18:52
Also get a lean cut of meat. I had issues with fat a couple times.
Do ya'll dry fruits & veggies too
_terrapin_
02-17-2008, 20:27
Important to marinate the meat thoroughly, first, for 12-24 hours. Usually a mix containing lots of soy or teriyaki sauce, aka "liquid salt." Cut the meat into thin strips, make sure that the marinade liquid completely covers the meat. Use lean meat!
scavenger
02-17-2008, 21:01
You can also sun-dry jerky on a clothesline in the sun. flys will land on it but it dont matter. if the meat aint dry after a day, put it in the fridge and hang it again the next day.
john gault
02-17-2008, 22:41
You can also sun-dry jerky on a clothesline in the sun. flys will land on it but it dont matter. if the meat aint dry after a day, put it in the fridge and hang it again the next day.
That's too "old school" for me, except for the fridge part.:D
That's too "old school" for me, except for the fridge part.:D
Yeah, real old school means no fridge. Then you have to cover it at night to keep the dew from settling on it. Use the hide it came in.
Wise Old Owl
02-18-2008, 00:37
Do ya'll dry fruits & veggies too
NO.
There is a reason for sun dried tomatos - the god awful smell.
If you can pick it up cheaply at the supermarket - bag it.
Solar dehydrators are easy to make, I remember running across the plans for them one time when I was doing a search for some other solar project I was working on.
If I didn’t already have a few dehydrators I think I would rather make one of these then allow bugs to land on & eat part of my jerky. That just sounds too unpleasant to think about eating myself…:eek:
You guys are just too squeamish. The bugs aren't taking your food, they're adding protein.
You guys are just too squeamish. The bugs aren't taking your food, they're adding protein.
Just wondering if fly scat would be considered protein or carbohydrates :-?:D
bigcranky
02-18-2008, 08:44
There is a reason for sun dried tomatos - the god awful smell.
If you can pick it up cheaply at the supermarket - bag it.
The smell of drying tomatoes is close to heaven. The smell of drying *strawberries* is way beyond heaven, approaching nirvana.
We dry fruits: strawberries, cherries, apples, pineapple, mostly. Buy the fruit in season at the local farmer's market when it's cheap. We usually get 4 gallons of strawberries and dry 3 (and eat the others); do that two or three times in May and you'll have dried strawberries for a couple of years. There's a cherry orchard not far away -- we pick several gallons and dry those. I like Granny Smith apples dried -- we look for them on sale in 5 lb bags.
Veggies: plum tomatoes are easy and very tasty, get them from your own garden or the local farmer's market. Onions and peppers, same thing. Mushrooms are easy, as are various beans (cook them first or use canned).
Beyond that, you can dry cooked pasta and rice (better than instant rice), tomato sauce, chili, almost any kind of stew, etc. Spread it thinly on parchment paper in the dehydrator until very dry.
Also, I really like that chicken that comes in a bag -- but a week's worth gets heavy. It dries pretty well, and rehydrates okay, unlike jerky. Not sure why it doesn't turn into jerky itself, though.
All of this is predicated on the assumption that you want to make your own hiking meals, either for short hikes or for maildrops on a thru-hike. You may want to do this for health reasons (low salt diet, etc.), or to have more control over what goes down the hatch.
[quote=bigcranky;540487]Also, I really like that chicken that comes in a bag -- but a week's worth gets heavy. It dries pretty well, and rehydrates okay, unlike jerky. Not sure why it doesn't turn into jerky itself, though. /quote]
'cause it's cooked first.
wrongway_08
02-18-2008, 09:05
Just wondering if fly scat would be considered protein or carbohydrates :-?:D
Ahhh but its not fly scat they are leaving behind - its fly throw-up and larva, both a good source of protein! :cool:
Added benifit, the throw-up helps seal in the flavor. :eek:
bigcranky
02-19-2008, 08:02
[quote=bigcranky;540487]Also, I really like that chicken that comes in a bag -- but a week's worth gets heavy. It dries pretty well, and rehydrates okay, unlike jerky. Not sure why it doesn't turn into jerky itself, though. /quote]
'cause it's cooked first.
Well, then why when I make chicken jerky do they tell me to cook it first? It still turns out as jerky.
NorthCountryWoods
03-02-2008, 13:48
Marinade lean beef or game in Worcestershire sauce, maple syrup, orange juice and Montreal Steak Seasoning from Costco. I generally eye ball it and it varies depending on how much you need to cover, so don't have exact measurements, but it's probably:
1/4 cup Worcestershire
1/4 cup Maple syrup (grade B)
1/2 to 1 cup orange juice
2 tablespoons Montreal seasoning.
Awesome for jerky or even better as a marinade for steaks cooked on the grill
NorthCountryWoods
03-02-2008, 13:50
Also, don't know why but if you freeze the combined meat and marinade and then defrost it seems to soak up more flavor and is more tender than just marinading alone.
There are several ways to cure meat.
They all involve both:
1. Killing any harmful bacteria present.
2. Preserving the meat from harmful bacteria growth.
I think you should always start with very fresh meat, because even if you kill all the bad bugs some nasty toxins might still be left behind. Not all bugs are bad though, which is why hanging meat for several days wasn't such a bad way to tenderize meat. That said, when it comes to killing and preserving bugs dehydration alone could be enough, but stuff like salt and spice and honey is also very important for killing and especially for dehydration. The cooking is only useful for the initial killing, and it isn't the only way.
I meant to say especially for preserving.
Appalachian Tater
03-02-2008, 14:15
Watch Into The Wild if you want pointers on making moose jerky. You could probably substitute a cow, pig, or other domesticated animal for the moose.
I think its worth mentioning that stuff like salt and seasoning spices and honey and smoke are not just for flavour. They were originally primarily for preserving, in the case of honey and spices not just in their use by man but in their natural state. Bees make honey with some natural preservatives besides just sugar. You can pack other foods in honey to preserve them also, and it also make for more compact calories, volume wise. Spices are also natural preservatives because they come from things like seeds that contain foods that need to be preserved, at least for one season if not longer. Water is the enemy of course, because it dilutes these preservatives, and activates life. Almost all preserving involves eliminating water, or air, or both, plus some other preservatives, either natural or synthetic
Watch Into The Wild if you want pointers on making moose jerky. You could probably substitute a cow, pig, or other domesticated animal for the moose.What was it that he did wrong there? Did he not dehydrate it fast enough, or not slice it thin enough, or not use enough smoke, or what? I haven't seen the movie but I recall from the book that he was bummed out about letting so much meat go bad. I think he beat himself up a bit too much about the moose, and wasn't thinking enough about himself. I'm thinking in his situation you would need to stike a balance between preserving large amounts of protien, and some fat, and using up alot of carbohydrates in the process. Lots of work cutting up a whole moose I should think. It would be interesting to know what the best way to go about it might have been from the energy conservation point of view. I can't remember what Chris was doing for carbohydrates.
Appalachian Tater
03-02-2008, 15:01
What was it that he did wrong there? Did he not dehydrate it fast enough, or not slice it thin enough, or not use enough smoke, or what? I haven't seen the movie but I recall from the book that he was bummed out about letting so much meat go bad. I think he beat himself up a bit too much about the moose, and wasn't thinking enough about himself. I'm thinking in his situation you would need to stike a balance between preserving large amounts of protien, and some fat, and using up alot of carbohydrates in the process. Lots of work cutting up a whole moose I should think. It would be interesting to know what the best way to go about it might have been from the energy conservation point of view. I can't remember what Chris was doing for carbohydrates.I didn't read the book. In the film, it got maggoty while he was smoking it. From his weight at death, he was in catabolism for quite some time, so he probably wasn't getting much in the way of carbs. His corpse weighed 67 pounds when they found it, but it had been sitting around a while, so who knows.
Wise Old Owl
03-02-2008, 15:08
You can also sun-dry jerky on a clothesline in the sun. flys will land on it but it dont matter. if the meat aint dry after a day, put it in the fridge and hang it again the next day.
MMMMMM Flies for dinner - I don't think so.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/MarkSwarbrick/shizzy0087.gif
Wise Old Owl
03-02-2008, 15:15
Next we will be hiking in loincloths or thongs eeew..
Unrelated but on topic.....
Someone put me up to it to make breakfast in freezer bag cooking in another thread - so one idea was to take spam and fry it or straight out of the can and throw it into the dryer, served up nice and hot in freezer bag. with a boiled egg is lightweight and full of protein. Taking canned meats and figuring out the shelf life in a bag after it is removed, well the dried spam (low sodium) is awesome. I will get back to you guys in a week as I am conducting a 7 day test.
boarstone
03-02-2008, 16:00
Just make sure ALL fat/fatty parts of meat is trimmed off...fat is your enemy when trying to dry it, if not all removed will cause it to spoil even after drying.
With patient trim work, a good marinate (any with high salt content) look for prepared sauce packets used for chinese/thai cooking, chilli, etc. You can adjust as you experiment with different flavors.
Maybe someone like Boarstone can help me with this. There are many dried sausages that have a lot of fat. In fact, most sausages are plenty fat. And yet, the wisdom on jerky seems to be that fat is the major evil. Anybody know why?
American style jerky is just a dried meat like a dried sausage, but without the intestine casing. There are lots of European style meats just like it as well. The smoking doesn't seem to be an absolute, even though most commercial jerky seems to have real or artificial smoke flavor.
Bacon is a dried meat, often sugar or salt cured, with a lot of fat. If bacon is dried well enough, it keeps very well. Dried pork belly is the same.
Must be something to do with the drying technique. I know that in traditional meat drying, the key is to strip it thin and quickly, so the surface has a chance to harden off before the flies get at it, and the breakdown from body heat and enzymes doesn't get too far along. If you can't dry it, cool it fast. Then either freeze or dry in direct sunshine. I wonder if smoking wasn't primarily a way to dry when the weather wasn't cooperating? It also reduces the "free meat" smell that attracts bears and other scavengers.
I've been in a big herring smokehouse, and it is an awesome place. The smell just penetrates everything, it's dark and all the beams are black and dripping fish fat and smoke. The size of a small house.
Appalachian Tater
03-02-2008, 17:10
Fat can itself be used to preserve foods, such as covering a terrine with a layer of fat or dipping eggs in tallow. Pemmican incorporated a good deal of fat. Gelatin can also be used as a way to exclude oxygen.
Of course, there are more certain methods of preservation.
Fat can itself be used to preserve foods, such as covering a terrine with a layer of fat or dipping eggs in tallow. ,,,
Fat is one of the main ingredients of pemmican, used to seal the meat as well as to provide calories. I think the best fat for pemmican is said to be tallow.
One of my very favorite ways to cook duck is as a confit, which is basically cooked in fat, fried. I suspect that southern fried chicken is a kissin' cousin of this.
boarstone
03-03-2008, 04:03
Fat is one of the main ingredients of pemmican, used to seal the meat as well as to provide calories. I think the best fat for pemmican is said to be tallow.
One of my very favorite ways to cook duck is as a confit, which is basically cooked in fat, fried. I suspect that southern fried chicken is a kissin' cousin of this.
commercial dehydrating is far different than home dehydrating...don't forget..
there's is loaded with preservatives (chemicals) not available to the general public...
NorthCountryWoods
03-03-2008, 06:33
commercial dehydrating is far different than home dehydrating...don't forget..
there's is loaded with preservatives (chemicals) not available to the general public...
Think he was talking about Pemmican the ancient recipe which was 50/50 meat and fat, not the modern jerky brand name.
Jail Break
03-03-2008, 10:12
IN OTHER WORDS...
YES... it goes in raw.
redredrose
03-03-2008, 16:28
Do ya'll dry fruits & veggies too
I dehydrate fruits and veggies even when I have no hike planned. A 5 pound bag of frozen mixed vegetables will dehydrate overnight in my Wal-Mart dehydrator and keep on the shelf, in a sterilized jar for at least a year. I just scoop out a quarter cup or so and add it to anything and call it dinner.
My favorite is dehydrated watermelon. I just chunk out watermelon in the summer, dehydrate it on plastic wrap laid on the trays of the same dehydrator and wait for it to be dry. It's like heaven on a winter hike in the snow. Makes me warm all over, just like summertime.
Applesauce becomes "Fruit Roll-ups" and tomatoes are just like sunshine . :sun
Hey do you guys cut the steak with the grain or across is when going to make jerky?
atraildreamer
03-03-2008, 18:30
Just Google: "Dehydrating foods"
Lots of good info out there. :-?
www.nesco.com is a very good site. :sun
Most sites recommend putting the finished jerky in a 160 degree F oven for at least a hour to kill any remaining nasties. :eek:
CrumbSnatcher
03-03-2008, 18:35
My husband is trying to tell me that you put the steak in the dehydrating machine raw to make jerky .... ??????
Is this right ?????
Jerky always seems very over cooked to me in the store......raw meat sounds gory.if you dont have a dehydrating machine,you can also use your oven! lowest setting and wedge something in the door so its barely propped open.
Hey do you guys cut the steak with the grain or across is when going to make jerky?
Pretty sure it's just preference on this one. I like beef jerky to be stringy, like I know I'm eating meat. When you cut it across the grain (so that you're looking at "the end") you don't get stringy, and it's a little easier to chew. But I still like my stringy jerky.
kayak karl
03-04-2008, 08:49
Pretty sure it's just preference on this one. I like beef jerky to be stringy, like I know I'm eating meat. When you cut it across the grain (so that you're looking at "the end") you don't get stringy, and it's a little easier to chew. But I still like my stringy jerky.
not to be funny, but i cut mine on a diagonal. like when cutting london broil. it leaves the strings about inch+ long
i love jerkey with soy sauce and ground black pepper. yum!
have any of you tried the "box fan" method of making jerky? supposedly it's better because a dehydrator cooks the meat. the box fan dries the jerky without cooking and is more flavorful. My friend's box fan jerky is way tastier than store bought, but I've never compared to homemade dehydrator jerky
http://annarbor.albertelli.com:85/weblog/?p=86
Monkeyboy
03-24-2008, 10:50
not to be funny, but i cut mine on a diagonal. like when cutting london broil. it leaves the strings about inch+ long
Exactly......
My father was a butcher and couldn't sell London Broil because everyone thought it was too tough....
....but what it was is that they would cut it like a loaf of bread, which is with the grain, which leaves it chewy and stringy.
But at a diagonal, it turns out to be the most tenderest peice of meat you can get, without being mushy like prime rib or filet mignon.
London broil, cut diagonally while partially frozen, makes for the best jerky, IMHO.
borntobeoutdoors
03-27-2008, 09:35
As has been stated, Jerky is made from raw meat. It originally was a method of preserving meat when their was no refrigeration.
I prefer to cut the strips about 1/8" of an inch. If you put the meat in the freezer and let it "firm up" it becomes very easy to slice thin. It should be a lean meat, or cut the fat away. Fat does not dehydrate well.
Finally, the big secret to Jerky is the marinade. The brine will draw much of the fat out and the flavor will permeate the meat.
After some practice, you will find the "balance" where the meat is dry enough to be preserved but is still somewhat pliable.
It is the absence of moisture that prevents bacteria from spoiling the meat. It also helps if you vacuum pack the jerky into bags when finished. Inexpensive vacuum sealers can be purchased at Wal-Mart.
Venison jerky is hard to beat. I just slice up some raw meat, marinate it, then dehydrate it intill the thickest piece is brown in the middle. YUM!
borntobeoutdoors
03-28-2008, 16:14
Fish jerky is equally yummy.
Pretty sure it's just preference on this one. I like beef jerky to be stringy, like I know I'm eating meat. When you cut it across the grain (so that you're looking at "the end") you don't get stringy, and it's a little easier to chew. But I still like my stringy jerky.I like stringy jerky also. One of the main reasons I bring jerky is because it is pretty much the only hiker food I bring that gives me something serious to chew on.
OP,
Thanks for the link and the idea by the way. I've been wondering the best way to kill the bugs before seasoning and dehydrating. Now I'm thinking that step doesn't need to be perfect because it can be done after. Cool.
have any of you tried the "box fan" method of making jerky? supposedly it's better because a dehydrator cooks the meat. the box fan dries the jerky without cooking and is more flavorful. My friend's box fan jerky is way tastier than store bought, but I've never compared to homemade dehydrator jerky
http://annarbor.albertelli.com:85/weblog/?p=86I'm going to try it with my oven, which has a convection fan, on its lowest setting. I'm going to see how I can keep the temperature lower for the initial stage. I'm wondering if I might slow cook it first in honey and pepper, and them do the drying and final bug killing in the oven.
twentybelow
03-28-2008, 17:07
if you dont have a dehydrating machine,you can also use your oven! lowest setting and wedge something in the door so its barely propped open.
i have a dehydrator but still use the oven for jerky. just do as CrumbSnatcher says and crack the door a bit. impale the strips of beef on shish-kabob sticks near one end and then lay the sticks across the wire rack with the meat suspended below. a piece of aluminum foil to catch the initial dripping makes clean up a snap.
Fiddleback
03-28-2008, 19:29
I've never used anything but an oven. I (and others) strongly suggest you leave the door cracked to vent moisture. Some ovens, however, have an on/off switch that is activated by the oven door so wedging a wooden spoon or some other implement between it and the door might be necessary to keep the oven running while the door is cracked open. Set the oven at it's lowest...which is 170° for most newer models.
There should be no 'bug' issue with fresh cut meat (excluding ground meat/hamburger). If you are still concerned though, you can blanche the strips of meat before putting them in the oven. Holding the strips in near boiling water for 30 seconds will kill the surface 'bugs' and is all that is necessary. When I first started making jerky that's the technique I used ('cause that's the instructions I had) but I later realized that it's truly unnecessary.
FB
Chaplain
04-03-2008, 00:59
I never used my oven. I bought one of those inexpensive dyhydrators at Wal-Mart. Works real good for me. My favorite it apples and pineapples. the meat I am still learning, but it is always good once you are out on the trail.