View Full Version : Outdated map sets?
Does anyone have an opinion as to how outdated a set of trail maps from ~'92 would be?
How many major re-routes have there been?
I'd like to scan the maps in for quick reference on my camera but would prefer not wasting time if they are too far off the mark.
_terrapin_
02-21-2008, 21:30
IMO, '92 is too old. Most likely the trail routing is 95% correct, but that last 5% will bite you. There have been lots of changes in shelters -- new ones built, old ones torn down, some "relocated." You could always chance it and follow the white blazes... but I wouldn't.
snuffy smith
02-21-2008, 23:36
I just hiked Springer to Neels Gap with maps from 1995. They were a pain. The new Gooch shelter wasen't on them neither was Woods Hole.
You never know what the Trail has endured over the years, Whether it be re-routes,extreme weather,etc. You always need current maps and info.
Tennessee Viking
02-21-2008, 23:59
For Tennesse, there are some major re-routes.
Campbell Hollow to Elk River to Walnut Mtn Road.
Pond Flats on Pond Mountain.
Watauga Lake
the_iceman
02-22-2008, 06:34
I bought new maps for my thru last year and some of the "new" maps were still 5 years old so there were a few surprises. You just need to deal with them, For example the shelter just north of Max Patch was relocated several years ago. The signs along the trail still gave the distance to the old one which was a few miles further north. Wingfoot's book gave the distance to the new one as about a mile further south than it really was and I think the map still showed the old one.
Everything you have is a general guide you just need to learn to go with the flow. Some days you will swear a shelter is 5 miles closer other days 10 miles further. You will sail over some mountains and struggle over some hills and water will hardly ever be where books, maps, signs, or people tell you it is.
enjoy the adventure for that is what it is.
_terrapin_
02-22-2008, 07:48
I used my '90 maps on a VT section in 2002. That's when I finally decided to update. It just got to be too much of a hassle dealing with the changes and relocations. I suppose an old map is better than no map at all.... but I'm not even sure of that any more. No map is 100% accurate, but the underlying reality is constantly changing.
TinAbbey
02-22-2008, 08:38
Frame them.
Thanks for all of the input.
Shelter location isn't a priority (I stop in and cook/nap/read when one is handy)-- more looking for the road crossings, nearby roads & water sources in relation to the trail.
The data book & blazes serve me well. I would like to have a topo available in the event I need to make a bee line, though. If the trail has re-located to different ridge lines, they may end up being worse than nothing...
Maps purchased in '92 probably don't show much of the Cumberland Valley relocation. Near the south end of the Valley the Trail moved almost three miles. Look at your PATC Map 1 and see if the trail on that map goes through Boiling Springs or not.
It might be around then that the Trail switched ridgelines south of Caledonia S.P. (US 30 in PA) The old trail is a blue blaze and will get you there.
Between Rausch Gap and Swatara Gap in PA was an over-a-mile sideways change in route that didn't get correctly captured until the 2004 edition KTA map.
_terrapin_
02-22-2008, 09:37
The 1990 maps of PA were horrible. The latest maps of PA are excellent. I forgot all about the Cumberland relo....
The 1990 maps of PA were horrible. The latest maps of PA are excellent. I forgot all about the Cumberland relo....
Heck, I wasn't even going to go THERE (even Bryson did...) but yes, the revised KTA maps from the Susquehanna River north to NJ are much better than what would be in a '92 map set.
Blissful
02-22-2008, 09:49
I used a 1980s map in Virginia from Maupin Field to Waynesboro and of course it neglected to mention the extra five miles beyond Humpback Rocks and the new shelter Paul C Wolf. A rude awakening.
Get maps at least in the 21st century or better.
Yeah, get newer info. Even with 2005 I get really frustrated with things that are outdated.
_terrapin_
02-22-2008, 11:27
I used a 1980s map in Virginia from Maupin Field to Waynesboro and of course it neglected to mention the extra five miles beyond Humpback Rocks and the new shelter Paul C Wolf. A rude awakening.
Beautiful site, beautiful shelter. But only about 5 miles from Rockfish Gap, which (IMO) diminishes its usefulness a bit (what with Waynesboro being a very popular town stop.)
Again, thanks for all of the input.
I decided to buy Delorme's topo software and permanently retire the maps.
shelterbuilder
02-22-2008, 21:31
For showing topography and other natural points of interest, old maps are okay, but anything that's man-made can change - sometimes suddenly! In this case, old maps can be a curse...and leave you cursing!
"When in doubt - follow the blazes!"
I used old maps for our section, just to show the gang the elevation, names of "Big Butt Mtn" name of gap and the day's route, but supplemented from this site and the ATC internet site for the inevitable changes on shelter campsite info, water since it was dry last year and re routes. I worte the changes on a piece of paper and put it in the plastic with the 2 maps of our sections. Worked great and I was the mapper for our section. We found the blazes to be just fine, but have heard that this is not always the case, so were prepared.
I decided to buy Delorme's topo software and permanently retire the maps.
Just like the maps, the software is only as good as the data that goes into it.
In the 90's I moved to Boiling Springs, PA. I looked in the DeLorme Atlas, saw the dotted line track it had for the A.T., and said: "Wow, neat, the Appalachian Trail goes right through the next town!" Now, residents in the old town B.S. have to pick up their mail at the Post Office, no delivery. I started wondering what the white marks were on the poles within a couple of days, then I peered across the street from the P.O. and tried to make out the lettering on a routed sign by the cottage next to the lake. So I stopped in there and learned a few things. :)
The A.T. maps have two great advantages over software: 1. Someone who cares about the A.T. made the map and had some interest in making sure it was accurate at the time; and 2. For most of the A.T., the proceeds from map sales go to the organizations charged with maintaining the A.T., and form an important part of their income.
There's a problem there: eventually the electronic gizmos will be reliable enough (or considered so by enough people) that map revenue will die; where, then, will the funds come from??
Does anyone have an opinion as to how outdated a set of trail maps from ~'92 would be?
How many major re-routes have there been?
I'd like to scan the maps in for quick reference on my camera but would prefer not wasting time if they are too far off the mark.
The only thing outdated maps are good are to use as posters. We put ours up as illustrations of were we have hiked before.
Jack Tarlin
02-23-2008, 19:39
I agree with what others have said. If you're budgeted for it, I'd get new maps. In the years since your old set was issued, there have been some major changes: The Maine maps, for example, are now extraordinarily detailed. The Pennsylvania maps, which used to be the absolute worst of any section of the Trail, are now great. New York and New Jersey were updated as recently as last year; North Carolina and Tennessee were updated the year before that. The maps for Georgia and part of NC were updated a few years back; I'd like to see the same thing done for Virginia, which has lousy maps. And New Hampshire and Vermont are long overdue for revision. But most of the Trail's sections are now covered by brand new, or fairly recently revised maps; were I you, I'd get new ones.
[quote=ki0eh;547484]J
The A.T. maps have two great advantages over software: 1. Someone who cares about the A.T. made the map and had some interest in making sure it was accurate at the time; and 2. For most of the A.T., the proceeds from map sales go to the organizations charged with maintaining the A.T., and form an important part of their income.
quote]
Thanks for the lecture. I contribute.
This thread is in straight forward for a reason.
Please keep on topic.
Jack,
Who is responsible for updating trail maps? Is it the local maintaining clubs?
Is there a list somewhere showing the year of the most recent map revision for each state?
Jack Tarlin
02-24-2008, 18:48
The ATC could certainly tell you.
And yes, the varying Trail Clubs, as well as the Conference, are involved with the maps and the updates. They are usually re-done every few years, tho in a few unfortunate cases, it takes significantly longer.
But if you write Laurie Potteiger at www.appalachiantrail.org, she could give you more accurate info on dates, including whether or not there are any new section updates are planned anytime soon.
Wise Old Owl
02-24-2008, 20:12
This post caused me to pull out my 98 KTA color maps out compare to my 95 KTA black & white and the differences are not so much in the trail itself ( remember what Terrapin said 95% )
Right up front the new maps are larger and easier to read. The new maps show old and new additional trails. The new maps show more water sources or springs. In High cliff & terrain areas the new maps are easier to read. The information about were trail towns are and post offices is indispensable. On the older maps Port Clinton is a dot, on the new you see streets.
Purchasing the new maps and framing the old ones is the right thing to do. Those old ones are very nostalgic. Great question, It made me pull out some dusty stuff for half an hour, great memories.
[quote=ki0eh;547484]J
The A.T. maps have two great advantages over software: 1. Someone who cares about the A.T. made the map and had some interest in making sure it was accurate at the time; and 2. For most of the A.T., the proceeds from map sales go to the organizations charged with maintaining the A.T., and form an important part of their income.
quote]
Thanks for the lecture. I contribute.
This thread is in straight forward for a reason.
Please keep on topic.
I apologize that you took this personally; I meant no ill will nor judgment. As someone who is making maps for other footpath groups (not the A.T.), I find many folks do not know where the maps come from, who makes them, and why. I believe this is relevant to the topic to possibly help others evaluate the choices they might make for themselves. Your thoughts and your contributions are most welcome.
I do wonder where the money will come from if others make your choice on software, if they do not contribute as you do. Printing maps and guides is pretty expensive too so maybe enough will contribute that the money for other administrative and maintenance expenses will be there after losing this major expense item. Surely I hope so; I hope the trails will still be there when I can retire and hike!
[quote=Nomad94;548474]
I find many folks do not know where the maps come from, who makes them, and why. I believe this is relevant to the topic to possibly help others evaluate the choices they might make for themselves. Your thoughts and your contributions are most welcome.
Start a thread.
The question was about routing changes.
Others managed to provide specific info about sections, mapsets, etc-- which is what was asked for. Straight forward.
I took no offense; you have provided little info specifically while casting a broad net.