View Full Version : new thermarest prolite pads
i "played" with these new pads at rei yesterday -- the prolite 3 being "3" season, and the 4 is "4" season -- thus, the heaviest of the two.
i must admit, i like the orange color :) and, i thought they both felt pretty comfortable. (the test was on the uncarpeted walkway in the store) -- i tried flat on my back, and on my side -- both versions seemed to pass the digging hip test for comfort.
though inflatable mattresses will always be heavier than closed cell foam, they're awfully alluring -- has anyone tried/bought? what do you think?
part of me yearns for the extra comfort inspite of the extra ounces. (also, if i did get it -- it's what i'd be sleeping on my last month in my apt. on a hardwood floor). money aside, thoughts?
d
though inflatable mattresses will always be heavier than closed cell foam, they're awfully alluring -- has anyone tried/bought? what do you think?
I've bought one over the weekend. I'll be testing it out in the backcountry next weekend. I did like the fact that it came in under the adversised weight (12.1oz claimed weight of 13oz). It doesn't seem to self-inflate nearly as good as my POE pad.
I also bought it, the 3/4"X41" version, Prolite 3S which weighs, with the nifty sylnylon bag, 13.44 ounces I bought it to replace it's heavier predecessor, the Ultra-lite 3/4 at 18.56 ounces. So I spent $55 and saved 5.12 ounces. So far I am not real sure I am proud of that, but I splurged. I'll use it in a hammock mostly, very underinflated and so have it available if I am forced to sleep on the ground.
But I have not used it yet.Just got it. One plus is that I was told is that the bottom of the Prolite is tougher than it's predecessor. In the morning, I drag it out of the hammock, lay it on the ground underneath the fly and lounge on it in my sleeping bag fixing breakfast and eating. So, the tougher bottom, was a plus for me.
And, Denise, you are right-it is an appealing color.
Hammock Hanger
02-24-2004, 20:54
on a long hike where you sleep out on the ground/hard shelter floor night after night a little extra padding seems like a wonderful luxury.
Sue/HH:jump
Rain Man
02-24-2004, 23:23
i "played" with these new pads at rei yesterday -- ...
though inflatable mattresses will always be heavier than closed cell foam, they're awfully alluring -- has anyone tried/bought? what do you think?
I hear you can be comfortable hiking or comfortable sleeping. I choose sleeping, hands down!
When I finished GA in November, I used a full-length Therm-a-Rest Camprest and was happy to be hauling it. These old bones, plus that I sleep on my side always, require some extra cushioning for my hips and shoulders.
After that I purchased a 3/4 length on sale and have tried it in 10 degree weather in my backyard and it was great, plus saves a little on the weight.
So, my thoughts are these are worth the comfort. I just saw the new REI versions and would go with them if I were buying now, I do believe.
Oh, I also require a pillow to keep my head up and weight off my shoulders. I'm going to try an REI/Campmor or MSR water bladder and blow it up with air. It'll do double or triple duty, in other words. :)
I'll be on Springer this Sunday night. My daughter hits the trail Monday morning, the 1st. :)
Rain Man
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Rainman, for a pillow try a standard airline pillow...as a side sleeper it will toss and turn with you with the U-form neck rest, and only weights 2oz. I too, will be on Springer this Sunday night and look forward to meeting you and your daughter!
I looked at one of the Prolite pads (don't remember which one) in a store and observed that the foam had holes about 1/4 inch in diameter cut through from bottom to top. That would make me think that it's not very warm. Are the Prolite 3 and Prolite 4 the same in this regard? Anxious to hear some actual usage reports. If you're reporting on pad insulating ability, please tell us whether you inflate the pad firmly or somewhat soft and whether you sleep on your back or side.
tlbj6142
02-25-2004, 11:24
I looked at one of the Prolite pads (don't remember which one) in a store and observed that the foam had holes about 1/4 inch in diameter cut through from bottom to top. That would make me think that it's not very warm.I noticed that too. Remember is the the air that is the insulator for these pads, not the foam. The foam is just used to "self-inflate" the pad. Though I suppose it does provide some value when the pad is crushed flat. But not much.
Rain Man
02-25-2004, 11:31
Rainman, for a pillow try a standard airline pillow...as a side sleeper it will toss and turn with you with the U-form neck rest, and only weights 2oz. I too, will be on Springer this Sunday night and look forward to meeting you and your daughter!
Happy,
I have several "airline pillows," but try to make my gear do double or triple duty. I figure a water bladder can (1) hold water, (2) be a pillow, and (3) be a shower and pot/foot/hand rinser on occasion. :) I've gone the clothes stuffed into stuff sack route, and that just gets way too HARD during the night.
See you Sunday evening! Should have my wife and Azerbaijani son (exchange student) with us too. Pics of me and daughter are in my Gallery, if you want to recognize us. :)
Rain Man
:dance
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Hey you guys be careful up on Springer..it was beautiful up there last weekend but it sounds like some nasty weather is heading that way.
I noticed that too. Remember is the the air that is the insulator for these pads, not the foam. The foam is just used to "self-inflate" the pad. Though I suppose it does provide some value when the pad is crushed flat. But not much.
Air is a good insulator only if it is still. That's why a foam-filled Thermarest is much warmer than a hollow air mattress. If the air can move in the pad (and convection currents will be set up if one side of the pad is warm and the other cold) then it can transfer heat. Closed-cell foam is a bunch of tiny air pockets that are isolated from each other. The R-value of a Thermarest does depend on how the foam is cut - the lighter ones have more holes, weigh less, and are less insulating. The heavier ones have solid foam without holes and better insulating value. Gotta pick your trade-offs.
Big Dawg
02-25-2004, 13:26
I should know this, but what does r-value mean????
Big Dawg
02-25-2004, 15:40
never mind------ What are “R-values”?
R-values are a measure of insulation and are based on a mattress being fully inflated. The higher the value, the warmer you will sleep. For a higher R-value, fully inflate your mattress.
RedneckRye
02-25-2004, 20:00
The Prolite 3 is 1" thick and has a R-value of 2.3. The Prolite 4 is 1.5" thick and has an R-value of 3.2. The old style Ultralight was R2.6, the Guidelight was R3.8 (1" and 1.5"thick). For more warmth the new Trail is R4.2 or the Expedition is R4.4 (1.25" and 1.75" thick.
I've bought one over the weekend. I'll be testing it out in the backcountry next weekend. I did like the fact that it came in under the adversised weight (12.1oz claimed weight of 13oz). It doesn't seem to self-inflate nearly as good as my POE pad.
Bought the ProLight 3 3/4 length a month ago. Slept out one night in my tent in the backyard on the snow, with temps in the teens. It was not warm enough; there were cold spots and my feet eventually got cold too without anything under them. Realize it was it intended to be warm on the snow but wanted to try it. Plan to supplement with a cheap and light closed cell pad cut down to 3/4 length and stagger the two to make a full length mat. This combo is still a bit lighter than my old regular 3/4 length Thermorest and should be more comy and warmer. In warm weather could just use the ProLight, with or without an even shorter piece of foam. Thought about exchanging for the ProLight 4 but still afraid it alone is not enough on snow. According to MSR's website, they write that many people supplement the 4 with closed cell on snow.
Agree it does not inflate well on its own, that it has a honeycomb like foam inside with holes in the foam that go clear through. It does however seem to have sufficient cushioning with a few puffs of air added. Have not tried it on bare ground in the backcountry.
Agree it does not inflate well on its own, that it has a honeycomb like foam inside with holes in the foam that go clear through. It does however seem to have sufficient cushioning with a few puffs of air added. Have not tried it on bare ground in the backcountry.
I beleive that the poor self-inflation is more due to the foam then the holes. My Pacific Outdoor Equipment Max Lite 1.0 has holes Die-cut into the foam and it has no problems self inflating.
gravityman
02-26-2004, 13:09
I've always blown up my ultralight. I was told that it was because I have no patience. :) Never had a problem, even in winter.
Gravity Man
grrickar
09-01-2004, 18:23
I purchased a Prolite 3 to add to my gear collection. I bought the full length pad, which weighs about the same as my short Trail Thermarest. Less insulation, but lighter and this way I can carry a full length pad that is more compact.
I've never waited for either of them to self-inflate, I always blew into mine to fill it. I watched a guy at REI tell a woman who was buying one to fill the pad to capacity by mouth, and then to lie on the pad with the valve near her head, and with a simple twist you could adjust the firmness and loft of the pad.
eyahiker
09-01-2004, 18:25
I LOVE MINE.
Will never go back to anything less. Have to give it a few extra puffs for super hard/rooted ground. Otherwise, worth the $ and the oz.'s
Singletrack
10-16-2004, 07:59
I used the Prolite 3 for 300 or so miles on the Trail. Had my old Thermarest Ultralite sent to me, and sent Prolite 3 home. I could never get comfortable on it. After inflating it completely, and lying down on it. It was too hard. Then releasing some air, I never could find that comfortable spot I desired, as I could on the Ultralite. By morning, my hips could feel the hard ground. It would lose air over night. I am not crazy about the wild orange color, and it stains easily. Glad I did not sell my Ultralite. I think Thermarest will be making some changes on the Prolite 3.
Kerosene
10-16-2004, 09:10
I used the Prolite 3s during my Georgia section hike back in April. The extra weight over a closed-cell foam is definitely worth it for my aging body. I slept on it down to 31* and was just fine.
For a pillow, Rainman, I took the advice of Gardenville(?) and bought kid's water wings from Wal-Mart for 88 cents, cut one of them to form a "butterfly" and inflate for a good night's sleep. Less than one ounce and it stuffs along with your sleeping bag.
The Prolite 3 is 1 inch thick. I suspect that your old Ultralight was 1 1/2 inches thick. So I suspect that you discovered that the 1 inch thick pad was a little thin for your bones. Had you bought the Prolite 4 you might have been more satisfied. The Prolite 4 is 1 1/2 inches thick.
Generally speaking, younger bones don't need as much padding as old bones. So, the youth can get away with the closed cell pads and the 1 inch thick thermarests. Older bones appreciate the extra padding much more.
The Prolite 3 is 1 inch thick. I suspect that your old Ultralight was 1 1/2 inches thick. So I suspect that you discovered that the 1 inch thick pad was a little thin for your bones. Had you bought the Prolite 4 you might have been more satisfied. The Prolite 4 is 1 1/2 inches thick.
Generally speaking, younger bones don't need as much padding as old bones. So, the youth can get away with the closed cell pads and the 1 inch thick thermarests. Older bones appreciate the extra padding much more.
Thanks for the post. You just helped me make up my mind. I'll go with the extra weight and get the thicker pad. These old bones thank you....
Generally speaking, younger bones don't need as much padding as old bones. So, the youth can get away with the closed cell pads and the 1 inch thick thermarests. Older bones appreciate the extra padding much more.Sadly, I've found this to be true. The Prolite 4 works for me, barely. But I ache in the morning around the knees and hips. For car camping, I have an old thermarrest, 2.5 inches thick. I sleep much better on it, but it weighs almost 4 pounds.
Youngblood
10-17-2004, 12:38
Sadly, I've found this to be true. The Prolite 4 works for me, barely. But I ache in the morning around the knees and hips. For car camping, I have an old thermarrest, 2.5 inches thick. I sleep much better on it, but it weighs almost 4 pounds.
Frosty,
A lot of us can sympathize with you. The next step might be an RV, hammock or one of them blow-up mats. :) There are some inflatable mats out there that have partial insulation in them so they don't sleep so cold... and then there are the ones filled with down that are down right toasty. Some of these are pretty light and pack small.
For what its worth, I saw two different hikers this summer that slept without mats on shelter floors... that hurt just typing it. One of them was Elwood, but the other one seemed to be quite normal.
Youngblood
For what its worth, I saw two different hikers this summer that slept without mats on shelter floors... that hurt just typing it. One of them was Elwood, but the other one seemed to be quite normal.
Youngblood
That's how it was done in my youth, long before the days of thermarest.
Hammock Hanger
10-17-2004, 18:02
For what its worth, I saw two different hikers this summer that slept without mats on shelter floors... that hurt just typing it. One of them was Elwood, but the other one seemed to be quite normal.
Youngblood
When I hiked in 2002 I would occasionally sleep in shelters, being a hammocker I didn't have a pad. It is hard but doable. -- This year I actually carried a 3/4 insch prolite t-pad so I had something to use when I was tempted to stay in shelters (which it turns out I did almost the whole way, wierd!) It seemed okay for me, better then no pad at all. Guess I'm not as old as I thought! It was useless as a pad under the hammock to help block wind, as the core is made with lots of cut-outs and the wind could go right thru it.
Sue
mdjeeper
10-17-2004, 18:18
i picked up a prolite 4 and love it. it does take a couple of breaths to get it fully inflated (to my satisfaction anywho!), but other than that i have no complaints. I havent tried it out on any snowcovered ground yet, but did use with the temps down below freezing and had no cold spots anywhere. no problems with deflating and rolling it back up, didnt slide around the floor of my tent and stayed right under my bag allnight (and i am a roller)..
Percival
10-17-2004, 21:15
The problem is the Prolite is still heavy. The P-3 is 1 lb. 4 ounces and the P-4 is 1 lb. 8 ounces. That's about as heavy as my Guidelite. Seems whatever the Thermarest folks do, they still can't get the weight down. Which is remarkable, given the really light materials out there today.
Pencil Pusher
10-17-2004, 22:10
Seems pretty light to me. I think they use materials that are more durable than light, especially given what a drag it is to wake up restless after an hour or so of 'sleep' and discover your air mattress has deflated (doh!). Better yet, in the interest of going light, you left the repair kit at home (double doh!). The folks looking for lightweight should get the 3/4 length and put clothes or the pack under the feet... or the feet in the pack. Here's a product from MEC that is like a beefier Ridgerest and about as cheap: http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=677965&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=334835&bmUID=1098061178265
Oh, and I just noticed they also have an interesting sleeping pad comparison chart. It's a link you'll see in the one above.
The problem is the Prolite is still heavy. The P-3 is 1 lb. 4 ounces and the P-4 is 1 lb. 8 ounces. That's about as heavy as my Guidelite. Seems whatever the Thermarest folks do, they still can't get the weight down. Which is remarkable, given the really light materials out there today.For comparable sizes, the Guidelite is heavier than prolite by a third. THe 1.5" 20x72 Prolite 4 is 24 ounces, the 1.5" 20x72 guidelite is 32 ounces.
Thermarest is the lightest of all inflatables. At least I don't know of any inflatable lighter than Prolite 4.
The problem is the Prolite is still heavy. The P-3 is 1 lb. 4 ounces and the P-4 is 1 lb. 8 ounces. That's about as heavy as my Guidelite. Seems whatever the Thermarest folks do, they still can't get the weight down. Which is remarkable, given the really light materials out there today.
The 3/4 or "short" length is fine for most people, and weighs less. P-3 short weights in at 13 ounces, and the P-4 short weights in at 17 ounces.
Likewise, the Z-lite short is 11 ounces
Kerosene
10-18-2004, 10:57
Thermarest is the lightest of all inflatables.I just ran across the TorsoLite (http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/torsolite_inflatable_sleeping_pad.html) 1" inflatable foam pad from Bozeman Mountain Works (I just joined BackpackingLight.com, recommended elsewhere on WhiteBlaze). This pad comes in at 10 ounces, shaving 3 ounces over a Thermarest Prolite 3s by narrowing from shoulder to torso and cutting overall length since you tend to sleep on a "pillow" anyway. A little pricey at $69.99 ($58.79 for BackpackingLight.com members).
Youngblood
10-18-2004, 12:19
For comparable sizes, the Guidelite is heavier than prolite by a third. THe 1.5" 20x72 Prolite 4 is 24 ounces, the 1.5" 20x72 guidelite is 32 ounces.
Thermarest is the lightest of all inflatables. At least I don't know of any inflatable lighter than Prolite 4.
I think sometimes we get confused on previous weights of ThermaRest mats because they have changed the weights at various times over the years. I think the weights of the ultralight and guidelight models have shifted by several ounces. I bought a full length ultralight back in the 90's that weighed 1 lb 8 oz, I recall seeing that the weight had increased to 1 lb 13 oz a year or so ago. I also replaced that with a full length guidelight on my 2000 thru-hike and I think it weighed a little less that the 2 lbs that I have seen listed in recent years.
Alligator
10-18-2004, 12:26
I just ran across the TorsoLite (http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/torsolite_inflatable_sleeping_pad.html) 1" inflatable foam pad from Bozeman Mountain Works (I just joined BackpackingLight.com, recommended elsewhere on WhiteBlaze). This pad comes in at 10 ounces, shaving 3 ounces over a Thermarest Prolite 3s by narrowing from shoulder to torso and cutting overall length since you tend to sleep on a "pillow" anyway. A little pricey at $69.99 ($58.79 for BackpackingLight.com members).The Torsolite is 32" long. The P-3 is 48" long. As the Torsolite is 1/3 less the length, it should be 1/3 less the weight (or lower). 13*(1/3)=8.7 oz. However, the torsolite weighs 9.9 oz. It's an interesting find, but it seems to need additional components to be effective. I think it would be difficult to try to stay fixed on three components, but that's just me. I tend to roll around a lot, "like an alligator with prey;) ".
From their website, see link above.
The TorsoLite Inflatable Sleeping Pad is designed with two primary users in mind. The first group of users are lightweight backpackers who do not want to give up the comfort of an inflatable sleeping pad, and carry enough other insulation (e.g., foam backpads in your backpack for your legs and extra clothing for your head) to complement the TorsoLite. The second group of users are lightweight winter backpackers who are going to combine the TorsoLite pad with a 3/4 or full length closed cell foam sleeping pad for sleeping directly on snow.
Acutally, 32 is 2/3 of 48. It saves 1/3 the length and should save about 1/3 the weight.
Alligator
10-18-2004, 13:27
Bad math on my part:o, was thinking less. Will fix.
Kerosene
10-18-2004, 14:05
I currently carry the T-Rest 3s, which forces me to put my feet on my pack or extra clothes. I always try to form some sort of pillow also, so my head doesn't need the extra cushioning. So, even though it doesn't save as much weight as I'd like, it is lighter and it might work well for the 3-season backpacker who's looking for comfort more than insulation.
Alligator
10-18-2004, 15:19
If a hiker can be comfortable with a shorter pad, such as a 48" pad or even the 32" pad, go for it. I just know I won't be. But I'm 6'2" and 190 lbs, plus a long torso and I toss and turn. I carry the 72" T-rest to be comfortable, so while I do my best to keep the weight down, my limits differ from others. I've never been a proponent of the short pads, I find the pack too lumpy at night.
My first T-rest was the big one 77" long, 2" thick, ~ 3 lbs 6 oz! (Over ten years ago, actually, had a foam pad first.) It was a monster but man did I sleep good. I still car camp with it. I next bought an ultralite long, 72"l, 1" thick. But it doesn't have enough padding for the hips, so I switched to the P-4 and I am happy. There was a slight increase in weight, but it was offset by buying a new T-rest chair, which weighs an oz or two less now. (My wife gets the old chair and T-rest.)
The chair, again a comfort thing. Sit back, play cards, read a book, sit by the fire, relax while cooking dinner. I've got my pack weight between 30-35 lbs fully loaded (3 season), and I'm comfortable, well fed and content when I get to camp.
Advice on a 32" pad? If you know you can sleep on a 48" pad, slide your 48" pad down 16" and then sleep with your head off the end. Make sure it's on a colder night. Anyone over 64" will still need to pad their feet, but pay close attention to your head comfort, especially warmth. If you're comfortable, make the buy.
Last, I want to add that extra clothes needed to provide ground insulation are extra clothes not able to be worn if temperatures drop . So they are not really "extra" anymore (mutually exclusive uses) and become a hidden weight cost regarding the sleeping pad. Any clothing item greater than a hat or mittens will weigh more than 3-4 oz.
njkayaker
10-25-2004, 20:43
I'm 5'9'' and the short pad works fine for me. The key (in my opinion) was having some of it under my head and knees.
I went with the thicker 4 because I figured that the extra comfort was worth the slightly-increased weight. The stuffed volume of the 4 was not much more than the 3. Basically, I chose thicker/shorter over thinner/longer.
I was more concerned with volume than weight (though weight was a factor). And I found that the Prolite squishes-up well.
I do need to blow it up (i.e., it's not very self inflating).
I've only used it in cool weather (i.e., not winter). I've mostly used it on very-flat but hard surfaces (e.g., wooden platforms).
(Make sure you store it unfolded with the valve open.)
It does seems to be a bit expensive.
It does seems to be a bit expensive.
Which is why I went with the older model thermarest. It is 1/4 inch thinner, weighs the same, and has a higher R value than the P-4. Used it this last weekend and am very happy with it. It was 60 dollars cheaper. A BIG plus.