View Full Version : Small pack companies (Franatic Fringe, Laurel Mountain Designs, etc.)
Wondering if any of you guys have experience with super light packs (8-16 oz) by companies like Franatic Fringe, Mountain Laurel Designs, Gossamer, etc.?
Anyone very satisfied with one of these lightweight packs? Or am I better off buying a kit and sewing my own (Ray Way, Gossamer, etc.)?
Thanks for any help.
Trying to lighten the load even more.
Check with Egads... he's an ultralight weenie :D, and I know he uses a Gossamer pack.
The Solemates
07-25-2008, 16:26
dont know if you consider it ultralight, but i think the six moon designs packs are the best lightweight packs. granted i do not own one because i cannot justify buying another pack when i have so many, but ive tried them on at every traildays and ruck and really like them, and they are very durable.
i wouldnt make anything...but thats just me..
tlbj6142
07-25-2008, 16:35
I made my own pack that weights ~16oz. (no hipbelt), it is fine up to ~25#. Any more than that and I find it uncomfortable. But for 90% of my trips, I never exceed 20# so it isn't often an issue. You can see it here (http://picasaweb.google.com/yellowjacketlite/SkylineTrail/photo#4979420848790700050) next to me on the ground (it has 5 days worth of food and a bit of water in it at the time the picture was taken). The pack in the right foreground is a FF pack.
My back and bottom are made from Dyneema, where as the front and pockets (didn't have mesh on-hand when I made it) are silnylon. If I were to make a new version (and I will someday), I'd make the whole thing out of Dyneema (except for mesh pockets).
Have you considered SMD Essense (http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/shop/shopexd.asp?id=44) or ULA's Relay (http://www.ula-equipment.com/relay.htm) or Amp (http://www.ula-equipment.com/amp.htm)? All 3 seem like great packs and are made from more durable fabrics.
FWIW, I think Ray's pack has too much volume (same for some of the GG packs), but I like my packs small and stuffed rather than larger and loose. FF pack is basically Ray's pack already assembled. In fact, I believe it is FF "exposure" that pushed Ray into making his pack kit.
I have a 10oz pack by patagonia I really like. My regular pack is a Jam2, and much bigger at only 10oz more, but would still like to try the patagonia on a summer solo.
The Patagonia is light sylnylon, simple draw string style but with a flap and pocket on top and two drink holders on the side. I bought it as a potential front pack but love it as a day pack.
Here it is. Only 1200ci. 1800ci same weight and style would be better.
http://www.patagonia.com/web/us/product/product_focus.jsp?OPTION=PRODUCT_FOCUS_DISPLAY_HAN DLER&catcode=MAIN_SP_US.CLOTHING_GEAR.PACKS/TRAVEL_GEAR.TRAVEL_GEAR&style_color=48815-763&ws=
Old Grouse
07-25-2008, 17:02
I have that Patagonia pack also, and like it. However, I found the straps cut into my shoulders, so added some aftermarket padding that velcro's on. Perfect.
Thanks for the replies.
My girlfriend actually owns that Patagonia pack. I wouldn't dream about using it for backpacking, way too small.
As far as SMD, I wouldn't go there. I saw almost 100% disatisfaction with them on the PCT last yr. I can think of 3 people off the top of my head who switched to another company during their hike. I own a tarptent by them.
Anyone used the Franatic Fringe packs? They are pretty reasonably priced. I liked the Mountain Laurel Designs, but they seem outrageously priced for such a light pack/little material
A-Train,
Check with Fanatic Fringer on Hammock Forums about the Fanatic Fringe packs.
I like how the 17 oz Gossamer Gear G4 57 L / 3500 CI rides and fits all my down insulation w/o over compression. I like having the 3 large pockets too. Putting the pad inside the pack does make it hot in summer though. This is true of all non-frame rucksack style packs, not just GG. However, it feels good in winter.
I used to have the 8 oz G5 but over filled it and split a seam while putting it on. Yes, I over filled the pack. It was in the mid 20 lbs range loaded for low teens in GSMNP last December. It probably had ~400 miles on it.
I have a Salomon Raid Revo 20 pack too. I have used it for overnight, but it really is a day / hydration pack because it is only 17 L / 1037 CI.
I second the accolades of ULA packs too. They are very well designed and built. I have the Catalyst
I am considering either an Osprey Stratos 24 or Stratos 32 for a weekend pack. I'd love to hear Whiteblaze hiker's opinions on these too before I drop coin. I mention them because I cannot fill my GG G4 in the summer for weekend trips. I was sub 10 for my hike last weekend. It felt like slackpacking, but I had all the essentials and was as comfortable as the other dudes at the campsite.
Good luck with your selections
Egads
I was sub 10 for my hike last weekend.
Egads
Your pack size and weight was sick on the last trip. I felt like a sherpa standing next to ya.
I'll pack for you next trip and show you how it's done:D
taildragger
07-25-2008, 20:03
http://www.zpacks.com/
super light
A-Train,
Check with Fanatic Fringer on Hammock Forums about the Fanatic Fringe packs.
I like how the 17 oz Gossamer Gear G4 57 L / 3500 CI rides and fits all my down insulation w/o over compression. I like having the 3 large pockets too. Putting the pad inside the pack does make it hot in summer though. This is true of all non-frame rucksack style packs, not just GG. However, it feels good in winter.
I used to have the 8 oz G5 but over filled it and split a seam while putting it on. Yes, I over filled the pack. It was in the mid 20 lbs range loaded for low teens in GSMNP last December. It probably had ~400 miles on it.
I have a Salomon Raid Revo 20 pack too. I have used it for overnight, but it really is a day / hydration pack because it is only 17 L / 1037 CI.
I second the accolades of ULA packs too. They are very well designed and built. I have the Catalyst
I am considering either an Osprey Stratos 24 or Stratos 32 for a weekend pack. I'd love to hear Whiteblaze hiker's opinions on these too before I drop coin. I mention them because I cannot fill my GG G4 in the summer for weekend trips. I was sub 10 for my hike last weekend. It felt like slackpacking, but I had all the essentials and was as comfortable as the other dudes at the campsite.
Good luck with your selections
Egads
Thanks a lot Egads, this is exactly what I was looking for!
http://www.zpacks.com/
super light
I hiked a lot of miles around Joe last year on the PCT. I respect his designs and ingenuity, but I'm not totally sold on his stuff from a quality standpoint. I saw him making alterations way too many times on the trail. Nothing wrong with that, but I'm not handy enough to do the same on a long hike.
Greentick18d
07-26-2008, 01:05
I liked my ULA Circuit so much I bought a Relay for my smaller/summer pack and for my wife to use. The Relay is 16-17oz but the straps were really long. I cut them down and recycled the extra. Nice, bombproof Dyneema, 3 outer pockets and a bungee thingee. Sweet ride.
taildragger
07-26-2008, 03:52
I liked my ULA Circuit so much I bought a Relay for my smaller/summer pack and for my wife to use. The Relay is 16-17oz but the straps were really long. I cut them down and recycled the extra. Nice, bombproof Dyneema, 3 outer pockets and a bungee thingee. Sweet ride.
Just having inspected the ULA's (I'll get to test my circuit this weekend, and later on this summer on some summit bids) I'd take them over most lightweight. The pack durability/weight/volume is hard to beat. I think that the amp would be awesome for some trips where you don't have to carry much water.
BTW, ULA's were still available at Mt. Roger's outfitters about 2 weeks ago
I love my ULA Catalyst. It's not super light but it holds everything I need and is phenominally comfortable.
FYI, the Gossamer Gear G5 is on sale for $50 now. Large is only size left.
simplespirit
07-28-2008, 15:11
I have a ULA Catalyst and a Conduit. I've only worn the Catalyst for about 1 hour with 28 lbs in it as a test fit but I used the Conduit this past weekend and it was wonderful. It even went through some bushwhacking with me due to taking an unmarked trail and survived without a scratch. I bought the Catalyst for winter use but I'm almost positive I'll be able to carry my winter gear in the Conduit so the Catalyst may never get used.
tlbj6142
07-28-2008, 16:29
As far as SMD, I wouldn't go there. I saw almost 100% disatisfaction with them on the PCT last yr. I can think of 3 people off the top of my head who switched to another company during their hike. I own a tarptent by them. What happened to their packs? Why did they not like their SMD pack? Which model(s)?
Tarptent by SMD? Are you using "tarptent" as a generic term not the brand?
What happened to their packs? Why did they not like their SMD pack? Which model(s)?
Tarptent by SMD? Are you using "tarptent" as a generic term not the brand?
Most folks were using the purple one (starlite?). I don't remember specific problems, but it's a bold statement when you see multiple people changing packs during a thru-hike. Knew another guy who kept his (quit after 900 miles) who wasn't very happy with it.
I have the original model (Lunar solo?) and have been so-so about it. I'm a little long for it. I had the owner help me set it up properly at the Kickoff and he said it was one of the first models and "defective" and that I should buy up for 125 dollars to a newer model. I continued using it sparingly and it's been fine.
simplespirit
07-28-2008, 21:20
Just for the record, I carried a Starlite a couple of trips ago and it wasn't a good fit for me. I've also tried a Gossamer Gear Mariposa which was fine but not durable in certain areas. The ULAs seem to fit me perfectly and seem very durable so far.
FYI, the Gossamer Gear G5 is on sale for $50 now. Large is only size left.
I was interested however:
1) it doesn't seem like you can order it, and says sold out, however in another area it says only Large (which I want).
2) my friends who own this pack (and love it) warned against buying the spinaker version (which is the one advertised) saying the Sil Nylon is much more durable.
Thoughts?
Rasputen
07-28-2008, 21:45
I have a Maraposa Plus that I've used for a couple of years for hiking and backcountry Fly Fishing and it is still going strong. It's a sweet pack and I would certainly buy another and will.
FWIW, I recently inquired about a pack at GG and this is the e-mail I recieved from Grant. This may interest some folks on the fence about what pack to choose.
*We have a new G5/Miniposa hybrid coming out in a month or two
called the Monarch that might suit you. It's about 12 oz or so but has the full waistbelt of the Mariposa's, is made of silnylon for a bit more durability, and has a smaller volume like the Mini..
Happy Trails,
Grant
SouthMark
07-28-2008, 22:06
I have a Gossamer Gear Mariposa Plus that I use in winter and a ZPack Z1 that use for three season trips. I love both of these packs. They are well made and comfortable. They replaced my Granite Gear Vapor Trail and a Latitude Vapor that I never use anymore except to loan to friends.
Of the nine people who started SOBO on the CDT on June 15th this year, six had ULA packs and three had Gossamer Gears. I think all six of the ULA owners had used their packs on at least one thru-hike already. I have a Mariposa Plus, which I like a lot, but it is not in good enough shape to start another long hike. (Unlike the other eight people, I was only for a week.) The other two Gossamer Gear packs were brand new Miniposas. The owners have never done a long hike before, and I rather suspect their packs are not going to make it all the way.
A couple of photos:
http://www.trailjournals.com/photos.cfm?id=359807
http://www.trailjournals.com/photos.cfm?id=359831
I think the Miniposas were severely overloaded. I know the Colorado boys made it to Helena, but have wondered how the packs did.
taildragger
07-28-2008, 23:00
Marta, were all but one of those ULA's catalysts? I thought that I might have spotted a circuit, just curious
Marta, were all but one of those ULA's catalysts? I thought that I might have spotted a circuit, just curious
No, not all Catalysts. There were two Conduits, a P-something (2005 vintage), and I don't know about the others. I'm pretty sure the whole ULA size range was represented.
The Conduits made the biggest impression on me. I have one and know how small it is. You have to go pretty light to use one on a long hike, in the cold. Skittles had a bear canister in his, and snow shoes strapped to the top. It's a sturdy little pack.
tlbj6142
07-29-2008, 10:13
The Conduits made the biggest impression on me. I have one and know how small it is. Is it really that small? "On paper" it seems huge. That is one thing I wish pack vendors were more consistent about is pack volume. One vendor's 3200ci is no where near other vendor's 3200ci.
The one issue that bothers me the most about the Conduit is the lack of mesh (or whatever) on the back of the pack. My homemade pack's back is Dyneema and it is a sticky (sometimes uncomfortable) sweat factory. And from this I have learned that Dyneema isn't completely waterproof, my sweat will eventually penetrate the pack material. Not a big deal for me (as it just gets the surface of my pad wet), but it is annoying.
simplespirit
07-29-2008, 12:34
I think the conduit would carry all my winter gear if going tarp/bivy route or maybe even a small 1-man tent. Pretty sure I could carry all my gear and part of a 2-man tent if splitting it as well. I used it in the Shining Rock area of NC this past weekend and had no issues with stickiness of the Dyneema.
I don't have a problem with the stickiness of the back. It gets wet, of course, but no wetter than my other packs.
In terms of volume, I find it's small enough that if I have one large item (a zero-degree sleeping bag or a bear canister, for instance), there's not much room left for the rest of my stuff.
simplespirit
07-29-2008, 13:43
Odd. I carried half a synthetic quilt for 2, stove/pot/fuel, inflatable sleeping pad, first-aid/survival gear, extra socks, and food for 2 days inside the pack and I was still 3-4 inches below the top of the pack so I had that space plus the extension collar left. I could've fit our MSR Hubba Hubba minus poles in sideways and still had some room left.
My son(14) and I have ray-ways, and love them. I am not a long distance hiker, but I think doing a long hike with this pack would not be a problem. In May I did a 50 mile trek on the BMT/Approach Trail, and my pack weighed 16lbs, including food and water.
One thing I like about this pack is, after a few trips it gets funky, I just throw it in the washing machine on cold/gentle, hang it upside down dries really fast, smells brand new.
tlbj6142
07-29-2008, 14:48
I don't have a problem with the stickiness of the back. It gets wet, of course, but no wetter than my other packs. Maybe I had the wrong description of the issue. I find the Dyneema back far hotter than other back material I have used on packs. But, then, all my other packs have a padding and/or a meshy type material on their backs that has a non-continuous pattern (lumpy). Whereas my Dyneema's back more or less conforms to my back leaving very little, if any, space for air movement.
On my Dyneema pack, I don't have a hipbelt, but I would think having a hipbelt would make it worst. Then again, on my hipbelt packs, the pack's back tends to "pull away" from my back leaving an air gap. Hmmmm. Maybe I need to add a hipbelt to make my pack cooler?
Don't you just hate it when you put your pack back on in the cold after your sweat gets it wet?:(
Adding to this comment, "One vendor's 3200ci is no where near other vendor's 3200ci"; most vendors include the pockets in the volume, so be sure check the volume of the main compartment. I found out by trying on packs that I can fit more gear inside an Osprey Stratos 24 than I can in a REI Venturi 30.
Egads
Greentick18d
07-29-2008, 19:08
...Whereas my Dyneema's back more or less conforms to my back leaving very little, if any, space for air movement.
On my Dyneema pack, I don't have a hipbelt, but I would think having a hipbelt would make it worst. Then again, on my hipbelt packs, the pack's back tends to "pull away" from my back leaving an air gap. Hmmmm. Maybe I need to add a hipbelt to make my pack cooler?
On nontechnical trail I can loosen the shoulder straps slightly and put some space between me and the pack while the pack rides on my hips. I have done this with my Relay and Circuit (within the weight limit for the Relay, up to ~40# in the Circuit, I had accidentally overweighted it on a shakedown). I use this technique continuously in hot/moderate weather. In cold weather I use it on/off to control sweating.
I have been using a Conduit for a couple of years and love it, but saying that it's made of Dyneema is like saying that your car runs on Ethanol. There is less than 10% Dyneema in a Dyneema grid pack (those thin white lines), the rest is nylon. I have a full Dyneema McHale pack which is absolutely waterproof and will probably be around in the next millennium.
tlbj6142
07-29-2008, 20:18
On nontechnical trail I can loosen the shoulder straps slightly and put some space between me and the pack while the pack rides on my hips.Correct, but my Dyneema pack doesn't have a hipbelt, so the lower third to two-thirds still gets "stuck" to my back.
I did discover on my last trip that using my GG NightLight (torso length) pad (which is slightly bumpy) was less irritating than when I use my ProLite 3S. As the later, more or less, conforms to every space in my back (think of it as very soft play-doh). Whereas the former did not.
Greentick18d
07-29-2008, 21:50
Correct, but my Dyneema pack doesn't have a hipbelt, so the lower third to two-thirds still gets "stuck" to my back.
I did discover on my last trip that using my GG NightLight (torso length) pad (which is slightly bumpy) was less irritating than when I use my ProLite 3S. As the later, more or less, conforms to every space in my back (think of it as very soft play-doh). Whereas the former did not.
I just reread your post, I must of spaced and missed the last 2 lines...
Skidsteer
07-29-2008, 22:36
The Conduits made the biggest impression on me. I have one and know how small it is. You have to go pretty light to use one on a long hike, in the cold. Skittles had a bear canister in his, and snow shoes strapped to the top. It's a sturdy little pack.
The conduit will probably be my next pack purchase. I took a Circuit on a recent six day trip and had lots of space to spare.
The ULA packs are impressive and the hipbelts are just stellar.