View Full Version : Problems Sleeping
Sometimes when I hike 20 mile days I can't go to sleep at night. My heart is just pumping and I can't seem to get relaxed. It has become almost certain that when I go camping I am taking sleeping pills (happens with 10 milers too). I would not normally take sleeping pills. I smoke cigarettes but no whiskey. Am in decent shape though a bit underweight for my height. 6'3/180lbs I eat healthy but do not exercise reguarly and I do have blood sugar problems in my family (not saying I have them. . . yet). Usually hike alone but rarely get spooked. Hopefully I have posted in the right catagory. New to White Blaze. Anyone dealt with this? Is there any correlation between not eating enough and over hiking?
HikerRanky
08-26-2008, 01:29
First of all, welcome to WhiteBlaze!:welcome:welcome
While not a doctor, it sounds as though the adrenaline levels in your body are elevated.... Of course, it could also be the dopamine levels as well.... Do you feel like you could lift a car or something like that, or are you just so excited to be outdoors?
Randy
I'm not sure that your experience is that unusual. Specifically, I've had similar trouble sleeping when first getting back on the trail and read that others sometimes do as well. The general experience of being outside in a new environment, sounds of nature, hiking a long day etc. can be stimulating. It takes me a day or two to get back into a good trail sleep groove.
You might consider packing a nonprescription sleep aid like Simply Sleep (Diphenhydramine) or Advil PM (Iboprofen with Diphenhydramine). These are nonhabit forming, although I wouldn't want to use them regularly. I don't notice any after effect the next day from either if these. Use an hour or more before bedtime and you might find yourself drifting off to sleep more easily.
Blissful
08-26-2008, 10:47
It's important to get to camp at a reasonable time to allow yourself time to relax after a big day. Set your camp up early, not when it's tme for bed. Enjoy a nice dinner. And for me, laying in bed listening to my MP3 works well. Nicotine also acts as a stimulant, recommend you not smoke before bed and perhaps consider cutting back on it altogether.
You're probably uncomfortable because you're sleeping on the ground. Get a hammock and all will be solved. :D
Valentine
08-26-2008, 11:17
Sounds pretty common to me as well. I have trouble sleeping first night or two. Adjusting to less coffee and such. A comfortable hammock REALLY helps though.
I find a little Jack Daniels helps if you are not dehydrated. Can't understate how comfortable a hammock is and aids in my nights rest as Hooch says.
john gault
08-26-2008, 11:22
No pills, don't like giving money to the drug companies. When I have problems sleeping, which does happen more often on the trail, It usually only lasts one or two nights, but after that I'm pretty tired from not sleeping and hiking all day.
Also, I'd give up the cigs and start drinking whiskey. And I would start exercising, because hiking is exercise, so if the only exercise you get is hiking, here-and-there, seems like it would be harder on your body. Kind of like stop-and-go traffic vs. steady flow driving on a highway.
Footslogger
08-26-2008, 11:25
Third vote for the snort of JD before you crawl in the fartsack !!
'Slogger
Good advice so far. JD is a nice relaxant.
How often have you hiked/backpacked. Are you still just being affected by nervousness? How many days out have you gone. I know some people who are nervous the first few days, but settle down and they get acclimated and become more tired over the long haul. Most longer distance hikers I've known have no problems sleeping whenever they allow themselves the opportunity.
Welcome.
Jan LiteShoe
08-26-2008, 11:38
I never sleep well my first couple days on the trail. It's just so different from the home routine. While not nervous either, some primitive part of my brain remains on high alert.
That falls away as the exercise and lack of sleep takes its toll.
Warning: Not sleeping WILL make the hills seem higher that day though.
;-)
leeki pole
08-26-2008, 11:44
....fifth vote for JD.....sweet
I would not take pills, prescription or OTC. What's the purpose in smoking?
I often have trouble sleeping the first night out. I think its excitement, and nerviousnes.
Footslogger
08-26-2008, 11:51
Stop and eat dinner and hike on for an hour or two ...THEN take the nip of JD.
The extra miles will burn off some of that excess energy and the JD will be icing on the cake.
'Slogger
john gault
08-26-2008, 12:01
...Besides, sleeping is overrated. It's a drug company conspiracy to sell sleeping pills. It takes some practice, like anything else, but you can ween yourself off sleeping (to a point). I know this from 23 years in the Navy. Every 5 nights I would stand duty on the ship and not get more than 4 hours of sleep. And when the ship was underway, at best I'd get 6 hours a night, much of the time less sleep and usually never at one shot; never did it have a negative effect on my performance. Lack of sleep is just another crutch people can fall on when the f_ck up.
...Besides, sleeping is overrated. It's a drug company conspiracy to sell sleeping pills. It takes some practice, like anything else, but you can ween yourself off sleeping (to a point). I know this from 23 years in the Navy. Every 5 nights I would stand duty on the ship and not get more than 4 hours of sleep. And when the ship was underway, at best I'd get 6 hours a night, much of the time less sleep and usually never at one shot; never did it have a negative effect on my performance. Lack of sleep is just another crutch people can fall on when the f_ck up.
I might express it a little more gently, but basically I agree. :rolleyes:
mister krabs
08-26-2008, 12:10
I've been using melatonin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melatonin) for a while, it works for me with no perceptible residual effect.
SmokeHouse
08-26-2008, 12:10
All the above advice is great, But when is the last time you went to a doctor and had a physical done... may want to consider that also to be on the safe side...
john gault
08-26-2008, 12:12
I might express it a little more gently, but basically I agree. :rolleyes:
I'm trying, but having real problems fitting into this kinder-gentler world:sun
I have a hard time sleeping because of the different sounds in the outdoors. I have found that ear plugs work wonders for me, or falling asleep listening to an mp3 player, to either block out sounds or fall asleep to familiar sounds.
...Besides, sleeping is overrated. It's a drug company conspiracy to sell sleeping pills. It takes some practice, like anything else, but you can ween yourself off sleeping (to a point). I know this from 23 years in the Navy. Every 5 nights I would stand duty on the ship and not get more than 4 hours of sleep. And when the ship was underway, at best I'd get 6 hours a night, much of the time less sleep and usually never at one shot; never did it have a negative effect on my performance. Lack of sleep is just another crutch people can fall on when the f_ck up.It does seem to make you irritable as hell, though.
It does seem to make you irritable as hell, though.
Chocolate cheers me up more than sleep does.:rolleyes:
humunuku
08-26-2008, 13:48
Whats going on is that when you hike the 20 mile days, your body is going beyond its normal comfort zone. So when it time to go to sleep, your body is still in "i've been worked hard and need to repair my self ASAP" mode. So your HR stays up the supply all the muscles with the blood they need to do rapid repair.
How to remedy this - hike slower so your HR stays in the lower Aerobic zone until you get in better shape. Your not the only one who experiences this, high level athletes get it too (they just have a high threshold before it happens)
dessertrat
08-26-2008, 13:50
Some studies show that people who sleep much more or much less than usual have shorter life expectancies, for what it's worth.
I have the same issue. No matter how many miles I hike, I simply don't sleep much on the trail. I've tried sleep pills, but they don't work very well for me.
So I simply accept the fact that I don't sleep much on the trail, which gives me more time for hiking. :)
Jim Adams
08-26-2008, 14:12
I live on 5 hours of sleep a night in normal life but I usually sleep a good 7 hours while hiking. I have had the same problem after some long days but I usually adapt to the trai pretty quick and am sleeping well by the third night out. I do like the sounds of the night forest and they tend to lull me to sleep....and Jack Daniels always helps.
geek
yeah - Jack, Jim or SoCo help...
Tipi Walter
08-26-2008, 15:11
A Backpacker's Toolkit For Insomnia:
Several good books(wonder why my pack's so heavy??)
Little radio w/ headphones(i.e. Art Bell's Coast to Coast thru the night)
Digital camera(scroll thru your shots at night)
Trail journal(writing at night can chew up the hours--try remembering every backpacking trip you've ever done, the dates and places, the gear you used, who you were with, the highlights and weather, and write it all down)
Melantonin? Tried it but unclear results.
Camomile tea? Unclear results.
Night hiking with headlamp also works, especially in the winter(and on snow under a full moon--wow).
One last thing: Using a pair of good soft foam earplugs can often help me to sleep longer as it puts me into a very quiet cocoon beyond all sounds, jets or wind or otherwise.
john gault
08-26-2008, 16:17
A Backpacker's Toolkit For Insomnia:
...Little radio w/ headphones(i.e. Art Bell's Coast to Coast thru the night)...
That usually works for me, but sometimes it just keeps me up longer:)
superman
08-26-2008, 17:05
Now there you go. I barely stay awake until my head hits my clothes bag. Then you non-sleepers mistake my snoring for a bear. Yet another reason to not sleep in a shelter. Sun rise comes early...stop listening for the "it sounds like a bear" noise and go to sleep. I've drunk my share of JD and you usually wake up during the night and have a harder time going back to sleep. Just let the day go so you can get a jump on the next one.
I have the same problem if I go the the gym later than normal in the afternoon. Man my heart rate will not slow down forever. Usually a couple of beers does the trick for me.
You are not the only person having difficulty sleeping on the trail.:(
trouthunter
08-26-2008, 22:09
If you can't sleep keep hiking, you can walk right through darkness, it's not that bad!
Okay, seriously I have the same problem, I think it is just excitement on my part.
Like others have said, by the second or third night I sleep fine.
I live quite healthy, no smoking, exercise regularly, nutritious diet, ect.
Personally I'm not scared of a little JD myself, maybe even a script if I really need to chill. Being well rested helps you make better and faster decisions. Lots of accidents take place because of lack of sleep, but it probably isn't that big a deal on the AT.
Lawn Sale
08-27-2008, 01:21
I have the same problem. Two years ago I did the 100-Mile section and averaged 3 hours a night. No matter how hard I pushed throughout the day, it was all I could get. I normally have this problem, so I brought 2 types of sleeping pills (OTC), and despite taking 2 of them, I still couldn't sleep more than 3 hours.
No negative side effects though, and I wasn't tired during the day. It just made for long nights.
phishpapond
08-27-2008, 03:02
All this talk of JD your going to turn this guy into a drunk.
Try rum works much better for me.
You could also try Kava tea Chamomile work also but not as well.
If you can't find the teas look for the pill form.
Niether one will put you to sleep. They just make it easier for you to fall asleep
Im sure JD or JB will work, I havent been out since I posted that I was just going along with everyone. I refrain from drinking because I just drink until I'm plastered. Some would say you can't control your drinking or your this or that but hey, I quite drinking years ago so I am in control. Different folks, different strokes.
Stay up and read for a while.
WILLIAM HAYES
09-25-2008, 12:22
Try melatonin and valarian I usually take 2 tabs of each -available at Wally Mart another option is to take two benadryl tabs and an aspirin ( a trick that our Nurses on the midnite shift use to fall asleep quickly after work). Hillbilly
JD doesn't work for me, I need Gentleman Jack. Keep some of that and chocolate at the cabin as sleep aids.
maybeFritz
09-25-2008, 14:48
I will start with the disclaimer that I am just starting to really hike beyond day hikes. That said, I have spent a good bit of time outdoors, and have had similar issues.
Granted...quitting smoking will help-first hand on that one. But I suspect just being outside has something to do with it. It is not the "normal" place to sleep for you (or me, yet) so it takes a while to be comfortable. All said, the body has a fantastic way of getting itself into balance. A night or two of fitfull or hard to find sleep will leave you tired enough that the body says screw it and decides it doesn't mind the woods so much. Overall fitness tends to help-one less change for to be adapting to all at once.
And I second (or third) that the amount of sleep needed is relative-also from the navy perspective. A couple hours is more than survivable for long stretches. Just go with what your body tells you it wants, I sometimes think it is smarter than I am.