Rough Day Yesterday

[fiddlehead]

So, I have been working on this trail here in Phuket, Thailand that when finished will most likely be about 100 miles long.
I've been working on it for about 6 months now and just got my new Garmin 60 CSX to help me with things.
This is important as there is no trail out there and it is thick jungle and in the middle of rainy season which makes it thicker.

So, I wanted to hike what i have designed so far and try to do it in one day.
Which i didn't think i'd be able to but thought i'd give it a gallant effort.

It is very steep, probably 50 deg slopes at times and bushwhacking is probably necessary 20% of the time.

WHen i started this adventure, i joined the local Hash House Harriers as i heard that they knew the jungle better than anyone and had been established for 20+ years here.
I started running with them and was pretty amazed that no one ever seemed to be afraid to run through swamps, thick grass, bushwhacking etc. as Phuket is known for it's king cobras and they are deadly.
When i asked, they said no one had ever been bitten by a snake in their history of the club.
They said I should really be concerned with wasps. The local wasp here is called a Tor (speaking Thai) and they are huge. And they can kill.

well, i've been out about 15 or 16 days so far and get pretty lost and pretty heavily into some thick bushwhacks and stuck in sticker bushes etc. and about 3 weeks ago, i got bitten on my ring finger by one of these wasps.
As soon as it happened, i though that a cobra must've bitten me as i really really hurt and then turned numb and then hurt again and it all lasted 24 hours. I had trouble sleeping and was worried that i wouldn't be able to play the guitar. (i'm a professional musician come nightfall)

But the pain went away so i just thought, i'll be more careful from now on and i know what to look for.

Well, yesterday, we went out to do the whole trail with my 2 friends: Kim and Joanne (Canadian and Australian respectively) and we were about 7 hours into the hike and stuck at a very steep mtn that had given me problems before. I was about to come back down and look for another place to start when Kim said: it looks like it would be pretty easy to climb up that stream bed full of big boulders.
Well, i didn't use my head and just started climbing some boulders.
AFter about 100 feet of climb, i pulled myself up and looked and there was the dreaded wasp nest right in front of me with about 30 of the bastards flying around.
They are about an inch and half long and i immedietly yelled "Wasp" go down quick. and started crashing down myself.
One hit my head hard and i swatted him to the rock below and hit him with my stick. He got back up and came after me again. Two of them were circling my head and 7 times (about) they hit my hat (hard)
Finally, one got me in the neck just below my hat.
Now, my skin was very exposed as i had shorts and a tank top on as it often gets to 100 deg here. They didn't even try to get me on the skin. They just kept hitting my head and hat.

We were all scrambling as fast as we could now and were almost 60 or 70 yards away when another one hit me on the back of my head just beneath my hat.
The pain was very intense. I was pretty scared as it was near my spinal chord and the other near my jugalar vein.
We sat down for a while and drank lots of water and continued.
When we got to the top, there was a monk camp there in the jungle and a Buddha statue with monks meditating and chanting and doing what they do.

One of them knew me (from having been there before in my exploration) and we told him what happened. They blessed us and gave us bracelets to protect us but told us that these Tor are very dangerous and have been known to bring down an elephant!
WE ended up stopping for the day at the top as my head was throbbing and it was a good 3 or 4 hours to the next road crossing and we had already done 8 or 9 hours and were all tired anyway.

I couldn't sleep much last night mostly because i couldn't lay my head down anywhere without pain. or at least until i rolled it a bit then it woke me. I had a slight fever and went to a Thai Pharmacist who gave me Monkey balm which is what i said on a thread about 2 weeks ago as what to be used for insect bites (Monkey or Tiger balm, Tiger being the stronger but she said that Monkey is better, not sure why)


Anyway, in retrospect, i am not going to let this stop me from doing what i love. But, i will say that it was the most dangerous situation i think i've ever been in in 18 years of hiking.
i've been false charged by a bear, almost stepped on a sleeping bear, almost stepped on a 3 rattlesnakes, did a chin up on a waterfall in CA and came face to face with a copperhead, been chased my a cow moose when alone in MT, been indirectly struck my lightening on the AT (hit a barbed wire fence next to me and jumped across it to my knees and knocked me off my feet), and had hypothermia in the smokies in an 8" rainstorm when i was too stupid to stop and put on my fleece jacket until too late, and have had 2 brown recluse spider bites, all in the states.

Anyway, i'll be trying to organize the mileage and the turns for a future guidebook or instruction book on the route as well as uploading the actual track from my gps onto my blog when i'm done so, if anyone wants to come hike paradise, they can. But thought i'd tell you about the worst wildlife encounter i've yet to have on the trail

Here's one picture from earlier in the day: http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg201/fiddleheadpa/xwhiteblaze.jpg

[_terrapin_]

I don't have any stories to compare to yours, Fiddlehead. But I can state for a fact that last year on the AT, my biggest annoyance (besides the drought, maybe) was the prevalence of stinging insects. Ironically, the stings made for my longest-mileage day. I figured the best way to avoid the bastards (and work off the pain) was to walk as fast as I could.

[Gray Blazer]

Good story, glad you're OK.

[Kerosene]

i've been false charged by a bear, almost stepped on a sleeping bear, almost stepped on a 3 rattlesnakes, did a chin up on a waterfall in CA and came face to face with a copperhead, been chased my a cow moose when alone in MT, been indirectly struck my lightening on the AT (hit a barbed wire fence next to me and jumped across it to my knees and knocked me off my feet), and had hypothermia in the smokies in an 8" rainstorm when i was too stupid to stop and put on my fleece jacket until too late, and have had 2 brown recluse spider bites, all in the states.Remind me not to hike with you, fiddlehead. Or, maybe I should hike with you if you're going to attract all the bad stuff?! ;) Glad to hear that you made it back okay.

[Yahtzee]

Be well, Fiddlehead. Keep that spirit of yours.

[NICKTHEGREEK]

Just from my viewpoint Fiddlehead the bee stings are a small price to pay for the company. They seem to be quite easy on the eyes.

[Homer&Marje]

Just from my viewpoint Fiddlehead the bee stings are a small price to pay for the company. They seem to be quite easy on the eyes.

Those views are very easy on the eyes. As someone who has been stung by a large wasp (Not in Thailand) but they are super painful... I saw one in the whites that was all black with white and yellow stripes, about 2 inches long, 1/2 inch of that being stinger...looked nasty, glad it wasnt in a foul mood. Great story though.

[fiddlehead]

Remind me not to hike with you, fiddlehead. Or, maybe I should hike with you if you're going to attract all the bad stuff?! ;) Glad to hear that you made it back okay.

That's just all the bad stuff (in one sentence)
Would take a thick book to tell all the good stuff that happened in that time including the rest of the day we had on Sunday.
I already got a wonderful email from one of the girls thanking me for such a great day!
It's mostly all Good! (except here i am almost 2 days later and still have a headache)

[Marta]

Wow, not fun. Good luck with avoiding the evil beasts in the future.

Have you tried Benadryl? Is the wasp venom harmful because it's a poison, like a snakebite, or because it evokes an allergic reaction, like most wasp stings do here? If it's the latter, Benadryl might help.

[mudcap]

Good luck,flying beasts suck. I am always allergic. Like Marta said,Benadryl for me. Helps, but is not a cure-all for me,had some rough times too. The older I get the more complicated it gets.:o

[CrumbSnatcher]

fiddlehead, Paradise? wasp that can drop a elephant ah,no thanks. stop playing with the wildlife and get a pet. a dog or something. wait a minute where do you live? lets forget about the dog. just joking, i'm glad your alright.or at least as normal as you were before:-?:D

[fiddlehead]

Is the wasp venom harmful because it's a poison, like a snakebite, or because it evokes an allergic reaction, like most wasp stings do here?

Not sure but i think it's a poison as i've never had a reaction to a bee sting like some do.
It's hard to get accurate info here as most things are in Thai.
If i ask Thai people, they just say "oh wow!, hurts like hell for 24 hours" and too many at one time can kill you.

I have a friend who was stung years ago and his hair is white in that spot now.

It ain't gonna stop me from hiking. The important thing is, i know what they look like now and will carry some monkey balm with me from now on.

Thanks for all the kind words everyone.
Hello Yahtzee. You still in law school?

[Egads]

Fiddlehead,

I just checked out your gallery. You've got some great pics. Take care and carry the benedryl.

Egads

[Jan LiteShoe]

Well, as a beekeeper and a one with an interest in pollinators and such, your story intrigued me (glad you're okay!). I know nest-builders will often defend their brood and colony fiercely against percieved threats.

I googled around and came up with this on a Thai forum:

"The large black and orange wasp or hornet is called a "Dtua Dtor". It is generally not agressive and will only sting when provoked. The sting is extremely painful & highly poisonous. Usually a trip to the hospital and occasionally fatal - especially for young children."

"Tor Hua Sua,
black and orange, about 1 1/2 inches long and quite fat - these give a wonderful sting, got done by two of them on the arms, it is the most painful sting I have ever had, I was literally "thrown back" like an electric shock..only worse. 12 hours later my arm was twice the size and I had to use my other hand to lift it onto the steering wheel to drive the car. These can kill you ( apparently 7- 10 stings can be fatal), 2 kids near me died not long back, a guy in Chiang Rai died after climbing a tree to attack their nest (not the best idea), do not believe Thai when they say that they do not attack unless provoked..bull****, once they establish a nest you will be attacked by just venturing near it.
I was a bit inclined to "live and let live" with the nest in my garden, starts out like a tennis ball, and true, they didn't bother me, however, as it grew to the size of an overgrown football, their habits change and they become extremely aggressive, they will attack without provocation."

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Big-Black-Wasps-t192548.html

[Jan LiteShoe]

By the way, was this the nasty bugger?
http://flickr.com/photos/tjt195/43919505/in/pool-10millionphotos

And from this wacky site Thaibugs:
http://www.thaibugs.com/Articles/ananova.htm


Snack-hunting man stung to death by wasp swarm
A man has died after being stung by wasps in Thailand while raiding a nest for an afternoon snack.Nor Jaiprom and his friend Somboom Jaiwong went into the forest after work, to look for wasps nests and remove larvae to roast as a snack.The men disturbed a nest and a swarm of angry wasps emerged and attacked them.Mr Jaiprom had found the giant nest in a tamarind tree and poked it with a stick, while Mr Jaiwong shook the tree.The Thai Rath newspaper reports 49-year-old Mr Jaiwong ran away screaming in pain from the stings but his friend was overcome.His bright red and swollen body which had been stung dozens of times was found near the tree.Mr Jaiwong, who is recovering in hospital, said they had collected wasp larvae many times before and the insects usually flew away without attacking.
Ananova Story filed: 09:00 Friday 21st September 2001



Do you have the plant/weed plantain around?
It seems to grow everywhere in the states, and was introduced from another continent.
http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/plala.htm
The broadleaf form works too, and wikipedia says it grows in much of Asia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadleaf_plantain

I encourage it to grow near the bee yard. When I get careless and get popped, chew a leaf, hold it on as a poultice for a minute or two, and pain and itching is much relieved. It contains allantoin and other compounds that disperse the venom. Might work, across the world.

[Yahtzee]

Hello Yahtzee. You still in law school?

Just graduated. Are you looking to sue the wasps? Pain, suffering, oh man, think of the possibilities. I studied international law mainly, so I'll just change the word "international" to "interspecies" and I think we are golden.

Moved to Philly to be with my lady and am planning on doing the Horseshoe Trail shortly just to get out for a while.

Hope all is well. The thought of actually putting together a trail from scratch is one I toy with when daydreaming. Must feel excellent to have accomplished it for real. Congrats on its completion!

[Erin]

Thanks for sharing. Your experience is incredible and interesting. Your posts are excellent. Please stay safe and continue to share your stories about your trip.

[brotheral]

Very interesting read !! Glad you're okay.... :sun

[MedicineMan]

real name=inpatients capensis common name=touch me knot
I've got 3 bee hives up and running at the house, was working one hive with no smoke and took 3 hits on the back of the neck all 3 within an inch diameter--a wee bit of pain; luckily a thick crop of Jewel weed is on the 'fleeing path' from the hive....crushed and rubbed into the bit area and instant relief.
Just thinking maybe a similar/equivalent plant exists over there.
p.s. also excellent for poison ivy :)

[fiddlehead]

Well, as a beekeeper and a one with an interest in pollinators and such, your story intrigued me (glad you're okay!). I know nest-builders will often defend their brood and colony fiercely against percieved threats.

I googled around and came up with this on a Thai forum:

"The large black and orange wasp or hornet is called a "Dtua Dtor". It is generally not agressive and will only sting when provoked. The sting is extremely painful & highly poisonous. Usually a trip to the hospital and occasionally fatal - especially for young children."

"Tor Hua Sua,
black and orange, about 1 1/2 inches long and quite fat - these give a wonderful sting, got done by two of them on the arms, it is the most painful sting I have ever had, I was literally "thrown back" like an electric shock..only worse. 12 hours later my arm was twice the size and I had to use my other hand to lift it onto the steering wheel to drive the car. These can kill you ( apparently 7- 10 stings can be fatal), 2 kids near me died not long back, a guy in Chiang Rai died after climbing a tree to attack their nest (not the best idea), do not believe Thai when they say that they do not attack unless provoked..bull****, once they establish a nest you will be attacked by just venturing near it.
I was a bit inclined to "live and let live" with the nest in my garden, starts out like a tennis ball, and true, they didn't bother me, however, as it grew to the size of an overgrown football, their habits change and they become extremely aggressive, they will attack without provocation."

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Big-Black-Wasps-t192548.html

Thanks for working that out Jan Lite Shoe. I too found that post last night in the middle of the NFL games (they start at midnight and go till 9 AM here)
I believe the one you posted the link to the picture is not the same one.
The one that attacked me was mostly black with a white or light yellow thing hanging from it's belly. I couldn't find an exact match on that guys website.
But it hurt, i'll tell you that.

A few Thai people including my wife told me that Thai's love the larvae but it is very dangerous to go after it. They eat many strange things here. (but not dog)

I have a thick skull i guess in more ways than one and am not going to let this stop me from doing what i love. I am thinking of maybe carrying some powerful insect spray and carrying it on my belt like bear spray. (Hey, these buggers hurt me more than any bear ever did.)

I am just now starting to write up an entry on my blog about the whole day and have lots of pictures to go into it. It may take a while to put down my thoughts properly but will let this forum know when I get the page done.

This is just the first 15 kms of a trail that is expected to be about 150 kms when i get to the other end of the island. i'm figuring it's going to take me at least 3 years. But i'm learning as i go and once i get further north, will get a lot of help from the hash house harriers who know that area a lot better than down in the southern part where i live.

I need some help with some technical problems like turning my gps screen into a jpg file that i am going to try to get over in another thread here on whiteblaze. Also the profile map on my gps that i want to turn into something visual online. If anyone knows how to do this could they please help. (PM or post on here and i'll contact you)
My new gps is a Garmin 60 CSX and is awesome. Kept it on all day and never lost signal and was in some heavy duty jungle too.

Ok, thanks for all the support. Keep it coming. I am anxious to get things written down and go out and redo a couple of problem areas and most likely will go out another day and continue on some of the terrain i have marked before and go another 10 kms or so before my trip back to the states in Oct 20.

Yahtzee, i like your way of thinking to possible fund this adventure. Congratulations. Philly aye? I'll be in Port Clinton Nov 10 till
Dec 18, then back here in PHuket.

[BeerStyck]

Hey Fiddlehead! Yahtzee directed me over here to this thread. That's a good read, thanks for the story! I'm glad you're okay and not planning to allow this to get in the way of your vision of a trail across the island.

I'm not sure if it can happen, but I would love to make it up your way and meet up w/ both you and Yahtzee while you're in sometime in Nov. or Dec. Take care man and keep living the way only you know how.

BeerStyck

[fiddlehead]

I have written up my first section of my future guidebook.
I am expecting the first section to be about 15% of the whole trail when finished.

I would appreciate any and all feedback on this guidebook if anyone cares to spend the time reading it.
It is complete with about a dozen pictures from the first 15 kms of the trail and about a 10 hour hike so far.

Also, I am posting a .kmz file which can be downloaded from here at whiteblaze and put into YOUR Google Earth and you can follow the route exactly if you so choose. The red line would be my original intended route designed on GE, the yellow line is the line i hiked with the girls last Sunday and the grey line is the route i fixed, as i found a new way over one of the mountains yesterday.

Here are the links. click here for the story (http://fiddlehead.wordpress.com/2008/09/26/guidebook-for-phuket-high-trail-section-a/) on my blog.

And here is the .kmz file http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/wb_style/attach/kmz.gif

Any feedback can be given either on this thread, or a PM, or on the blog itself. Up to you.

I'm much more of a hiker than a guidebook writer so please guide me on my guidebook. Thanks