View Full Version : personal Safety (not from bears)
We are group of women hiking for couple days starting this weekend and wondering if it is safe for us to do.
depends upon where you're hiking and whether or not you know what you're doing.
be smart, use your brain, and trust your gut, if it feels wrong, then don't do it or move on... if you meet someone that makes you feel uncomfortable then move on... do your research (lots of reading available here on wb), be sure you have the appropriate gear...
gsingjane
12-24-2008, 09:10
Worrying about personal safety is something women unfortunately have to do, on the trail or off. But from my experience, you will be fine on the trail, especially if you're in a group. I know it is a little daunting at the beginning, and the first night out you may toss and turn a little bit (sounds are much louder at night!) but odds are, you will be safe and you will have a wonderful time. Accept that you'll be scared (there is a reason humans like fire and houses!) but also understand, that's part of the experience and will lessen with time. Just try not to focus on it too much and get yourself too worked up, you'll talk yourself out of going and that would be a shame.
Have fun, that's the most important thing.
Jane in CT
buckwheat
12-24-2008, 10:49
Hang a sign on your pack:
"Looking For Hardworking Husbands"
I doubt you'll have any trouble outta the trail mix you'll encounter.
Montana Mac
12-24-2008, 10:53
I know this is a woman only forum but safety is a question on a lot of peoples mind. I posted this info in another thread earlier today.
Here is some info:
John Viehman, executive director of Backpacker in an article stated that there is one crime for every 800,000 users and that you are 190 times more likely to get killed in a car accident driving to the trail head. Also there have only been seven people killed in the last fifty years.
Here is link to the above info:
http://books.google.com/books?id=LgC...um=9&ct=result
It is also important, IMHO, not to act like a "victim". Most predators, humans included, will look for the weakest target that will give them the least fight. If you maintain a posture that indicates you are not an easy target your chances of harm will be greatly reduced. Also as Jane stated being with a group will give you an added advantage.
Have a safe and enjoyable hike.
Rockhound
12-24-2008, 11:17
I'm sure some on this site would suggest that you all be armed when hikng. I disagree. Alone, you may fall into the "target group". By hiking in a group nobody in your group will be precieved as a "victim". If you were hiking alone you may or may not want to take additional precautions but the fact is, even if you choose to hike alone, you are actually safer on the trail than out there in the "real world" I'm sure this post will soon be deleted as I've found the moderators here stand on the opposite side of this issue but in the end its a personal choice.
Use common sense and you should be fine. At this time of the year especially, you should focus your attention on staying warm, dry, fed, sheltered, and on your feet (I'm talking about the footing). Leave detailed info with your family/friends on your route, parking, car make, model, and license, and expected return.
Slo-go'en
12-24-2008, 12:06
My only concern for personal safety at this time of year would be "are you prepared for the weather?" All other threats are insignificant by comparison.
Lone Wolf
12-24-2008, 12:08
not true. don't forget what happened to meredith
From an ex-law enforcement officer, if you are going to hike alone, be aware of other people and be OVERLY observant of every person you visually make contact with. Always be aware of your surroundings, if you can hike with a group, do so! (of course I hike alone 90% of the time--like I have room to preach). If you can at least carry a can of Pepper spray that is issued to LE officers (21% or greater) I would strongly suggest buying it. I personally do not carry a weapon while hiking. I have never encountered anyone acting strange YET!! But Lonewolf has a good point! Look what happened to Meredith and the elderly couple from Brevard. Scary thing is, I was hiking in that area when they disappeared. But all in all, hiking is ALOT safer than driving your own car! Just go out and enjoy what the mountains have to offer and soak up the wonderful vistas! Don't worry about things too much, it will spoil your hike if you do!
Blissful
12-25-2008, 23:51
be smart, use your brain, and trust your gut, if it feels wrong, then don't do it or move on... if you meet someone that makes you feel uncomfortable then move on... do your research (lots of reading available here on wb), be sure you have the appropriate gear...
All of the above.
And carry cell phones and your own gear for safety and survival (and in case others drop out).
And don't give strangers your itinerary.
BumpJumper
12-26-2008, 20:15
From a WOMAN's point of view....safety is in most of our (womens) minds. Something most men dont understand.
Use your gut like another poster said. Common sense is key and attitude is upmost.
From a cops point of view...just be aware of your surroundings....just like in the parking lots. When strangers are around, just take notice.
skinewmexico
12-26-2008, 20:52
Use the buddy system.
2011_thruhiker
12-26-2008, 21:34
I solo hike-alot. The best advice I have to give-and practice alot-always use your head and know where you are at all times. There is some things I carry on my person at all times and not in my pack-my cellphone (although it will be doubtful if you will get signal, but if you can get somewhere to where you can use it then it will be invaluable), and a 6" folding knife, some type of currancy-perferrably cash-and identification. The biggest two things that will help save me is 1. A way to communicate (once I get to a place where the phone can be used) and 2. A way to defend myself. All else can be dealt with until help arrives.
Also, I don't take unness. chances such as inviting people I just met into my camp and I also camp so I am not easily seen or acessed from the trail. The less people who know where I am-the less trouble I run into. BTW-my experiances have always been very pleasant but my guard is still up regardless.
2011_thruhiker
12-26-2008, 21:52
Also-sorry for the double post-but I forgot to add a couple more tips-
1. I never EVER let people walk behind me-I always step aside and allow them to pass. I can't watch people from the back of my head, so I rather have them in front of me where I can see them.
2. Before stepping out on the trail, my friends and family have my iternary, but I always stop by the Ranger's Station to say a quick hello and let them know where I am off too and where my car is parked. I have been asked-more often than not-if I would like to leave my name, date of when I will be back and liscense plate with my car description so they can "keep it on their patrols". This is always nice.
3. I also point my tent door from my viewing vantage point-usually from the way I came in to my campsite. It's usually easier to see someone coming towards you that way which hopefully buys you an extra second or two to re-act.
4. Flashlights are always kept on a clip so at night I know exactly where it is-usually swinging from the inside top of my tent or from my belt loop on my pants.
5. As I said before all my experiances have been very pleasant, however, if my gut feeling tells me to get off the trail or re-route-I immediately do so without a second thought. And have done so several times. You need your instincts out there and the trail will definately fine tune them. So rely, rely, rely on them as you do your gear. It just may save your life.
Even though I solo hike-I'd still follow these same rules even if I was hiking with a group-
don't forget what happened to Meredith but don't be afraid to put your foot out there because of that, what happened to her was a freak thing and her killer is behind bars now, the chances of something horrible happening on the trail are very very very slim... as others have pointed out the more dangerous part is heading to and from the trail...
(and please don't turn this in to a meredith argument, i just don't want to see everyone afraid to step out their doors)
We have some personal safety and awareness tips for A.T. hikers posted on our website at http://www.appalachiantrail.org/safetyawareness.
Laurie Potteiger
ATC
While all the advice mentioned above is warranted, please do not forget that as a group you are only as fast as your slowest hiker. Make sure you have maps in the case of an emergency for alternate routes out, make a doable itinerary considering all fitness levels. Make sure everybody is carrying the correct gear, being that it is winter, not a bad idea since you are in a group to each one carry something extra, one thing, an emergency blanket, an extra long underware top, and extra long underware bottom, an extra headlamp, extra batteries. As far a saftey from strangers, unlikley to be a problem. Stay hydrated and look out for your fellow hikers
From a WOMAN's point of view....safety is in most of our (womens) minds. Something most men dont understand.
Use your gut like another poster said. Common sense is key and attitude is upmost.
From a cops point of view...just be aware of your surroundings....just like in the parking lots. When strangers are around, just take notice.
How is it that men don't understand safety concerns? Lots of men are slight of stature or don't have self-defense training. Not all men are billy bad...butt and probably worry about safety too. I won't go into it since this is in the women's forum, just don't be closed minded.
I think Bumpjumper is talking in general terms, and I agree with her. Men don't have to be as cautious as women, that's just a fact, generally speaking. This is not about being close-minded.
All the advice here is good advice. I've been hiking alone since 2003 and honestly, I feel safest on the AT. Happy Hiking
Something tells me this will be removed but I think it is good advise. Pepper spray is great when you have it handy, but most wont. A gun in your pack it worthless unless they are dumb enough to wait for you to fish it out to shoot them. I am a large man with very little fear of being attacked but I have shown many woman how to use there knife if things turn ugly. Most important thing to remember if using a knife for defence, DON"T LET THEM KNOW YOU HAVE IT TILL ITS TO LATE! Assisted opening 4-6in folding knife with belt clip, I can have it in my hand and open in less than a second, so can you. Most people carry a knife anyway so it's not even added weight. I'm sure there are good sites on the web that will show you places to cut someone to disable them and not kill them. Just keep your head if being attacked. Also don't forget those hiking poles, or should I say short spear if used right.
sliderule
01-01-2009, 12:35
I never EVER let people walk behind me-I always step aside and allow them to pass. I can't watch people from the back of my head, so I rather have them in front of me where I can see them.
Everyone should adopt that policy!!!
eganblue
01-11-2009, 23:14
I'm planning on thru-hiking the year after I graduate but I don't have any friends/family who are willing to go with me. I'll be eighteen. Would it be foolish to go alone?
fraufrack
01-12-2009, 01:08
I took a course at my university called "Rape Aggression Defense." It is offered all over the country through schools and other community centers, though I'm sure there are other short self defense classes you can find, too. RAD is only taught to women, and provides all sorts of self defense moves that use only your own wit and strength, because any weapon you have, even pepper spray, can be used against you. I feel much safer after having taken the class and would recommend it to any woman. Also, be careful about sharing any tips you learn. Obviously, we all want our sisters, moms, daughters, and gal friends to be safe, but if you put a tip in public domain then a predator can use it against you.
Something tells me this will be removed but I think it is good advise. Pepper spray is great when you have it handy, but most wont. A gun in your pack it worthless unless they are dumb enough to wait for you to fish it out to shoot them. I am a large man with very little fear of being attacked but I have shown many woman how to use there knife if things turn ugly. Most important thing to remember if using a knife for defence, DON"T LET THEM KNOW YOU HAVE IT TILL ITS TO LATE! Assisted opening 4-6in folding knife with belt clip, I can have it in my hand and open in less than a second, so can you. Most people carry a knife anyway so it's not even added weight. I'm sure there are good sites on the web that will show you places to cut someone to disable them and not kill them. Just keep your head if being attacked. Also don't forget those hiking poles, or should I say short spear if used right.
Let me first start by saying hi and sorry for intruding on a women's only forum. I do have to agree with Wyrm, though I'm not exactly large(5'8" 190 athletic frame) I don't fear getting attacked(the new yorker in me) but I still carry a knife, a tactical folder, CRKT with a carson flipper that opens as fast as a switchblade. Never know when you'll need something to protect yourself. Also forget about that using your keys thing most women are taught, it doesn't work unless you get in really close and the more distance from an attacker the better. And if you have to, go "unlady like" and hit the soft and squishies, twig and berries, wedding equipment, or whatever you like to call them.
The knife can be found here for more info http://www.crkt.com/m16srt.html
randyg45
01-13-2009, 17:55
"Trusting your gut" is great- until you are actually attacked.
The poster who said "don't look like a victim" is exactly right. Matter of fact, why not look loke a predator? Wear an "NRA" hat or a S&W tshirt, or maybe an " I Kil Yu School of Kung Fu" sweatshirt. Hang a suitable knife (NOT a fake-looking Rambo job; just a hunting/camping knife, preferably well-used, with a 4" or so blade) and a can of bear spray on your hipbelt or pack straps.
Muggers and rapists look for ez targets. Look otherwise.
"Trusting your gut" is great- until you are actually attacked.
The poster who said "don't look like a victim" is exactly right. Matter of fact, why not look loke a predator? Wear an "NRA" hat or a S&W tshirt, or maybe an " I Kil Yu School of Kung Fu" sweatshirt. Hang a suitable knife (NOT a fake-looking Rambo job; just a hunting/camping knife, preferably well-used, with a 4" or so blade) and a can of bear spray on your hipbelt or pack straps.
Muggers and rapists look for ez targets. Look otherwise.
Well put, and although I agree with not looking like a victim helps, advertising isn't something that will do it.
If someone really wants to try and hurt you all that posturing is just a challange for them. And most guys thrive on challenge, possitively or negatively.
Best if you learn how to defend yourselves more. That will prevent you from carrying yourself as a victim as well as giving you the edge of not being on if needed. Women are expected to be passive, change that and you change being prey. Sorry if I've spoken a little too candid for most but when it comes right down to it its always better to be safe than sorry.
BumpJumper
01-14-2009, 05:46
How is it that men don't understand safety concerns? Lots of men are slight of stature or don't have self-defense training. Not all men are billy bad...butt and probably worry about safety too. I won't go into it since this is in the women's forum, just don't be closed minded.
I aint smokin what you are rollin on that one. Not a clue what you are talking about. I didnt say the first thing about men being billy bad butts or their safety.
Women get on this forum to ask WOMEN'S perspectives. A MAN is NOT a woman. At least not physically in some cases. So, how could they possibly know how a woman feels about something....anything?????
Why the bark?:confused:
From a WOMAN's point of view....safety is in most of our (womens) minds. Something most men dont understand.
Use your gut like another poster said. Common sense is key and attitude is upmost.
From a cops point of view...just be aware of your surroundings....just like in the parking lots. When strangers are around, just take notice.
How is it that men don't understand safety concerns? Lots of men are slight of stature or don't have self-defense training. Not all men are billy bad...butt and probably worry about safety too. I won't go into it since this is in the women's forum, just don't be closed minded.
I aint smokin what you are rollin on that one. Not a clue what you are talking about. I didnt say the first thing about men being billy bad butts or their safety.
Women get on this forum to ask WOMEN'S perspectives. A MAN is NOT a woman. At least not physically in some cases. So, how could they possibly know how a woman feels about something....anything?????
Why the bark?:confused:
what don't you understand? men worry about safety too. for themselves, for their loved ones. in fact, general probably worries more about my safety on the trail than i do.
BumpJumper
01-14-2009, 13:45
Uh...yeah...ok.
I aint smokin what you are rollin on that one. Not a clue what you are talking about. I didnt say the first thing about men being billy bad butts or their safety.
Women get on this forum to ask WOMEN'S perspectives. A MAN is NOT a woman. At least not physically in some cases. So, how could they possibly know how a woman feels about something....anything?????
Why the bark?:confused:
1) I don't bark
2) I ain't "rollin" anything
You disdain for men shows through in the tone of your posts. You can argue that all day long but that is my opinion.
Men understand person safety issues. Men get raped, beaten and robbed these days. Maybe not as much as women, but it happens. If a man is approached on a trail by several shady characters they are probably thinking the same thing as a woman - how the hell can I get out of here. (Seen Deliverance? Most men have.)
Ok, last post by me because I'm right.
BumpJumper
01-14-2009, 17:33
Ouch. That just hurts.:D
Mrs Baggins
01-14-2009, 18:00
I was always terrified on trails, even with my husband there. My parents were the "murderers are behind every rock" kind of people and never had an encouraging word about being out in the woods. Then one day in New Zealand in 2003 I walked away from my husband and the others we were with and headed back down a long trail in the woods to where our van was parked. I was about 2 miles along a 4 mile trail when I realized I was on my own - no one was anywhere near me - and I wasn't scared. I was 47. Since then I've done a lot of overnights and several days at a time hikes and while I'm always with someone I am no longer scared when they are out of my sight. I am cautious, absolutely, and always acutely aware of my surroundings and every sound but I am not terrified anymore.
Silly story: I was with SHOE and Slow Barbara coming out of the Smokies and headed for Standing Bear Hostel. I had gotten way ahead on the last mile or so and was headed down the trail towards the gravel road to the hostel when I saw a beat up old car sitting on the road. I stopped dead and watched it for a minute, then walked forward - and the car crept forward, and stopped when I stopped. So I'm in Tennessee, every book I've read about women hiking in TN had stories about creeps watching for women at the road crossings and I'm alone. I made a big show of checking my watch and looking back up the trail to show I was waiting on others coming up behind me (and they were nowhere in sight or sound) and then decided to just turn around and go back to meet up with them. When I turned and started back up the trail, the car moved forward a little and then the guy was yelling my name at me! Beat up old car and scraggly haired guy - wonderful. And then I saw SHOE! Turned out she had called Curtis at Standing Bear for a ride as she was having leg pain and they had just pulled up to wait for me to come down the trail! So sometimes, not usually, but sometimes our gut is wrong. I apologized to Curtis for thinking he was scum. :)
BumpJumper
01-14-2009, 19:11
So true like everything else in life. You never know.
Sleeps_With_Skunks
01-15-2009, 04:44
This is a great thread.
I used to teach the self defense course for my dojo to the younger preteens. As I used to tell them you can't prepare for everything or you will make yourself paranaoid at everything. What you can do is make yourself look like less of a target. The last thing a person who wants to harm you in anyway wants is someone that gives them grief.
I taught girls and boys how to handle things only if a person that shouldn't be touching you touches you because words are words....actions are a whole different game. I also threatened to make them the test dummy for the self defense class if I found out they were using this knowledge to show off or beat up on their siblings. I showed them how to dress, carry themselves, and how to be aware of what is going on around them. If you want a copy of my handout to my class...feel free to PM me and I'll send it to you.
Yes, I carry a small pepper spray/mace /UV mix for my own sense of security and the fact that I attract black and white critters into camp for some odd reason. I also teach the knowledge that if a person who is drunk or high on drugs, pepper spray or anything else short of breaking their knee will not stop stop them if they grab you...yes I taught people how to break knees, bite, and (my favorite) the proper way to spit to totally gross someone out and make them let go of you. As my sensei taught me..."groin strikes...they can still walk and be a lot more angry at you....break the knee and they aren't going anywhere much less after you. And if you use this and it's not a life or death situation I will have you doing warmups until you drop."
If someone is truly worried about their safety...take a self defense course at a respectable place.
2011_thruhiker
01-15-2009, 12:09
This is a great thread.
If someone is truly worried about their safety...take a self defense course at a respectable place.
I agree! However, being a woman and a 2nd degree black belt in Kempo karate as well as having taught self-defense classes for over 10 years, the chances of the physical aspect of self defense moves being mastered enough in 1-5 classes to be life saving are slim.
However, a good olde fashioned kick to the groin sending the groin parts into the belly are not. You only need one strike to get away. Make it count is my attitude.
And the mental conditioning given in self defense classes are invaluble. I always start off my first sentence in the first class-"Ladies, martial arts will NOT save your life, but the mental conditioning and the courage to do what is ness. to save your life to your life that you will gain from this class, will save your life. Because when it comes down to it-the only thing that is going to save your life in a crisis situation is your head and the ability to stay calm to do what you need to do."
I don't teach how to kick the crap out of someone with fancy moves, but how to make that one strike count to bide enough time to get the hell out of there and awareness to surroundings-you're your first line and ONLY line of defense.
BTW, I do believe a darkened parking lot at night is far more dangerous for a woman to be attacked than the AT. You wouldn't catch me dead pitching my tent in Walmart's parking lot without a loaded 12 gauge shotgun by my side.
And if anyone is interested....I do teach self defense classes free. I am a firm believer of it and have seen the results first hand of that kind of mental conditioning at work-highly affective.
I agree! However, being a woman and a 2nd degree black belt in Kempo karate as well as having taught self-defense classes for over 10 years, the chances of the physical aspect of self defense moves being mastered enough in 1-5 classes to be life saving are slim.
However, a good olde fashioned kick to the groin sending the groin parts into the belly are not. You only need one strike to get away. Make it count is my attitude.
And the mental conditioning given in self defense classes are invaluble. I always start off my first sentence in the first class-"Ladies, martial arts will NOT save your life, but the mental conditioning and the courage to do what is ness. to save your life to your life that you will gain from this class, will save your life. Because when it comes down to it-the only thing that is going to save your life in a crisis situation is your head and the ability to stay calm to do what you need to do."
I don't teach how to kick the crap out of someone with fancy moves, but how to make that one strike count to bide enough time to get the hell out of there and awareness to surroundings-you're your first line and ONLY line of defense.
BTW, I do believe a darkened parking lot at night is far more dangerous for a woman to be attacked than the AT. You wouldn't catch me dead pitching my tent in Walmart's parking lot without a loaded 12 gauge shotgun by my side.
And if anyone is interested....I do teach self defense classes free. I am a firm believer of it and have seen the results first hand of that kind of mental conditioning at work-highly affective.
well, which one is it?
Lone Wolf
01-15-2009, 13:09
meredith knew karate
I grew up on a farm and wandered around in the woods alone or with other kids as I was growing up. I never felt afraid, so maybe that is why I am not scared now. I actually like to be alone in the woods. I have not, however, overnighted alone and know that will be a challenge for me when I thru. I tend to be a bit skiddish in the dark.
My parents too are very concerned about my hiking, especially in light of the deaths in the last few years. I try to tell my Mom that as a single woman I face danger everyday. Coming home after work or school or going out and going from car to house in the dark is dangerous. Travelling to SORUCK alone could be dangerous for me alone. I try to tell her that someone up to no good isn't going to hike 10 miles into the woods when there are closer targets.
I can't hide in my house and never live because I'm single and no one wants to go hiking with me or no one I trust wants to thru with me. I have to take some chances and then use my head.
*Common sense is a good tool as well as knowing how to defend yourself.
*Don't let people you don't know walk behind you.
*Don't tell strangers your agenda.
*If alone and someone gets strange, mention that your group is ahead or behind and will be looking for you.
*If you are at a shelter and someone starts acting strange, hike on if there is no one else around.
*One I like....if someone gets strange....act a little crazy yourself :D
*Carry a whistle and a cell phone. You might not have a signal when you need it but, then again,you might.
*Always sign registers...can be vague about where you are stopping for the night but at least if you are missing the authorities know where you have been. And if you fear someone is following you, you can write down details that might bring help.
I understand personal safety fears. But I think that we are at greater risk in our everyday lives than we are on the trail. For the record....if I die on the trail, know that I died happy.
Everyone was on such a high horse (or whatever the saying is) that no one responded to a new wb members question:
I'm planning on thru-hiking the year after I graduate but I don't have any friends/family who are willing to go with me. I'll be eighteen. Would it be foolish to go alone?
Your not foolish, you are smarter by going alone.... you will start your hike w/ several others who are alone too, you will find friends that you get along w/ and hike similar to you, allowing you to hike your own hike....
just remember to be smart, have the proper gear
i've seen many 'best' friends that start out together but hike completely differently so they end up in a riff...
i've expressed my thoughts on saftey a few times, but my concern is all this fear of saftey is going to lead to all of us being hermits, as fdr said 'the only thing to fear is fear itself' we need to be respectful and aware of our surrounds but if we live a life of fear then we will never put one foot in front of the other.
I grew up on a farm and wandered around in the woods alone or with other kids as I was growing up. I never felt afraid, so maybe that is why I am not scared now. I actually like to be alone in the woods. I have not, however, overnighted alone and know that will be a challenge for me when I thru. I tend to be a bit skiddish in the dark.
My parents too are very concerned about my hiking, especially in light of the deaths in the last few years. I try to tell my Mom that as a single woman I face danger everyday. Coming home after work or school or going out and going from car to house in the dark is dangerous. Travelling to SORUCK alone could be dangerous for me alone. I try to tell her that someone up to no good isn't going to hike 10 miles into the woods when there are closer targets.
I can't hide in my house and never live because I'm single and no one wants to go hiking with me or no one I trust wants to thru with me. I have to take some chances and then use my head.
*Common sense is a good tool as well as knowing how to defend yourself.
*Don't let people you don't know walk behind you.
*Don't tell strangers your agenda.
*If alone and someone gets strange, mention that your group is ahead or behind and will be looking for you.
*If you are at a shelter and someone starts acting strange, hike on if there is no one else around.
*One I like....if someone gets strange....act a little crazy yourself :D
*Carry a whistle and a cell phone. You might not have a signal when you need it but, then again,you might.
*Always sign registers...can be vague about where you are stopping for the night but at least if you are missing the authorities know where you have been. And if you fear someone is following you, you can write down details that might bring help.
I understand personal safety fears. But I think that we are at greater risk in our everyday lives than we are on the trail. For the record....if I die on the trail, know that I died happy.
this has always worked for me..
BumpJumper
01-15-2009, 14:04
*One I like....if someone gets strange....act a little crazy yourself :D
Now that is the best advise I have seen yet.
Everyone was on such a high horse (or whatever the saying is) that no one responded to a new wb members question:
true dat. i went alone when i was 20 and it was a great decision. you get used to the alone after the first couple of weeks. then again, i avoided shelters and generally kept to myself, so alot of that alone was by choice. after the first week or so, a few of us had a pack that met up at night but we all hiked alone during the day.
also, you really have to love somebody and be on the same wavelength to take off on a long distance hike with them and stay friendly. it takes alot out of you. (but it gives alot back).
go, go, go! and have a great time!