View Full Version : Water treatment/getting sick?
I just finished reading a 5 page thread regarding filtering water vs. not filtering water and Giardia. I was never aware of the Giardia myths and was fascinated to see that some folks have hiked thousands of miles and haven't filtered a drop.
During a backpacking trip in the Smokies about 2 years ago over Memorial Day weekend, a buddy had gotten about 32 oz of water from the nearby stream and set it down where we were cooking. Where he got it in the stream, there was no water movement, several objects floating, and some weird mold thing that "looked like a long worm clumped up in the form of a brain" (yeah, soudns weird but its a pretty accurate description) This was Sunday morning. And of course, I polished off the 32 oz of this water before I realized it was supposed to be cooking water.
Didn't really think that much of it, got back on the trail and got to our vehicle and drove back to Atlanta. Tuesday morning hits, and I remember not feeling all that great. Went out to lunch with some co-workers and started to feel weaker. 4:00pm came around, and despite it being another 90 degree HOTlanta day, I was shivering and had the runs. I felt extremely weak. I drove back to my apartment, and fell asleep on my bed around 5:00pm, and slept for the next 14-15 hours w/ several 15 minute runs to the bathroom/refridgerator. I woke up around 7:30am, felt well rested, and headed into the office to catch up on some work, but the weak/hot feeling came back, and I had an awful case of the runs just like the day before. I went to see a Dr. at lunch, and he gave me Levaquin... I rested that afternoon, and woke up the next morning. Rather than still feeling a little weak, I felt much much better, and didn't feel bad moving forward.
Anyways, that's my story... so my question is, could this sickness come from the water that I drank? And is 48 hours too long/short of an incubation period before whatever could have been in that water to rear its ugly head? I've never been sick like that or have felt that weak before... whatever it was, it totally knocked me on my ass, and the Levaquin really kicked whatever I had to the curb. But for the last few years, when I see a story about folks contracting Giardia, I always think to myself "yeah, I've had that, it really sucks", but now I am not so sure what it was. I know we all aren't doctors here, but any insight to help my curious mind would be greatly appreciated!
- Greg
Pokey2006
03-01-2009, 22:33
Can't say if it was giardia, but it sounds like something you picked up in the water. Many water sources in the Smokys are iffy (lots of horse activity nearby).
My opinion, the people who never treat or filter and who never get sick A) don't just drink water from any source -- they are pickier about where they scoop and drink from, and B) have built up some immunities from years of consuming untreated water. However, even those folks might have gotten sick from drinking water as nasty as what you described. If they had some immunity to whatever it was you got, maybe they wouldn't have gotten quite so sick, is my guess.
It didn't have to be giardia to have sucked a lot.
Christus Cowboy
03-01-2009, 22:41
It would sound to me that it probably came from the water..... I know there's people who do the untreated water deal... but there's something about that explosive diarreha thing that I just can't get past......
Thanks for the responses, all. In case y'all are curious, this was at "campsite 90" according to the Smokies Map, a campsite that is about 7 miles from Fontana Dam. I think there are a few horse barns within a 5 mile radius of that campsite.
Pokey2006
03-01-2009, 22:51
Looking at my map, it does look like that campsite is on a horse trail. Yep, that'll do it.
SGT Rock
03-01-2009, 22:56
90 - geez I won't stop there to eat let alone get my water there.
Pokey2006
03-01-2009, 23:01
So I guess he's lucky he got out alive? And here he is, complaining about a little stomach bug...:)
The Weasel
03-01-2009, 23:05
In '00, I saw at least two major water sources fouled with horse manure literally in the water source as well as around it in GSMNP. On one other occasion, I watched two horses in part of a horse train that were urinating in a water source. I have also seen dogs defecate by water sources as well as urinate there, and I have no doubt that wild animals do so as well. And not just in the Smokies.
TW
Pokey2006
03-01-2009, 23:12
Sad to say, humans do, too. In 06 I saw bits of, um, dirty toilet paper just a few feet, and uphill, from the spring at Carter Gap Shelter in NC.
Smokys seemed to me to be hairy with the horse poop than other places. Also places where poor planning has privies uphill from water sources. If you don't treat your water anywhere else on the trial, at least treat it in the Smokys! And use this as a lesson to be more watchful of what is around the water source and how it may effect its potability.
i thought giardia had a 10 day incubation period? whatever you had, i feel for you. GI stuff is the worst!
SGT Rock
03-08-2009, 11:57
Most likely it was actually a stomach virus.
I've heard biologists sat "The solution to polution is dilution."
There are micro-organisms everywhere. Many consider our bodies to be natural habitats for at least part of their lifecycle. They don't consider themselves foriegn. Most problems come when people and livestock are in larger numbers. Wild animals tend to be disperse, though deer populations can sometimes get rather high also. Stagnant waters are a problem too of course. This is all common sense. I am not afraid of a moose pissing or ****ting upstream in its a decent fast flowing stream. I am sure it happens. So what?
If in doubt treat the water, but don't be afraid of 1 ppm of moose piss.
datachomper
03-08-2009, 13:00
Most likely not Giardia.
That medicine, Levaquin, is an anti-bacterial agent. If you really do think that it was the medicine that knocked out your infection and it didn't just naturally run it's course. Then it was a bacterial infection caused by something like E. Coli or the like. Giardia is a protozoa which is fundamentally different, in structure, than bacteria. To treat Giardia (or Cryptosporidia which is actually more common) I'm guessing you would have been prescribed an anti-infection agent like Flagyl.
I'm neither doctor nor a pharmacologist.
fiddlehead
03-08-2009, 13:39
The Giardia that i picked up in Nepal in '89 sounded a lot worse than what the OP described.
Farts and even burps smell like sulfur. Going to the toilet at least 5 times a day.
It was about 10 days after it started that i finally got back to Kathmandu and see a doctor. He told me to take a drug there called "Tiniba" and get 10 pills. said i had 2 choices: take 2 a day for 5 days, take 5 a day for 2 days. I did the latter. It did the job.
I heard later it is a bad drug but not as bad as Flagyl (I believe this is what American doctors prescribe) It is a bad drug also.
anyway, been back to Nepal 7 times since. Never got giardia again. I live in Asia now and often drink the water both here and in the Himalayas. No problems since. (including a few thru-hikes) (had my best tasting water in Thailand the other day right out of a pond up on a nearby mountain)
So, i believe you do become immune to much of the bacteria out there no matter what the scientists will attempt to prove differently.
SGT Rock
03-08-2009, 13:42
Another point - the OP's symptoms went away too fast.
It may not have been the water from the Smokies. As I recall, those bacteria bugs usually get you within 24 hours. Maybe something from a restaurant on the way home. I got something like that on my hike last year - I suspected some rank coffee from a truck stop.
Another point - the OP's symptoms went away too fast.
Agreed... if it had stuck around, more likely to be something from the water. A quick thing like that though is much more likely to have come from food.
Blue Jay
03-08-2009, 16:33
I know this is going to be hard to believe but disease in humans is caused by HUMANS. Horse diseases effects horses, moose disease effects moose. When a disease crosses species it's a very big deal. Ebola and SARs are examples. Eating and drinking another animals waste is done all the time. You do it every single day. The food industry is almost completely unregulated. Fast food companies are virtually the only ones who inspect raw material vendors.
Blue Jay
03-08-2009, 16:36
So, i believe you do become immune to much of the bacteria out there no matter what the scientists will attempt to prove differently.
Actually science has proven that exactly. All of this is basic grade school science.
Blue Jay
03-08-2009, 16:40
Oh before someone brings up dead animals in the water, yes that can make you sick. I like filters.:welcome
fiddlehead
03-08-2009, 20:05
I guess lots of things CAN make you sick.
Reminds me of a time we were hiking in western AZ and found a moving stream (not so common in AZ) and were pretty excited, we proceeded to chug a few quarts.
About 200 meters further up the trail, we found a dead coyote in the water. None of us got sick though.
A lot probably depends on your immune system also. Mine has always been pretty strong i guess.
datachomper
03-08-2009, 20:44
I know this is going to be hard to believe but disease in humans is caused by HUMANS. Horse diseases effects horses, moose disease effects moose. When a disease crosses species it's a very big deal. Ebola and SARs are examples. Eating and drinking another animals waste is done all the time. You do it every single day.
Wait, what? All of the stuff we would catch out on the trail is zoonotic.
Pokey2006
03-08-2009, 21:26
I know this is going to be hard to believe but disease in humans is caused by HUMANS. Horse diseases effects horses, moose disease effects moose. When a disease crosses species it's a very big deal. Ebola and SARs are examples. Eating and drinking another animals waste is done all the time. You do it every single day. The food industry is almost completely unregulated. Fast food companies are virtually the only ones who inspect raw material vendors.
You must not have been paying attention in your grade school science class.
E. coli, as one example, can be spread through the waste products of all kinds of different mammals. A cow can poop it out, it contaminates food eaten by a human, the human gets sick from it. To say that only cows would get sick from the E. coli in the cow's poop is ludicrous.
I still think the water was the most likely culprit of whatever bug this guy caught, in this particular situation. Though contaminated food can get you just as sick. The one time I got sick in Nepal was, I suspected, from something in the dinner I ate right before getting sick, not from the really gross, dirty (yet filtered and treated) water I had been drinking for six weeks.
McKeever
03-08-2009, 22:32
I know this is going to be hard to believe but disease in humans is caused by HUMANS. Horse diseases effects horses, moose disease effects moose. When a disease crosses species it's a very big deal. Ebola and SARs are examples. Eating and drinking another animals waste is done all the time. You do it every single day. The food industry is almost completely unregulated. Fast food companies are virtually the only ones who inspect raw material vendors.
I work with my horses on a daily basis and am a hiker too so let me try to clear up a few misconceptions. Let me say that we all know that when a horse wants to go, it's going to go, and so is any other animal or spring break touring on the AT. Now, with that acknowledged the vast majority of horse handlers will not allow their horses to rest, tie, or hobble around any water so horses are no more of a nuisance and threat to water than the uneducated touring that heads to the AT for spring break and breaks ever common sense rule there is like today when I hiked up Angels Rest. For the second part, there are many diseases in common with horses and humans that are believed transmittable.
The most common in the US are West Niles. Every year here in VA we loose horses to West Niles. They are greatly more effected then most humans and an infection is a death sentence to a horse. It is possible from what I understand for West Niles to be transmitted. There is an equine vaccination for West Niles and my horses receive it every year.
Equines flu is out there too. My horses also received vaccinations. Some horse handles have flu symptoms after handling some horses.
All horses have parasites (worms) and are treated regularly just as your dog should be and we all know that worms can be transmitted between humans and animals, horses too. De worming greatly lowers the chance and also helps keep the steams safer. Horses are expensive so the ones you see on the trail have been dewormed and vaccinated. It is not legal to transport a house without a current coggins test.
Horses are also vaccinated for rabies which is communicable between humans, as with other domestic animals.
In reality, since horses are not permitted on the AT and are share only a few intersections, it's unlikely that a horse would cause any stream contamination.
This time of year during the thaw, deer urine over a wide spread area can work into shallow water tables and cause problems. I would say that their is abundant risk from deer, and low risk from horses.
Get your water from the source, not the stream. I have never gotten sick from water, have only treated half the time, but am seriously careful. I am at the point to where all I am going to carry is iodine preps in my first aid kit and throw one in a quart of water as needed.