View Full Version : water moccasins
The Phoenix
03-31-2009, 18:05
I love snakes... they've been my all time favorite animal (now 3rd to panthers and wolves) and I have had some wild run-ins with snakes. I like em all big small venom non-venom... there is just simply one snake I don't like to mess with... the Water Mocc!!! They scared the ***** out of me and I don't like em unless its at a mighty far distance. I can be around 25 rattlers or copperheads... but if I see a big fat old cottonmouth... I do NOT enjoy it. I have not really heard one thing about them on the trail... will anyone just confirm that for me. I don't anticipate they live any further north than perhaps South Carolina... any info on these big mean mothers... lemme know please...
God Bless
leeki pole
03-31-2009, 18:11
Don't think you'll see a cottonmouth anywhere on the AT....but if you really want a close and personal encounter, come to Mississippi during crappie fishing season where they drop out of the brush. Now that's fun.
Water moccasins also known as cottonmouths are not found on the A.T. This question is addressed every season, most recently in the thread entitled Copperhead (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=38249) which is currently viewing.
beakerman
03-31-2009, 18:34
I've heard of folks saying they have seen them as far north as MD. I grew up in western MD not far from the AT and I personally can not confirm their presence there. There are a lot of "run of the mill" water snakes that get mistaken for cotton mouths by the uneducated.
However they are definitely no fun. Unlike most snakes which strike simply out of fear when they feel they can't get away those SOB's will actively chase you to get a chunk of you. I have witnessed that down here in TX and in Louisiana too when I lived there a few years ago.
leeki pole
03-31-2009, 18:41
Yep, they're very aggressive in the springtime, when the dogwoods and azaleas bloom, the crappie spawn and the snakes are mean. I rarely see them after about May 1. But I've had them get in my boat (now that's interesting) and while fishing strike me although I had chest waders on. That will get your heart rate up.
Desert Reprobate
03-31-2009, 18:44
I'm sure I remember running into one while swimming in north western PA when I was a kid. I don't think you can forget the sight of one of these swimming at you in the ole swimming hole with his mouth wide open. Teaches you to walk on water.
leeki pole
03-31-2009, 18:49
On the other hand, we rarely see copperheads here except near the first frost of autumn. They look for a warm place to winter, I guess, and one decided that my hot water heater closet was the perfect place. My wife moved OUT of the house until I was able to convince Mr. Serpent that he was not welcome. I love living in the country. :D
saimyoji
03-31-2009, 19:03
The lack of cottonmouths on the A.T. has been discussed here at least once every season, most recently in the thread entitled Copperhead (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=38249) which is currently viewing. Post a range map or evidence to the contrary and be done with it already!
you're becoming more an more crotchety. something bringin ya down, hoss? :confused:
I've heard of folks saying they have seen them as far north as MD. I grew up in western MD not far from the AT and I personally can not confirm their presence there. There are a lot of "run of the mill" water snakes that get mistaken for cotton mouths by the uneducated.
However they are definitely no fun. Unlike most snakes which strike simply out of fear when they feel they can't get away those SOB's will actively chase you to get a chunk of you. I have witnessed that down here in TX and in Louisiana too when I lived there a few years ago.
When I hiked out of Harpers Ferry north along the old canal I thought how "snakey" it looked. Five will get you fifty there's cottonmouths in that slough, because wherever you find logger head snapping turtles, you also find cottonmouths. And I saw several very large logger heads. I would be very carful in there at night.
beakerman
03-31-2009, 20:35
When I hiked out of Harpers Ferry north along the old canal I thought how "snakey" it looked. Five will get you fifty there's cottonmouths in that slough, because wherever you find logger head snapping turtles, you also find cottonmouths. And I saw several very large logger heads. I would be very carful in there at night.
yep that's the C&O canal you hiked along. I grew up biking the towpath, fishing the canal and river along side it and hiking the trails that are associated with it. Like I said I personally never saw a cotton mouth in the wild until I moved to Louisiana. I'd heard many folks say they saw one here or there but all I ever saw were nonvenomous water snakes that were dark like a cotton mouth but clearly not heavy enough in the body and they had the classic round pupil rather than the slit pupil of every poisonous snake in North America except the coral snake.
that has been my experience thus far I lived and played there for 20+ years YMMV...
SGT Rock
03-31-2009, 20:37
I've seen a few swiming snakes in the Cherokee Forrest and one at the Falls of Dismal. I've been in the water with them every time. I've not be hurt yet.
vamelungeon
03-31-2009, 20:59
There are lots of water snakes here in southwest Virginia, and people call them water moccasins, but they are mistaken. There are a lot of snakes that resemble moccasins, but until someone proves otherwise, I'll contend there aren't any on the AT. I lived in Montgomery Al for a while, and my mother is originally from Mississippi and I've seen REAL moccasins in both places but none here in the mountains.
Not every big water snake is a moccasin.
SGT Rock
03-31-2009, 21:01
Exactly.
BTW, are you a Melungeon?
There are lots of water snakes here in southwest Virginia, and people call them water moccasins, but they are mistaken. There are a lot of snakes that resemble moccasins, but until someone proves otherwise, I'll contend there aren't any on the AT. I lived in Montgomery Al for a while, and my mother is originally from Mississippi and I've seen REAL moccasins in both places but none here in the mountains.
Not every big water snake is a moccasin.
I almost jumped on one sunning on a rock in the middle of a stream ( I didn't see it until I was in mid air on my way down and it jumped about 4 feet into the air as I barely missed) while hiking in Mt. Rogers last summer. I have no idea what kind it was, they are all the same to me!:eek:
I saw a snake in Tenn. that I was sure was a cottonmouth. After thinking about it for a while (months) I don't think it was. Either way, it was a mean ass looking snake that I wouldn't mess with
take-a-knee
03-31-2009, 23:15
A lot of these guys get shot as "cottonmouths", they can have that same dusky appearance.
take-a-knee
03-31-2009, 23:16
Forgive my ineptness, here is the link:
http://www.uga.edu/srelherp/snakes/nertax.htm
Water snakes are all mean looking thick bodied things. Here we get the scream of mocs and copperheads in rivers and they are banded water snakes. Which are not venomous but thick bodied and have an nasty attitude and bite. I don't think you should worry about mocs on the trail. From all the summer pics, you will see more timbers. Just follow the rule...don't mess with it and it will not mess with you. Use a headlamp at night so you don't step on something. In daytime, given the chance, the snake will try to escape. Just let it. It you get on it and it assumes a posture, it is defensive, just back off and leave it alone. Given an escape route, the snake will take it.
http://www.uga.edu/srelherp/snakes/agkpis.htm (http://www.uga.edu/srelherp/snakes/agkpis.htm)
http://www.uga.edu/srelherp/snakes/nersip.htm (http://www.uga.edu/srelherp/snakes/nersip.htm)
They will ONLY make you sick for a few days...thats all....had it happen.No big deal.:)
I've heard of folks saying they have seen them as far north as MD. I grew up in western MD not far from the AT and I personally can not confirm their presence there. There are a lot of "run of the mill" water snakes that get mistaken for cotton mouths by the uneducated.
When I hiked out of Harpers Ferry north along the old canal I thought how "snakey" it looked. Five will get you fifty there's cottonmouths in that slough, because wherever you find logger head snapping turtles, you also find cottonmouths.
Maryland boasts 27 species and subspecies of snakes, only two of which are venomous. These are the timber rattlesnake and copperhead.
See All about snakes in Maryland (http://www.dnr.state.md.us/wildlife/snakeinfo.asp) from which the above quote was cut and pasted for a complete list of Maryland's native snakes and other pertinent information. Venomous snakes of Maryland (http://www.dnr.state.md.us/wildlife/vsnakes.asp) may also be of interest.
I'm sure I remember running into one while swimming in north western PA when I was a kid. I don't think you can forget the sight of one of these swimming at you in the ole swimming hole with his mouth wide open.
There are 18 nonvenomous and three venomous snake species in Pennsylvania. The three venomous species of snakes in Pennsylvania are the northern copperhead, eastern massasauga and timber rattlesnake.
See Snakes in Pennsylvania (http://www.fish.state.pa.us/factsnake.htm) for information provided by Pennsylvania Fish and Boat Commission. Timber rattlesnakes and copperheads are the only venomous snakes found on the A.T.
Click on cottonmouth (http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/wildlife/information/?s=030015) for information including county-level distribution information provided by Virginia Department of Game and Inland Fisheries.
Since some of the snakes native to Florida are not covered by Snakes of Georgia and South Carolina, those who hike there may wish to refer to Online Guide to the Snakes of Florida (http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/herpetology/FL-GUIDE/onlineguide.htm). Click on Eastern cottonmouth (http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/natsci/herpetology/fl-guide/Agkistrodonppiscivorus.htm) to go directly to that page.
They will ONLY make you sick for a few days...thats all....had it happen. No big deal.:)
The quote which follows was cut and pasted from my Eastern cottonmouth link in post #23.
Cottonmouth bites can be quite dangerous. The victim should seek immediate medical care from a physician or hospital experienced in treating snakebite.
Others who have more time to devote to it than I do might locate and link information provided by medical professionals regarding cottonmouth bites.
vamelungeon
04-01-2009, 12:16
Exactly.
BTW, are you a Melungeon?
Yes, my user name is a combo of VA and melungeon. Most people wouldn't have noticed.
Yes, my user name is a combo of VA and melungeon. Most people wouldn't have noticed.
hahaha... i did, but didn't say anything... but then, i'm not most people.
room for a whole 'nother appalachian thread here...
SGT Rock
04-01-2009, 22:34
Yes, my user name is a combo of VA and melungeon. Most people wouldn't have noticed.
Very cool. My guess is most folks on WhiteBlaze have never even heard of the Melungeons.
beakerman
04-02-2009, 02:06
emerald...like I said I lived, loved, played, worked etc...all around MD where the AT comes through for some 20 years. I'm am adept at identifying snakes and in that 20 odd years I never once saw a cotton mouth--yep that's exactly what I said never once... So why do you have to throw me in there with folks that think they have? Especially when I clearly say: "There are a lot of "run of the mill" water snakes that get mistaken for cotton mouths by the uneducated"...you make it sound like I don't know what the heck I'm talking about.
If that was not your intent then fine just be a tad more careful when quoting things that's all...if that was your intent well I'll keep that in mind...
MoBill122
04-02-2009, 11:20
Personally, I can't wait to see the pictures of the first 30ft boa constrictor someone spots on the Florida Trail. Seems they have really taken a liking to south Florida. There was a news article about that last week somewhere.
We have a 3-4ft rat snake that lives somewhere in the basement. My wife goes downstairs every morning to walk her treadmill.... I keep waiting to hear her SCREAMING one morning.
Will probably happen when I'm backpacking off in the woods. I'll get a 911 call.... GET YOUR A$$ HOME AND GET THAT SNAKE ! ! NOW !^%$&!%!!!!
Got to have some excitement in life...ya know...
The quote which follows was cut and pasted from my Eastern cottonmouth link in post #23.
Others who have more time to devote to it than I do might locate and link information provided by medical professionals regarding cottonmouth bites.
I thought he was referring to the Water Snake variety of bite (that the OP might possibly run into( as opposed to the Mocc (which the OP will probably NOT run into).
Cottonmouths never have bothered me much, not the "Common Water Snake" that has also been fairly common in the AR and LA locations I've lived. Copperheads have let me get the closest without giving themselves away than most any other snake I've handled. My most startling though was the 15' snake I ran across in a New Orleans West Bank neighborhood canal. Looked alot like HUGE cottonmouth, but I figure it had to actually be some relative of an Anaconda. Now THAT mad for an interesting day for a 12 year old.
I thought he was referring to the Water Snake variety of bite (that the OP might possibly run into( as opposed to the Mocc (which the OP will probably NOT run into).
Cottonmouths never have bothered me much, not the "Common Water Snake" that has also been fairly common in the AR and LA locations I've lived. Copperheads have let me get the closest without giving themselves away than most any other snake I've handled. My most startling though was the 15' snake I ran across in a New Orleans West Bank neighborhood canal. Looked alot like HUGE cottonmouth, but I figure it had to actually be some relative of an Anaconda. Now THAT mad for an interesting day for a 12 year old.
They were both cottons i was hit by.If you are a child,then YES go to the doctor.After 35 yrs in fl...never heard of but one death and that was due to water sking and landed in a nest,And my buddy was his friend and said ...he was hit 19 times and still lasted 2 days?
emerald...
I believe it best to rely upon the State of Maryland for authoritative information about native snakes within its boarders.
Copperheads have let me get the closest without giving themselves away than most any other snake I've handled. My most startling though was the 15' snake I ran across in a New Orleans West Bank neighborhood canal. Looked alot like HUGE cottonmouth, but I figure it had to actually be some relative of an Anaconda. Now THAT mad for an interesting day for a 12 year old.
Saw my first copperhead of the season today hiking in Carolina Beach State park in Carolina Beach, NC. Stretched out on a patch of sand lying in the direct sunlight and didn't bother to stir when I walked by 2' away.
The closest I've ever come to a snake incident was just north of Pearisberg last September. I planted my boot down and missed stepping on a copperhead by less than 2 inches. It coiled right up and did the "mouth wide open" thing right next to my bare calf. I gingerly stepped to the side and kept walking.
When I started hiking I was pretty afraid of snakes. I've seen so many now that, while I still respect them, I've lost my fear of them and just give them their space when I come across them. Hopefully, I'll never step right on one and get bitten.
beakerman
04-06-2009, 00:58
I believe it best to rely upon the State of Maryland for authoritative information about native snakes within its boarders.
Hence my point. I NEVER said there were water moccasins in MD. In fact I, having lived there, said I doubted there were any despite the fact I know people that CLAIM to have seen them. I am 100% certain they were mistaken and even said so.
I'm not disagreeing with what the MD-DNR says in this case. If the snake in question were present with as much time as I have spent in the area I know I would have seen one--especially given their behavior which I have seen first hand where I live now. These bugger don't just back down and slide away--even when they have all the space in the world they are very aggressive.
Jack Tarlin
04-06-2009, 10:12
There are two venomous snakes found on the Appalachian Trail, the copperhead and the timber rattlesnake.
There are no water moccasins in Maryland or anywhere else on the Trail.