Euro Ultralight walker, reflective sleeping bag

[scrivner]

This is kind of an expansion and new direction of a thread on reflective blankets and bags.

A few years ago I fell into a conversation with a young fellow at the Czech border. He was traveling with an Army, don’t know which Army, surplus rucksack no larger than a daypack, at the most, maybe 1700ci. The rucksack was made of very lightweight fabric that looked like linen or flax.

Under the top flap was a surplus poncho and underneath the pack he had strapped on a sleeping bag with a reflective surface that looked similar to the AM bivy, but wasn’t that. The surface was much more slick and it felt like it had some kind of thin fibers sandwiched inside the outer layers. It was about half again the size of the AM bag. He said it weighed less than a half-kilo, which would be about one pound. He didn’t have a sleeping pad, and said he didn’t need one with this bag because it insulated him from the ground. He also said he wanted to travel light and “free like a bird.”

We didn't share a common language, but stumbled along in, sort of, German, my three words of Czech and his fifty words of English. I got that he had been traveling for about two months, sleeping in the forest, or in groves of trees along side roads. He was walking across Europe.

He said that his poncho was his tarp/rainwear and the bag was the only shelter he had, and that he was not cold at night - best I could understand. He was going to show me the sleeping bag, but then his friend arrived, he got a ride, and we never finished our conversation.

I was very impressed by his relaxed approach. I hefted his bag, couldn’t have weighed more than 8 to 10 pounds total, including a bottle of not too bad brandy, which he generously shared. The only hi-tech item he had was the sleeping bag. He said his rucksack cost about 5 US and the poncho was about the same, both from a "military store." The sleeping bag cost about 20. From the looks of it all, and what I think he said, I would guess that his whole outfit couldn’t have cost more than 60 70 bucks US. He wasn’t the least concerned about gear, the weather (it was chilly and starting to rain) or where he was going to be the following week.

I was carrying a Salomon Raid 30, which cost more than his whole outfit (100 bucks in Paris) and it was stuffed with a down bag and other pricy items. To tell the truth I felt a little embarrassed, like a bloated fat cat, by my outfit compared to his, and by his easy-going approach.

I wonder if we could all benefit from such a low key, inexpensive approach. And, I sure would like to know what bag he was using.

Would like to hear from anyone who has any ideas about this.

Cheers,

Scrivner

[Valentine]

Yes of course most of us could benefit from a low key inexpensive low impact non consumerism approach. However I like a sleeping bag that doesn't make me sweat. And a stove that doesn't tip over or is hard to light in sub freezing temps.
In my youth when I had less money I always did with less but envied nicer equipment and such. Now that I have less time and more money I spoil myself with better gear.

It is an interesting post. Go simple. And sometimes I hike a backcountry overnight trail with very little such as your fellow hiker. Try the E-bivy, 7-8oz and has a foot box vent.

[Kerosene]

He was also a 'young fellow' who didn't need a sleeping pad and had inured himself to other minor discomforts. You can certainly survive with less gear than we tend to carry, and he may not have needed much food if he could easily re-supply as he walked across Europe. An 8-10 pound base weight is certainly doable, but personally I'd probably end up a bit higher.

[scrivner]

Maybe I should reword my post to say something like, "Makes ME wonder if I should rethink my approach.

I did not mean to suggest that anyone else should change their ways of doing things. I just wondered if anyone else shared any of my thoughts on this topic. And, if so, would care to share their experiences.

I've been hanging out here and trying to figure out the best equipment choices that would allow me to undertake a 1,000 mile walk lightly loaded and be able to sleep in reasonable comfort. I'm 65, coming up on a birthday, and long ago I spent a good deal of time in wild, and semi-wild country and sleeping out with minimum gear. And, I remember being uncomfortable many times. Now, coming to back to long distance walking and the outdoors after many years away, I thought my old bones needed a thick pad, a comfy sleeping bag, a ultralight tent to keep bugs off, etc. But maybe not.

I guess what I was trying to say was this: maybe i can get by with less, and maybe I SHOULD do so. A little discomfort won't kill me and might be a good thing. Maybe I need to let go of my notion of needing comfort, which is really a kind of insecurity.

Many years ago I attended military survival schools, and later civilian survival schools, and have taught survival skills off and on for decades. So, i do know the difference between survival needs and wants. I know there's no danger in being a little cold or uncomfortable.

It's just that it's been many years since i was involved in all that, and in the interval, like many of us, have had major injuries and illnesses that have left me far, far away from my former peak of health and fitness. Among other hinderances, spinal injuries simply won't allow me to carry more than very light weight. All of which, I think, have led me to my current search for comfort at very low weight.

Remembering that fellow at the border made me wonder if there were any here who traveled as he did, and if they had anything to say on the topic, or offer any practical advice. Also I wanted to find out what bag superman bought in Sweden, thinking that it might have been similar to the one my friend of the road had.

Valentine, do you mean the Adventure Medical bag?

In any event, thanks for all comments.

Scrivner

[Kerosene]

You have spinal injuries and your joints are getting creaky. Plus, you've got 30+ years under your belt (maybe over your belt?) since you slept on a hard surface for an entire night. I dare say that you will go beyond mildly uncomfortable. Rather than go without a pad, or with an 8 oz. 1/4" closed cell pad, I'd buy a Thermarest NeoAir short (9 oz, $$$, 2.5" thick). May not be cheap, but it is light and compact.

Once you're outdoors for a few days/weeks, your internal thermostat will adjust to cooler temperatures. I find that I can easily wear shorts and T-shirt while hiking down to 45F if it isn't overly windy. There are several 16-24 ounce high-loft down mummies that can keep you warm into the 30's, plus you can add a few layers to from your camp clothing if it gets a lot colder.

The challenge for ULers is to take just enough gear to be reasonably comfortable most of the time, with enough knowledge and skill to avoid/handle life-threatening situations, at the risk of some limited discomfort if you're unlucky enough to catch extreme weather.

I've certainly been uncomfortable at times, but never for more than a day or two, and I feel I can handle most situations, or have the intelligence to avoid them if not.

I pack light even when traveling on business, although I could go lighter, but at some point saving another pound really doesn't make a difference in how you feel at the end of a long day.

[scrivner]

Kerosene,

Thanks for your comments. I've got a little more than years hanging over my belt these days, although that portable food storage unit is shrinking as I progress in my conditioning. And yeah, I've had more hard words than hard beds in the past, oh...20 years. I guess I'll see how that goes this weekend. We're going to the mountains and although we're camping next to the car I'm going to take an assorment of gear as see how it goes. I have a couple of Thermarests, didn't know about the Neo; I'll check it out.

Do you know of a 16oz bag, not a mummy, that's a good one? I know mummies are warmer, but I prefer to wear a wool hat and just use my bag like a blanket unless it's really cold.

I too travel light when on biz, it's that or a roller bag which I detest.

Cheers,

Scrivner

[hammock engineer]

This is kind of an expansion and new direction of a thread on reflective blankets and bags.

A few years ago I fell into a conversation with a young fellow at the Czech border. He was traveling with an Army, don’t know which Army, surplus rucksack no larger than a daypack, at the most, maybe 1700ci. The rucksack was made of very lightweight fabric that looked like linen or flax.

Under the top flap was a surplus poncho and underneath the pack he had strapped on a sleeping bag with a reflective surface that looked similar to the AM bivy, but wasn’t that. The surface was much more slick and it felt like it had some kind of thin fibers sandwiched inside the outer layers. It was about half again the size of the AM bag. He said it weighed less than a half-kilo, which would be about one pound. He didn’t have a sleeping pad, and said he didn’t need one with this bag because it insulated him from the ground. He also said he wanted to travel light and “free like a bird.”

We didn't share a common language, but stumbled along in, sort of, German, my three words of Czech and his fifty words of English. I got that he had been traveling for about two months, sleeping in the forest, or in groves of trees along side roads. He was walking across Europe.

He said that his poncho was his tarp/rainwear and the bag was the only shelter he had, and that he was not cold at night - best I could understand. He was going to show me the sleeping bag, but then his friend arrived, he got a ride, and we never finished our conversation.

I was very impressed by his relaxed approach. I hefted his bag, couldn’t have weighed more than 8 to 10 pounds total, including a bottle of not too bad brandy, which he generously shared. The only hi-tech item he had was the sleeping bag. He said his rucksack cost about 5 US and the poncho was about the same, both from a "military store." The sleeping bag cost about 20. From the looks of it all, and what I think he said, I would guess that his whole outfit couldn’t have cost more than 60 70 bucks US. He wasn’t the least concerned about gear, the weather (it was chilly and starting to rain) or where he was going to be the following week.

I was carrying a Salomon Raid 30, which cost more than his whole outfit (100 bucks in Paris) and it was stuffed with a down bag and other pricy items. To tell the truth I felt a little embarrassed, like a bloated fat cat, by my outfit compared to his, and by his easy-going approach.

I wonder if we could all benefit from such a low key, inexpensive approach. And, I sure would like to know what bag he was using.

Would like to hear from anyone who has any ideas about this.

Cheers,

Scrivner

I'm spending a month or so in Europe for work. I work with people from Norway a lot in the US. I am always surprised by their laid back nature. No matter how much I have to do in the office if I start to get stressed out a little, I get come on let's go to lunch. An hour or so (usually so) later we come back and everything gets done.

I think people can learn a lot from this. Relax, work smart, enjoy yourself, and it will all work out in the end.

As for traveling around. For me warm, dry, and well feed are the 3 main things, everything else is frosting on the cake.

[Valentine]

This one; http://www.rei.com/product/750938
I find it a compromise between a space blanket and a bivy. I use it for long day hikes.
I appreciate your desire to do with less. Try an inexpensive hammock (15-20oz). Really comfortable and simpler than a tent. Let me know what you are thinking about purchasing.

[scrivner]

Hammock Engineer,

Your comments are spot on about Europeans in general. Over the years I've lived in various European countries for extended periods (Germany, France, Spain Italy) and have worked in almost all of Europe, including Eastern Europe. Even the Germans are more relaxed and laid back than we are. And yes, everything still gets done.

My European friends are all amazed that we, Americans, work so many hours and get so little vacation time. From Denmark to Italy they say, "Americans live to work, we work to live."

Cheers,

Scrivner

[scrivner]

Valentine,

I have one of the AM bivys. I'm going to try it this weekend.

As to bags, I'm at the scanning at looking at everything stage. I'm considering everything from the LaFuma Extreme Light to a WM, or jacks or better product. I'm kind of lost in the forest of bags, so to speak, at the moment.

Cheers,

Scrivner

[bigcranky]

Scrivner,

Any bag with a full zipper can be opened up and used as a quilt. I do this all the time. For non-mummy bags of high quality, check these:

http://tinyurl.com/65ve8l

http://tinyurl.com/6jau2d