View Full Version : Hammocking
Graywolf
10-01-2009, 00:38
As some of you are aware, I have posted numerous questions on hammocks and my curiosity has really perked. REI has the HH Expediton on sale now for $139, just the basic setup, which might be fine with me as I still don't know about taking it on a long hike. But I was reading some of the threads on how uncomfortable the ground can be and it go me to thinking ho HOT the ground gets here in Texas and that the HH can get me off the ground and with the air circulating around me, may be somewhat cooler too.
But IF I was to use it for the winter, besides the quilt, what other equipment would I need to purchase for the HH. If the total bill is over 230, I am sticking to the tarp/tent.?
You can get away with using a pad down to any where from 50 to about freezing, depending on personal comfort. It'll cost you a few bucks.
My advice is shop around. But if you want the basic HH model, I have a used one I would sell to you for $50, shipping included. This also includes snakeskins which make pack up quick and very easy. With this kind of start, you can drop $100 dollars on a bigger, much more livable tarp and still have $80 to invest on underinsulation.
Or stick with the stock tarp and invest in an underquilt if you like.
freefall
10-01-2009, 03:41
I have the Expedition A-sym and have used it down to 15* with a Thermarest Pro-lite 3 pad and a 20* bag. I set it up in a shelter in the Smokies and it was good down to 8*.
But I sleep warm.
Your goal is to keep the transfer of heat out of the bottom mostly as long as it isn't real windy.
The best thing would be an under-quilt that gives you an extra 5-10* or so.
I personally would use one that could be stuffed with leaves and duff from the surrounding area to provide even more insulation if needed.
It also depends on where and when you are hiking. If it's the AT and you are hiking in March, you will have sub-freezing weather at some point. I never set my hammock on the ground but I did dress in EVERYTHING I had in my 20* bag a couple of times.
The biggest thing is if it is windy. That will lower the temperature that you feel.
For me, If I do the AT again with a hammock starting in March,I would carry a home-made sil-nylon under tarp. That way I can stuff it with leaves and duff to fit the night. And at 6/7 ounces, the under tarp is light enough you can carry it all the way.
Fiddleback
10-01-2009, 12:12
It's a difficult question because there are so many variables...first and foremost, what's the rest of your sleep system. The total sleep system is very much an individual thing which, in turn, is shaped by the climate and weather it is to be used in.
In my own experience, a ¼" pad has kept the cold away in the mid- to low-20's. Oware now sells a similar, 3/16" pad (6oz) for $28. Many here don't care for pads but there are others that don't use anything else for underinsulation. I'm in the latter group. Importantly, a pad allows you to start hammock hanging with a small additional cost (dollars and pack weight) and allows you to 'start simple' to find out what works and what is needed given your camping area, your sleep system, and you. I'm a strong advocate of backyard experiments with the hammock and sleep system before hitting the trail.
I'm familiar with Texas. I've always considered most of the state to be a harsh camping environment with extra helpings of heat, hard ground and bugs (and other creepy crawlies). I never hammocked there but it was home for a long time and I think a hammock would be a great way to camp in my former home state. A pad such as above should be all you need to keep warm except in the most extreme of Texas areas and weather. Keeping cool is another matter...:D
FB
As a fellow Texan, I can tell you that you'll be fine with just a pad. I used one down in the 20s in VA this spring, and it doesn't get much colder than that here. I did eventually invest in a Yeti underquilt, but haven't tried it yet, as it is still too warm here. There is a Texas Hang off I45 near Conroe at Stubblefield Park in Nov. Check out this thread for details http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9625&highlight=Texas+Hang You'll be able to see lots of different hammocks and setups there if you can make it.
i sleep on the ground in the winter ussually just using my tarp that i use with my hammock. i keep the hammock with me though and take afternoon naps in it when its considerably warmer to counteract having to sleep on the ground at night. dont trust the tarp that comes with the hh it is basically useless in heavy rain/wind.
peter_pan
10-01-2009, 17:22
i sleep on the ground in the winter ussually just using my tarp that i use with my hammock. i keep the hammock with me though and take afternoon naps in it when its considerably warmer to counteract having to sleep on the ground at night. dont trust the tarp that comes with the hh it is basically useless in heavy rain/wind.
Lunchbox, et al,
There is really no reason not to use your hammock year round.... Many do.... Many options to staying warm.
Pan
Graywolf
10-01-2009, 18:20
Thanks everyone. Lots of good advice. I sleep with a pad right now, I find those thermarests too bulky and heavy for me, plus I had one pop on me once. First and only one I had.:D. Looks like it may be in order to break down and just do it. Even if it is for only warmer weather.
I did give in and signed on the the other site, HammockForums. So I may get more good info there. Looks like I may raise camping experience a little..(no puns intended).
Graywolf
I'm going to give you some hammocking heretical advice. I have been hammocking for the past 3 years including the winter seasons. Around here, where I like to go, it commonly gets below 20 degrees. I will not chance that kind of exposure in a hammock. I did once, with lots of nice quilts and nearly froze (it was 15 degrees with winds of 25-30mph constant).
Instead for the winter I have a Tarptent scarp 1 with a Big Agnes pad and a nice Feathered Friends down bag. Sorry, but the chances of high winds, condensation, and very cold temps make me go to ground in the serious winter months.
BTW, I just got back from 3 days in the Mt.Rogers/Grayson Highlands area and it was blowing hard, gray, foggy and overcast with temps in the 40's during the day and upper 30's at night. Stayed warm in a Warbonnet BB with JRB quilts.
Fiddleback
10-02-2009, 12:30
Staying warm in a hammock is just a different learning curve...perhaps a bit steeper, but just a learning curve.;) Over in the above mentioned Hammock forum you'll find lots of stories about sub-zero hammock hanging. I myself haven't dropped below 20° but then, I don't use a top cover or bag either.:eek:
If you can't stay warm in a hammock in Texas, y'all just haven't finished learning yet.:D
FB
unclemjm
10-02-2009, 12:39
As a fellow Texan, I can tell you that you'll be fine with just a pad.
There is a Texas Hang off I45 near Conroe at Stubblefield Park in Nov. Check out this thread for details http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9625&highlight=Texas+Hang You'll be able to see lots of different hammocks and setups there if you can make it.
Ditto what Red Hat said.
Ladytrekker
10-02-2009, 12:40
I went hiking with two people last weekend that both had just bought hammocks and were excited about trying them out. Monday they both took them back to the store and traded for tents. There reasoning was they both felt totally claustrophobic and could not move around and we spent the entire hike looking for trees that were the proper distance and location it was exhausting. I have no opinion I use a tent and am sticking with a tent.
I have more room in my Warbonnet Blackbird than I ever did in my Walrus Zoid one man, but not as much room as in my Tarptent Rainbow. That said, I am much dryer and much more comfortable in my hammock, than in either tent. Finding trees shouldn't be a problem, since straps are adjustable... duh
lazy river road
10-02-2009, 15:14
Graywolf have you checked out hammockforums.com they have been my guiding light in hanging...great site just as friendly as people here on WB...
Fiddleback
10-03-2009, 12:10
I went hiking with two people last weekend that both had just bought hammocks and were excited about trying them out. Monday they both took them back to the store and traded for tents. There reasoning was they both felt totally claustrophobic and could not move around and we spent the entire hike looking for trees that were the proper distance and location it was exhausting. I have no opinion I use a tent and am sticking with a tent.
One night? New, untried equipment? The aforementioned learning curve is a bit steeper and longer.:D
FB
If I were you, I'd take Bearpaw up on his offer, and get into it that way. The new thing in hammocks is the Warbonnet, which I may eventually get, but the HH is the only one with the bottom entry which I love. I bet you could post in the "want to buy" forum for a HH and you'd get several offers from new Warbonnet owners getting rid of their HH.
As far as walking around to find trees a certain length apart, that's mostly neophyte mentality trying to find the perfect spot, which IMO, is a holdover from tenting where you truly do need to find the perfect spot in order to lay flat on the ground with nothing protruding under you. Many different lengths of space between trees will work OK. If you're doing anything other than sleeping, or perhaps reading a book or listening to iPod, then yes, not any room to do much in a hammock. Again, I think that's a holdover from tenting mentality. Plenty of room outside the hammock, and isn't that the point - to be outside?
Kerosene
10-03-2009, 13:41
I've gotta tell you, I found that a standard backpacking pad (20" of width like a ProLite) just didn't cut it below 50F. While my underside would be warm, any part of my body that pressed against the uninsulated side of the hammock through my 20F down bag was almost immediately chilled. While I am a warm sleeper, I am also a light sleeper and a temperature variation like that would keep me awake or awaken me. If you're going to go with a pad, get something extra-wide that will almost wrap around look (look into a segmented pad extender), which should get you down to perhaps 40F.
JoeHiker
10-03-2009, 15:04
I agree on that. I found that NO pad was good enough under 50 and they were no fun in a hammock anyway. Once I finally managed to get a warm-enough underquilt and over quilt and didn't need my pad at all, I gladly got rid of it.
Using a basic hammock and a tight fitting bag you can have a hammock with insulation all around you and you won't have to carry the extra weight of bug netting when you don't need it. For buggy weather you can purchase an ENO bug net which slips over your hammock and bag. That's the way I go now. I've sold my HH and don't miss it one bit.
http://outdoors.webshots.com/album/237103382ByZIeG
Here's an example of my early experimentation. I got the idea from the Speer Hammock website - well worth a visit.
Graywolf
10-04-2009, 03:07
Graywolf have you checked out hammockforums.com they have been my guiding light in hanging...great site just as friendly as people here on WB...
Yeah, Already signed up. But I havnt posted yet. Just reading through the thread getting my fill,,(no puns intended)
Greywolf,
Sounds like your still on the fence.
You can buy an inexpensive hammock (I picked one up at Wallyworld for $10 and a blue foam pad just to try it out for under $20.
Tie a ridgeline made out of paracord and drape some Tulle (netting availible from the Walmart fabric counter for about $1 a yard used to make wedding veils) over the ridgeline for bugnetting if you need it (Tie a knot in the tulle with the ridgeline in the middle if you need to gather it at the ends.)
For a tarp you can pick up a 8 x 10 blue poly tarp also from walmart for under $10 and some mason line to tie it up and out with.
You've got a fully functioning test rig for under $40 .... and if nothing else, the hammock would be cool just for hot summer camp outs.
Wise Old Owl
10-04-2009, 12:11
I went hiking with two people last weekend that both had just bought hammocks and were excited about trying them out. Monday they both took them back to the store and traded for tents. There reasoning was they both felt totally claustrophobic and could not move around and we spent the entire hike looking for trees that were the proper distance and location it was exhausting. I have no opinion I use a tent and am sticking with a tent.
Wait-you cant pitch a hammock on the ground between two hiking sticks? Where were you hiking?
Fiddleback nailed this too, If you just buy a hammock out of the store and don't try some customization at home, (longer ropes, etc) and spend some time reading WB or Hammock Forums (See top Right) well shame on your freinds.
Its so easy a bear can do it!:D
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ESfodwZmuuI/SmnRBnoYquI/AAAAAAAAAZ8/dNfb_ZJxsw0/s400/YEJgzG9t7q51gi9cw7Y8N4ado1_400.jpg
Graywolf
10-04-2009, 23:43
Wait-you cant pitch a hammock on the ground between two hiking sticks? Where were you hiking?
Fiddleback nailed this too, If you just buy a hammock out of the store and don't try some customization at home, (longer ropes, etc) and spend some time reading WB or Hammock Forums (See top Right) well shame on your freinds.
Its so easy a bear can do it!:D
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ESfodwZmuuI/SmnRBnoYquI/AAAAAAAAAZ8/dNfb_ZJxsw0/s400/YEJgzG9t7q51gi9cw7Y8N4ado1_400.jpg
Wiseowl, That is just too good. I found another bigfoot vid with a hammock. I was going to post it but this bear is too good.
And yes Capt, I am still on the fence. When I read the basic description on the hammocks it looks good, espsecially under 2 pounds, however when I start to add up the cost and the weight of all the extras, I am just not interested. When I figured after I buy the hammock, the under quilt, a larger tarp etc, etc, my cost is really mounting up. And my weight, well it too is going back up and I am trying to keep my base weight below 10 pounds, which I have proudly have done. I just want to have fun and not break the bank. So yes, I am still on the fence.
Until then, I will keep searchin and looking, but also having fun.
This cost is not with the one offered to me, which I am still considering.
Wise Old Owl
10-05-2009, 03:00
Cost & weight? Capt got the right idea, here is what I was working on, I will quickly point out you can do it on a budget through Campmor. I still don't have a underquilt - I just jump into the bag and get comfortable.
See my Gallery -
Then look at
1st idea 10 oz poncho $?
http://www.integraldesigns.com/product_detail.cfm?id=728&CFID=1295805&CFTOKEN=62332568&mainproducttypeid=1
2nd idea 9oz tarp $59
http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___20068
http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___42505
16 oz Byers Mosquito $39
Add tripteese rope & hogs. and a few titanium pegs
MORE INFO
http://hikinghq.net/hammock/hammock.html
Hope that helps, keep in mind if you add that up you are pretty close for a professional setup.
Wasn't there a post in this thread where someone offered a used hammock? Talk to Bearpaw! sounds like a great idea.
The Byer's mosquito hammock looks like a fairly good option if it's sturdy enough. The old Byer hammock (non-mosquito) had very flimsy lines. I ended up cutting them all off and threading some 6mm cord through each end of the hammock. It made the hammock shorter, but I can use it under my poncho without the ends getting wet. I tore the netting out of two Traveller hammocks just getting in. The stitching between the netting and fabric acted like perforations in a checkbook, actually cutting the mosquito net.
I had no such problem with my HH A-sym.
Still, after several years of experimentation I prefer a basic hammock with a separate bug cover. Leave it at home when bugs are a problem and use a regular sleeping bag to cover both the hammock and you (appropriate bags are hard to find - see the Speer hammock website and check out the Peapod for ideas).
Graywolf
10-05-2009, 18:55
Cost & weight? Capt got the right idea, here is what I was working on, I will quickly point out you can do it on a budget through Campmor. I still don't have a underquilt - I just jump into the bag and get comfortable.
See my Gallery -
Then look at
1st idea 10 oz poncho $?
http://www.integraldesigns.com/product_detail.cfm?id=728&CFID=1295805&CFTOKEN=62332568&mainproducttypeid=1
2nd idea 9oz tarp $59
http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___20068
http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___42505
16 oz Byers Mosquito $39
Add tripteese rope & hogs. and a few titanium pegs
MORE INFO
http://hikinghq.net/hammock/hammock.html
Hope that helps, keep in mind if you add that up you are pretty close for a professional setup.
Wasn't there a post in this thread where someone offered a used hammock? Talk to Bearpaw! sounds like a great idea.
Yeah, Thats why I mentioned that at the bottom of my last post. I am just taking every thing in. I am on a budget so I have to make it all count. The offer is good though. I will have to wait till next week for it.
The Byer's mosquito hammock can be flipped upside down if you don't want the netting in your face for a quick break or if there are no bugs. It only weighs 16 oz and held my 250# friend the other day no problem.. just be careful when you wrap it up so the ropes don't get tangled. for $40 its a good deal.
Graywolf
10-06-2009, 03:49
I just sent bearpaw a message to tell him I still want the hammock so you guys can !@#$$$.....hehehhehe.. anyway, once I have it, be expecting alot of questions.
Graywolf
MedicineMan
11-02-2009, 23:57
I decided long ago that trying to get someone to like a hammock is like trying to convince a liberal to be conservative or vice versa....a total waste of your time and his/hers..
If you really want to try this out I would suggest whipping up a test hammock on Risk's site.
If you're a backpacker already I'm sure you have a tarp and a few foam pads laying around.
About $10 and a weekend will tell you if you like it or not.
east_stingray
11-08-2009, 10:39
Like the other guys said, there is an abundance of information over on HammockForums, and it's mostly the same folks that hang out in the hammock area here. Make sure you get a pad that's wide enough... the pad wraps around you in a hammock and will cause cold spots if it's too narrow.
Check out JustJeff's hammock site for a really good primer on hammocking... www.tothewoods.net
MedicineMan
11-08-2009, 10:55
so you got the inexpensive hammock to try out and you tried using the typical thermarest pad and got 'cold shoulder wrap' Ed Speer at Speer Hammocks.com has a pad extender which is an inexpensive way to use your existing pad...its a sleeve you slide your pad in and this sleeve has wings you slide in little pads at your shoulders. I've got this pad extender and it works.
I've gotta tell you, I found that a standard backpacking pad (20" of width like a ProLite) just didn't cut it below 50F. While my underside would be warm, any part of my body that pressed against the uninsulated side of the hammock through my 20F down bag was almost immediately chilled. While I am a warm sleeper, I am also a light sleeper and a temperature variation like that would keep me awake or awaken me. If you're going to go with a pad, get something extra-wide that will almost wrap around look (look into a segmented pad extender), which should get you down to perhaps 40F.
This is exactly what the Speer SPE is designed to eliminate. Works quite well. Underquilt is still probably the "best" solution, but these definitely work and are much cheaper. You can put two pads into the SPE and sleep pretty toasty. For winter, I would get the 4X4 model.
Edit: Guess MedicineMan and I were thinking alike. Anyway the SPE's are on sale now, here's the link:
http://www.speerhammocks.com/Products/SPE.htm
tech30528
11-12-2009, 00:40
I've got the HH UL ASM, and a Big Agnes bag. Works great. The bag has no insulation in the bottom, instead has a pocket that contains the inflatable insulated pad. My 20 degree bag comes in right at 3 pounds. The pad maintains it's shape and prevents sagging, and there are no layers to get twisted up in. Right at 5 pounds for hammock, bag and pad, and a very compact pack.
take-a-knee
11-12-2009, 01:16
so you got the inexpensive hammock to try out and you tried using the typical thermarest pad and got 'cold shoulder wrap' Ed Speer at Speer Hammocks.com has a pad extender which is an inexpensive way to use your existing pad...its a sleeve you slide your pad in and this sleeve has wings you slide in little pads at your shoulders. I've got this pad extender and it works.
I'll second that it works. If you stay with hammocking, and get crazy and decide to do it when it is REALLY COLD, you can use the SPE and an underquilt.