I'm often asked about gear I use, specifically about this piece of gear or that piece of equipment. Almost every piece of gear used by the military is built heavier than it needs to so it can withstand intense use, because of that, it is not well suited for long distance hiking. But there are some items out there that are worth considering.

Why? Well if you have ever been to a surplus store, you will find tents, sleeping bags, ponchos, rain gear, boots, clothing, etc at what are rediculously low prices compared to stuff found at REI or EMS. The lure of cheap durable gear tugs at you, plus all that cool earthtone blend in stuff can make a statment when you encounter the yuppie hikers with their $300 GoreTex jacket and $250 boots on a day hike - "I'm a real hiker man! I don't need all that expensive stuff to hack it out here!"

So on to my review.

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Reviewer: SGT Rock

Age: 35

Height: 68"

Weight: 155 pounds

Experience: 17 years active duty in the US Army. Positions include Scout, Scout Squad Leader, Scout Section Sergeant, Scout Platoon Sergeant, Bradley Gunner, Bradley Commander, Scout HMMWV Commander, PLDC Instructor, 19D BNCOC Instructor, PLDC Senior Instructor, PLDC Division Chief, Academy Chief Instructor, Recruiter (very short tour, dont hold this one against me), and finally First Sergeant of a Light Ground Cavalry Troop. Units: 3rd Armor Division, Germany; 1st Cavalry Division Fort Hood, Texas; USARB Milwaukee, WI; 3rd Armored Cavalry Regiment (The Regiment of Mounted Riflemen), Fort Bliss, Texas; NCO Academy, Fort Bliss, Texas; NCO Academy, Fort Knox, Kentucky; and 2d Armored Cavalry Regiment (Dragoons), Fort Polk, Louisiana.

Equipment Used: Just about everything the Army has. Things I have not used but would like to are the new compression GoreTex bags with bivy, the one person shelter, and the single layer GoreTex raingear.

Locations/conditions tested: From the frozen winters of the Bavarian Alps to the steamy Lousisana Swamps; deserts of Kuwait, New Mexico, West Texas, and the Mojave Desert.

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Clothing:

Most miltary clothing is still in the age of cotton. BDUs get wet and stay wet, but at least the socks are wool. Boots are heavy and designed for protecting from wire and spikes, not neccissarily walking.

But....

1. Army polypro long underwear works. I was caught in an ice storm on Mount Rogers in 1997 and all I had was a set of Army polypro underwear - I was warm even standing still. The good points: Warm. It has a fleece like inside that should be worn against the skin. It is very comfortable. The neck zips open or closed for some venting and in the up position makes it to the top of my neck. The pants weigh 8.3 ounces for mediums, and a medium top is 10.6 ounces.

2. Knit PT cap. It is a black watch cap made from wool, very warm and only weighs 2.1 ounces.

3. Polypro neck gaiter. Newly introduced as official issue gear, it has been used by soldiers unofficially for a while. When combined with a knit cap and polypro underwear it gives you complete protection from ankles to head. It can also be used as a scarf, handwarmer, hat, headband, etc.

4. Dress nylon socks. Solders have been using these as sock liners on ruck marches before there was polypro liners. Durable and only weigh about 0.5 ounces a pair.

5. Poly/wool glove liners. Dry quickly, cheap and only o.6 ounces a pair. These are light brown instead of the wool green inserts. The benifit is you can wear them inside other gloves so that you can remove the thicker glove and still have dexterity while keeping your hands warm for short time work.

6. Field Jacket/Pants Liners. Quilted liners made to button inside a field jacket. These liners are very light and highly compressable. Unlike some high tech polarguard 3D type jackets like the Puffball, these do not loose loft over time when stuffing. I have the same field jacket liner I was issued in 1985. Soldiers know what work, and most don't even wear the field jackets these are made for, instead they wear them under their BDU tops. While I was in Germany, it was before the days of GoreTex and polypro. The warmest jacket was what was called a "Graf Jacket", basically a rain top with the field jacket liner sewen into it. Buy the tops and bottoms a size smaller than you normally get, they are made to go over bulky uniforms. My small liner weighs 10.5 ounces, and my field pants liners weigh 8.3 ounces.

7. Trigger Finger mittens. Although not light, these are VERY WARM. They weigh 3.5 ounces, but the main benifit is the index finger and thumb can still be used. I use a pair under OR rain mittens in very cold weather, then I can take off the mitten shell and use my idex finger and thumb for minute work. Anything really complex and I can wear just the liners if I have all three (not likely!)

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Shelters:

Most Army shelters are too heavy. Canvas with steel pegs and wooden poles, the shelter half needs to to operate and the design is the same since about 1901.

But...

The Poncho is a nice piece of gear that weighs 21 ounces and can serve as both rain gear and a shelter. Earl Schaffer sent his tent home early on his long cruise and relied only on an Army poncho for the rest of his trip.

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Sleeping bags/pads:

Every Army sleeping bag I have ever used is too heavy and bulky.

But...

1. Poncho liner. Some hikers like to ditch the sleeping bag in warmer months for fleece, but occasionally freeze. I watched a hiker have a miserable night the first shelter out of Pearisburg on a cold JUNE night because he went with the 23 ounce Wal-Mart fleece bag. The Poncho liner is a quilt which in my experience is a lot warmer than the fleece bag and it only weighs 20 ounces. I also find it highly compressable.

2. Sleeping pad. The Army standard sleeping pad is a 72" x 24" x 3/8" pad with built in straps. I have successfully used this pad, a poncho liner, and polypro underwear down to about 45 degrees while inside a Hennessy Hammock. The wide long pad is easily trimmed for those people wanting a pad wider than what seems to be a 20" standard in most sleeping pads. It weighs 19.8 ounces.

3. Sleeping pad, self inflating. Personally I don't care for it, but if your looking for cheap surplus, the Army now has a Thermarest Litefoam Long pad, only in green. Same as the civilian model. It weighs 23 ounces if I remember correctly.

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Packs, bags, and other carrying gear:

Tha ALICE pack is very durable and is also heavy, but you can get one cheap. If you go that route, trim off all those external mounting points, get rid of the radio pocket, maybe trim off the back poacket like Earl Schaffer did, and maybe get rid of the top pocket flap and straps, just use the top cord lock for closure. My main problem with the ALICE pack was the frame must be designed for someone 5' tall, everone else gets a compressed spine. The military has a million little cases designed to carry this and that, all modular and easy to get into, but not what a backpacker needs.

But...

If you are flying with a pack and need something to carry it in, the duffle bag is tough and huge. The opening is as big as the rest of the pack, so if it fits inside the bag, it will get into the bag.
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Mess Gear:

Most stuff is heavy steel like the plate and utensils, the canteen cup is heavy, canteens are hard plastic and weigh 5 ounces empty. Most stuff is not suited to a backpacker's needs. The food (MREs) are heavy and produce too much trash.

But...

The MRE spoon is light, plastic, and has a long handle that comes in handy on occasions. I keep one in my gear that is now about 2 years old. Disposable spoon, yet tough enough to make any hike, and only about 0.4 ounces.

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Other stuff:

There are a lot of things in the Military that don't always get used for the intended reasons. Soldiers find ways to make things work like using a decon wipe container to store cigarets.

1. 100 MPH tape. This is a brown form of Duct tapr that we use in the Army. I find it a lot more durable, yet easier to tear than silver duct tape. I have found it at surpluss stores and I carry it instead of standard duct tape.

2. Hexamine fuel. Hexamine and Esbit tabs are the same thing. In the Army you can sometimes get a cardboard roll of about six 1/4 ounce blocks. I have found these at surpluss stores which can save you money. Beware the Trioxane tablets which are foil wrapped and usually come in a brown cardboard box, they have about 1/2 the BTUs of Hexamine and burn too quickly to be effective.

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Conclusions/Recommendations:

You may noticed that I didn't include prices. In my experience you can buy brand new stuff and pay more than you would at REI, or you can find a deal and get almost any of this stuff for about $5-$10.

As for what I personally reccomend, I use the following items very regularly in my backpacking equipment:

Polypro underwear, poly/wool gloves, knit PT cap, neck gaiter, trigger finger mittens, field jacket and pants liners, poncho liner, and 100 MPH tape.

Imagine, buy most of your cold weather clothing for the same price as some guys spend on just a jacket!

For cold weather hiking, there's nothing better than army surplus wool pants. I've been using them since the mid-70 (well, not the same pair because they are made of reprocessed wool which lacks durability). I've used U.S. army, navy, and marine surplus. Swedish
and Swiss surplus seem readily available these days. Tightly woven wool pants are moderately windproof, loose enough for some ventilation, and don't pick up snow too badly. Plus wool has the wonderful property that water on the outside doesn't readily wick to the inside. If you find them scratchy, wear polypro underneath, or, in warmer weather, long lycra shorts will do the trick.

K-boots, also known as Korean boots, Mouse boots, or Mickey Mouse boots are I believe not used by the U.S. army anymore and therefore difficult to find (though I did buy a new pair a couple of years ago). They are a vapor barrier boot with rubber interior, rubber exterior, and thick wool felt insulation totally sealed inside. Good to -20F for hiking and moderate standing around. Quite idiot-proof (you can walk through streams in these at -20 and have warm feet 10 minutes later). Great for snowshoeing, but hard to get a crampon to fit because of their shape and flexibility. Look for K-boots made in USA or Canada (avoid the K-boots made in Korea, as they are not sealed on the inside and could give you frostbite).

Other cold weather surplus gear I've used in the past but given up: army wool mittens with trigger finger (OK, but had bulky useless cuffs), surplus leather mitten shells (once they get wet, they freeze solid and the leather dries slowly. good to wear while waxing boots, though.), green cotton baggy wind pants (functional, and cotton is OK for the outer layer, though they can get wet and freeze).

The poly pro underwear IS very good.Kept me warm on the cold flight-line working on aircraft.

ps. Sgt Rock....Toujours Pret!

Always Ready!

2. Knit PT cap. It is a black watch cap made from wool, very warm and only weighs 2.1 ounces

Oddly I found this after I posted my gear list which included one of these if I could find one. I'm not the most experienced hiker but I virtually grew up wearing these hunting (waits for the GASPS) and on boats. Great little caps, warm and very light.

I have had a field jacket for over 5 years and I also have to say that the trigger finger mittens are the warmest gloves I have ever had. I have heard that the finger that is not used for shooting is for nose detail:D. Also when you have the polypro under the pants ( yes I know that NYCO is nylon and cotton, but...) even if the pants are wet you stay warm. I tested this fact by accident. To make things short went ice fishing and the guy driving thought his truck was so danged great and rammed into 14" snow. He had no shovel so we had to dig by hand for about 3 hours until a snowmobiler came and got a tractor to pull us out. By the time we were out, the pants were soaked but I couldn't even feel the cold and wet. I have been using an ALICE pack for quite a while and a ECWCS goretex parka for a few years. I have used the LCI's for day hiking. I even got the assult pack for longer day hikes when I need to carry all my water. I had it loaded with almost 30 lbs this fall. No problems.

Hey Sarge ,Speaking of Military gear,can you or anybody on here give me some info on a bayonet I found?? Its too heavy for backpacking for the most part anyway ,but I was fishing one day and hooked something heavy which turned out to be an M9 type bayonet. On the blade near the hilt it says M9 Phrobis 3 U.S.A (the 3 is actually in roman numerals)complete with the scabbard canvas pouch on front and sharpening stone on back.I asked this question on Bladeforums.com and a few people said it was actual military issue and a few said it was a well made copy.Do you know anything about this Pig sticker??? Oh yeah one more thing, also on the blade the number 2 is scribed like they do in the army for inventory purposes. Thanx alot,Streamweaver

The scabbard, is it canvas or nylon?

Before you get to answer, here is a URL: http://www.quarterbore.com/knives/m9bayonet.html

My experience with this model is they dull pretty easy and the tip tends to break when you use it a s a wire cutter. That is what that lug hole in the blade is for - you attach it to the scabbard lug near the tip and use it for cutting wire obsticles. I've seen them used, they don't cut well to start with. In my troop we keep them locked up or Joe would just screw them up. We will give them out if we deploy, but I will put my own edge on mine.

The Scabbard is the hard type plastic or nylon with a canvas pouch on the front and it has a metal plate on the end for cutting wire .it also has the heavy wire belt clip with a nylon buckle and canvas straps. Streamweaver

Thanks Sarge! I just found something else ,on the back of the scabbard just below the sharpening stone there is a picture of a fish ,maybe a shark or possibly a dolphin.

I just took a quick look at the website ,Thats the knife I found right at the top of the page . Thanks for the info and the website!! I think I might make a lighter scabbard for it out of nylon webbing or something(if thats strong enuff) though it will still be kind of heavy. Streamweaver

I was in the army when they replaced the old bayonnets with the high-speed wire cutter ones(I'm thinking 86 or 87). Like any new knife out of the box,they were razor sharp.
I had just been bit by a brown recluse (in North Carolina) so I had to go to the medical clinic everyday to have the wound re-packed. At the same time, my division was doing an annual dog and pony, where troops had to stand for hours in the North Carolina sun with rifles on there shoulders...with razor sharp brand new bayonnets at the end. Joes passed out and mayhem ensued.
I'll be first to state that I'm no Rambo (I spent some time in central America and went to Desert Storm) but some of the bloodier moments I witnessed in my military career were in that clinic that week.

Swamp

I own a nice set of the Single Layer Gortex Rain Gear that i've had since first issue. It's still in perfect shape, so it's going to be my workhorse on my upcoming thru-hike in January.

I've literally been through hell in that jacket and wouldn't switch for anything by REI, Marmot, Land's End, Mountain Hardware, et al, etc. for any amount of cash, because the misery would never end.

I've seen sets on sale at surplus stores for about $150 - $170 and if you're interested in obtaining a pair, I say go for it. But be careful as most surplus stores also offer military knock off's that are considerably lower quality, 'Something' Industries, as I recall.

As for me, I'll be readily identifiable on the trail in camo in the middle of winter, so you shouldn't have a problem saying hello.

I was in Combat Camera in the Air Force and we got issued gear for all occasions.

My favorite gear, that I still use:

Matterhorn cold weather boots: These babies are high above the ankle, have a thick sole and quilted lining. They are WARM and rugged. Not for a long hike but I do use them in nasty, cold weather for short outings.

Field Jacket: I have a desert field jacket which I find plenty warm even without the lining. I use it camping, but it's really too heavy for trail use. It does have a hood in the collar and I really like all the pocket space.

3 Day Bag: This is my favorite backpack for day trips or summer overnights. I travel with it, hike with it and have taken it around the world.

Desert BDU bottoms, cut off below the cargo pocket: Sure, it's probably geeky looking, but these are what I hike in during the summer. Besides, the Individual Ready Reserve says I only have to keep 3 uniforms in working order...so I "altered" the rest :)

Fleece helmet liner: Ok, if you wear this thing you look like Baldric in Black Adder. However, it's warm and it has a velcro flap that covers the neck below the chin. Great for sleeping in cold weather.

Wool glove inserts: I wear these as my regular gloves. There are two models that you can get at any surplus store...fingerless and with fingers. These gloves are designed to be worn as liners for the leather outers, but work fine by themselves. If you're gung ho and it's wet out you can use the leather outers, too.

550 cord: I think it's also known as parachute cord. It is indispensable, nothing compares to it.

Poncho: Sgt Rock already covered this. It's heavy, but is so versatile it probably saves weight in the long run.

i love the lighter military gear,i use a lot of the clothing,my first section hikes i used a large alice combat pack that wieghed 60 lbs,i ditched that pack,to heavy:cool: neo

The only military gear i carry is the P-38. I'm surprised you didn't mention it.

Military gear is often cheap and durable (if a bit heavy). Some real gems in there. Seems like many of use similar gear out of the miltary kit. Of course, my stuff was bought and did not come with a 2+ yr enlistment. :)

Anyway, some stuff I personally use:

P-38: Yep, as with Fiddlehead, use this handy-dandy little can opener. Has many, many, many other uses. From the old c rations, but you can still find the original (and clones) in many surplus stores. http://www.georgia-outfitters.com/p38.htm

Duffle Bag: My luggage of choice. Can stuff lots of gear into it Can beat the crap out of it. And only $20.

Flyers Kit Bag: (5000 ci!). Another great (and cheap!) bag for hauling gear.

Wool liner gloves: I used to use smart wool liner gloves..but they wore out too quickly. Even at the discount rate of $5 ea. they were getting to be expensive. (They normally sell for $20!!!). Went with the surplus wool inserts. With my SilNylon mitts and these gloves, been in all kinds of weather. (Total combo is ~2.75 oz).

Underwear: cheap and warm!

Balaclava: OK the one I use is not gov't issue..but the company that makes mine also makes one for the US Miliary. Mine is in green as opposed to brown..otherwise it looks identical. Light and warm.

Boonie hat: I had to replace my lost hat ($6 at target) and went with the military issue one. Sun protection and keeps the rain out ofmy face. Only problem it is too darn new looking! I am sure it will be suitably grungy in the future.

Friends of mine use the TRIGGER MITTS for chainsaw work, and the BDUs are great for trailwork.

The only military gear i carry is the P-38. I'm surprised you didn't mention it.



i have carried a p-38 on my key ring for years:cool: neo

I'm going to the surplus store for Christmas presents today! Sweet Idea!

I just found some wool glove inserts for a buck a pair at a flea mkt
I finally found a field jacket liner for a decent price(still looking for the field pant liner to go with it)
I have been using a p-38 type canopener,not the actual military one but its made by cohglans and works well.
I also found a military pack liner for 2 bucks ,a bit heavy but that didnt turn out to be a big problem because all of the rubber coating fell off at the same time LOL still a good ripstop stuff sack though.And lighter!LOL
A guy at the flea mkt had military winter boots,I think they are the ones called "Mickey Mouse Boots"? They looked like good boots and were cheap .40 bucks I think,but they didnt have my size.

Always Ready!
Semper Paratis!

(Inside joke: Clean as you go.)

here are my favorite military surplus gear links:cool: neo


http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ctd/default.asp?

http://www.majorsurplusnsurvival.com/

http://www.loadup.com/


http://www.sportsmansguide.com/

A guy at the flea mkt had military winter boots,I think they are the ones called "Mickey Mouse Boots"? They looked like good boots and were cheap .40 bucks I think,but they didnt have my size.

Mickeys are insanely warm boots. The whites ones are espicially warm. Rubber on the outside, wool in the inside, pocket of air in the middle. The blackones were used for high altitude planes during the Korean era...they were so warm, they made some for winter use, too (the white ones). That's the general history, anyway. I am forgetting the specifics.

Could never find them in my size. I did find some Sorrel Caribous in my size for $8 at thrift store though a while back. Talk about a thrift store find. They *were* in almost new condition. Now..not so much. :)


Rock, do they still have the Mickey boots for military use?

Anybody know where to get MCW/LRP rations?

Its a shame the military can't get up to date with all the modern fabrics and gear available. I have found the majority of the surplus stuff is probably OK for car or backyard camping, but not suitable for long distance travel. It seems NASA has been responsible(at least in years past) for some of our modern equip, food prep/storage, fabrics.

Its a shame the military can't get up to date with all the modern fabrics and gear available. I have found the majority of the surplus stuff is probably OK for car or backyard camping, but not suitable for long distance travel. It seems NASA has been responsible(at least in years past) for some of our modern equip, food prep/storage, fabrics.

Then I read some of the reports from the British troops after the Falklands war. the polypropylene melted to their skin. I hate it when that happens!

field jacket liners and the matching pant liners are the bomb! used to be a guy could get them tailored with elastic cuffs and buttons for dirt cheap in the p.i.

my good luck charm is my marine corps wool green watchcap. it keeps my bald head warm always!

To: Sgt Rock,

You forgot to mention the Stainless canteen cups with folding brass handle( 1950's) they serve as both a pot to heat water for quick meals. Also can find Esbit tablets, Para-cord, and old Parachutes for making your own Silnylon shelters

Mike

they sell sew in zipper kits for the GI poncho liner which converts it into a nice warm weather sleeping bag or sleeping bag liner. ranger rick sells them (www.therangerdigest.com) pretty cool site and the guy is basicly insane.

The only military surplus gear i use is a 100 ounce camelback water hydration system and a polypro camo liner.

I really like the camelback, especially with it's shut off valve. The bite valve comes completely off for cleaning, but it;s a little hard to get out.

Great thread. I was in the Marines for a while, so I have a few comments and a question.

Goretex sleeping bag liner/ "bivy sack": We used these instead of sleeping bags in moderate weather. Expensive, but a great, light-weight piece of gear.

Foam sleeping pad/ iso-mat: I don't plan on getting an inflatable thing, these pads have always worked for me.

Mickey Mouse or vapor barrier boots: I was issued these in 1999, so the Marines were still using them then. They probably phased them out shortly after, though, as we got Goretex boots the next year. (Hate the Goretex boots, too heavy, I'd rather wear jungles unless it was really cold.) VB boots were incredibly warm and actually comfortable to hike in, which I never expected. My feet were never cold.

Watch cap: I always wear it when sleeping, except for summer.

Goretex: Forget cotton, when I was at cold weather training we only wore poly pro and Goretex. I still have my Goretex jacket and pants, and was actually wondering if it would make sense to take it on the trail in May when I do a section going north from PA. It could function as a rain coat... but probably too hot, right?

I'd appreciate any comments.

I like getting stuff I don't have to sign for...

A good source for military surplus that I have found in Coleman's Surplus in PA. I don't have the website handy, but they normally have just about everything.

I am still in a get issued some things that are pretty good. I have noticed that the boots, jackets and gloves are getting better the longer I stay in. I still like my old camoflague poncho liner and carry it everywhere.

The only military gear i carry is the P-38. I'm surprised you didn't mention it.



i have carried a p-38 on my key ring for years:cool: neo
zz
z
Also known as a "John Wayne"..
x

i collect military field gear:cool: neo

The polypros and field jacket liners rock. I have been warn with them on under my BDUs in alaska, south dakota, north dakota, and colorado.

I also use flyer's jacket and pants liners with the elastic cuffs and waists on the pants, and full zipper on the jacket liner. These do not loose loft after multiple compressions. Mine have help up great these last 8 years.

The poncho liner rocks! The air force has been using cool max the last few years as a standard issue option for cold weather clothing.

Cabana

Stocker & Yale compass, a very good compass, there was another issue called a Trinimun SP? that is supposed to be better but I don;t see how, the new issue poncho liner is supposed to be warmer than the older one. I like my old one in a HH. Used it two weeks ago and kept warm. Ditto on dress socks as liners, cheap enough to use a few times and throw away.

Mmmmmm..... Back in the day we were given those little 5-count packs of smokes in our C-Rations (Most smoked back then). They seemed to be either marlboro, winstons, kools or newports. We were alway trading the greens to the blacks for the reds. Along with 1-instant coffee, 1-powdered creamer and 1-sugar packet.

I still carry my P-38. I think after Wildflecken, Graf, and exercises at Eglin,I amassed quite a few P-38s.

Mmmmmm..... Back in the day we were given those little 5-count packs of smokes in our C-Rations (Most smoked back then). They seemed to be either marlboro, winstons, cools or newports. We were alway trading the greens to the blacks for the reds. Along with 1-instant coffee, 1-powdered creamer and 1-sugar packet.

I still carry my P-38. I think after Wildflecken, Graf, and exercises at Eglin,I amassed quite a few P-38s.

Toolshed, when you mentioned Graf a little shiver went down my spine. Very cold in winter, and then muddy or dusty depending on the amount of rain...Lots of pigs as well. Lost a buddy there as well when he walked into the tailrotor of his Cobra while de-arming after being on the range. Not a place I would willingly go visit!!

I just went back to Hohenfels to prepare for my last deployment and it was still the same as the mid-eighties. Germany is great elsewhere ;)

Hi Buck,
I was with the 11th Armored Cav in Fulda - Border Guards. Flight Ops - Worked with the Cobras, Hueys and '58's. Long time ago. Nice Avatar!!!

Toolshed, I was a Cobra pilot with the 13th Attack Helicopter Battalion at Giebelstadt (near Wurzburg). 1984-1988. Lost a tailrotor in flight on the East German border on 20 OCT 87 and I have a little back problem as a result. REAL happy to be here though!

My wife hates the avatar!! It was taken while I was flying Medevac Blackhawks in Kosovo in 04-05. She says (and is probably correct...) that I look goofy :D

The website for Colemans Surplus is www.colemans.com (http://www.colemans.com). Wow, that was a stretch for me to figure out... Maybe I am goofy like my wife says:D

They have pigeon note carriers (seriously) on sale if you want to set up a relay while on the trail to get messages home...

Are these the thermal underwear to whick you refer??
http://www.majorsurplusnsurvival.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=202678&Category_Code=57

Is Their price in the ball park or where else should I look?

TIA

Tom

Those look like the same thing that I was issued. Colemans is about $23.00 for the shirt, so I would say thats a decent price. I have not looked at Ebay, but something to note is that in my experience in the Army, anything that is an undergarment is not usually turned back in to supply. Meaning, when a guy gets out he may have new stuff that he has not worn and may try to sell.

Toolshed, I was a Cobra pilot with the 13th Attack Helicopter Battalion at Giebelstadt (near Wurzburg). 1984-1988. Lost a tailrotor in flight on the East German border on 20 OCT 87 and I have a little back problem as a result. REAL happy to be here though!

My wife hates the avatar!! It was taken while I was flying Medevac Blackhawks in Kosovo in 04-05. She says (and is probably correct...) that I look goofy :D
That is amazing. Did you autorotate down? Glad you made it safely. One ouf our pilots, Captain Cheek (IIRC), hit wires in his Cobra in late '80, but made down safe.

I left Germany in '81. I used to fly on a lot of sorties when I could (preferential hot refuels, assisting pilots with weather, route planning and AFOD always helped).

My station was Fulda airfield and I opened the airfield (Fulda) and worked from 6AM-2PM or closed it and worked 2PM- 10PM. I absolutely loved it there and usually got to fly the border several days a week. On my off days, I'd try get a ride to various german cities or a few hours or so.

That is amazing. Did you autorotate down? Glad you made it safely. One ouf our pilots, Captain Cheek (IIRC), hit wires in his Cobra in late '80, but made down safe.

I left Germany in '81. I used to fly on a lot of sorties when I could (preferential hot refuels, assisting pilots with weather, route planning and AFOD always helped).

My station was Fulda airfield and I opened the airfield (Fulda) and worked from 6AM-2PM or closed it and worked 2PM- 10PM. I absolutely loved it there and usually got to fly the border several days a week. On my off days, I'd try get a ride to various german cities or a few hours or so.

Toolshed,

I have nightmares about wires. A buddy just hit a set in a Hawk in Peru. Lucky to be here as well. I have not hit any but have come really close way to many times.

Your job was the backbone of the whole thing. All I did was go kill a couple of tanks and get shot down by the invading Soviet tanks or so they told us...

Yup, we autorotated as best we could, but the gearbox came off as well and that was about 70 pounds waaaay back on the helicopter. We hit pretty level (about 12g's according to the investigation) and I would have been OK except one main rotor hit the ground and we rolled upside down. Hit so hard it ripped the 20mm off the front! Co-pilot up front had a compressed spine and my seat collapsed. Would you believe I am still fighting with the VA over it! They say the crash did not cause all my back problems... Not many had survived this so we got a "Broken Wing" and I was put in for an Air Medal but got an ARCOM. I'll try to put a picture below if the system will allow.

Hi, This is Flowerlady and we are starting our hike Feb, 27 07. We have got alot of realy good stuff at Mainemilitary, they have realy good prices to. Check them out. Flower Lady 2007camo@mainemilitary.com (camo@mainemilitary.com?subject=MaineMilitary.com)

The only military gear i carry is the P-38. Walther or can opener? :D

=I'll try to put a picture below if the system will allow.


Nice Buck. Glad yer still with us, bum back or not.

Field jacket liner (aka the chinese smoking jacket) and poncho liners both rock and are very durable and probably fairely cheap even new. I think Ranger Joe's sells brand new 'cho liners for $30. http://www.rangerjoes.com/poncho-linerwoobie-p-3691.html

The gore-tex bivy sack (a bag cover, not a bivy "shelter") was very impressive. I slept in subfreezing weather nekkid with it and the 32* patrol bag and stayed comfortable. I also stayed almost completely zipped inside one during a 2hr steady rain. Left about 4" unzipped by my face to vent. These would work well with a light tarp.

Just remember that the tradeoff for durability and price in surplus stuff is usually increased weight.

I have a question regarding Army boots. I have been pondering getting a pair for hiking for some time. Which kind easily available now for women would work best for my purposes? (I do not know what kind I could easily find, or which works best so I am asking those who have used them.) The purposes being, they must be able to wick moisture, and withstand weather extremes, heat and cold. This (http://www.motrails.com/elkcity.html) is the trail I'd be using them on the most for now, until my hopes for section hiking the AT can begin to really germinate. (Section hiking to start, maybe a full thru hike.) I realize I'll probably have new boots by the time I get to the AT, so for now, what kind of Army boots would best suit my needs? I do go out in the winter if it isn't icey or the snow too deep. But here in extreme SE Kansas we don't get as much snow as we do ice, and it does get quite hot in the summer.

Also, I wear heavy (thick soled, sort of gothicish brogue/creeper ankle boots) shoes every day and have gotten used to them, light slippers feel odd to me. Arch/ankle support is a concern though. (I roll my ankles inwards when I walk, cannot help it, one leg is an inch longer than the other.)

Er, take the sole from these (http://www.amazon.com/T-U-K-Womens-T2157-Brogue-Oxford/dp/B001AB6IDQ/ref=sr_1_21?ie=UTF8&s=shoes&qid=1250972115&sr=1-21), and put it on these (http://www.amazon.com/Rocket-Dog-Womens-Lumber-Oxford/dp/B001F0QL9I/ref=pd_sbs_shoe_3) (black, leather) and you pretty much got what I wear everyday, but I think maybe a little heavier. Point being, I can probably manage heavyish boots.

Zabigail, Your shoes seem very heavy to me, and I usually wear heavy hiking boots. Have you tried either running shoes or what's called trail runners (heavier duty running shoes used for running on mountain or woods trails). What I have liked are ankle height or higher hiking boots based on running shoe technology.
http://www.rei.com/category/4500216/q/Men's+Hiking+Boots shows what I mean, but these are sure expensive!!!

I still carry my P-38. Spent my foreign time in 67-68 in Augsburg (Sheridan Kaserne) and frequent jaunts to Graf. Pigs and mud. Remember C-rat Ham & Lima Beans? What a taste treat! :D Not even hot sauce seemed to make them edible. They were even disgusting to look at. We wore Mickey Mouse boots but they became damp with sweat inside and cold, too. I never liked them. The C-rat cigarettes were usually so old that the tobacco would fall out the ends.

About the only surplus things I carry are an M-66 jungle hammock with the poncho attachments, poncho, and the poncho liner.

I have a question regarding Army boots. I have been pondering getting a pair for hiking for some time. Which kind easily available now for women would work best for my purposes? (I do not know what kind I could easily find, or which works best so I am asking those who have used them.) The purposes being, they must be able to wick moisture, and withstand weather extremes, heat and cold. This (http://www.motrails.com/elkcity.html) is the trail I'd be using them on the most for now, until my hopes for section hiking the AT can begin to really germinate. (Section hiking to start, maybe a full thru hike.) I realize I'll probably have new boots by the time I get to the AT, so for now, what kind of Army boots would best suit my needs? I do go out in the winter if it isn't icey or the snow too deep. But here in extreme SE Kansas we don't get as much snow as we do ice, and it does get quite hot in the summer.

I'm not sure why you want multi-season boots, which tend to cost more. For cold weather with snow and/or very cold rain, Army boots are not the best, frankly, compared with any number of commecial brands, which are just as dry and warm but far, far lighter. (Remember the adage, which is TRUE: "One pound on the feet equals five pounds on the back.") Especially with good wicking undersocks and outersocks, don't go the "Army" route: You're not doing things they do: Keep in mind that those boots are designed for major ankle protection in far worse environments than trails, while carrying up to 100 lb of gear, weapons and ammunition (sometimes more).

For warmer weather, trail shoes accomplish far better results, especially if you are reducing your weight carried down to 20% or thereabouts of body weight.

I agree with Rock: For most purposes, military gear is engineered beyond what trail hikers should have.

TW

What I am looking for is boots that can be worn during the seasons here, that will last decently. I do need arch and ankle support, and of course comfort is needful too. The shoes I wear for everyday have lasted for a goodly time. Sturdiness was a big consideration when I bought them, as was comfort. (I have wide feet and finding shoes that feel good at the toes, and aren't too long isn't easy.) The area I hike is often wet, but it gets quite hot here too. And, as I said I do go out in the winter. I have worn lightweight shoes for things like basketball, and Asics gels (they were new tech) were what I wore for cross country in High School. But I am unsure I can find any lightweight boots that won't wear out too soon. What makes things even more frustrating is there isn't any kind of outfitter very close to where I live, we'll have to drive to Oklahoma, maybe Tulsa to get to an actual building. I really do need to try any boots on before I even think of buying them.

What I didn't say above was, I was asking about what you know as heavy boots because to me, it is a higher priority to get sturdy boots that fit and will work in the weather I'll be using them in. I don't think shoes will cut it, I need ankle support as well as arch support. Jungle boots aren't that heavy, as an example, but I don't know if they'd fill all my needs. If you know sturdy lightweight boots that fit the bill, comment on my page, or here, or PM me and let me know. :)

The desert boots are tough, and comparatively lightweight. I wouldn't consider them 3 season, tho.

The desert boots are tough, and comparatively lightweight. I wouldn't consider them 3 season, tho.

I have had experience with a military issued neck gaiter (I don't believe its poly pro though) and the sleeping bag system. The gaiter is nice cause it fits tighter around the neck to keep out drafts and it can be used as an ear warmer or headband too. I also really rather liked the military outer (green) bag. I was amazed at how it compressed. It went into the same bag I put my Marmot Helium down bag in. I wouldn't feel comfortable using it in anything cooler than 45 to 50 degree. It says you can go down to 30 in it before using the black inner bag...but I'd be too cold. I weighed the green bag in the waterproof stuff sack I put it in and it was about 2 pounds -- not bad for synthetic. I noticed that the lining left me feeling clammy though which is weird cause I don't normally have that problem with my other bags. ANywho, I was impressed with it esp. for a free bag :)

after seeing this, I will try to find polypro long undies at the army surplus store and i like that sounds of that knit cap too though I think I'll check with the boyfriend and see if he has the knit cap.....nothin like free gear!

Thanks SGT.Rock!

Walther or can opener? :D

I have a P-38 can opener, Korean War vintage, that my army veteran uncle gave me years ago. I keep it on my key ring. I was doing some office temp work and when going to make the coffee, no one had a can opener to get at the new brew! :eek: I took out the P-38, attacked that can of Maxwell House, and had that caffeine brewing in no time flat! :clap My co-workers were so impressed with the P-38, that when I saw them on sale at a local flea market for 10 cents each, I bought 20 of them and passed them out to everyone in the office. They were a great and useful, (not to mention-cheap! :D) gift that everyone appreciated receiving! :banana