View Full Version : PA Outfitter Issues
FYI the outfitter in port clinton is closed. Also the outfitter in Harrisburg called "wildware" is still there, however his selection is almost nothing. I don't know if he is going out of business or what, but last time I was in there he had like a couple girls packs and a few clothes items only. Just figured I'd give a warning.
Also the Wildware has a big "for lease" sign on it. Looks like we'll be in a 500k+ metro with NO hiking outfitter. There are things we just can't get at the Blue Mountain canoe outfitters in Marysville, Bass Pro & Gander Mountain. REI, are you listening? (Or even EMS...?)
Cookerhiker
11-09-2010, 16:46
That's too bad. Do you think that Cabelas' arrival has contributed to these stores' demise? That's unfortunate since last I checked, Cabela's backpacking stock (as well as the knowledge of their staff) was very limited.
I don't think Cabela's or any other large box sportsmen store hurt Wildware. I just don't think there was a market in Central Pa. for hiking gear. Wildware has gone mostly to water equipment, a market that is much larger in a town by a river. There is another Wildware on the West Shore in Mechanicsburg, but I am not sure that it's stock of hiking gear is any better. In the last few years, that location seemed to retain some of the gear that the other store phased out. I wouldn't want to give the impression that Wildware is bare for hiker gear. If you have a specific need, fuel, filter, etc. you can still get stuff there. It just has almost no selection. Not a place to completely outfit yourself.
It sounds like the Port Clinton outfitter (I was never there) had issues on top of the normal for a small business.
Perhaps the Wildware Hbg East Shore is having life cycle issues - it has lasted longer than the 2 other locations that used to be Wildware before a breakup. I'm sure the large Bass Pro Shop 1 exit south and Gander Mountain 1 exit north on I-83 haven't helped them, in addition to the other internet vs. bricks-and-mortar issues.
I don't think anyone can make money just on core hikers short of being Winton Porter or MRO. The tangential customers would see GM and Bass Pro as equivalent. Although it would be interesting to see someone try to make a go in Duncannon, I would hope that rent is cheap there.
It is strange that Wellsboro has a better BOM outfitter than Harrisburg.
There is another Wildware on the West Shore in Mechanicsburg
They closed ~3 yr ago
Cookerhiker
11-09-2010, 17:23
.... Although it would be interesting to see someone try to make a go in Duncannon, I would hope that rent is cheap there.
It is strange that Wellsboro has a better BOM outfitter than Harrisburg.
Re. Duncannon in addition to the presumably-cheap rents, their location is handy since the upgrading of Rt. 322 several years ago.
Re. Wellsboro, I was there last week and was impressed with the stock given its remote location. It struck me as similar to Wilderness Voyageurs in Ohiopyle - far from cities but in a location with a range of outdoor activities available - cycling, paddling, winter sports - in addition to hiking.
ShakeyLeggs
11-09-2010, 18:29
Yes there is now only one Wildware location. So sad because they over the years have lightened my wallet considerably.
The best location for an outfitter in my opinion would be Boiling Springs. Right by the lake. If I had the time and money i would make a go of it.
Re. Wellsboro, I was there last week and was impressed with the stock given its remote location. It struck me as similar to Wilderness Voyageurs in Ohiopyle - far from cities but in a location with a range of outdoor activities available - cycling, paddling, winter sports - in addition to hiking.
Were you at Pine Creek Outfitters (http://www.pinecrk.com/) out on Rt 6 west, or (the place I meant) Wild Asaph Outfitters (http://www.wildasaphoutfitters.com/) in the gas-lit downtown (owned by Blue Heron GAME'02)?
Cookerhiker
11-09-2010, 22:24
Were you at Pine Creek Outfitters (http://www.pinecrk.com/) out on Rt 6 west, or (the place I meant) Wild Asaph Outfitters (http://www.wildasaphoutfitters.com/) in the gas-lit downtown (owned by Blue Heron GAME'02)?
2 weeks ago after finishing the Susquehannock Trail, I stopped in Pine Creek. Last year after finishing the Black Forest Trail, I browsed through Wild Asaph.
duncannon should definitely be the place. nearly every thru hiker takes a nero or a zero there... cost of living there is significantly less than harrisburg.
Johnny Thunder
11-10-2010, 01:06
duncannon should definitely be the place. nearly every thru hiker takes a nero or a zero there... cost of living there is significantly less than harrisburg.
yeah but how many through hikers are there by then? maybe a thousand.
so even if every hiker buys something big, like new boots, the place still nets only 100K a year. and that's a best-case scenario.
rare that an outfitter north Neels survives almost entirely on thru-hikers. there's just not enough near duncannon to bring section folks in like there is in hotsprings, damascus, etc.
Johnny Thunder
11-10-2010, 01:07
i meant "gross" not "net"
bummer72
11-10-2010, 20:28
Just outside (west) Lancaster, PA, on Roherstown Road ( Route 741) which is an exit of of Route 30, you'll find "The Wildernest Outdoor Store"
Small and locally owned since 1978, this has been the go-to place for our area. http://www.thewildernestoutdoor.com/
Lancaster, PA has an EMS in the Park City Mall.
Duncannon should definitely be the place.
Those who care may accomplish more by making nice with Cabela's. Maybe it just takes someone who wants the job. They are not going away anytime soon.
I recently called them to ask if they had a copy of Guide to the Appalachian Trail in Pennsylvania. When my call was connected to the person responsible for that merchandise, the response I got was "No." I responded, "Do you mean you are sold out, or you do not stock the item?" I wasn't completely surprised when I heard they don't stock it.
I told the person who took my call what I thought of the response and called Border's in Wyomissing. The salesperson asked if I could hold while he verified they have a copy. When he indicated they did indeed have one, I asked if he would hold it for me. It was waiting for me at the checkout line when I arrived just as he said it would be.
I have seen Cabela's stocking an A.T. guide and map set, boxed, in with the other books to the far left of the main doors.
With my travel patterns from the Harrisburg area Duncannon is much more on the way than Lancaster - though I may be strange. I have not had the opportunity to go to Wildernest yet and only go to EMS when someone gives me a gift card.
Also in the Harrisburg area Blue Mountain Outfitters (http://www.bluemountainoutfitters.net/) (in Marysville, next town south of Duncannon on the west side of the river, reachable from the A.T. by the determined using Darlington Trail (http://www.satc-hike.org/darlmap.pdf) and a back road), although they aim at paddlesports, does have filters, fuel, stoves, etc. that cross over from paddling to backpacking. They do have some trail maps for sale but obviously not much turnover since when I stopped there to replace a filter I saw they were a version or two behind current on their trail map rack.
Wise Old Owl
11-11-2010, 08:44
Cabelas, Dicks, Sport Authority are not places that us gear junkies would pick anything up for hiking. The selection is dismal and the employees know nothing. Their wide market appeal is for major sports, hunting, back of car camping. One can occationally snag a item or two but do not confuse the "caves" or box stores catering to hikers needs.
Stick to REI, EMS, local outfitters, and the internet.
Also the Wildware has a big "for lease" sign on it.
Tried stopping there this evening to pick up a couple of things.
The door didn't have any hours listed but could see a blackboard through the door that said stuff like "Welcome to Wildware Backcountry, Thanks for 33 Years, Go Play Outside" but didn't say "closed forever".
However the domain name http://www.wildwarebackcountry.com/ is now in the hands of pirates, and there was a large dumpster parked outside the door filling up most of the parking spots. (No I didn't dive in for any possible "deals"... ;) )
At least when the West Shore store closed, they had a sale... so this seems an especially sad and ignominious (but hardly unexpected) end.
Wise Old Owl
11-11-2010, 22:14
no surprise there.
fiddlehead
11-12-2010, 07:44
I was in Cabelas last week to pick up some fuel for my pocket rocket stove.
I couldn't find it so, asked the woman in the backpacker section where they are as they must have them with the AT being so close.
I said you must get many hikers here looking for them.
She replied: "That doesn't mean we'd have them" which to me meant she was telling me it is not a priority for them to cater to hikers.
Now, fishing rods and guns? They probably have the biggest selection in America!
Cookerhiker
11-12-2010, 07:48
I was in Cabelas last week to pick up some fuel for my pocket rocket stove.
I couldn't find it so, asked the woman in the backpacker section where they are as they must have them with the AT being so close.
I said you must get many hikers here looking for them.
She replied: "That doesn't mean we'd have them" which to me meant she was telling me it is not a priority for them to cater to hikers.
Now, fishing rods and guns? They probably have the biggest selection in America!
no surprise there.
-------------
I heard from someone else that they sent out a blast e-mail to locals saying they were closing that day and to get down there quick for specials, a few weeks ago. Guess I must not have left my e-mail with them.
they = Wildware (is ATTroll taking checks again?)
Wise Old Owl
11-12-2010, 12:45
set up a pay pal account...
bronconite
11-12-2010, 13:20
Those who care may accomplish more by making nice with Cabela's. Maybe it just takes someone who wants the job. They are not going away anytime soon.
I recently called them to ask if they had a copy of Guide to the Appalachian Trail in Pennsylvania. The response I got was "No." I responded, "Do you mean you are sold out, or you do not stock the item?" I wasn't completely surprised when I was told they don't stock it.
I told the person who took my call what I thought of the response and bought a copy at Borders in Wyomissing.
I bought my guide and map set there a few years ago Emerald. I wouldn't doubt that they do have a few and the person you were talking to just didn't want to be bothered to find out what exactly it was you were looking for and then getting you a valid answer. Many of their employees are just your typical big box retail employee.
I was in Cabelas last week to pick up some fuel for my pocket rocket stove.
I couldn't find it so, asked the woman in the backpacker section where they are as they must have them with the AT being so close.
I said you must get many hikers here looking for them.
She replied: "That doesn't mean we'd have them" which to me meant she was telling me it is not a priority for them to cater to hikers.
Now, fishing rods and guns? They probably have the biggest selection in America!
Again, typical big box retail employee mentality. Did you get your fuel? I bought my pocketrocket and my miniworks there. I know they stock the fuel and they usually have the replacement ceramic filter for the miniworks. Cabelas is not worthless, but they are a giant retailer and not a pro shop.
skinewmexico
11-12-2010, 18:43
I've never seen a Cabela's that didn't stock fuel.
Cabela's would like everyone to know they are the world's foremost outfitter and call to the attention of all who will listen their proximity to world famous Appalachian Trail.
Sad but true, though they are less than a mile from it, they are incapable of outfitting a long-distance A.T. hike.
I wonder whether it would be possible to shame them into living up to their potential?
MedicineMan
11-12-2010, 22:46
speaking of the Cabellas near Port Clinton, i stopped there on the way up to Vermont and on the way back--I was looking for wool camo, none the first stop but that had it a couple week later.
Hoop Time
11-19-2010, 16:11
I know there were rumors that Bag O' Tricks was looking at a location in Duncannon to open an outfitters back when I was working on the AT Journeys trail towns piece. I tried to send word to have him let me know if he was doing so in order to include it in the story. Never heard anything, but was later told it apparently had fallen through.
I think the issue, as someone else pointed out, is that throughs who get that far are not enough to keep a business going, especially in off months.
That said, the Harrisburg market would seem ripe for a good outfitters. Esp. if they were versatile and carried paddle and bike stuff as well as hiking. There are three hiking clubs in the area and a very active canoe club, and lots of mountain bikers.
Would seem an ideal spot for an REI since they have a distribution center about 90 minutes west near Bedford.
Update: Wildware is officially "Goalie Planet" now. A hockey outfitter store. I think an outfitter would definately work in harrisburg, but would really have to be marketed well to shine out of the shadow of Bass Pro, Gander Mtn, and nearby Cabela's. Even the Eddie Bauer store here does well. I have some plans for small business ventures in the future (coffee shop to fuel my other addiction) Maybe I'll have to just incorporate some quality gear into my business plan :-?
BAG "o" TRICKS
01-22-2011, 17:34
I know there were rumors that Bag O' Tricks was looking at a location in Duncannon to open an outfitters back when I was working on the AT Journeys trail towns piece. I tried to send word to have him let me know if he was doing so in order to include it in the story. Never heard anything, but was later told it apparently had fallen through.
I think the issue, as someone else pointed out, is that throughs who get that far are not enough to keep a business going, especially in off months.
That said, the Harrisburg market would seem ripe for a good outfitters. Esp. if they were versatile and carried paddle and bike stuff as well as hiking. There are three hiking clubs in the area and a very active canoe club, and lots of mountain bikers.
Would seem an ideal spot for an REI since they have a distribution center about 90 minutes west near Bedford.
Cabela’s stores, similar to Bass Pro and Gander Mountain, are primarily hunting and fishing outfitters. With the limited quantity of quality brand name backpacking gear they carry, hikers won’t spend or make them 'big bucks’ so they don't and probably won’t cater to their specific needs, which in some small way is a bonus for the specialty outfitters. I was looking at opening an outfitter a few years back in Duncannon PA but that’s when the economy started to tank and I thought otherwise. Retail stores are a tough business today as most people will shop and buy on line. Spoke with many friends who own well known outfitters along the ‘AT’ and they all say the same thing, “sure they’ll come into your store to see it first hand or try it on, and then they head right back out the door to shop it and purchase it on line”. That’s just the way it is today, you can order from your cell phone on trail and have it shipped to your next mail drop. In any case the new super WallyWorld open 24 hour is located between PC and Hamburg south on 61 a few hundred yards closer than the Cabela’s on the same side of the road. It should help hikers needing to resupply but look for King’s and Redners food markets to suffer, maybe even end up closing. During the summer months I usually take hikers who need fuel or footwear to Cabela’s, others walk the mile or so or call the store and take the van shuttle from pavilion when it’s available. There was a guy that worked there that had thru hiked the AT and I believe he had some influence on what they carried, don't know if he is still there now. Last I was at Cabela’s they were carrying Cascade Designs products, MSR (tents, filters stoves, fuel) Thermarest, Platypus, Seal Line, along with some freeze dried foods, and various brand head lamps. Last summer I was there and they still had MSR stoves and fuel. Usually they have their brand shirts, pants / shorts and socks (SmartWool’s & Thorlo’s) and in hiking footwear again their brand plus Merrell, New Balance, North Face. I will checkout gear on line but I always end up buying it and supporting the Outfitter's along the trail.
Cabela’s stores, similar to Bass Pro and Gander Mountain, are primarily hunting and fishing outfitters. With the limited quantity of quality brand name backpacking gear they carry, hikers won’t spend or make them 'big bucks’ so they don't and probably won’t cater to their specific needs, which in some small way is a bonus for the specialty outfitters. I was looking at opening an outfitter a few years back in Duncannon PA but that’s when the economy started to tank and I thought otherwise. Retail stores are a tough business today as most people will shop and buy on line. Spoke with many friends who own well known outfitters along the ‘AT’ and they all say the same thing, “sure they’ll come into your store to see it first hand or try it on, and then they head right back out the door to shop it and purchase it on line”. That’s just the way it is today, you can order from your cell phone on trail and have it shipped to your next mail drop. In any case the new super WallyWorld open 24 hour is located between PC and Hamburg south on 61 a few hundred yards closer than the Cabela’s on the same side of the road. It should help hikers needing to resupply but look for King’s and Redners food markets to suffer, maybe even end up closing. During the summer months I usually take hikers who need fuel or footwear to Cabela’s, others walk the mile or so or call the store and take the van shuttle from pavilion when it’s available. There was a guy that worked there that had thru hiked the AT and I believe he had some influence on what they carried, don't know if he is still there now. Last I was at Cabela’s they were carrying Cascade Designs products, MSR (tents, filters stoves, fuel) Thermarest, Platypus, Seal Line, along with some freeze dried foods, and various brand head lamps. Last summer I was there and they still had MSR stoves and fuel. Usually they have their brand shirts, pants / shorts and socks (SmartWool’s & Thorlo’s) and in hiking footwear again their brand plus Merrell, New Balance, North Face. I will checkout gear on line but I always end up buying it and supporting the Outfitter's along the trail.
Bag of Tricks are you a private outfitter? I support my private outfitter her even if it means I wait a little to get it..They try and help the thru hiker..Yeah I have a gander up the road but thats not the guy going out of his way for a thru hiker...
Wise Old Owl
01-22-2011, 19:40
I have to admit this is in a way funny we as a group are assuming they picked the spot in PA close to the trail... I think you are all wearing rose colored glasses. They picked the spot to be central to PA and the land was there for a song. They cater to HUNTERS, they have no IDEA about the trail or care.
IMO and yea I posted that... try and buy a sill nylon anything at Cabelas. NUTS.
I have to admit this is in a way funny we as a group are assuming they picked the spot in PA close to the trail... I think you are all wearing rose colored glasses. They picked the spot to be central to PA and the land was there for a song. They cater to HUNTERS, they have no IDEA about the trail or care.
IMO and yea I posted that... try and buy a sill nylon anything at Cabelas. NUTS.
I say the same thing about Gander hear outside of Roanoake!!! It's about Hunting!!! Big money in repairs and gear...
Jim Adams
01-23-2011, 06:29
I don't understand why you all are so picky. My local Bass Pro Shop special ordered my light weight 7lb 4oz. waders for all of those AT stream crossings....they were so helpful...they were thinking about me ahead of time....I think the sales man's exact words were "he saw me coming".
geek
shelterbuilder
01-23-2011, 10:23
Let's face it, folks - they money is in hunting and fishing, not backpacking. We are an out-numbered and out-spent minority.
Years ago, there was a joke circulating about backpackers (I can't remember who said it) that went something like this: "Backpackers come into this town with a clean pair of underwear and a $5 bill...they stay 2 weeks, and they don't change either one". While it may not be entirely accurate, it does speak to our 2 most endearing qualities -- We're smelly and cheap. How are you going to make a living by catering to us in a "brick-and-mortar" store?
GoonerYank
01-24-2011, 10:15
I have a hard time believing that an REI or an EMS would be unsuccessful in the Harrisburg area. I say that because I assume that's the reason those stores aren't located here. I've taken a few trips down to the REI outside of Baltimore and it has always been crowded. There is usually a decent number of people in the Lancaster EMS.
I keep crossing my fingers and hoping. A brick and mortar store that I could go into without having to drive almost an hour would be so very nice.
Trailryder42
01-24-2011, 13:51
I guess it's just a matter of perspective. I'd love to be THAT close to one. As it is, closest one to me is 7 hours away.
I keep crossing my fingers and hoping. A brick and mortar store that I could go into without having to drive almost an hour would be so very nice.
I have a hard time believing that an REI or an EMS would be unsuccessful in the Harrisburg area. I say that because I assume that's the reason those stores aren't located here. I've taken a few trips down to the REI outside of Baltimore and it has always been crowded. There is usually a decent number of people in the Lancaster EMS.
I keep crossing my fingers and hoping. A brick and mortar store that I could go into without having to drive almost an hour would be so very nice.
That's true, also an EMS is less picky site-wise than an REI so they could go right into an existing vacant strip mall storefront. I just dropped more than $400 at REI in Timonium yesterday on some pretty basic stuff like a new Whisperlite and liner gloves.
Maybe the "Shoppes at Susquehanna Marketplace" http://www.theshoppesatsusquehannamarketplace.com/index.asp?shopping=center.map off the Progress Ave I-81 exit would be a good fit for an EMS, not too far from Duncannon and filled with up-market retail like Williams-Sonoma. (The up-market retail neighbors is to attract those people who buy all those TNF clothes that keep a B&M outfitter in business.)
If Wellsboro can support a good small independent outfitter, and Lancaster in addition to the EMS, I would really think Harrisburg could.
mweinstone
01-24-2011, 16:16
it would be cool if campmore opened a store in duncannon like the one in jersy. that way, poor people in the area could go their for lots of stuff. as its the dollar store of the outfitters and fun as heck.campmores cheap older lines of clothes would be very good for the deppressed region. they would also ruel the barbaque market,bikes, boating and all manner of crap in their catalog.
Jack Tarlin
01-24-2011, 16:22
Trix is right when he says that Duncannon cannot support a full-service independent Outfitter shop.
At present, the mid-Atlantic states (i.e. from Harpers Ferry to Kent CT) pose a problem for most folks as far as outfitters go, unless one has access to a car or can get well off the Trail.
Hikers travelling in either direction need to be aware of this, and should plan accordingly, especially when it comes to things like Aquamira, fuel cannisters, etc.
I hate driving to Baltimore for an REI, but really, I tend to travel a lot as is. When I lived in the State College area, I loved Appalachian Outdoor (a local brick and mortar). They stay alive by selling TNF, and Arc'teryx clothes to students, but the owner is a great guy who will bend over backwards for hikers. (Not all of the staff has the same work ethic though...) When I stopped in after a football game this fall, they were even selling Tyvek and Reflectix by the foot. Now, driving to Baltimore or Harpers Ferry are my choices...
I hate driving to Baltimore for an REI, but really, I tend to travel a lot as is. When I lived in the State College area, I loved Appalachian Outdoor (a local brick and mortar). They stay alive by selling TNF, and Arc'teryx clothes to students, but the owner is a great guy who will bend over backwards for hikers. (Not all of the staff has the same work ethic though...) When I stopped in after a football game this fall, they were even selling Tyvek and Reflectix by the foot. Now, driving to Baltimore or Harpers Ferry are my choices...
I'll second that about Appalachain Outdoor's, absolutely great store and great customer service. I always found it surprising that the EMS that opened in State College a fews years ago barely lasted a year though.
GoonerYank
01-25-2011, 08:36
Maybe the "Shoppes at Susquehanna Marketplace" http://www.theshoppesatsusquehannamarketplace.com/index.asp?shopping=center.map off the Progress Ave I-81 exit would be a good fit for an EMS, not too far from Duncannon and filled with up-market retail like Williams-Sonoma. (The up-market retail neighbors is to attract those people who buy all those TNF clothes that keep a B&M outfitter in business.)
That's certainly an option. I'd only have to take a 5-10 minute trip up Paxtang Avenue to get my shopping done. Maybe if I e-mail EMS they will put a store there. I'm sure they would do that for me.