Newbie looking for advice [Archive] - WhiteBlaze

couscous

11-21-2010, 00:21

"i slept in a hammock this first trip and froze to death."
- Friends don't let friends use hammocks below 40°F without explaining the need for extra insulation underneath.

"what are some tips for hammock camping or should i switch to a tent???"
- It's simpler to stay warm in a tent, but with the right gear a hammock can be comfortable. As mentioned above, http://www.hammockforums.net is a great resource. I'd also suggest some back yard testing so you can learn how much insulation you need above and below at various temperatures to be comfortable.

english

11-21-2010, 00:57

Mtn Scout, I was out on the trail last weekend in my ENO Pronest Hammock, and also froze my ass off in 26F :( Saying that I didn't have my Thermorest under me (1st dumb mistake). The second night we camped at Annopolis Rocks, MD where they do not allow campfires (second dumb mistake). I'm going back out in a few weeks with my Thermorest Ridgerest ($18 & 8oz from REI) & ALPS Razor Sleeping Bag Cover ($36 from REI & 26oz). My L.L. Bean sleeping bag is 20 rated and I think thats pretty accurate. While there are plenty of hammock under quilts available, they come at a very, very high price and weight. Hope this helps

QiWiz

11-21-2010, 09:04

FYI - I have a Jacks R Better Nest underquilt with all the connectors in excellent like-new condition I would be willing to part with. $210 shipped priority mail.

gunner76

11-21-2010, 11:12

Hammock forums is the place to learn about hammocks.

Once the temps drop into the 60's you will need some form of insulation under you. A cheap WallyWorld blue pad ( I use the 25 inch wide waffle pattern) can work into at least the 40's. Weights about 15oz and cost about $10. I also have a thick self inflating air foam matters but as it weights 4+ pounds, I only use it for car camping. Under quilts are very nice but will set you back $200 and up.

There are a variety of other "tricks" to keep warm at night such as using a hot water bottle, wearing extra clothing ect ect.

Pictures are of the two different pads in two of my hammocks (Warbonnet Blackbirds double layer) from a camping trip in the NC mountains last month. the 3rd pic is the wife's hammock with her sleeping bag.

On that camping trip the wife and I had to spend one night in the tent as we could not find a spot to hang our hammocks and it was a very uncomfortable night even sleeping on 2 blue pads

gunner76

11-21-2010, 11:31

Also check Hammock Forums for "group hangs" (where a group of hammock hangers get to geather to show off their gear, swap lies and camp out). These are a great place to see different gear setups and get advice.

bailcor

11-21-2010, 11:35

4 Season Insulation Videos available on Hennessy Hammock

http://hennessyhammock.com/video_setup.html

Spiffy

11-21-2010, 11:42

Shug has a great series of videos on YouTube. I personally think it would be better to experiment with a hammock initially in some warmer weather. But winter hammocking can be done successfully.

Link to Shug's Video: Minus 26º Minnesota Backpack Hammock Quest

http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6751&highlight=Minus

daltontr

11-21-2010, 11:57

Get an under quilt.

+1

An under quilt will make all the difference in the world. Check out Jacks-R-Better (http://www.jacksrbetter.com/).

Mtn Scout

11-21-2010, 21:41

thanks for all the info. I was not planning on it getting that cold that night. we were expecting low 40 temps and i felt i had the right gear, but the temp dropped to about 30 and the wind was blowing like crazy/ so it was nothing like what the weather forecast had said. i did learn to be prepared and not put all the faith in the weather man!!!

rip waverly

11-23-2010, 11:46

i'm new to the hammock too, and the hammockforums.net really taught me a lot about hammocks and backpacking in general

Buffalo Skipper

11-24-2010, 15:38

Get an under quilt.

+2 on the Under Quilt (UQ)

These are popular sources for UQs.
http://www.hammockgear.com/
http://www.jacksrbetter.com/index.htm
http://arrowheadequipment.webs.com/apps/webstore/products/category/270320
http://stores.tttrailgear.com/-strse-Insulation/Categories.bok
http://warbonnetoutdoors.com/quilts.php

You can also convert an old sleeping bag to an UQ. As suggested go to http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/ for a truly amazing wealth of information on hammocking.

rjcress

11-29-2010, 09:31

Love seeing lots of familiar names here from HammockForums.net :)

I'm pretty new to hanging also and trying to figure out how to get the right combination of low cost, low weight, high compressability/small packed dimensions, and high warmth.
Definitely a work in progress... but getting there.

Shug's videos are great, but you'll see how much high dollar gear he uses. Ouch!

Looks to me that the most cost effective way to get to lower temps is to use multiple CCF pads in the hammock, combined with a space blanket.
Multiple layers on top also, with your sleeping bag on you, not wrapped around and under you.
Tarp setup, direction of hang relative to the wind, sit selection (out of the wind), etc. are also crucial.

macdude

11-29-2010, 20:11

I will never sleep on the ground again as long as there are trees around. I use a therm o rest pad year round in my Hennessey and haven't got cold yet.

TinaLouise

12-01-2010, 08:56

I use home made under and top quilts. But my sewing machine is on the fritz and no time to get it fixed so my husband is using in his hammock an Exped 9 down mat along with 2 military poncho liners. One liner I'd sewn channels into (before sewing machine messed up) for him to put under his hammock. He used that during warmer temps. This coming weekend we're expecting temps of 28ish F and he will be useing the poncho liner under his hammock and the down mat inside. I've used the down mat alone in temps down to about 20 but he's leary of trusting it. He can always remove the poncho liner if he gets to hot. He's also using the second poncho liner as and over cover. It will be placed over the hammock's ridgeline and will help keep some heat inside the hammock. (hammock is a Warbonnet Blackbird). This poncho liner will be tied to the hammock so it doesn't slid off during the night. Plus excess liner will be tucked between the outer under poncho liner and the bottom of the hammock for extra protection and warmth. This is probably overkill for the temps we'll be in, but my husband is new to hanging and I'd rather he was toasty warm. This also works for low cost as the poncho liners are cheap and we already had the down mat from our tent camping days.
Pleast note, if you use a blow up type mat in a hammock... two things... a mat with no insulation in it (like the air mats used to float on in the pool) will do nothing for you in a hammock (no insulation is still no insulation!!) and two... don't put as much air inside a blow-up mat as you would normally put in if you were using it on the ground.

TinaLouise

cbr929_sp

12-01-2010, 10:55

Love seeing lots of familiar names here from HammockForums.net :)

+1 some of the same names here, the best advice I can give you is just get out locally and try different set ups. the best way to figure out what you need, because your needs may not be the same as others. If your in the backyard and cant enjoy it then go into the warm house and try again the next nite. hope this helps

gunner76

12-01-2010, 14:12

Love seeing lots of familiar names here from HammockForums.net

This is were I learned about HammockForums.net

Buffalo Skipper

12-03-2010, 16:21

This is were I learned about HammockForums.net

HammockForums.net is where I learned about whiteblaze.net. ;)

scope

12-03-2010, 17:42

HammockForums.net is where I learned about whiteblaze.net. ;)

Whiteblaze is where we first discussed having a separate Hammock forum.

scope

12-03-2010, 18:06

Perhaps a little 101 is in order...

Hammocks require some thinking, but once you do think, it ain't all that complex. Sleeping bags don't insulate when compressed - same principle as on the ground, which is why those going out there and making these mistakes really ought to know better. Tenting has the same basic elements as a house, so I guess the thought processes get taken for granted - and basically not thought about.

On the ground, pads have 2 functions, comfort in terms of softening pressure points where you lay down, and insulation from the cold ground where your weight compresses the sleeping bag. A hammock provides comfort by alleviating pressure points and spreading pressure of your weight along the entire surface of the hammock - that's why those who enjoy camping in a hammock rave about them, because there is such a distinct difference with regard to pressure points between laying in a hammock and laying on the ground.

But you can't go without the insulation. While the ground is cold, too, its temperature remains relative stable, whereas air can fluctuate rapidly. Then you add in the cooling effect of the wind - no matter how light - whisking away your radiating body heat from underneath you, and you can get pretty miserable quick if unprepared in a hammock. Pads work for insulation, but they don't serve to make a hammock more comfortable, and in fact, may make them less comfortable. An UnderQuilt allows insulation to loft underneath you and enjoy the full comfort of the hammock.

If you're like me, you hate sinking more money into an UQ when you already have it sunk in a sleeping bag. But its worth it. Then, you don't need as much insulation on top. In the meantime, a pad will suffice with your sleeping bag zipped all the way open and used like a quilt.

Smile

12-04-2010, 07:15

Don't discount a tent, try one on your next hike then you can decide what works best for you ;)

velcrots

12-23-2010, 13:02

I just did a short cold weather trip in a hennessy hammock. i kept nice and warm with a thermarest mat underneath me, and inside a 20 degree bag (much better than a thermarest blanket).

here's the only problem with a hammock (any make)...you have no living space! it's hard to move around, you can't store much of anything in there, you can't change in there, or cook.
a tent can give you those options. imagine it's cold outside, but raining. sure you could hang out under a tarp to keep dry, but you can't make a fire to keep warm. so you're only option to be comfortable (other than more clothes) is to get in your sleeping bag. that means though you're confined to a hammock, and sleeping position. at least a tent you've got some room for your gear, and to stretch out or sit up, maybe use your stove for a hot drink, as well as cleaning yourself up, or changing.

Ironbelly

12-25-2010, 08:26

Velcrots, maybe your not using your hammock to it's full potential.

Living space: I do not find this an issue, if you really feel the need to spread every item out all over the place then spread it out under your hammock and tarp area. I usually hang my pack off my hammock suspension and have a small 3x3 sheet of painters plastic that I use as a ground gloth to put any items needed if it's really wet or what have you. Of course you could change clothes in the hammock it would just be a little interesting, but why not stand up outside of the hammock and change? I also cook while laying in my hammock all the time, especially breakfast.

Last time I checked you can't make a fire in a tent either...

You can use a hammock as a chair, in fact I think it is the best camp chair ever.

Yes, a tent does make things "easier" just because it's a compeltely enclosed environment. But that doesn't make a hammock user not able to do the same things, they are just done slightly different but the end result is the same by either user.

Tinker

12-25-2010, 23:27

There are options to underquilts. I used to have two hammocks - this one, which I used only in the colder months http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=38616&catid=member&imageuser=2502
and a Hennessy Hammock. I sold the HH because I like the top entry better, and the basic hammock with a bug net gave me more room and better cooling in the summer.
The high fabric sides on the HH block a lot of air flow which is not optimal when the weather is hot.

gunner76

12-26-2010, 10:12

Last time I checked you can't make a fire in a tent either...

Actually you can. I use to have a 4 season tent with a section of the floor that unzipped so you could set up your stove on the ground.

It is not recommended due to the fire hazzard of burning down your tent (with you in it) and the smell of the food would make your tent a target for bears and other critters

My wife and I were on a week long camping trip a couple months back and we ended up spending one night in our tent as there not any places to hang our hammocks. Most unfortable night of the whole trip.

velcrots

12-28-2010, 12:39

Ironbelly,
what cook system are you using in your hammock, a jetboil? that would seem to me the only thing possible. I agree that the end result is the same as far as most things go, but i'd prefer to change inside some walls when the freezing cold wind and rain are whipping around. that's just me though. the reason i want the living space also it more for longer base camps. i just want a system that is versatile enough to cover most conditions, maybe i'd carry both my hammock and a tent...?

Ironbelly

12-28-2010, 22:06

Velcrots, just to clarify, I am not using my stove IN my hammock, just in my hammock area i.e. still under my tarp. It depends on the time of year, but I use both my Bushcooker LT 1 which is a wood-gas or can be used as a alchohol stove, and a MSR XGK EX in winter. I use a snowpeak 700ml mug, and sometimes a gsi kettle with it. I however do use my stoves while I am still in my hammock and the stove is on the ground. "sings Shug's it's breakfast from the hammock time song"

I use a Warbonnet blackbird hammock, and a superfly tarp. Any large tarp, such as a kelty noah 12 for example are perfect for those times when your confined to your shelter area. I have a good 4-5ft between my hammock and the tarp wall so there is quite a large area to have a safe cooking area and not run a high danger of setting my tarp on fire. NOTE: I am very very very very carfeul when using my MSR XGK EX, I usually dig a deep hole in the snow and place the stove down in it to increase the distance even further.

A hammock setup can be plenty versatile, you just have to decide how versatile you want it to be. You can go with a tarp that just barely covers your hammock or you can go with a tarp that gives you 3-5 feet around all edges of your hammock. I always carry a large tarp because I share my shelter space with my siberian husky, and I like to have a nice large sheltered area to sit back and relax in foul weather.

If the weather is really bad you can rig the sides of the tarp in like doors to completely seal off the tarp on both ends. In my case, my superfly has built in doors which are very nice to have at times. Or if the weather is not a wind driven rain/snow you can rig the tarp porch style which I prefer to do whenever able.

Spider

12-31-2010, 11:03

On Sunday I'll be setting out on a 3 day trip, my first winter experience. I'm also using a hammock. I made a makeshift UQ out of two space blankets duct taped together which I'll hang with normal parachord under the hammock. I'll let you know when I get back if it works or not. I'm also using a closed foam pad under my sleeping bag.

Tipi Walter

12-31-2010, 12:09

i slept in a hammock this first trip and froze to death.

Enough said.

hammocks are great for the summer, but i'd switch to a tent if you plan on doing more in the winter...that's just me though...

Good post.

thanks for all the info. I was not planning on it getting that cold that night. we were expecting low 40 temps and i felt i had the right gear, but the temp dropped to about 30 and the wind was blowing like crazy/ so it was nothing like what the weather forecast had said. i did learn to be prepared and not put all the faith in the weather man!!!

Dropped to about 30F? Wait til you're on an open bald and it gets to -10F. Oops, wait a minute, ya can't hammock on an open bald.

Don't discount a tent, try one on your next hike then you can decide what works best for you ;)

Amen.

I just did a short cold weather trip in a hennessy hammock. i kept nice and warm with a thermarest mat underneath me, and inside a 20 degree bag (much better than a thermarest blanket).

here's the only problem with a hammock (any make)...you have no living space! it's hard to move around, you can't store much of anything in there, you can't change in there, or cook.
a tent can give you those options. imagine it's cold outside, but raining. sure you could hang out under a tarp to keep dry, but you can't make a fire to keep warm. so you're only option to be comfortable (other than more clothes) is to get in your sleeping bag. that means though you're confined to a hammock, and sleeping position. at least a tent you've got some room for your gear, and to stretch out or sit up, maybe use your stove for a hot drink, as well as cleaning yourself up, or changing.

I would like to hear from hammockers who have to sit thru a 5 day blizzard and basecamp during a rough winter storm where there's not much option to move. The snow's too deep, the trail is too blocked with leaning brush. "You have no living space . . . . . ."

Northern Lights

12-31-2010, 12:41

JaxHiker

12-31-2010, 21:28

When you are on the trail is it necessary to carry both a tent and a hammock?

Not at all. What'd be the point? So far I've never hiked anywhere I couldn't find a place to hang but I've certainly found places I couldn't put a tent. With a hammock you can stop damned near anywhere and turn it into the "perfect" spot. I haven't carried a tent since I got my hammock.

Has anyone tried making their own underquilt. I quilt so if I could find instructions I might just make my own.I've got a couple of friends that made their own. I've been wanting to make a Kick Ass Quilt (http://www.hammockforums.net/index.php?page=kaq) for a long time now but haven't gotten around to it.

Pro Vagabond

12-31-2010, 21:51

The more I read on these boards about hammocks, the more I want one. I will have to check out the hammock site.

When you are on the trail is it necessary to carry both a tent and a hammock?

Has anyone tried making their own underquilt. I quilt so if I could find instructions I might just make my own.

I made my own underquilt and topquilt. Again, go to hammockforums.com and search the threads. Tons of info and good people, too.

lyodom

12-31-2010, 23:05

Interesting post on Hammock Forum....

http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=26497

JaxHiker

01-01-2011, 00:14

On my last hike all the guys sleeping in tents or in the shelter the first night were bitching about how horrible the night had been. The guys with hammocks were very much the opposite. :)

GvilleDave

01-02-2011, 15:25

When I started hammock camping I used pads for insulation. If you can find it buy evasote pads from Gossamer gear. They sell wide (25" - 30" I think) pads which help to make sure youyr insulatiuon wraps arounfd your shoulders in a hammock. When it's really cold I will double up and use a wide closed cell foam pad like evasote with my thermarest on top of that. That set-up has gotten me Comfortable into the teens no problem. I use my sleeping bag open on top like a quilt w/ just the foot area zipped to make a small foot pocket.

Don't get me wrong, I love my underquilts! But if you are just starting to hammock camp buy your gear in stages to offset the cost and start out using pads, they work just fine.

As for carrying as tent and a hammock - I only carry a hammock and tarp. I sold my tent after not using it for the entire two years since I started hammocking. With the right gear and the right knowledge how to use the gear I am way more comfortable in my hammock that I ever was in my tent days in the same conditions (cold or hot weather). YMMV...

gunner76

01-05-2011, 09:05

Regardless of tent or hammock, be sure to test out your gear at home before heading out.

Most fun the wife and I had was watching a young couple spend an hour trying to set up their brand new tent (still in the box) at the camp site next to us. After watching them for 20 minutes I asked if they needed some help and they said no, another 40 minutes and they got the tent set up.

I won't even go into their attemp to make a fire