Another Kings Ravine Mount Adams Accident

[imscotty]

I am always surprised at the hikers who post on here planning for nice spring hikes in the Whites Mountains in April. If you are not freezing cold and knee deep in snow at that time of year then you will probably be wet and knee deep in mud instead. Either way, unless you like that sort of thing, it is best to wait a bit for warmer dryer weather.

Here is a news story that will give you an idea of current conditions in the ravines...

http://www.wmur.com/news/man-survive...-snow/25402494

[Slo-go'en]

Sounds like he was sking on the snow fields on Mt Adams. If you can't stop at the edge of the ravine, that is quite a tumble to take, about 1500 feet of near vertical bouncing. It's a miracle he survived that fall at all, with all the boulders and spruce trees at the bottom. Probably the only thing which saved him was the fact there is so much snow at the bottom of the ravine.

[RedBeerd]

He seemed prepared and experienced but it goes to show you things can happen, experienced or not. Can't imagine tumbling down that ravine..

[jeffmeh]

Yikes. It ended about as well as it could though, given the circumstances.

[FarmerChef]

Wow. Amazing that he survived the fall and almost equally amazing that he crawled back out to his car. Not that that was the right thing to do or not but an impressive feat nonetheless.

Now for some fun math. I cite as my source for my calculations the all-knowing Wikipedia. Always factually correct. I know. I read it on the internet.

Terminal velocity of a sky diver = 122mph
That's .034 miles per second for all you math aficionados (I'm not one, I just play one on the internet)

Our victim states (according to the crack reporting customary to many a news story these days) that he fell about 600-700 feet total including a period of about 10 seconds in the air. Let's have some fun nit picking. Shall we?

At .034 mps for a total of 10 seconds, our sunny adventurer would have fallen approximately .34 of a mile during that one period alone. As we know, a mile is 5,280 feet. Thusly, he would have fallen about 1790 feet. Ok, we could subtract some for acceleration at the beginning of the 10 seconds but still....

Oh and the article also states that he fell when an ice shelf (cornice?) gave way but the victim states that his binding released. One or the other or both? Confused.

In all seriousness, really glad this turned out well and what a story to tell the grandkids some day. Sounds like he roughly knew what he was doing and had an unfortunate accident. And I can definitely see how people assume that the weather they have in the valleys must be typical of the mountains too. Course, we see that all up and down the trail and in the mountains, down south too.

And I really wish I could get my oldest child to solve a fun math problem like that, even if the answer is really just a swag. Ohhhh, I think I just found me a good brain teaser for on the trail...

[imscotty]

I think when you are flying through the air down Kings Ravine even one second would seem like ten

[rafe]

I've skied Tuckermans, from about halfway up, on a good year, and that was scary enough. I didn't have the nerve to start from from further up.

What I noticed from my watching the more ballsy skiers that day was that there was no recovery from any kind of fall. Once you're down, you basically slide to the bottom of the bowl. I watched several skiers fall and try to halt their slides, and none succeeded. A few times I watched other skiers try to stop them, and they went down as well.

Snow conditions were unlike anything I'd seen anywhere, before or since. The snow was in a state of perpetual avalanche. Which is to say... you could actually hear and observe the topmost layer of snow (corn, really) drifting down the slope. It was a continuous, ongoing thing.

[Old Hillwalker]

http://www.friendsoftuckermanravine.org/inferno

The 2014 Tuckermans Inferno Race in Tuckermans Ravine is this coming weekend. (April 12) It's a bit tame since the days of the 30s and 40s when Toni Matt, a Swiss on April 16th 1939 schussed, non-stop from the summit of Washington all the way down to the bottom.

Check out entry #3 at http://www.skiernet.com/legendary-runs.html (Description of Toni Matt's breakneck run)

[contrast009]

I think it is likely that his perception of time was a little altered based off of the fact that he was falling. I ran the math assuming he wasn't moving at the time he started falling (more or less correct because he said he was trying to stop sliding when his binding released.) If he had been in free fall, using the 122 mi/hr figure for free fall, he would have fallen 1,290 feet. Now, I then worked the problem backwards, using the rough figure of the 700 feet he said he fell. it would take 5.5 seconds to accelerate to free fall, at which point he would have traveled 487 feet, and then a further 1.1 seconds to travel the remaining 213 feet at terminal velocity. That gives a total of 6.6 seconds in free fall for a 700 foot free fall. That sounds a little more reasonable. This doesn't take into account any prior velocity he may have had or anything he may have hit or time he spent sliding. this assumes that he simply fell off of a 700 foot cliff.

Source: Am an Engineer (in training)

ANYWAY... He is very lucky to have survived the fall and the crawl out. I think he sounded like he knew what he was doing for the most part. He did right to tell someone where he was and when to expect him back. IMHO he really should have had at least another person or two with him for just the case that he got in trouble which happened. But of course it is easy for us armchair analysts to judge, so we should take a grain of salt with our judgement.

[contrast009]

Also, FarmerChef, your numbers were good. I got the 1,290 foot figure by taking into account his initial acceleration

[Pedaling Fool]

Time Dilation http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...ain-stops-time

Excerpt:

"Does the experience of slow motion really happen," Eagleman says, "or does it only seem to have happened in retrospect?"

To find out, he first needed a way to generate fear of sufficient intensity in his experimental subjects. Instead of skydiving, he found a thrill ride near the university campus called Suspended Catch Air Device, an open-air tower from which participants are dropped, upside down, into a net 150 feet below. There are no harnesses, no safety lines. Subject plummet in free fall for three seconds, then hit the net at 70 miles per hour.

Was it scary enough to generate a sense of time dilation? To see, Eagleman asked subjects who'd already taken the plunge to estimate how long it took them to fall, using a stopwatch to tick off what they felt to be an equivalent amount of time. Then he asked them to watch someone else fall and then estimate the elapsed time for their plunge in the same way. On average, participants felt that their own experience had taken 36 percent longer. Time dilation was in effect."

[Slo-go'en]

For those of you unfamiler with King Ravine, this is what it looked like this afternoon from the valley. The place he was likely sking is to the right of center, below the summit of Mt Adams. SAM_0807.jpg

[Sarcasm the elf]

This is the second thread in a week where people are unnecessarily debating mathematical calculations. If you keep this up you are going to scare off all the hikers.


Glad the guy made it back alive, I'm not sure I could have dragged myself that far in the condition he was in.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Let me clarify all these calculations and give a more precise accounting of events: he fall down, go boom, ouch

[myakka_]

Let me clarify all these calculations and give a more precise accounting of events: he fall down, go boom, ouch

Ummm I think you missed a few "boom ouches" followed by a "oh mommy mommy, oh oh mommy" as he dragged himself to the road. But otherwise a very astute accounting of the incident.

[Meriadoc]

For those who enjoy math and hiking:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=1&theater

Glad he survived! Amazing fortitude and persistence.

[MDSection12]

He sounds like he was prepared for that possibility, and he was obviously prepared to do what was necessary to get out. I'm glad he's OK and kudos to him for an amazing self-rescue.

Wow. Amazing that he survived the fall and almost equally amazing that he crawled back out to his car. Not that that was the right thing to do or not but an impressive feat nonetheless.

Now for some fun math. I cite as my source for my calculations the all-knowing Wikipedia. Always factually correct. I know. I read it on the internet.

Terminal velocity of a sky diver = 122mph
That's .034 miles per second for all you math aficionados (I'm not one, I just play one on the internet)

Our victim states (according to the crack reporting customary to many a news story these days) that he fell about 600-700 feet total including a period of about 10 seconds in the air. Let's have some fun nit picking. Shall we?

At .034 mps for a total of 10 seconds, our sunny adventurer would have fallen approximately .34 of a mile during that one period alone. As we know, a mile is 5,280 feet. Thusly, he would have fallen about 1790 feet. Ok, we could subtract some for acceleration at the beginning of the 10 seconds but still....

Oh and the article also states that he fell when an ice shelf (cornice?) gave way but the victim states that his binding released. One or the other or both? Confused.

In all seriousness, really glad this turned out well and what a story to tell the grandkids some day. Sounds like he roughly knew what he was doing and had an unfortunate accident. And I can definitely see how people assume that the weather they have in the valleys must be typical of the mountains too. Course, we see that all up and down the trail and in the mountains, down south too.

And I really wish I could get my oldest child to solve a fun math problem like that, even if the answer is really just a swag. Ohhhh, I think I just found me a good brain teaser for on the trail...

Just for fun: I took him to mean that he went airborne at one point for what he perceived to be ten seconds. I'll agree that his perception of his time airborne is almost certainly off, but I think his story is plausible once you account for a little embellishment there. I also assumed he attempted to cut his edge in as a reaction to the slab giving way, but was unsuccessful as a result of the binding releasing... The article is unclear at best, but I don't think it's as far off as you make it seem.

Also, I've been airborne for at least a minute and a half on a snowboard.

[MDSection12]

Forgot a smiley in there FC, to be clear.

[Matthikes]

Wow. Amazing that he came out as well as he did.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

[Gray Bear]

I was on the other end of the Presidentials on the summit of Pierce about the same time this happened. It was a gorgeous day. I'm glad this guy is ok and was prepared. I think a lot of people would have dialed 911 and requested SAR to carry them out. He mentioned he banged his knee up and hand to crawl. I do most of my trips solo so the wife and I have an agreement that I never leave on a trip without leaving a map of my route, an estimated time out of the woods and the “if you don’t hear from me by X:XX call Fish and Game” time. The difference between the two times depends on the time of year and weather forecast. I’m thinking about a Spot or Delorn type rig.>>