Shopping list for nobo starting March 1st, please help

[raphaelmatto]

I've been poking at this shopping list for a few months & would love some advice on brands/system strategy before committing (I've purchased other items already, Notch tent, Circuit pack etc).


Thanks!


// SLEEPING BAG


zpacks 20*
http://www.zpacks.com/quilts/sleepingbag.shtml


hammockgear burrow 20 (used with neoair xlite)
http://www.hammockgear.com/burrow-20/


// DOWN JACKET


Montbell ex light down jacket
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?p_id=2301344


Feathered friends Daybreak Jacket
http://featheredfriends.com/daybreak-down-jacket.html


// SLEEPING SOCKS


Goosefeetgear down socks
https://goosefeetgear.com/products/1-down-socks


Westernmountaineering flash down booties
http://www.westernmountaineering.com...ts&cat=Booties


// LONG SLEEVE SHIRT


Icebreaker tech-t crew
http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens-top...&cts=001%7C002


smartwool nts micro crew
http://www.smartwool.com/clothing/sh...tern-crew.html


some kind of sleeve to add to my short sleeve tshirt
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003DONJG2/ref=cm_sw_su_dp


// SHORT SLEEVE TSHIRT


Icebreaker tech-t-lite
http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens/tec...&cts=301%7C401


Arcteryx citron velox crew
http://www.arcteryxonline.net/Arcter...Crew_p774.html


// FLEECE (haven't researched much)


mountainhardwear monkey man 200
http://www.mountainhardwear.com/mens...ationColor=205


icebreaker sierra plus
http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens-jac...or=201&cts=201


north face glacier
http://www.thenorthface.com/catalog/...r-1_4-zip.html


// RAIN PANTS (haven't researched much)


golite turnalo storm (just the pants)
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-...l#.VFbrdPTF_C4


montbell dynamo wind pants
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?p_id=2305123


froggtoggs bull frogg pant
http://www.froggtoggs.com/mens/mens-...rogg-pant.html


// RAIN MITS


mld event rain mits
http://www.mountainlaureldesigns.com...products_id=51


black rock gear WPB Cuben Fiber Rain Mitts
http://www.blackrockgear.com/overmitts.html


// WARM MITS


Black rock gear Expedition Liner Mitt
http://www.blackrockgear.com/linermitts.html


// UNDERWEAR


none


exofficio (which ones??)
http://www.exofficio.com/products/mens/underwear


// SHORTS (haven't researched much)


smartwool phd run short
http://www.smartwool.com/clothing/bo...run-short.html


// SUN HAT (haven't researched much)


the north face horizon breeze brimmer
http://www.thenorthface.com/catalog/...mer-hat_4.html


// SOCK LINERS


injinji sock liners
http://www.injinji.com/shop/liner.html


// GLOVE LINERS


mountain hardware butter liners
http://www.amazon.com/Mountain-Hardw.../dp/B000UYUHS6


// MOSQUITO HEAD NET


moskytiera sts headnet permethrin
http://www.alpsport.cz/Product/cs-CZ...net-permethrin


// WARM HAT


black rock gear hadrons


http://www.blackrockgear.com/hadrons.html


// PILLOW


montbell u.l. comfort system pillow
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?p_id=1124290


// UTILITY KNIFE


???


// TIGHTS/LONG JOHNS (to wear under rain pants or shorts in the cold)


???

[raphaelmatto]

Ah, just found the super light knife thread:

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...per-Lite-Knife

... so I can probably sort out what to get from that.

[Connie]

I like 1/4 and prefer 1/2 zip neck layers for ventilation, instead of a crew neck.
http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens-bas...ip/100491.html

I like BugBaffler bug head net, because it has elastic straps that go under the arms.
http://bugbaffler.com/products/headn...FcZbfgod2BsAKg

Sea to Summit Travel Pillow
http://www.seatosummit.com/product/?...=0&o2=0&o3=201

NeoAir Xlite or XTherm
http://www.cascadedesigns.com/therm-...-xlite/product

Mont Bell South Rim Shorts
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?p_id=2305319

[fastfoxengineering]

I would also get a 3oz windshirt. Its something youll use almost everyday if you have it. Very versatile.

[fastfoxengineering]

And if your going synthetic. Patagonia capilene is hard to beat for thermals. Cap 4 hoody is very versatile... That and a windshirt. Great combo

[raphaelmatto]

Thanks, Connie for the tip on the 1/2 zip, that looks like a better long sleeve shirt option. The bug net w/straps looks way better, thanks! I've got a small xlite but I've been sleeping on it this past week & decided it's too short even for me (I'm 5'5"), my lower legs/feet hanging off puts a little pressure on my spine, so now I'm trying to decide between the next size up xtherm or xlite (I'm thinking I'll go with the xtherm if I get the burrow 20 since there'll be no down under me, and the xlite if I get the zpacks 20). I saw in another thread that you recommend getting cascade design clips to attach the burrow to an xtherm & that sounds like a great solution to me -- I see they're made to clip onto thermarest blankets, how does that work with the burrow? Did you sew on loops? Thanks also for the mont bell shorts link! So I guess what I'm looking for with shorts is a longer lightweight synthetic?


Thanks, fastfoxengineering -- I've got a marmot mica shell to serve as my windshirt. I'm sort of sold on merinowool for a thermal base layer, but the R1 fleece that's part of that same system looks nice:


http://www.patagonia.com/us/product/...?p=40108-0-CNY

[mattjv89]

Well you know what it takes to keep yourself warm better than I do, but this is striking me as a little light on insulation for a March 1st start. As far as the down jackets both are pretty light pieces with 2.2 oz fill on the ex light and 3.1 on the daybreak, both layers that would be roughly equal to another fleece. Don't get too hung up on the light weight of those pieces, within reason there is no way around the fact that if you want to stay warm in winter it's going to weigh you down a bit more. Any piece that's under a half pound total weight (the ex light) is not a lot of jacket any way it's done. The Montbell Alpine Light seems to be a popular choice, or the Montbell Mirage if you can stomach the price tag and don't mind the paper thin construction. There are many more, those are just two that come to mind.

I'd say something similar about the sleeping bag, if you're OK wearing most or all of your clothing layers to bed sometimes it would probably be fine but from everything I've heard about the early march weather a 20 degree bag by itself isn't going to cut it some of the time.

You mentioned not researching the fleece much yet, personally I find a lot more versatility in layering two lightweight pieces than a single heavy one like what you've linked to. My standard winter insulation for while I'm moving is a long sleeve baselayer similar to Capilene 4 which keeps me warm down to low 30s. Colder than that I add on a 100 weight fleece. I find that a lot more adaptable to changing conditions than one heavy layer.

[Connie]

The loops were provided. I didn't need the snaps, for the width of the standard. If you could work out the width you need to turn during the night, you could order standard or wide. I use the elastic cord I had. ZPacks has elastic cord for sale. I have the sewn footbox. I use the shortest NeoAir, either Xlite or XTherm. I have the XTherm. I put my lower legs on my backpack, inside the bivy, helping keep things inside the backpack overnight reasonably warm as well as providing insulation for my lower legs. If I needed more, I would have down leggings and down booties for sleepwear and for camp. I have my NeoAir Xlite or XTherm less inflated, only just enough so my hip doesn't hit the floor when I turn to my side. That way, my legs are not "hanging off the edge". Also, I do not have to warm up more air in a more thick NeoAir. The XTherm is warm! I may need the XLite for warmer weather.

I think the MontBell Mirage is more for slow going high altitude with an anorak.

I like the MontBell Alpine Light. Ask others.

My experience is Montana, the North Cascades and the Olympic Mountains in Washington State and mountains in Colorado. I have also been on the Oregon coast, and, in Iceland. I know I am either active, in camp, or, inside my sleeping system.

I have selected a down vest, sleeves and hood and a big "wind shirt".

If that works out for me, I will report it at White Blaze.

I am still waiting to get the order right. It isn't what was on the website, when I placed my order.

I purchase down, only if I can be active or remove it and remain warm enough because the layer system is working for me. If I can do that and use it to be warm in camp, that works for me. The type of down jacket that works for me is called a Belay Jacket. It is more versatile. That is the jacket, I choose.

[raphaelmatto]

Thanks mattjv, this is exactly the kind of advice I need b/c I'm not sure how to layer for hiking in 20ish* conditions. I usually section hike later in the year, but I move slowly due to a bad knee which is why for the thru I set the early-for-me March 1st start -- lots of time to finish bf Oct 15th. I'll look for a heavier down jacket (thanks for the montbell links!), and a 100-weight fleece. Interesting that you and ffe both recommend the capilene 4 instead of a long sleeve merino wool shirt, is it really better? Yes, I'm planning on wearing the jacket etc in the bag.


Thanks Connie for that info on the snaps! & awesome advice re the xlite w/less air in it & feet on backpack -- I'll try that tonight. It would be nice if I could stick w/the small & not have to re-purchase. Thanks also for the +1 vote for the Alpine Lite!


I really appreciate help w/this stuff -- it's where I have the least experience.

[Connie]

I think you have to find out for yourself about the first layer after underwear.

People are different.

I never feel warm in any weight caprilene or synthetic first layer. However, after a 150 merino first layer, fluffier-polpropylene traps air nicely. I don't perspire in it. I like it. Next, down. But not too much down.

Tipi Walter has two of the heavier-weight merino, he likes. Maybe he will show up, in the thread.

[fastfoxengineering]

merino t-shirt
cap 4 hoody
ul down jacket/hoody
wind jacket
rain jacket

I, as well as, many others prefer a merino t-shirt then synthetic/fleece as a midlayer.

But the combo I just listed will do alot for you. But everyone's different. And it might not be warm enough if your starting March 1st. It'll be cold WHEN hiking. Add a synthetic insulated vest because its something you can wear WHILE hiking. The vest will keep your core warm and it's easy to vent while hiking. Then you can add this vest as another insulating layer in camp until its warm enough to send home.

Clothing is probably one of the most "personal" decisions on the trail.. Some people hike in running shorts when there's a blizzard in the smokies.

[gbolt]

I did a lot of research on Headnets. I endorse Petter Vacco Headnets everychance I get. http://www.petersheadnets.com/index.html
He makes them himself and sometimes falls behind do to lots of orders. However, well worth the wait.
I made a very crude youtube vid when mine arrived in the mail. Here is the link:


Your list looks good and now becomes a personal choice as too which item(s) you finally decide on.
Enjoy the process!

[Connie]

I was interested in his head bug net. I went to his website. If I read correctly, t indicates he hasn't been doing head bug nets since July, 2014.

[raphaelmatto]

Thanks for the link gbolt. Yeah, I checked out the website too -- I like supporting small business folk. Worth sending him a note, seems like the kind of website that might get out of date with reality.

Thanks again Connie & FFE, here's what I've settled on based on your recs:

150 weight icebreaker tech t merino tshirt
http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens-tsh...&cts=004%7C403

Pategonia capilene 4 1/4 zip hoodie
http://www.backcountry.com/patagonia...ooded-top-mens

montbell alpine light down jacket
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?p_id=2301176

mica shell (already own -- can't this be both my rain jacket and wind jacket?)

... & I'll also look into a vest after trying these pieces together, maybe this one:

http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens-jac...or=001&cts=001

Any recs on leggings? I was thinking these to wear under shorts/rain pants:

http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens-bas...01%7CG80%7C401

I've got a pair of pategonia capiline 3 leggings that are pretty warm but sometimes itchy.

[Connie]

I found the "silkweights" brand.

There is mid-weight, etc. Their products use a soft and not-too drying fabric "just right". No doubt, discontinued, because this particular fabric is not available from the mills.

It doesn't seem to wear out, and, there is no odor.

I suppose it would be possible to get odor, but why?

The "discontinued" link has more selections.

Maybe you can find your size?

https://www.peckhamperformancewear.com

I don't know about that vest. I think the synthetic insulated "puffy" vest is what was indicated. I like a down vest. If I can find a synthetic vest, it is great because you can hike, strenuously, in it. It keeps you dry. Maybe this one?

Thermawrap Sport Vest http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?p_id=2301171

[mattjv89]

Interesting that you and ffe both recommend the capilene 4 instead of a long sleeve merino wool shirt, is it really better? Yes, I'm planning on wearing the jacket etc in the bag.

I don't mean to suggest that it's better, just what I use currently. I'm only using that because I already have it and I'm done spending money on more equipment for a while. I like the reduced stink of wool and the comfort after wearing it a few times, if price was no object I'd probably be wearing more of it.

[Connie]

Here:
http://www.ultralightbackpackingonli...roducts1b.html
http://www.ultralightbackpackingonli...roducts1c.html
http://www.ultralightbackpackingonli...roducts1d.html

I haven't updated it all.

I gave you these links to show a great deal of choices are available, just "to be mean".

We do things here. In Scotland, differently.

Would it work, here? If I had money for different gear, I would "find out".

I think you have been making good choices. Keep it up. Let others speak up, before you spend.

[raphaelmatto]

Thanks Mattjv for clarifying, okay I might try to swap out the cap 4 for a icebreaker Oasis Half Zip Hood:

http://us.icebreaker.com/en/mens-bas...&cts=001%7C002

... I like to sound of a less stinky shirt a lot. I have the money now so I figure I should just pony up for wool if each item is researched properly.


Haha, thanks Connie, those links are super helpful. & yes, mean -- I'm pedantic & will read through all of this.


In the meantime I read the icebreaker & montbell return policy (30 days for Montbell, 365 for icebreaker & they even pay for return shipping) & have ordered most of what was mentioned so far to try it all out / check sizes etc (except for the cap 4).


Also picked up a Gerber LST knife based on info in the light knife thread.

[gbolt]

I was interested in his head bug net. I went to his website. If I read correctly, t indicates he hasn't been doing head bug nets since July, 2014.

Sorry, you are correct. He stopped accepting new orders as of July 3, 2014. However, I ordered mine in early March last year. It may be worth contacting him after the holiday season. He does these on the side and in addition to other work; so it does seem to follow a pattern. Good Luck. The Headnet is awesom, and Sea to Summit is a good backup if he has stopped production all together.

[raphaelmatto]

Fyi for anyone finding this thread, I contacted Peter just before Christmas, he was super friendly and got a net out to me a few days ago, it arrived today and is much nicer than the bug baffler. Not sure if this means he's officially taking orders again, but it's worth a shot to email him.


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