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  1. #21
    First Sergeant SGT Rock's Avatar
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    Hi Walter. I was out clearing some of that trail a couple of weeks ago and thought I might run into you somewhere. Me and Skeeter got most of the blow downs that were obsitcals between Yellowhammer and Nichols Cove cleared. We still have some work to do. I plan to take over Big Fat Gap to Yellowhammer Gap as my section.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tipi Walter View Post
    So, is the Yellowhammer Gap trail down to Tapoco Lodge called the Yellowhammer Trail? I wondered as there's a sign in the gap reading "Belding Trail".
    I don't know what it's official designation will be. For now I just call it the Tapoco Lodge Trail. The new manager is the son of the new owner and has been a professional trail maintainer in the GSMNP. They plan to do all the maintenance from Yellowhammer Gap down to the Lodge. He is a cool guy, you would like him.

    The Belding Trail intersection is still there and I haven't hiked it yet. But it doesn't follow the new trail at all.
    It's a great reroute as the Bob is nice and "Four Mile Ridge" is nice between the Bob and the Hangover and Hangover Lead South is rugged and Windy Gap #400 is one of my faves (even has a spring head not far from Big Fat Gap right off the trail to the right) and Windy Gap itself is a good place to rest and Nichols Cove down to the gravesite is good. Yellowhammer Trail always seems to need work but it's pretty and ZAP you're in Yellowhammer Gap.
    I totally agree. That ridge isn't "bald", but it is open for good views and is nice hiking. I think it is some of the best hiking in the wilderness area. Rick Harris plans to lead a hike in that section around the 21st of March, you might want to go with him. I would love to but I have to work that weekend.

    I've got that campsite at about 0.3 from Big Fat Gap. Look at the file I attached and you should see it at about 173.2.

    Like I said above, I've cleared most of Yellowhammer Gap Trail with my son. There were a couple that were too much for the tools we had, but we plan to get back out when the weather permits. This weekend was on the schedule but the weather has prevented us from getting up there.

    The only problem I see with the Gap re-route to Tapoco Lodge is having permission denied from the lodge owners if they ever change their minds. It's possible. But then it's a simple alternate to Ike Branch down to the Lake etc etc.
    I agree it is possible they could. However we spent hours with them last month and they are building trail on their own property. They are great people that love hikers, and I think only hikers acting like asses could ruin it. Hopefully we get a good class of hikers that do not act "entitled" that hike through there and keep up the good will.

    With this reroute backpackers won't get to camp at "Barrel Gap" off 149 north of Cold Spring Gap or Snow Camp by Cherry Log Gap or Crowder Camp or get to see the pretty Stiffknee Trail.
    Those are trade offs. Rick Harris has recommended going down to that campsite you showed us off Cold Spring Gap and then back up to Bob via some road in the area. I don't know that route and a small reroute in the area is still possible there.


    I for the life of me can't understand why people coming down to Slickrock Creek would ever call the rescue squad in high water when all they have to do is wait 3 or 4 days for the creek to go down. Are we in such a hurry to panic in the first hour and in such a rush to cross? Just mellow out and wait for the water to lower. It's called a wilderness for a reason.
    Personally I think the occurrence of this happening is greatly exaggerated. I've only heard of one issue in all the years I've been publishing the guide. And they didn't call rescue, they just hiked back up to Farr Gap and got a ride into Tellico Plains.

    But no, this reroute will get the BMTA boys in (along with the Crosscut Mountain Boys and possibly SAWS) to keep these favored trails open, esp Hangover Lead South and Yellowhammer.
    I agree
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  2. #22
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    Now the BMT leaves Cold Sp Gap and goes up 54A to a Tee intersection by a trailpost and a rock. To the left is 54A heading north down to Cherry Log Gap and straight ahead is the half mile trail to Bob Bald. I have divided 54A into north and south. 54A south is from Cold Gap to the Tee, 54A north is down to Cherry Log Gap (and the big campsite I call Snow Camp).


    yeah...

    ive done all the trails using various routes and destinations........

  3. #23
    First Sergeant SGT Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AO2134 View Post
    Please, for the love of god, do not take what I said above as a criticism of the trail. I didn't mean it like that at all! I did a 20 mile section NOBO and SOBO over Christmas break from Wilscot Gap to Hwy 76 and back. I was alone and I loved how alone I felt. That being said, if I was lost and and I was that alone, I would not have enjoyed it as much to say the least. I simply don't have the skills to get "unlost" should the worst happen.
    I don't. The BMT is different from the AT, and that is part of its personality and charm. However I am working to make navigation easier whenever I get the chance. I feel that the BMT will become more important in the near future as AT hikers that are wishing to escape the crowds the AT is drawing will at least consider it as an alternate to the first ~250 miles of the AT.

    I understand that there are regulations on certain parts of the trail which prevent blazing. I get it. I just got accustomed of seeing my good friend, the blaze every so often. I couldn't imagine going miles hoping I was on the trail without seeing a blaze for long stretches. That would leave me very uneasy.

    In my experience with hiking so far (250 miles of the AT, 50ish miles on the Bartram Trail, 90ish miles on foothills trail and side trails, 50 ish miles on BMT in Ga, and several others), I never felt like I could get lost. (i.e., the trail was so well maintained and easy to follow that even someone like me couldn't get lost). I never felt the need to bring a map. It was "idiot proof."

    However, when I hear experienced hikers like yourself talk about difficult sections to navigate on the BMT, I think it may be a little more than I could chew. But then again, I thought the same about the AT 6 months ago. Now, I am fairly certain I could hike the AT blind folded.

    I hope the same for the BMT. That is sounds intimidating at first and it is intimidating until you get the feel for it.

    I am confident in my ability to get to Thunder Rock Campground. After that, I will be far more careful on my planning and scouting the area before the hike. No spur of the moment, no preparation, throw everything in the pack and go hike like I do often on the AT.

    I have a great respect for the BMT. I anticipate I will finish section hiking the BMT NOBO and SOBO long before I section hike the AT.
    I think if you keep on plodding along the BMT like you plan, if you ever thru-hike the AT you will find navigating the AT a piece of cake.
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  4. #24
    First Sergeant SGT Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10-K View Post
    I used the Guthook app on my PCT thru hike last summer. I only looked at paper maps in the evening when I was reviewing the next day's route to get an overview. Other than that, 100% of my navigation was via smartphone.

    I'll be using the CDT version this summer - it would be awesome if you could get a Guthook-BMT app.
    Thanks for the feedback. I think it is a no-brainer to make this app happen. However to get the BMTA to agree to officially be part of the project is the hurdle to cross. I could make it happen in less than a month if it were just me doing it, but I want it to be something the BMTA endorses and sees some income from. Guthook and I talked and I believe this app will eventually happen with or without the BMTA. Stay tuned...
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  5. #25

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    Sgt Rock Quote---
    "Those are trade offs. Rick Harris has recommended going down to that campsite you showed us off Cold Spring Gap and then back up to Bob via some road in the area. I don't know that route and a small reroute in the area is still possible there."

    Some of us call that area The Wedge because on the map it looks like a wedge falling south from Bob Bald down to our campsite, Swan Cabin and Wolf Laurel, all hemmed in by the "wedge " bowl between Cold Spring Gap and Horse Cove Ridge (Stratton Ridge trail).

    Where we camped that windy day below Cold Sp Gap (the wedge) has a trail which continues downward over Bob Creek (where we got our water) and continues down an old logging road to a Tee at another logging road running left and right. (There's a Bob Creek water culvert here). If Rick Harris takes his boys down and follows this trail, he can turn left at the Tee and this "tractor road" will take you all the way back up into the middle of Bob Bald.

    But really, there's no need for a reroute into the wedge (you just lose 800 feet of elevation from Cold Sp Gap to the tractor road and have to regain it again climbing to the Bob). The 54A climb to the Bob is perfectly nice and the Wedge just offers a safety-valve spot to camp in case Cold Gap is hellish, which it is on frequent occasions as you know.

    My backpacking buddy Hootyhoo tells me the Graham country forest honchos logged out this tractor road and the wedge recently and left "a thousand stumps" according to him. I haven't seen it yet and I don't want to see it.

  6. #26

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    Another Sgt Rock Quote---
    Like I said above, I've cleared most of Yellowhammer Gap Trail with my son. There were a couple that were too much for the tools we had, but we plan to get back out when the weather permits. This weekend was on the schedule but the weather has prevented us from getting up there.

    Just a footnote to your quote---I remember one part of the Yellowhammer trail which is terrible going either direction. It's at a small creek crossing not too far from the Dotson graves where the trail hits a muddy vertical chute with terrible footing needing some extensive steps or a short reroute detour. You may remember it.

  7. #27
    First Sergeant SGT Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tipi Walter View Post
    Another Sgt Rock Quote---
    Like I said above, I've cleared most of Yellowhammer Gap Trail with my son. There were a couple that were too much for the tools we had, but we plan to get back out when the weather permits. This weekend was on the schedule but the weather has prevented us from getting up there.

    Just a footnote to your quote---I remember one part of the Yellowhammer trail which is terrible going either direction. It's at a small creek crossing not too far from the Dotson graves where the trail hits a muddy vertical chute with terrible footing needing some extensive steps or a short reroute detour. You may remember it.
    I remember it well. There was a holly tree that had a limb hanging down marking part of the trail which we cleared. The other side is a nasty hand an knee climb when wet that could use a set of steps installed. Next trip I would like to start making that happen if possible.
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  8. #28

  9. #29

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    Thanks for all the hard work and the success in putting in a relo around a tough crossing in rainy weather! Event though I hung out in Green Cove some and gave it a few days to come down, it was still about 2 and a half feet deep. But in drier weather it could be fun. On the other hand, my road walk down the dragon's tail wasn't bad, as only a one or two cars ventured out into the pouring rain that morning.

    So much of what you experience on every trail just depends on the weather and having alternatives helps.

    Let's hope the lodge has sufficient visitors it sounds like a great place.

  10. #30

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    There are plenty of smart phone apps for hiking. I use Locus on Android phones. It does a lot of stuff that most don't need, but it does everything that I need/want. My .gpx file works just fine on it. My now out-dated map/gpx is at: lifeat2mph.com/bmt


    this is a practice edit... if it sticks then I will wonder why I am just a guest
    Last edited by gubbool; 03-01-2015 at 23:52.
    "To be nobody but yourself - in a world which is doing its best, night and day, to make you like everybody else - means to fight the hardest battle which any human being can fight; and never stop fighting."

  11. #31
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    I am so impressed with everyone involved. Thank you for making this happen! The BMT is marvelous. I can't wait to hike this new section.

  12. #32
    First Sergeant SGT Rock's Avatar
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    Hey Walter, I'm looking at a three day trail maintenance trip in March if the weather is good. If you available to come with us or maybe shuttle it would be appreciated. I'm thinking we may start at Beech Gap on 16 or 17 March and clear to Tapoco Lodge by 19 march.
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  13. #33
    First Sergeant SGT Rock's Avatar
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    On to other news. With all the recent changes to the BMT, I need to start editing the BMT Thru-Hikers guide for an earlier than normal update. That said, I need a new cover photo. If you have a good BMT trail photo with hiker(s) in it, please send it to me so I have some to pick from.

    thanks.
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  14. #34

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    Can someone review for me the reason blazes aren't allowed on parts of the trail under discussion here?

  15. #35
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    rock would have a more definitive answer but the short answer is that blazes are not allowed in some wilderness areas...................

  16. #36
    First Sergeant SGT Rock's Avatar
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    We blaze where ever we can. Land Managers for sections we go through have their rules about what trail marking are allowed and we have to follow those rules. So the list of where we cannot blaze is a patchwork of areas mainly wilderness areas but also includes GSMNP also does not allow blazing for any trail in the park except the AT. We have had issues getting blazes on road walks in some areas, but that problem may be gone or nearly gone with this new reroute.

    As to why this is the rule, well I don't know why wilderness rules are like that. Sometimes wilderness rules frustrate us, but we don't complain as it is better to have our trail and deal with the rules than to not get a trail at all. The AT passes through wilderness areas but is blazed, but as I understand it this is due to it either getting grandfathered in as it was in the wilderness before the rules, or maybe due to its status as a National Scenic Trail.

    I also don't know why the GSMNP does that except that they have 150+ different trails and trying to create unique blazing for all of them would be near impossible.

    The BMT is marked at all intersections by signs (unless someone steals them which has happened) so as long as you know what turn you need to take at which intersection you should be fine. In my guide I've gone one more step and list what other local trail name the BMT may use in a watermark over the mileages.

    In my experience there aren't many situations were someone was lost for long on the trail. The main cases are when someone is't paying attention at a turn and walks the wrong trail. It happened to me once on my first ever BMT long hike and I ended up about 1/2 mile down a steep trail in the wrong direction near the Ocoee River. I realized from my notes (there wasn't a guide at that time) that I should have been on a modest downhill trail. I realized what turn I missed (It was one of those 5 way intersections and I took the wrong left) and that if I stayed on the trail I was following I would hit a road in about 1/2 more mile and could follow that road over to where I was supposed to be. In my experience that is how most people lost on the BMT find out and probably better than half the time they deal with it.

    Another thing that I find happen is where they BMT crosses through some forest service area that has a network of roads and trails or around Cherry Log where the trail goes through a private development with roads and trails that it can get confusing. Over the years I've added maps to my guide of those areas so hikers can see the relationship of roads and trails and see where they should go, and if they miss leaving a road walk where they could possibly get back onto the trail with a short hop over on a road walk.

    As a final thought I'll share the worst lost story of someone on the BMT that I know of. I hope I don't embarrass anyone here because there is a possibility that it could be a WhiteBlaze member that did this, I never got the hikers name. The situation was a group of hikers going together on the BMT. One of the hikers was an very experienced hiker in that he had hiked the entire AT on a thru-hike. They had left camp and had separated by fist hikers, slow hikers, late risers, etc. So this hiker was the last one of the group and had no guidebook or maps. They started from somewhere on the State Line around Unicoi Gap and the community of Coker Creek. The hiker got to Sled Runner Gap and started down the Brookshire Creek section which is now Wilderness but was blazed years ago before it was BMT with an AT like rectangular white Blaze. At an important intersection there was a sign pointing the direction the hiker should turn, but he continued to follow these old white blazes and at some point realized he had made a mistake (probably when he hit the ford and road crossing of Bald River) and turned around to backtrack. He had to have walked right pass the sign he missed earlier, but he missed it again and walked all the way back up to Sled Runner Gap and went back up the BMT towards Coker Creek. I don't know where he stopped, but the following day he walked out to Coker Creek and someone shuttled him to his friends and they were able to get together again.

    My lessons learned:

    1. Just because you have hiked the entire AT you are not an expert navigator. The AT is basically built for anyone at introductory level to walk it without getting lost.

    2. Carry maps. If the hiker had spent about $10 on maps and suffered through carrying the extra 2 ounces of pack weight this also could have been avoided. They are like a first aid kit, and I doubt anyone hikes without a minimal amount of first aid stuff. Just insurance for when things go wrong.

    3. Even if you don't have a map, you should probably buy a trail guide. I think that if this hiker had just had the guide he would have been fine.

    4. If you are going to walk separately have a plan. When I hike with my sons we have a hard rule in that you never pass an intersection until everyone else catches up.

    5. If you don't have a map or guidebooks, then hike with someone that does.

    6. Don't count on cell phones to work in the mountains.
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  17. #37

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    Great info and insight--"wilderness rules." And it makes sense that with many many trails, it would be hard to have a blazing system that didn't involve some kind of science fictional color scheme. And I agree about the AT--did most of my hiking up to a few years ago OFF the AT; use map, use compass. On the AT, hardly ever really need either, but still good to have. Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by SGT Rock View Post
    We blaze where ever we can. Land Managers for sections we go through have their rules about what trail marking are allowed and we have to follow those rules. So the list of where we cannot blaze is a patchwork of areas mainly wilderness areas but also includes GSMNP also does not allow blazing for any trail in the park except the AT. We have had issues getting blazes on road walks in some areas, but that problem may be gone or nearly gone with this new reroute.

    As to why this is the rule, well I don't know why wilderness rules are like that. Sometimes wilderness rules frustrate us, but we don't complain as it is better to have our trail and deal with the rules than to not get a trail at all. The AT passes through wilderness areas but is blazed, but as I understand it this is due to it either getting grandfathered in as it was in the wilderness before the rules, or maybe due to its status as a National Scenic Trail.

    I also don't know why the GSMNP does that except that they have 150+ different trails and trying to create unique blazing for all of them would be near impossible.

    The BMT is marked at all intersections by signs (unless someone steals them which has happened) so as long as you know what turn you need to take at which intersection you should be fine. In my guide I've gone one more step and list what other local trail name the BMT may use in a watermark over the mileages.

    In my experience there aren't many situations were someone was lost for long on the trail. The main cases are when someone is't paying attention at a turn and walks the wrong trail. It happened to me once on my first ever BMT long hike and I ended up about 1/2 mile down a steep trail in the wrong direction near the Ocoee River. I realized from my notes (there wasn't a guide at that time) that I should have been on a modest downhill trail. I realized what turn I missed (It was one of those 5 way intersections and I took the wrong left) and that if I stayed on the trail I was following I would hit a road in about 1/2 more mile and could follow that road over to where I was supposed to be. In my experience that is how most people lost on the BMT find out and probably better than half the time they deal with it.

    Another thing that I find happen is where they BMT crosses through some forest service area that has a network of roads and trails or around Cherry Log where the trail goes through a private development with roads and trails that it can get confusing. Over the years I've added maps to my guide of those areas so hikers can see the relationship of roads and trails and see where they should go, and if they miss leaving a road walk where they could possibly get back onto the trail with a short hop over on a road walk.

    As a final thought I'll share the worst lost story of someone on the BMT that I know of. I hope I don't embarrass anyone here because there is a possibility that it could be a WhiteBlaze member that did this, I never got the hikers name. The situation was a group of hikers going together on the BMT. One of the hikers was an very experienced hiker in that he had hiked the entire AT on a thru-hike. They had left camp and had separated by fist hikers, slow hikers, late risers, etc. So this hiker was the last one of the group and had no guidebook or maps. They started from somewhere on the State Line around Unicoi Gap and the community of Coker Creek. The hiker got to Sled Runner Gap and started down the Brookshire Creek section which is now Wilderness but was blazed years ago before it was BMT with an AT like rectangular white Blaze. At an important intersection there was a sign pointing the direction the hiker should turn, but he continued to follow these old white blazes and at some point realized he had made a mistake (probably when he hit the ford and road crossing of Bald River) and turned around to backtrack. He had to have walked right pass the sign he missed earlier, but he missed it again and walked all the way back up to Sled Runner Gap and went back up the BMT towards Coker Creek. I don't know where he stopped, but the following day he walked out to Coker Creek and someone shuttled him to his friends and they were able to get together again.

    My lessons learned:

    1. Just because you have hiked the entire AT you are not an expert navigator. The AT is basically built for anyone at introductory level to walk it without getting lost.

    2. Carry maps. If the hiker had spent about $10 on maps and suffered through carrying the extra 2 ounces of pack weight this also could have been avoided. They are like a first aid kit, and I doubt anyone hikes without a minimal amount of first aid stuff. Just insurance for when things go wrong.

    3. Even if you don't have a map, you should probably buy a trail guide. I think that if this hiker had just had the guide he would have been fine.

    4. If you are going to walk separately have a plan. When I hike with my sons we have a hard rule in that you never pass an intersection until everyone else catches up.

    5. If you don't have a map or guidebooks, then hike with someone that does.

    6. Don't count on cell phones to work in the mountains.

  18. #38
    Registered User Cadenza's Avatar
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    I wholeheartedly endorse this reroute!
    Hopefully it gets the 'tourist' traffic off my beloved Stiffknee trail.

  19. #39
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    Hopefully it gets the 'tourist' traffic off my beloved Stiffknee trail

    ive only been down stiffknew once------and only saw one hiker (dogwood on his thru on the bmt).........

    does it trail get alot of traffic on it?

    i found it to be a wonderful way to get down into that drainage...........

  20. #40
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    It doesn't get a lot of traffic nor does it get much maintenance lately. It was always hard to get help with that section for some reason

    Sent from my SCH-R970 using Tapatalk
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

    BMT Thru-Hikers' Guide
    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

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