Rain Pants - are they needed?

[cayte03]

Hi -
I am planning a 5 week thruhike (not on the AT, but CT - thought that's not fully relevant). I would like to hear from people who don't bring rain pants. I believe a rain jacket is important, but I can't convince myself either way about rainpants.
Also, if anyone has relatively cheap (no more than $150) UL rain pants recommendations, I'll greatly appreciate them. UL would have to be approximately 6 oz or less. (I have the marmot precip and some heavy event ones by rei)
THANKS!

[mankind117]

If you want cheap UL rain pants it is hard to beat frogg toggs. You get the jacket + pants for like 20$ the only problem is that the material is fragile but on a well maintained trail it should be fine, but not appropriate for bushwacking. As for whether to bring them or not you didn't say when you are going. I don't bring rain pants in the summer (June to August) but otherwise I bring them. If it is cold out and you get your pants soaked even though it is your legs that is good way to get cold really fast. I know because I've been there. I remember a bad day in the Virignia moutnains last march, when it was raining, windy, and in the low 40s. Lots of the trail was very overgrown and my pants got soaked because I had not put my raninpants on. I had stand around for a while to make sure people make the right turn. It is amazing how fast the wet pants without the microclimate of the pants sucked the heat out of you. That is the only time I have been worried about hypothermia. I would never got without them unless it was summer and I was really sure that getting my pants soaked will not be dangerous. Around here that is about 3 months of the year.

[Traveler]

Always a debate, however rain gear isn't designed to keep you dry as much as its designed to keep you warm or perhaps better stated, not let wind and precipitation force you into hypothermia. Light rain in protected areas are one thing, trying to move over a few miles of exposed ridge with a 40 kt wind driven rain is another.

[bigcranky]

Well, you can get the Zpacks for $165, which is only 10% above your max. They are under 4 oz and look pretty tough.

My wife is one of those who hates rain pants except maybe in the winter. Last summer we were on a longish hike (4 weeks) and I had my homemade rain kilt, and she had nothing over her light nylon trail pants. There were a couple of occasions when she got cold enough that she wished for rain pants. Yeah, you still get wet (I got soaked thru in my rain shell and kilt), but I could manage warmth. She was unable to do so. I'm going to buy her the Zpacks pants, which she would likely wear by themselves, as I often do when it's warm.

So I guess I'm not the guy to argue against some sort of water resistant leg coverings. The CT gets pretty high with some good size thunderstorms.

[WalkingStick75]

Good points above but it also depends on what section your on and the time of year. You might be better off posting this on the CT thread.

[colorado_rob]

Always a debate, however rain gear isn't designed to keep you dry as much as its designed to keep you warm or perhaps better stated, not let wind and precipitation force you into hypothermia. Light rain in protected areas are one thing, trying to move over a few miles of exposed ridge with a 40 kt wind driven rain is another.

Yep, this exactly. More for warmth (when high/windy and/or wet). And Frog Toggs work fine, though some hate them (user error?) and they are not very durable (you do carry a bit of duct tape, right?).

[Namtrag]

I ripped the Frogg Toggs the first time I ever put them on...I squatted down in them to put a tent stake in the ground, and ripped out the entire crotch area. I still bring the jacket every trip...and yes, it has a few duct tape strips in it.

Personally, I don't see the point of rain pants unless it's cold out. I just wear Columbia kayaking shorts, which are pretty much board shorts. They dry quickly and I don't have to worry about the extra weight! I will take my rain pants in the late Fall if rain is in the forecast.

[Bronk]

I wear a rain jacket that goes halfway to my knees and either shorts or nylon jogging pants that can be wrung out and dry in 15 or 20 minutes.

[K2 Travels]

Have hiked a lot without rain pants. Biggest issue is not letting your underwear get wet (makes sleeping a bit uncomfortable).

Though I do now carry the rain kilt that ZPacks make. Very light and very good at keeping my knees and above dry (colder weather just roll your long underwear to the knee or above to keep them dry). The kilt also doubles as a ground cloth for your vestibule area or anything that you don't want getting wet (large enough unzipped that it can be a ground cloth and too cover for backpack etc). Great piece of gear.

K2

[Starchild]

Needed if the temp is low enough for warmth, not water-proofness (wet warm). For rain a rain skirt is better and dryer. Frogtoggs is a great entry level, test it out brand.

[jbwood5]

Needed if the temp is low enough for warmth, not water-proofness (wet warm). For rain a rain skirt is better and dryer. Frogtoggs is a great entry level, test it out brand.

This time of the year, you will sweat in most rain pants, but it could be a good emergency item if you get caught in freak storm at higher elevations. This time of the year, on the AT, I just carry lightweight nylon jogging shorts.

Most of the time in the Summer, it is better to get wet from rain than be soaked with sweat.

[HooKooDooKu]

I always take rain pants:
1. Extra warmth layer if needed.
2. Helps keep you dry if caught in a cold rain.
3. Keep the bugs off your legs in camp (if you don't like using deet).

[colorado_rob]

I ripped the Frogg Toggs the first time I ever put them on...I squatted down in them to put a tent stake in the ground, and ripped out the entire crotch area.

Very common! Probably why most hate FT rain pants. I've found (after a couple ripped-out crotches) that simply hiking them up before squatting or making big step over something solves this sever weakness. Basically, they just have too low a crotch in the pant which make them do this. Plus, having the crotch ripped out doesn't really hurt their functionality, in fact, it ventilates them in the important areas.

[cayte03]

hmmm...
so if rain pants are more for warmth than dryness, then why would i not want to wear my wool leggings in the rain (wet wool still keeps me warm)?

How do people feel about DWR coatings (home-sprayed or factory)?

[colorado_rob]

hmmm...
so if rain pants are more for warmth than dryness, then why would i not want to wear my wool leggings in the rain (wet wool still keeps me warm)?

simple answer: too warm and too heavy. Dri Duck pants (AKA Frogg Toggs) weight about 5.5 ounces. A pair of lightweight, quick drying hiking shorts and some Frogg Togg rain pants and you're good to go for legwear on the CT in the summer (I don't carry any other leg wear in CO in the summer, even climbing higher than the CT).

[handlebar]

Left my rain wrap home for last 200 mile chunk of AZT. Got to Patagonia and was ready to do laundry when I realized an important use: something to wear while my kilt is in the wash.

I prefer the the rain wrap to rain pants. It's not as much as of a sweat box. Mine is very light and packs about the size of a softball. It's fairly cheap from ULA. Served me well on 3 consecutive days of rain in PA one September.

[cayte03]

simple answer: too warm and too heavy. Dri Duck pants (AKA Frogg Toggs) weight about 5.5 ounces. A pair of lightweight, quick drying hiking shorts and some Frogg Togg rain pants and you're good to go for legwear on the CT in the summer (I don't carry any other leg wear in CO in the summer, even climbing higher than the CT).

I am not a fan of shorts for hiking (or anything else for that matter), so would you say a pair of lightweight quick-drying hiking pants and a pair of Frogg Toggs would be sufficient? (I've never even heard of Frogg Toggs before now.)

[Odd Man Out]

I've not has much experience with those 40 deg wind and rain conditions and had the same question. I was wondering if water repellent wind pants would be a suitable substitute? Otherwise I am liking the rain wrap idea.

[cayte03]

Now I am starting to wonder about rain-gear in general.... Someone, please correct me if any of the following is wrong. In my understanding anything that's UL and breathable (ex. OR Helium, Marmot Mica, whatever else...) is not really all that water-proof and wets out pretty easily. Basically, these are good as wind-breakers and for light rain, but not beyond that.
Anything that's GoreTex or Event or whatnot is much heavier, significantly more waterproof, and less breathable.
Is anything other than a good old plastic poncho actually legitimately waterproof in heavy rain?
I have no experience with cuben fiber clothing (or anything, for that matter - i am actually abotu to order my first cuben dry sack form zpacks). I understand it's completely waterproof, but is it breathable / comfortable?


My thought is that if it's super windy, wet, and below 40 degrees, I'd want "real" raingear. It doesn't need to be breathable, since I'd be wearing all sorts of layers and not exactly sweating much. I experienced this for several weeks hiking in above the arctic circle. I wore a down jacket under an event rain jacket and wool leggings under rain pants. I survived. But I am not expecting anything as absurd on the CT and I feel no need to carry all my heavy duty gear, since it is indeed heavy. Up until now I've always erred on the side of caution and carried more than the bare necessities. At this point, for health reasons, I really have to lighten my load... so I am trying to figure out what would be the best compromise. In my usual east coast summer hiking, I leave the rain pants at home. According to me, my pants will not be all that wetter from me sweating than from any potential rain. Plus, pants made out of magical fabrics do try pretty fast these days.

[cayte03]

PS - Where to the FroggToggs fall on that scale?