Smart Phone vs GPS

[Cedar1974]

I'm considering getting a separate GPS to hike with since most reviews on trail apps have come back that they don't work well due to lack of coverage on the trail. Have any of you had this problem and which do you think is the better idea? Also, suggestions for decent apps would be welcome too. I use an iPhone 4s currently, though will be upgrading in January.

[Traveler]

It really depends on what you will use it for and where. If you plan to hike well walked trails like the AT, you likely won't have much problem in losing the trail and a cell phone may be a nice way to track progress or stats. If you are in the back country following "approximate" routes to various places (as in desert hiking where there are not many real trails for example), you will probably want something more robust.

For what its worth, I find the articles I have read regarding the use of Smartphones or GPS units to mirror my own experience. I use a Garmin 60 CSx when out on trails. It gets outstanding coverage under fairly robust canopies and in canyons usually. There have only been a handful of times I have lost signal with it in WA state in some of the tall old growth forests. This and the 64 model supposedly have the best canopy/canyon signal reception but that could have changed in the past year. Cell phones may provide a back up, but not much beats a paper map, compass, and a GPS with the varied functions.

[Slo-go'en]

Most (if not all) phones have a GPS receiver built in. What they don't have is the maps, which they get via the cell towers when needed. Like when you use Google maps. But if you pre-load the maps you need for the area your in and have a GPS app which will interface between the two you can use it anywhere. The problem is topo maps require a lot of data storage so depending on how much area you want to cover, you might need several SD cards to hold it all.

I have a little hand held Garmin GPS unit which is next to useless as the screen is so small you can't see any detail more then 1/4 mile away if you zoom out. It also has the same memory limitations, so it has to have the maps for the area of interest loaded first.

I have a Samsung Galaxy Tab 3, 7" tablet with a GPS with a free app called "ViewRanger GPS" which works pretty good except the GSP receiver in the Tab is not very good and takes a long time to lock and pretty much never under canopy or rain. It also sucks the battery dry really fast.

[HooKooDooKu]

When my wife and I go on walks in the neighborhood, I use my Garmin GPS and she uses some fitness app for her iPhone 4s. On our dedicated loop, her fitness app always says we've hiked right at 2.0 miles, but my Garmin consistently says we've only gone 1.85 miles. Can't say for sure which is more accurate but my vote would be that a dedicated GPS unit is getting more accurate results than an iPhone app.

[Singto]

Good info and guidance. I didn't know about the View Ranger App. I'm gonna give that a try on my Samsung Grand 2 phone. Thanks Slo-go'en.

[md1486]

When my wife and I go on walks in the neighborhood, I use my Garmin GPS and she uses some fitness app for her iPhone 4s. On our dedicated loop, her fitness app always says we've hiked right at 2.0 miles, but my Garmin consistently says we've only gone 1.85 miles. Can't say for sure which is more accurate but my vote would be that a dedicated GPS unit is getting more accurate results than an iPhone app.

I have a Garmin GPSMAP 60Cx and I hike the Mt Adams this weekend by the Air Line trail and down by Valley Way. On many internet sites they give 14,5km and my GPS gave me 11.1km. I never lost signal the entire day. I'm also asking myself which is wrong.

[Connie]

XGPS 150A or XGPS160 Sky Pro bluetooth GPS receivers work with a bluetooth-enabled smart phone and four or five others' bluetooth-enabled smart phones or bluetooth-enabled laptops or tablets, if you like.

Highly recommended, if away from cell phone service.

[Traveler]

I have a Garmin GPSMAP 60Cx and I hike the Mt Adams this weekend by the Air Line trail and down by Valley Way. On many internet sites they give 14,5km and my GPS gave me 11.1km. I never lost signal the entire day. I'm also asking myself which is wrong.

Could that discrepancy be the elevation gain figured into the mileage?

[BrianLe]

I suggest that if you use the GPS a lot, and/or really depend on it, and/or have problems recharging a cell phone, then a standalone GPS can make sense. If you like having one but use it infrequently and/or don't really 'need' it, and you don't have a major problem with your smartphone running out of power, then having the right smartphone + software setup is a better choice. Or at least that's how it's worked out for me.

I bought a somewhat expensive GPS for hiking the CDT and was glad that I had it. But then I sold it on Craig's list after I was done; I didn't see myself using one very often after that. Then I bought a cheaper but perfectly fine GPS to use on the Pacific NW Trail (for much the same reason) and will hang on to that for similar use.

The key issue for me is being on a power budget. If I want to feel free to use the GPS more often, typically on less well-marked and/or well defined trails, then I don't want to have to have the GPS compete with other uses of the smartphone (for me: camera, blogging device, access to internet for uploading blogs and getting weather reports when possible, voice recorder, occasional book reader ...). With a separate GPS device I can carry a spare pair of lithium AA batteries at the cost of 1 ounce, and they're relatively easy to buy along the way in trail towns. I go the same way with MP3 player when I carry one, for the same reason.

[Starchild]

I would go with the smartphone. There are a bunch of off line map apps (so cellular service is not required), and they are just getting better all the time, The smartphone is where the advancements are coming to first. It's something you have already, so not a extra thing. Many apps are geared towards locating your position when and only when you ask, so you save batteries over continuous tracking.

[gpburdelljr]

Could that discrepancy be the elevation gain figured into the mileage?

Only if the grade was 97.6%

[HooKooDooKu]

Could that discrepancy be the elevation gain figured into the mileage?

Only if the two devices calculate distances differently.

I know in the case of my wife's iPhone App, it tracks changes in elevation and uses that info along with body weight to help calculate estimated calories burned.

My GPS, in addition to tracking elevation change with GPS technology, supplements changes in elevation via an air pressure sensor.

[Just Bill]

http://www.amazon.com/Silva-Starter-.../dp/B000COOUAA

Under an ounce.
No batteries.
Works under tree cover, in canyons, and even with one eye closed.
Screen won't fog, no moving parts to break.
Waterproof, highly shock resistant.
Costs $12, includes lifetime service plan.
Don't need wi-fi or bluetooth to update.
Pairs perfectly with your I-Phone.

[Venchka]

Assuming that Cedar1974 is talking about hiking the AT:
How many folks completed all, or large sections, of the AT long before there were smart phones or GPS?
I rest my case.
HYOH.

Wayne

[Venchka]

http://www.amazon.com/Silva-Starter-.../dp/B000COOUAA

Under an ounce.
No batteries.
Works under tree cover, in canyons, and even with one eye closed.
Screen won't fog, no moving parts to break.
Waterproof, highly shock resistant.
Costs $12, includes lifetime service plan.
Don't need wi-fi or bluetooth to update.
Pairs perfectly with your I-Phone.

Assuming that Cedar1974 is talking about hiking the AT:
How many folks completed all, or large sections, of the AT long before there were smart phones or GPS?
I rest my case.
HYOH.

Wayne

There you go.

Wayne

[10-K]

I like maps for the big picture but nothing says "You are here" like a GPS.

If you live in the southeast GSMNP offers a weekend long, ranger led map-compass course that's very good. I've taken it and a few other orienting classes - it's great fun but it's one of those things that require a lot of practice to get good at.

[rocketsocks]

Better still is a cheap $20 dollar gps off the net, and a map, plot those numbers and you're golden.

[Walkintom]

When your GPS seems to be under-reporting mileage, you may want to look at how often it is updating location.

If you follow a path that is not a direct line, such as a switchback or simply curving trail, and the GPS updates location - is it doing so often enough to reflect the path that you are following? If your GPS updates every 10 minutes - how much of a switchback have you traveled in 10 minutes?

I tend to believe that this causes more distance discrepancies by far than elevation changes.

Of course, other things could be coming into play - this is just one thing to look into.

[Rex Clifton]

If you bushwack you definitely want to go with a GPS. The Garmin Oregon is probably the best unit on the market. Of you stick to trails, a phone will do fine to give you coordinates but I have yet to find a map app that works well. You can easily find your position, however, by bringing along a map. Pencil a UTM grid on the map and set your phone that way. With a simple protractor it will take you less than 30 seconds to plot your position.

[HooKooDooKu]

When your GPS seems to be under-reporting mileage, you may want to look at how often it is updating location.

If you follow a path that is not a direct line, such as a switchback or simply curving trail, and the GPS updates location - is it doing so often enough to reflect the path that you are following? If your GPS updates every 10 minutes - how much of a switchback have you traveled in 10 minutes?

I tend to believe that this causes more distance discrepancies by far than elevation changes.

Of course, other things could be coming into play - this is just one thing to look into.

We are walking the neighborhood, and it's my eTrex that "seems to be under reporting"... but when I've looked at a track log of other walks in the neighborhood, I can perfectly see the 'bulb' of the cul-de-sacs that I walk thru. So if it were a case of not updating the location frequently enough, I would expect to see irregular edges, not smooth cul-de-sac shaped curves.