Unnamed campsites with fire rings

[fabianscorpio]

I've hiked 111 miles of the AT in PA, from DWG to Swatara Gap, SOBO, and I plan on hiking from Swatara Gap to Amicalola Falls on April 16th. During my hike from DWG to Swatara Gap, I've generally stayed at unnamed campsites along the trail (actually, I prefer these little out-of-the-way sites to shelters), and I've seen many of these little unnamed campsites with fire rings littered about the trail, in fact, these little 'unnamed' campsites seem to outnumber the actual 'named' sites and shelters. I was wondering if this is normal through-out the trail, or if it is just in PA that seems to have an abundance of these fire rings. In any case, it would be nice if the guide books listed these little slices of heaven, because it really could mean the difference between stopping early one night, or hiking another 3 miles to an unnamed site.

While I hiked this section, I made note of where I camped, and tried to make note of any other unnamed site along the way. I plan on doing this my entire trip because I'm certain this information should be available, and helpful!

[moldy]

It's quite normal. The AT has lots of rocks to make fire rings. Almost any open flat spot just of the trail will have one. Also plenty of old campfire spots have no fire ring at all. Way to many slices to heaven to list in a book.

[SWODaddy]

Guthook has many of them listed. Some even have pictures.

[SkeeterPee]

Guthook has many of them listed. Some even have pictures.

Agreed, have been Hiking PA section with Guthook and a large percent have been on Guthook.

[Wise Old Owl]

It's quite normal. The AT has lots of rocks to make fire rings. Almost any open flat spot just of the trail will have one. Also plenty of old campfire spots have no fire ring at all. Way to many slices to heaven to list in a book.

These are old campsites from the 50's

[nsherry61]

These types of sites are common in the White Mountains in NH along the AT, AND they are almost all illegal because they are not at least 200 ft from the trail.

[peakbagger]

Unfortunately it only takes a moron a couple of minutes to build a fire ring and many folks think a fire ring legitimizes a bootleg campsite.

[rafe]

These types of sites are common in the White Mountains in NH along the AT, AND they are almost all illegal because they are not at least 200 ft from the trail.

Can you be more specific as to the locations? I do a fair amount of hiking up there but haven't observed these.

[Tipi Walter]

These types of sites are common in the White Mountains in NH along the AT, AND they are almost all illegal because they are not at least 200 ft from the trail.

In the Southeast it is not required to camp 200 feet from the trail or a trail. In fact, most so-called "designated" campsites around here on close to the trail. And it's better to use these sites I suppose than to carve out a new site.

Unfortunately it only takes a moron a couple of minutes to build a fire ring and many folks think a fire ring legitimizes a bootleg campsite.

There are no "bootleg campsites" on the AT from Georgia thru North Carolina and Tennessee into Virginia. (Except of course for the GSMNP which has its designated sites). Fact is, a backpacker can set up wherever he/she wants from Georgia up thru Virginia.

Plus, most backpackers I know do not go to the trouble to build rock fire rings.

[Slo-go'en]

These types of sites are common in the White Mountains in NH along the AT, AND they are almost all illegal because they are not at least 200 ft from the trail.

And trail maintainers are forever looking for and then removing any sign these places exist. It's a never ending battle.

[fabianscorpio]

I just looked at guthook's and it seems they are removing the unofficial campsite icons in order to preserve the trail....ugh! Well, I'm still going to mark the campsites as I go and be sure to post it somewhere when I'm done. I think these are invaluable little sites....and not so abundant that become an eyesore either, IMO

[Slo-go'en]

I just looked at guthook's and it seems they are removing the unofficial campsite icons in order to preserve the trail....ugh! Well, I'm still going to mark the campsites as I go and be sure to post it somewhere when I'm done. I think these are invaluable little sites....and not so abundant that become an eyesore either, IMO

When you find these sites, you should remove all trace of the fire ring and brush over the spot as not to encourage other from camping there. There are plenty of designated sites along the AT, use them. If you do camp in a non-designate site, practice LNT and obscure any trace you were there.

[wornoutboots]

What is a "designated site"??

[rafe]

What is a "designated site"??

My opinion, FWIW: if it shows up on an ATC map or data book.

[Sarcasm the elf]

What is a "designated site"??

I believe this means sites that are designated as "official" and maintained by trail clubs. Camping rules vary hugely from state to state and also varies heavily depending on who owns the land that the trail is passing over. In the midAtlantic and Northeast many areas do not allow dispersed camping and only allow camping at the maintained sites, especially in NY/CT/MA, the rules in some places such as NH are complex enough that I'd have to look them up again if I were to hike through there.

[SWODaddy]

I just looked at guthook's and it seems they are removing the unofficial campsite icons in order to preserve the trail....ugh! Well, I'm still going to mark the campsites as I go and be sure to post it somewhere when I'm done. I think these are invaluable little sites....and not so abundant that become an eyesore either, IMO

Where did you see that? I saw a blog post from over a year ago saying he was going to remove them in some areas at the request of trail maintainers or property owners. My app still lists plenty, though

[SkeeterPee]

From the areas I have hiked the only designated areas are at shelters which seem to be about 8 miles apart, but sometimes 18 miles between shelters. if you want to hike 10, 12, or 14 miles you do not have a designated place. So in my mind there are not enough designated camping areas. In some areas I have hiked dispersed camping is allow so I have done that. I do stay away from the near trail fire ring locations as many are less than a mile from a road so they seem to be more of a party location than a camping area. But I would prefer if some of the better locations were consider "designated"

[shelterbuilder]

Designated campsites are those that are recognized by the local trail maintaining clubs (and therefore usually in the guidebooks/maps). As previously noted, any idiot can pile up a bunch of rocks and use it for a campfire, but that doesn't legitimize the site. There are lots of folks who don't like to use shelters (I won't get into THAT discussion), but if that's your preference, then please practice LNT. If you do build a campfire, make it small, and scatter the rocks in the morning before you leave. (One more thing - the regulations vary depending upon whose land you're camping on! In Pa., most of the A.T. runs across Game Lands, and Game Commission regs are the most stringent of all of the agencies. Primitive, one-night camping allowed within 200 feet of the footpath, but this must also be 500 feet away from trail-heads, road crossings, parking lots, and WATER SOURCES; no fires when the danger of wildfires is "high, very high, or extreme", as defined by the Bureau of Forestry.)

[peakbagger]

In the White Mountain National Forest on the AT, there is a lot of confusion on legal camping spots. Most of the confusion can be eliminated by reading the rules. No camping within 1/4 of a mile of a road, no camping within a 1/4 mile of an AMC Hut or AMC managed campsite and no camping above treeline. The WMNF actually posts "Restricted Use Area" signs around their huts and the campsites as well as at treeline although they tend to get ripped down or defaced frequently. There is also a 200 foot rule that applies to officially designated Wilderness areas. The AT skirts a couple of Wilderness Areas in the whites and goes through one (Great Gulf), in these areas the 200 foot rule applies where the camping is allowed as long as the hiker is 200 feet off the trail. The Ammonusuc Ravine trail below Lake of Clouds Hut is also designated no camping.

The big problem many folks hiking in the whites have is that they assume that even if camping is legal that they can find a campsite. Along the ridgelines the terrain is rocky and loaded with dense spruce fir. Finding a spot for a tent is darn close to impossible. On occasion there will be a flat spot immediately off the trail usually just below treeline that is legal but keep in mind there is a lot of day hiker use in the area and these flat spots are popular for use as a toilet. If a hiker elects to use these spots they had best watch their step and assume that are camping in an outhouse.

The final no camping rule in the WMNF that I find the most annoying is that the WMNF can arbitrarily post an otherwise legal spot as no camping. These spots are not listed anywhere. Frequently these are flat spots along the side of the trail. This has been done on the Franconia Ridge trail north of Liberty Springs campsite.

[rickb]

The final no camping rule in the WMNF that I find the most annoying is that the WMNF can arbitrarily post an otherwise legal spot as no camping. These spots are not listed anywhere. Frequently these are flat spots along the side of the trail. This has been done on the Franconia Ridge trail north of Liberty Springs campsite.

Good post.

WRT the part of your post I have quoted above, those signs should only follow a "Supervisor's Order".

"Should" being the operative word. Most do but, your example proves there are exceptions.

The Forest Service sign makers also flaunt the importance of a Supervisors Order when they post the entry to the Pemi (off of AT ) with a blanket prohibition against camping near water. The AMC sign makers often misapply that blanket claim (incorrectly) as well.

Peakbagger's practical considerations and LNT ethics and actual Superviors Orders all that should matter, but it's hard to simply write off signs. Even if those signe may pbe no more proper than the No Parking signs that Madona put up in front of her Manhattan home.