Food in the tent

[Engine]

...Bears will go after food if they think they can get it without encountering you. Even a few feet away.

About 10 years ago we were eating dinner at the highly used campsite below Gregory Bald on what was the old AT before it was rerouted. While eating, my daughter pointed out a large male bear which had entered our camp and was near the tent where she had left the food bag, only about 50' away. I "calmly" walked past the bear, within about 10' I would guess, picked up the food bag and carried it back to where we were sitting.

That bear looked almost comical as he watched me walk away with his targeted dinner. After a couple of minutes, he lost interest and wandered off to roll some logs and look for grubs. We watched him for about an hour before he left the area.

I'm not saying there aren't dangerous bears, nor am I saying my actions that day were well thought out, but in my experience, the hysteria over black bear encounters is way overblown. We've had close encounters many times and only once was I ever nervous about it. That bear actually moved toward my son and me in a manner I viewed as possibly predatory while we stood under Shuckstack tower. But when we left and hiked back down to the AT, he didn't follow, so even that was a non-event in reality.

[Malto]

Jester nailed it. In addition I believe avoiding cooking in camp will also help avoid late night wildlife encounters as will avoiding over used sites. I find it interesting that most of the serial long distance hikers that I know sleep with their food.

[Kc Fiedler]

I hang my food every time. PCT method. End of story.

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[garlic08]

One hiker I met on my PCT thru told me a bear removed his food bag from under his head while he was sleeping on it, in So Cal. That was an outlier incident, but it does happen. If he'd been in a tent, he probably would have been fine, but that story molded my beliefs in food storage.

I'll just echo what others have said, NEVER turn your back on your food, and hanging it securely is often the best way to deal with it. For me, it wasn't a pine marten but an ermine that caused the most damage, nearly destroying my pack in a few minutes while I was twenty feet away getting water at a creek near Crestone Needle in Colorado. Second most was a couple of ravens on a beach in Washington State, with me just a few paces away watching a sunset. I finally learned to put a line in a tree, every time. It's not very hard. If there are no trees, the food stays under my supervision at all times. Sometimes that means sleeping with it.

Once on the AT, and again a few weeks ago in Canada, a mouse nibbled a small hole in my tortillas while the bag was at my side. Some of those little guys are pretty fearless when it comes to an easy meal.

[10-K]

I sleep with my food and 99% of the time I camp in a random place a ways off the trail where my shelter will fit.

[evyck da fleet]

I sleep with my food unless there are bear poles, bins etc provided or I'm required to carry a canister. Like Jester, I will occasionally hang as a consideration to others. But on the AT where most shelters have food hung from the shelters mouse hangs, I'm not worried about a bear coming after the food in my tent. Its usually inside my pack inside my smelly shirt from that day.

I hung my food at the beginning of my thru but after waking up several times to find that I had left a candy bar wrapper, package of crackers or drink mix which I had forgotten about in my rain gear, I realized there's always going to be a trace scent on what's in my tent. If I do encounter a bear its most likely due to past hiker behavior at that site and a bear activity sign will usually be posted. So whether I do everything by the book or not, there is a slim chance of an encounter either way.

[Puddlefish]

Someone mentioned earlier it's about not leaving the food unattended, ever. Just because one person has good habits and can sleep with their food, doesn't mean it's a good idea for you, unless you have the exact same rigorous habits that they have. Location also matters.

A few nights, I did sleep with the food in my tent, because I was in the middle of a field, surrounded by short trees, far away from a shelter. Very little chance of habituated mice/small animals/bears being around.

Would I do so, within a quarter mile of a shelter in the Smokies, where there hundreds of animals have already learned that backpacks, bags and tents equal easy food? Nope! I also don't want to be the idiot that gets a bear killed because it's learned to associate people with free food because of my sloppy habits.

Hanging a proper bear bag is really simple, and part of the fun and challenge of backpacking. Do so when you're able to, it costs you nothing and can be rewarding. It's also kind of a fun spectator sport. You can be known as the bear pinata idiot, or the one who nails it on the first try.

[Bronk]

I only hang my food if there are bear cables or reports of bear activity in the area. That's what I see most people doing. BTW, bear cables are a great place to go shopping if you are running low on supplies.

[coach lou]

You've been in shelters?

I had my first ever animal damage this year in VT. Slept in a shelter against my better judgement, forgot to unzip all my pack pocket and check them. Turns out I had a Payday wrapped in my hip belt pocket that I had forgotten about. A mouse chewed it's way into it within an hour of me falling asleep.

On a side note, did you know that if you back-fist a hanging pack while half asleep the force can send a mouse flying about 20 feet? It wasn't totally intentional, since I only wanted to scare the mouse into running away, but man did it work.

I hung my bag in Congdon shelter, not ten minutes later I heard them on my bag. I shined a light on them, they were laughing at me! I grabbed my pole and smacked the bag, one fell, one scurried up the cord and the one I hit bounced off the wall and ran out the door. That night was my first food bag pillow............some of you may remember a flatten piece of cheesecake!

[Sarcasm the elf]

I hung my bag in Congdon shelter, not ten minutes later I heard them on my bag. I shined a light on them, they were laughing at me! I grabbed my pole and smacked the bag, one fell, one scurried up the cord and the one I hit bounced off the wall and ran out the door. That night was my first food bag pillow............some of you may remember a flatten piece of cheesecake!

And here I thought you just sat on that cheesecake by accident.

[dudeijuststarted]

It's clear that sleeping with food probably means no open containers of tuna or beef jerky.

I could not fall asleep in the vicinity of an open container of tuna! In other news, I hang my food and have not been attacked by a bear in my sleep, so I'm going with that 100% success rate.

[jj dont play]

I'm one of those that got lazy and slept with Food for pretty much all of Maine. I had food in Zpacks bear bag, then in trash compactor bag, then stuff in packed, closed up my pack and put it by my feet in tent. I felt the couple layers would keep the smell down, but did have a squirrel trying to get in my tent ALL night in the HMW. Pretty sure he smelt food, kept me up all night but other than that I lived.

[swjohnsey]

I always slept with my food. I mostly camped away from shelter and never cooked where I camped.

[SouthMark]

Have been sleeping with my food since my first AT hike in 1978. I have never even been lucky enough to see a bear.


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[T-Rx]

I always sleep with my food. I use OP saks inside my cuben fiber food bag. Never had a problem.

[tagg]

BTW, bear cables are a great place to go shopping if you are running low on supplies.

And as a bonus, after you remove the food you want from the bags hanging up there, there's enough space to leave your trash. So it's a win-win.

[Another Kevin]

Someone mentioned earlier it's about not leaving the food unattended, ever. Just because one person has good habits and can sleep with their food, doesn't mean it's a good idea for you, unless you have the exact same rigorous habits that they have. Location also matters.

That was me, and I agree with you - in fact, in the original post, I said that more often than not I hang food rather than sleep with it, because it's too much of a hassle to bring it with me when I leave my campsite briefly. An after-dark arrival, when I'll have trouble spotting a suitable branch and even more trouble slinging my line over it, or a place that's really lacking in sutable trees, shifts the balance toward sleeping with food. So does having a hiking partner so that there's another human around and the stuff won't be unattended. Otherwise, it's less work to hang than to maintain food discipline in camp.

Being at a 'frontcountry' site also tips the balance toward hanging, simply because there is going to be more habituated wildlife. Not just bears, but also raccoons and porcupines. And mice, if I'm in or near a shelter.

It's also kind of a fun spectator sport. You can be known as the bear pinata idiot, or the one who nails it on the first try

I think the funniest hanging issue I ever had was one time that I slung the 'biner perfectly over the branch I wanted - which was even a few feet higher than my usual hang ... and then watched all fifty feet of line follow it without having the presence of mind to grab the dead end. And then, of course, it took me six more tries to get it over again. I should have just slept with my bag. I was on one of the Finch Pruyn easements in the Adirondacks, miles from anywhere, so there weren't going to be a lot of habituated critters around. But by then I was just too stubborn to let the tree defeat me.

[Fredt4]

It's a pleasant surprise to read about all the hikers that sleep with their food. Previously everyone was pro-PCT bear hanging. The essential trick is to never leave the food unattended, and using a Ursack avoids all the rodents and their relatives. During my 2011 AT thru-hike I never had a problem with bears, and just a couple of encounters with the little ones. I remember a chipmunk that was pretty daring, but I'm sure he remembers me spooking him better. Down in Georgia a bear came around and the three other hikers hung their food against my advice. After the bear got two of theirs food the third took my advice and retrieved his food. Unfortunately in the morning he discovered he had lost his food because he was unwilling to sleep with it. Not sure what happened to them afterwards as I didn't keep up with them but I would not be surprised if food hanging wasn't a big priority for them. I been sleeping with my food in the Smokies since the early '80 because I've seen way to many food hangs go wrong.

[HooKooDooKu]

I been sleeping with my food in the Smokies since the early '80 because I've seen way to many food hangs go wrong.

Sleeping with your food in GSMNP is illegal.


I generally agree with the positive comments made about sleeping with your food, but GSMNP is different from most of the AT:
1. You are only allowed to camp at designated sites.
2. There are a limited number of sites.
3. These sites are heavily used.
4. There is a large concentration of bears (currently estimated at around 1,600 in the park).
5. The bears know where these designated campsites are located, and they visit them.


I've been camping in GSMNP for over 20 years, and in all that time, the only stories I've heard/witnesses about bears getting food hung on the bear cables is from the rare bear that learns that if you bounce the cables, a bag simply hung over the hooks might bounce off. So the only addition that is needed to pretty much guarantee that you will defeat the bears is to use a carabiner or use some means of attaching your food bag to not only the hook, but the loop the hook hang from on the bear cables.


So the only thing left to figure out is how to deal with mice. Mice can climb the bear cables. But because of the number of people using the shelters, they have little fear of humans. So sleeping with your food by itself doesn't protect your food from the mice.


So all that said, I can find little excuse to NOT hang your food when in GSMNP.

[Trance]

If you have anything stinky in your tent - OP SACK BRO.