To Urs or not to Urs, that is the question?

[Dogwood]

Also, http://andrewskurka.com/2011/bear-canister-basics/

Much of this technique info can be found in several places on the internet but Andrew condenses it nicely in his articles and offers his conclusions...to which I 100% agree.

[Venchka]

#1. Why is everyone talking about the Sierras and the Ursack in the same sentence? It's common knowledge that no US Government body recognizes the Ursack for use in California. Possibly nowhere on the West Coast. I don't think that Olympic NP recognizes the Ursack.
#2. I consulted Andrew and several other Ursack owners prior to making my purchase for use in the Rocky Mountains. If I take a wrong turn somewhere and find myself on the West Coast I will play the game by the local rules.
I hope to see Y'all somewhere along Thorofare Creek or the Smoky River.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dogwood]

#1. Why is everyone talking about the Sierras and the Ursack in the same sentence? It's common knowledge that no US Government body recognizes the Ursack for use in California. Possibly nowhere on the West Coast. I don't think that Olympic NP recognizes the Ursack...

Read the OP's opening comments. Also read mine in post #20.

In short, all areas in the Sierra don't legally require hard sided bear canisters. The Sierra is not just SEKI, Yosemite, etc. The Sierra is a BIG area. Look it up. In those areas where the hard sided cans aren't required - where the OP usually hikes - the OP is considering STILL protecting his food from wildlife using the lighter wt GEAR option of an Ursack.

[Venchka]

Sorry. I lost track of that when my own shopping swung into gear.
I know how large an area the Sierras occupy.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dogwood]

Nothing to be sorry about. jus clarifying. I need it too and welcome it.

[Venchka]

Please excuse my lack of focus.
I'm watching the election results.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[poolskaterx]

ok, to be fair this post is for the ursack but I have so much more to tell about.

Ursack was great and fit my food WAY better than my BV450; even with the 40ft of rope and mini carabiner to hang the sack with it was 24oz lighter!

I used an OP sack for the first time; I will use one every time I ever go hiking again overnight. OP sack works. I could not smell any of my food as I usually can with just my canister and I am sure it helps with critters detecting the food; nice to think my other stuff in my pack keeps clear of smells better too.

To hang my bag I had toss a rock over a branch 20ft up and not any higher or I would get it tangled in the branches above, I gotta admit it was a little intimidating the first time you try it; even more so when your buddies are all anxiously standing on the sidelines awaiting your failure...

Maybe I was fortunate or maybe I am just that good,lol! Bear bagging was easy; first throw over the tree branch went perfect and my friends cheered... well, except I forgot to hold the other end of the line and it went up and over the branch and back to the ground with my rock sack ha,ha! My friends all had a good laugh. 2nd try went much better and I had my ursack hoisted in no time; I believe once I got my bag hoisted and secured I was the envy of my canistered friends for the rest of the trip.

New question on " To Urs or not to Urs"; if I am hanging my food do I really need a bear proof bag or could I just get a critter proof bag and shave another couple of ounces and twenty bucks OR
do I go with a cuben food sack and shave even more weight for about the same cost?

[Dogwood]

I've heard it said that a black bears sense of smell is 100times greater than a humans.

[MuddyWaters]

Opsacks have weak zippers that fail. And are expensive.

A reynolds turkey bag is made of nylon, and less permeable to smells, cheap, widely available. Use rubber band around neck. 0.5 oz.

I use them so inside of my foodbag so pack dont smell like garbage and food. It works.
For a persons nose.

A bear...dont kid yourself. A bears nose is 5-7x better than a bloodhounds. Your not going to conceal anything from a bears nose. They find a mate by smell.....dozens of miles away.

[egilbe]

I was watching a news show on reintroducing orphan black bear cubs to the wild. The biologist was eating native food the bear mother would eat. The cubs would smell his mouth, lick his face, and in that way, learn what was good to eat. Bears learn thar human food can be good to eat, but they also learn to equate humans with danger.

If a bear wanted your food, he could smell it and come running from miles away. Most bears never learn that association, thankfully.

[poolskaterx]

Well I guess a bear can still smell my food but it did make mask the smell from me and keep my pack from smelling funky (to me) I guess the bear can still smell it but I couldn't. Maybe the opsack would be good to store my dirty clothes, lol!

Soooooo...
Any thoughts on just using the critter bag instead of the bear style Ursack? Maybe even try a zpacks food bag since I am hanging now?

[poolskaterx]

Opsacks have weak zippers that fail. And are expensive.

A reynolds turkey bag is made of nylon, and less permeable to smells, cheap, widely available. Use rubber band around neck. 0.5 oz.

I use them so inside of my foodbag so pack dont smell like garbage and food. It works.
For a persons nose.

A bear...dont kid yourself. A bears nose is 5-7x better than a bloodhounds. Your not going to conceal anything from a bears nose. They find a mate by smell.....dozens of miles away.

I'll have to check the turkey bag thing out, thanks!

[egilbe]

Do youlan on hanging the critter bag? If not, just get the Ursack Major. Rodents still cant chew through it, although it is funny watching them try.

[Venchka]

Are you planning to sleep 100 YARDS from your food?
You should. In grizzly country anyway. I imagine black bears deserve the same respect.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dogwood]

I was watching a news show on reintroducing orphan black bear cubs to the wild. The biologist was eating native food the bear mother would eat. The cubs would smell his mouth, lick his face, and in that way, learn what was good to eat. Bears learn thar human food can be good to eat, but they also learn to equate humans with danger.

If a bear wanted your food, he could smell it and come running from miles away. Most bears never learn that association, thankfully.

Neat. Thx for sharing that.

I wonder how it relates to my chocolate lab licking my face. I must be a messy eater.

[Time Zone]

I was watching a news show on reintroducing orphan black bear cubs to the wild. The biologist was eating native food the bear mother would eat. The cubs would smell his mouth, lick his face, and in that way, learn what was good to eat. Bears learn thar human food can be good to eat, but they also learn to equate humans with danger.

I'm a bit puzzled how the cubs are going to equate humans with danger after being shown what is good to eat by a human.

[Venchka]

I'm a bit puzzled how the cubs are going to equate humans with danger after being shown what is good to eat by a human.

Educated guess: The food smells and tastes will be remembered not the human "plate" the food was served on.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[poolskaterx]

I do not store my food 100 yards away but I do put it a fair distance from where I am sleeping. If bears are looking for food I figure they can probably smell me anyhow since my tent, sleeping bag, sleeping pad, all my cloths,etc was in the same backpack as my food. (maybe I am a bad example)

Two trains of thought on this;

1. If your food is 100 yards away the "black bears" have an undisturbed opportunity to try and get your food... but it is hanging up in a tree correctly it should be pretty safe;

OR,

2. Secure your food hanging, or bear canister, or however you do it closer so that you can scare the animals away if you hear a disturbance.

Just for the record, I am not messing with a grizzly but black bears are generally pretty timid from my experience.

I have not witnessed hikers storing food 100 yards away in all my years of backpacking. Sounds like a good safety measure but I have never seen it in practice; even if hikers store like that wouldn't you think food smells would still be on their gear?

[Dogwood]

I'm a bit puzzled how the cubs are going to equate humans with danger after being shown what is good to eat by a human.

I'm wondering about this too. Seems like there are going to be associations made linking food with humans in the bear's mind taught this way.

[Venchka]

I do not store my food 100 yards away but I do put it a fair distance from where I am sleeping. If bears are looking for food I figure they can probably smell me anyhow since my tent, sleeping bag, sleeping pad, all my cloths,etc was in the same backpack as my food. (maybe I am a bad example)

Two trains of thought on this;

1. If your food is 100 yards away the "black bears" have an undisturbed opportunity to try and get your food... but it is hanging up in a tree correctly it should be pretty safe;

OR,

2. Secure your food hanging, or bear canister, or however you do it closer so that you can scare the animals away if you hear a disturbance.

Just for the record, I am not messing with a grizzly but black bears are generally pretty timid from my experience.

I have not witnessed hikers storing food 100 yards away in all my years of backpacking. Sounds like a good safety measure but I have never seen it in practice; even if hikers store like that wouldn't you think food smells would still be on their gear?

Read the Backcountry rules for Yellowstone. Glacier, Grand Teton and Rocky Mountain may be similar.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk