Camping DIRECTLY on trail

[evyck da fleet]

I backtracked .2 miles from Kent and camped on a side trail instead of night hiking. A few hours later I heard what sounded like four wheelers miles away. The thought of getting run over by a drunk having no fun in the woods was enough to make sure I won't do that again. Unless it's an emergency where I can't self rescue and I don't want people walking by the tent ten feet off the trail.

[peakbagger]

Confession: I have pooped right in my campsite. Which was a spot WELL off trail - like half a mile from the nearest trail and well back from water, and I'd already packed up. Since it wasn't any too likely that anyone else would be sleeping there before Mother Nature had dealt with the consequences, and I wasn't coming back, I wound up digging my hole right where my tent had been.

This method has reportedly been used by trail crews sick of breaking up bootleg sites and having folks reopen them again. I don't think its official policy

[Tipi Walter]

This method has reportedly been used by trail crews sick of breaking up bootleg sites and having folks reopen them again. I don't think its official policy

I've never heard of "bootleg sites" but then I never camp where forest honchos have a policy of Camp Only Here. All the hundreds of miles of trails I backpack have no such policy---I camp whenever and wherever I like. Sadly, more and more areas are getting policed by the nanny state telling us where we must camp. It's lunacy. Hopefully I'll be long dead before the Cherokee and Nantahala and Jefferson and Chattahoochee national forests become regulated in such a way.

[Another Kevin]

This method has reportedly been used by trail crews sick of breaking up bootleg sites and having folks reopen them again. I don't think its official policy

The first thing I try is to post NO CAMPING and NO FIRES disks and brushing in the site. But yes, I've been tempted to make the site unpleasant in other ways.

I've never heard of "bootleg sites" but then I never camp where forest honchos have a policy of Camp Only Here. All the hundreds of miles of trails I backpack have no such policy---I camp whenever and wherever I like. Sadly, more and more areas are getting policed by the nanny state telling us where we must camp. It's lunacy. Hopefully I'll be long dead before the Cherokee and Nantahala and Jefferson and Chattahoochee national forests become regulated in such a way.

For what it's worth, the site in question was in New York's Slide Mountain Wilderness. The only restrictions there on where you may camp are the sensible ones of "either at a designated site, or else more than 150 feet from a trail or water source, more than a quarter mile from a road, and below 3500 feet." The 150-foot restrictions are in place to keep the wildlife relatively unmolested. The critters use human trails, a lot, and of course water sources draw them. The 3500 feet are where the ecosystem gets pretty fragile and it might take years for a campsite to heal. (In fact, it's allowed to camp up there in winter, because you aren't going to hurt the snow any.)

The site was a tiny clearing in a grove of hemlocks, just big enough to pitch a TarpTent Notch. In short, I wasn't going to be back, and it was highly unlikely anyone else would, either. No compunctions whatever about using the site as a toilet, there was no better place to do it than right where I was standing.

As far as camping on a trail goes, I've never done it knowingly. I'd do it if I really, really wanted to be found. (As in, wanted to be found badly enough to pay the likely $300 fine for camping there.)

[Dogwood]

Sleeping in the trail when the tread is in an area on a rocky narrow gritty(slippery?) slope(as can be the case on the PCT in SoCal, as is depicted), on switchbacks, on a narrow ridge, with brush(cacti, cholla, Joshua Trees, poodle bush, briars, etc) hemming it in, during PCT hiker bubbles with some in SoCal starting their hiking day pre 7 a.m., as is the case depicted, is not cool. Erecting a tent even it being a 1 p design and then sleeping in expecting others to get by you increases the uncool-ness of it all. Excusing this behavior saying no other options exist is a cop out. It isn't a matter of simply walking around. And, even if it was can't that lead to trail erosion as it seems it can in the picture? LOOK at the pic! Doesn't the PCT tread in SoCal already suffer from illegal use trails and illegal ATV/4WD tracks and meandering multiple routes?

Aren't some of the reasons why CS's are located some feet off the main tread are to cooperate with others to allow everyone to experience their hikes without having to walk around sleeping people, experience campers(and to give campers some privacy?), or the impact that can occur to the tread/adjacent tread area. Where did this camper go to the bathroom in the middle of the night? Seems if they could find a place to do that then a place to also camp OFF the trail was an option. What if they were hiking with a dog? What if an equestrian came along? What if another PCTer came along hiking at night as some PCTers do in SoCal, as this person did, and came across this person camping directly within the narrow tread? What if, as said, a coyote or rattlesnake or mountain lion or black bear was using the trail just ahead of another night hiker and came across this person blocking the tread? Could there be issues with everyone in one bottlenecked place during the night meeting up in close proximity?

This situation sounds more like a THRU/LD hiker with a typical gotta go go go thru-hiker mentality hiking into the night pushing themselves hard not aware of where they were on a map who, for their own convenience and out of ignorance, camped within the tread. Could this patterned behavior be further observed in sleeping in at this specific place on a slope during high PCT usage within the bubble? Who the heck sets up a tent in a narrow tread sloped area in the middle of the trail like this to sleep? Maybe, someone who sought to get in a couple more miles...and then felt spent? Certainly would be the first time this had happened.

Similar to this type of behavior is having someone camping and sleeping in the N. Kaibab Tunnel in GC NP because they felt tired or achy or didn't want to get wet or didn't have a CS reservation or failed to appropriately organize their hike(like rim to river back to a rim in day folks) assuming the rest of the world would accommodate their situation. Yet, the NPS has to repeatedly tell people NOT to camp in the tunnel. Can't have stock and others go by someone sleeping inside the tunnel.

What if every LD hiker with an ache or pain started camping directly in the tread? C'mon. Can't find a better option?

[rocketsocks]

Confession: I have pooped right in my campsite. Which was a spot WELL off trail - like half a mile from the nearest trail and well back from water, and I'd already packed up. Since it wasn't any too likely that anyone else would be sleeping there before Mother Nature had dealt with the consequences, and I wasn't coming back, I wound up digging my hole right where my tent had been.

confession: one of my free standing tents has a half moon zipper in the floor for cooking...and, where by I Monty-Pythoned my legs through, hiked up the tent to my waist, and by the cover of darkness visited my neighbor (buddy of mine) and let's just say I left him a present on his door step...then I Benny Hill'd it outta there.

[Zea]

Got hit with a horrible sinus infection and fever my 1st night of a 3 day hike in the Whites a couple years ago. I was heading south over Franconia Ridge toward Liberty Springs campsite on a 13 mile day with my fiance, my condition and her being new to hiking made it a much longer day than expected. By the time we cleared the ridge it had been pitch black out for over an hour. Those who've hiked up there can understand how hard it is to find space for a tent even below treeline. Kept hopping off the trail randomly to try to find anything, but it was pitch-black and the ground was spongy from rain the night before. Finally ended up just parking on some rocks about a mile from the campsite and leaning on my pack to crash for the night mid-trail. At that point even if we found a spot I was so drained I couldn't even fathom trying to get the tent up, pads inflated, hang a bear bag etc... and the fiance was new to it all so wouldn't be able to help much.

She ended up being too sketched out to just sleep on the trail, and after 20 minutes of kinda-almost-napping I figured with the little rest I might be able to slog my way to the campground. Ended up getting there after the longest mile of my life and luckily the caretaker let us crash in the overflow spot. All the platforms were taken and I would've had to try to squeeze a non-freestanding tent onto a platform next to people who were trying to sleep, which I really didn't have the energy for.

Basically I can understand if someone does camp on the trail if they have a valid reason to do it. I wasn't in what I would call an "emergency" situation, but I have never felt so completely done in my life. I was dizzy and my head was throbbing from the sinus issues, light-headed and sweaty from the fever and was aching all over. It was risky of me to keep going, my focus was gone and it was dark which was an awful combo. Going out into pitch-black woods while completely dazed and exhausted trying to find a spot is also not the wisest.

[rafe]

Let's just say, if it were me, camped on the trail, and another hiker came by, I'd anticipate a rude remark or two, and it would (probably) be deserved. I wouldn't do in daylight unless it were a true emergency. I wouldn't do it on a well-traveled stretch of trail except after dark or if I'd not seen another hiker for a good long time. I wouldn't do it if camping off the trail was an option.

We were NOBO and I didn't feel like staying at Chestnut Knob shelter. Stone shelters creep me out. There was some daylight left so we pushed on. I was pretty sure we'd find a place to camp in the woods, down the mountain. We walked and walked, daylight began to fade. We found a spot, off the trail, that seemed OK. But as we set up we were startled by yelling, in a not-friendly voice, from a house that we could see through the woods. We hadn't even noticed the house before that. It way too close for comfort. We hastily relocated our tents to the trail proper. We figured we were safer on the trail than on someone's private land.

[illabelle]

Got hit with a horrible sinus infection and fever my 1st night of a 3 day hike in the Whites a couple years ago. I was heading south over Franconia Ridge toward Liberty Springs campsite on a 13 mile day with my fiance, my condition and her being new to hiking made it a much longer day than expected. By the time we cleared the ridge it had been pitch black out for over an hour. Those who've hiked up there can understand how hard it is to find space for a tent even below treeline. Kept hopping off the trail randomly to try to find anything, but it was pitch-black and the ground was spongy from rain the night before. Finally ended up just parking on some rocks about a mile from the campsite and leaning on my pack to crash for the night mid-trail. At that point even if we found a spot I was so drained I couldn't even fathom trying to get the tent up, pads inflated, hang a bear bag etc... and the fiance was new to it all so wouldn't be able to help much.

She ended up being too sketched out to just sleep on the trail, and after 20 minutes of kinda-almost-napping I figured with the little rest I might be able to slog my way to the campground. Ended up getting there after the longest mile of my life and luckily the caretaker let us crash in the overflow spot. All the platforms were taken and I would've had to try to squeeze a non-freestanding tent onto a platform next to people who were trying to sleep, which I really didn't have the energy for.

Basically I can understand if someone does camp on the trail if they have a valid reason to do it. I wasn't in what I would call an "emergency" situation, but I have never felt so completely done in my life. I was dizzy and my head was throbbing from the sinus issues, light-headed and sweaty from the fever and was aching all over. It was risky of me to keep going, my focus was gone and it was dark which was an awful combo. Going out into pitch-black woods while completely dazed and exhausted trying to find a spot is also not the wisest.

Perhaps we should amend "in an emergency" to "not becoming an emergency." By wisely using the trail to camp/rest, you avoided injury. Those mountains truly are rough, and certainly dangerous for wandering around in the dark when ill and exhausted.

[rocketsocks]

Last time I slept ROT a couple came by a shot me a nasty look, I gave it my very best "I've been lost on for days" and could you please help me find the trail. The do you have any water was the cherry on top and sent them both running the way they came...my bad.

[colorado_rob]

Actually, I think our opinions are pretty similar on the topic.

Yep, in fact, seemingly nearly everyone is pretty similar on this one, though with different spins/twists. Kind of a bad thing to do, rude, etc, but if you gotta do it, you gotta do it, just do it when no hikers will likely pass by (over, through, ....). Not sure where all the "potato" comments fit in, but "camp potato" springs to mind....

[Dogwood]

Perhaps we should amend "in an emergency" to "not becoming an emergency." By wisely using the trail to camp/rest, you avoided injury. Those mountains truly are rough, and certainly dangerous for wandering around in the dark when ill and exhausted.

There we go. Don't let YOUR HIKE YOUR LIFE become an emergency when in your power to do so. It seemed this hiker had not been kidnapped and forced to do what he/she did. This hiker had the power to CHOOSE how late into the night and how far he/she hiked and how far he/she pushed their physical limits. HYOH, although typically referred to justify one's hike, has another aspect to it. It's called being personally accountable for your hike.

[Bansko]

I suppose I should admit to my camping on the trail incident. I don't approve of it and look down upon it, but I did it. I was night hiking somewhere in VA, intending to go all night, but rain hit and I just wanted to hunker down. After several miles of scanning left and right with my headlamp and finding nothing suitable I pitched my tent right beside the trail. While it allowed plenty of room for others to pass, I was still mortified that someone would come across my transgression.

I told myself I would wake up before dawn and pack up, but I was awakened by a couple of passing hikers at around 7:00 AM making a well-deserved comment about my tent being being in a spot where it shouldn't have been. I feigned sleep and after they passed I quickly packed up before anyone else came by.

[Berserker]

From an etiquette stand point it's kinda a no no, but I would think the the LNT teetotalers would be all over this...maybe a new trend of camping right on the trail will start

[colorado_rob]

From an etiquette stand point it's kinda a no no, but I would think the the LNT teetotalers would be all over this...maybe a new trend of camping right on the trail will start

LNT = "leave no trace", I haven't heard of "BNT" = "Be no trace", meaning as long as you're not "leaving" anything, what would be the rub? (<- all said tongue in cheek)

[Dogwood]

I've never heard of "bootleg sites" but then I never camp where forest honchos have a policy of Camp Only Here. All the hundreds of miles of trails I backpack have no such policy---I camp whenever and wherever I like. Sadly, more and more areas are getting policed by the nanny state telling us where we must camp. It's lunacy. Hopefully I'll be long dead before the Cherokee and Nantahala and Jefferson and Chattahoochee national forests become regulated in such a way.

Thank goodness there are regs concerning where one can camp. Think about it TW. Do you want water sources compromised, fragile ecological/historical/cultural sites damaged/destroyed, campfire and debris remains, problems among resource users,...? Do you think without such regs and enforcement campers/hikers/trail users are always going to know and do the right thing? Heck, even with knowing regs people in their selfishness and ignorance still can have the attitude I'll do as I damn well please. Why is it that you never have issue with regs and nanny state gov't that support your own aims, like barring equestrians or bicyclists from YOUR trails? Where's the "WE" in your equation?

[BrianLe]

Seems to me that part of the discomfort of talking about this in a wide-open forum is that people read comments and evaluate them based on their own experience base. If your personal experience at backpacking is limited to mostly hiking not too-o far from trailheads, and/or on popular trails at fairly popular times --- I can understand the response of "it's never ever acceptable to camp directly on the trail, period, end of story". Certainly on any trail, anywhere, it is indeed something that should be very rare, definitely not any sort of normal practice (!). But do some long distance hiking on lesser known and loved (and not so well marked or maintained) trails and you might see the point of view that says that this stuff is somewhat context sensitive. If you've been hiking for days without seeing another human being and you go through an extensive area where there's just no flattish ground that doesn't have thick brush growing on it, I think that anyone might see the logic of setting up camp on the trail surface just before dark and packing the tent back up just as it's light out enough to see.

I suppose this is another of those topics that's difficult, and perhaps just too difficult to share ideas about without ending up with unhappy feelings. Also at work here perhaps is how we tend to give rules of thumb about various things when teaching beginning backpacking classes. In such a class there's a tendency to simplify, to boil down things to simple rules of thumb, that are in fact more nuanced for a more experienced hiker. But we want to err on the side of beginners not doing bad LNT stuff, not getting into emergency situations, etc, so we give simple rules of thumb --- and often those rules then stick in people's minds, what they hear in classes seeming to be as if writ on stone tablets by the hand of an all-knowing deity.
I certainly would not want, in a class for backpacking beginners, to say something like "you only very rarely and only under very limited conditions want to camp directly on the trail" ! Maybe I should be wiser and just think of "the internet" as a class for beginning backpackers ... :-)

[Dogwood]

I backtracked .2 miles from Kent and camped on a side trail instead of night hiking...

Some gung ho hikers would see this as a horror backtracking to camp off trail outside of the tread...I'm being facetious but that's the attitude of some gung ho hikers. I'll keep hiking until I'm spent with no idea of where or how I might sleep. Ohh by the way my knees hurt which makes it OK to sleep directly on trail.

[full conditions]

On my southbound thru I had to do a long hitch down to Concord,NH and back to Gorham all in a day. I got back on the trail around midnight with the hope of making it to the Rattle River shelter - well, once my flashlight started to wane I just decided that, what the heck, it was a warm, cloudless night so I just laid down in the trail and went to sleep - got up at first light the next morning and just started walking (naturally, I was less than a couple hundred yards from the shelter - which was just as well as the occupants most likely would not have appreciated a midnight arrival). It was a great night's sleep.

[Lnj]

Some of the official campsites on the Approach trail are not more than 20 feet from the trail. My husband and I hung out hammock about 10 feet off the trail just south of Springer on the approach. Not "on" the trail or across the trail but just off to the side of it in a bed of boulders. We weren't in anyone's way and left no trace. Never occurred to me that this could be a no-no. We were in sight of the Black Gap shelter, but a good distance away from it. Don't think anyone passed by us the next morning, but if they did, they were either quiet or we were sleeping too well to hear them.