Estate Planning for Hikers

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

One of my closest friends was divorced when her ex died at age 32 - they had 4 minor children. Because he died on-the-job, there was a workman's compensation settlement - there is a court appointed guardian who decides what - if any - of this money the mother may use to raise these children. Thus far, the <bleep> guardian has charged more in fees than he has allowed the mother to use. Since the ex had no Will, his assets were sold and are / were being held in trust for the children to receive at age 18. I knew the deceased pretty well and he would not be happy with this situation -- and it could have easily been prevented with a Will and bit of planning. Don't leave your children in similar circumstances - spell out who you want to be responsible for handling insurance proceeds on their behalf and how your assets should be distributed.

If you are older and have grown children -- spelling things out can prevent a war between the children. I've watched many of my deceased friends kids fight tooth and nail for the assets and keepsakes. We had our children put what they wanted in writing and the letters are with our Wills. We have nine kids between us and we don't want a war when we are gone. Since we each have children from previous marriages, we also do not want anyone trying to do anything like trying to force a step-parent to surrender treasured household items or assets before the step-parent passes on. Our Wills address that aspect as well.

[Ashman]

Here is a question I have.In North Carolina,if you die without a will and
have dependent children under the age of 18 I believe you said 1/3 of
your assets go to the State.

Does the state take title to the assets?ie,if pop dies and most of what
he had was land and real estate etc does the state take possession of it?
Do they sell it to provide cash for the children?

And most importantly.........what kind of fees does the State charge the
bereaved widow and heirs?

And in the case of an estate that is heavy with negotiable securities and cash,does the State appropriate the income from those securities and cash
outright or does it collect a fee instead?

Somehow I dont think the State is doing this out of the goodness of its
heart for the poor little children.

Inquiring minds want to know..............

And,yes,I have a complete plan but it is impossible to "beat the man",
although I am trying.
Oldfivetango

I know it sounds crazy but that is what happens. Actually under that scenario wife gets 1/3 the other 2/3 held for kiddos In NC under that situation all property owned by the husband gets split like I said. The state infact does take legal possesion of the property and "manages" the property. (usually they drop the liquid cash into a savings account securites can and usually are liquidated). They charge a fee for doing so which is a certian percentange up to whatever income is earned. (which is usally ALL income cuz savings accounts don't earn too much) The widow in fact has to petetion for access to these funds. I had a widow client whose husband was killed by a drunk driver of a painting truck. Ladder flew off the truck, went through the windshield and decapitated him with his son in the passenger seat while on vacation. At the condo were two half completed life insurance apps (good point that needs to be added). He had a construction company that the widow now had to run with the oversight of the state. NOT GOOD AND COMPLETELY AVOIDABLE! Long story short, the more complete your plan the better you beat the man!

I am currently in a battle with my dad about the creation of a Health Care Power of Attorney. He contends that no one in my group should be given the responsibility of making my medical decisions, while I contend that I need someone who can make quick decisions with and for me without having to try and get in touch with him, which could be tough at times.

Kirby

Kirby at the end of the day, your dad wins that argument, as a minor you are "legally incompetent" meaning you aren't allowed to make legal decisions absent your parent's consent. In NC I prepare a HCPOA-like document for parents to fill out for their minor children. If you want more info PM me. From what I have read here, you are remarkedly mature for 16 years. The more info you have and the better you debate with facts rather than emotions will help a lot with your folks I'm sure. Kudos to you for even bringing it up. 75% of the American population have done NO estate planning other than the "default plan of the state"

Nice post Ashman. Very similar to what we receive in the military before heading overseas. It is nice of you to offer it to the White blaze community, some of which are younger pups who may need it, but not know it. I loved the disclaimer as well, but am saddened to see we have gotten to that point as a country. My friends and fellow soldiers in Sweden and Finland make fun of us for our litigious society...

I would also add to be very cautious before ever giving anyone a non-Health care Power of Attorney. Or any POA for that matter. Make your choices wisely and make sure you know the habits and demeanor of the person you choose. Even this is no guarantee, but it is better than picking a newly found "drinking buddy"!!

Godd call on the wisdom of who gets chosen. You need to make the choice or the state decides for you but you need to choose wisely. If you are concerned about the amount of power you are giving someone you need to make sure you limit the POA.

[Marta]

An excellent thread. Even if the state's plans for your money and your children are not markedly different than what you might specify in your will, and even if there's no dissension among the widow and heirs, it takes YEARS to get it sorted out without a Will.

[c.coyle]

Amen Sarbar! Regarding life insurance, go with simple TERM life insurance (bascially get 10 x your annual salary) (when you die, it bascially replaces your income for your family - they take the proceeds and invest it in something getting a 10% return and voila it generates the income that you had coming in) It is less expensive that WHOLE LIFE and all the other tricky life insurance products. ...

Good advice. Whole life and "universal life" are usually not the best, and almost never the cheapest, options. It's death insurance, designed to replace income if you croak. K.I.S.S. Life insurance should not be for saving money. Buy term and invest the difference if you want to build a nest egg.

Term insurance for younger, healthy people is cheap*. Anyone with dependents - man or woman, parent or spouse - who dies without life insurance is just downright irresponsible.

* Yes, when you get older, term insurance gets more and more expensive, but the kids are out of college, the mortgage is paid, you've put some $$$ aside, so you need less.

(I'm waiting to see if we have any insurance agents here)

[NICKTHEGREEK]

I am currently in a battle with my dad about the creation of a Health Care Power of Attorney. He contends that no one in my group should be given the responsibility of making my medical decisions, while I contend that I need someone who can make quick decisions with and for me without having to try and get in touch with him, which could be tough at times.

Kirby

Kirby, my son contracted a bad case of food poisoning at college and had to be taken to the hospital by ambulance in the middle of the night. Since he was 18, they would not release any information to us without him signing a release. For about 4 agonizing hrs he could not do so. If you think we enjoyed it, we didn't. Take care of the necessary paperwork and carry it with you at all times. If you have a cell, put your contacts under ICOE -In
Case of Emergency, it's becoming well recognized.

[c.coyle]

Disagree.

Judge and the dry cleaner. ...

Oh, that's right. Tons of lawsuits like this are filed every day! How'd the judge make out?

[LIhikers]

Ya know, I've had all those documents done, but way too long ago.
I think it's time to update them. Thanks for the reminder!

[archy]

I would rather have a good lawyer than a great doctor.

[Froggy]

Something that's worthwhile (get your parents to do this, too) is to get a credit report. File it. Repeat annually, shredding the old ones. When the family is wrapping up the estate, it's a great road map to credit relationships.

My father did this and it sure helped!

[Panzer1]

I am currently in a battle with my dad about the creation of a Health Care Power of Attorney. He contends that no one in my group should be given the responsibility of making my medical decisions, while I contend that I need someone who can make quick decisions with and for me without having to try and get in touch with him, which could be tough at times.

Kirby

I got to go with your dad on that one too. You know hiking on the trail is not like being on the dark side of the moon. If your were in any hospital near the trail and you needed you parents to make a medical decision, they could drive there in less than a day. Meanwhile the doctors in the hospital would just do whatever you needed.

Panzer

[Panzer1]

Good advice. Whole life and "universal life" are usually not the best, and almost never the cheapest, options. It's death insurance, designed to replace income if you croak. K.I.S.S. Life insurance should not be for saving money. Buy term and invest the difference if you want to build a nest egg.

Whole life/Universal life insurance is more that just death insurance its also has an investment component to it where you can save and invest money in stock market, bonds, ect, take pre-approved loans at low interest rates, increase/decrease your coverage as your needs change, and many more useful features. There are also some tax advantages to the investment aspect of the policy. However, I agree that most people are better off with just simple term life insurance.

Panzer

[Jack Tarlin]

Good thread.

Kirby: Nick's post (#25 above) makes a lot of sense. Put something in writing, and put it where it can be easily found.

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

Don't want to restart the med care for minors discussion again, but I think Kirby wants someone to be able to sign for him to have non-emergent situations checked - like suspected tick bite, spider bite, bad cold - that sort of thing. As you say, a hospital would give him necessary treatment in an emergency until his parents could be contacted.

[Kirby]

Don't want to restart the med care for minors discussion again, but I think Kirby wants someone to be able to sign for him to have non-emergent situations checked - like suspected tick bite, spider bite, bad cold - that sort of thing. As you say, a hospital would give him necessary treatment in an emergency until his parents could be contacted.

That's exactly my worry. I am fully aware that under federal law hospitals must give life-saving treatment to minors, no parental consent needed. But I am worried about things like tick bites, unusual rashes, etc., where it is not life threatening, there for requiring parental consent, but is still worrysome enough to warrant going to the hospital about.

Kirby

[J5man]

Kirby, you should not experience any unusual rashes until you get to college.

[Frosty]

but am saddened to see we have gotten to that point as a country. My friends and fellow soldiers in Sweden and Finland make fun of us for our litigious society...

Hey, take it to the political forum or whatever it's called. This forum's for hiking. Thanks.

[Jan LiteShoe]

This is a good thread. People often avoid this task.

My parents courageouly addressed this problem, procurring all the necessary documents, assembling records, and then discussing their wishes with us kids. It help alot at the end, practically speaking, when the emotions are in another place.

Their example impressed me enough to do the same for myself. I think it cost all of $125 to put together a simple will, and the rest, and think through some significant questions.

Endings aren't easy, but they can be simpler. The last thing you want is for the state to be involved making your choices for you.

[buckowens]

Hey, take it to the political forum or whatever it's called. This forum's for hiking. Thanks.

Sorry Frosty, no offense intended. It was merely a comment on the crazy necessity to post a disclaimer on a hiking website. Sort of like the guy who sued Piper for running out of fuel because the airplane was not labeled "Don't run out of fuel or you will crash and die..." There I went and did it again, sorry, but they hiked in to the crash site!

[Rain Man]

... Sort of like the guy who sued Piper for running out of fuel because the airplane was not labeled "Don't run out of fuel or you will crash and die..." There I went and did it again, sorry, but they hiked in to the crash site!

Still pullin' 'em outta the ol backside, eh?

As you were asked once already, take these political lies to the political forums, please.

RainMan

.

[buckowens]

Still pullin' 'em outta the ol backside, eh?

As you were asked once already, take these political lies to the political forums, please.

RainMan

.

I apparently missed the earlier post, and will in the future refrain from making any humorous comments regarding Trial Litigation. It was foolish of me, and I hope will not lead to papers in the mail next week.

I do however think the information that Ashman posted was very good, and good of him to do. Ashman, you are a class act.

The chance of being injured on the trail is a real concern, and the better the planning, the less hassle for the hiker and family. Medic alert bracelets are a must if an allergy is known.