If a hiker is complaining that maps are too heavy, I'll make the call right now that he or she probably won't complete a thru-hike.
It's just that simple.
Last edited by Bearpaw; 10-14-2008 at 09:02.
If people spent less time being offended and more time actually living, we'd all be a whole lot happier!
Bearpaw nailed it.
And incidentally, Earl Shaffer used maps on many, many occasions during his 1948 hike, and he used the best ones he could find. The argument that the very first thru-hiker didn't rely on them or didn't feel they were necessary or very helpful is simply false.
And as to the statement that plenty of thru-hikers have finished the Trail without maps, well plenty of people have hiked without tents or other shelters; they've hiked without health insurance; they've hiked without adequate winter clothing; they've hiked without first aid kits; they've hiked without money.
Just because people have managed to finish the Trail without these sorts of things doesn't necessarily make it advisable or prudent to hike this way.
And the same holds true with maps.
Jack is right on Earl using maps. Earl knew the value of having maps and if you read his own words you can see this. In “Walking With Spring” Earl wrote the following as he was near Springer mountain:As he approached GSMNP he wrote:“Which way did the trail turn? Trees were moss-spotted. Marking was faded. Because of mail difficulties at home I had not received maps and data ordered from the Appalachian Trail Conference, and now had nothing but a road map to guide me.”“No mail was waiting at the post office but the post master gave me a map of the Great Smoky Park, showing the trail route and shelter locations. For the next few days I actually would know the names of places and what to expect.”
Sometimes crooked thinking gets straightened out around here. It's nice to know we have plenty of straighteners.
So can....
So can anyone name one person that died while Hiking the AT because they
didn't have the maps ? It may sound harsh, but if someone has indeed died
only because they didn't have the maps, then I don't believe for a minute the
Maps would have helped. Reading Camping and Woodcraft which was first
published in 1906 by Horace Kephart will help much more than any map !
Keep maps in their proper pile please. The "things I might need" pile. And
anyone beyond Boy Scout age know you never take anything from the "things
I might need" pile !
I guess some failed to notice, refuse to acknowledge, or maybe just don't
know how to use "links" that I offered several options about the Maps. One
link even offered them ! SO lighten up please, and if I do get my shoulder
rehabbed for my Feb. or late March start. I will BET that not having the maps
will have nothing at all to do with me completing my hike.
They are to heavy, to expensive, and more worldly intrusion than I want or
need.
Nuff said by me.
Some Days Your The Bug , Some Days Your The Windshield
Here's what maps can do for you:
*They'll prevent you from getting lost.
*They'll help you out immeasurably if you DO get lost.
*They'll help if you need to leave the Trail in the event of an emergency
*They'll help you get to medical help, or will help you assist others
*They'll tell you where alternate water sources are located
*They'll help you intelligently plan your hiking each day
*They'll point out other georgraphic locations and points of interest
*They'll tell you if your day's hike will be easy, moderate, or difficult
These are just a few things that maps do.
How anyone thinks that any of this detracts from anyone's enjoyment of their hike is a mystery to me.
And in that they're easy to buy used On-Line or elsewhere, the idea that they are expensive is also absurd. They'll cost you a few bucks each. You'll
pay more for a Gatorade and a couple of candy bars.
Lastly, you'll seldom be carrying more than two or three maps at any one time. To suggest that deciding to carry maps means a dramatic increase in pack weight......well that's just silly. It's a handful of ounces. If you're that concerned about cutting back on a stuff in order to save weight, there are around a hundred other things that you should cut first.
You haven't acknowledged that you were horribly misinformed on Earl carrying maps or you distorted the facts. Try reading post #163 for Earl's own words, in case you missed them the first time around.Zzzzdyd-"This guy did. First reported thru-hiker. In 1948, Earl V. Shaffer became the first to report a thru-hike, walking the entire Trail from Georgia to Maine.
Apparently the only person who doesn't know how to use the links you referenced is you. If you actually checked the links you offer, they not only don't support your point that maps aren't needed, they say they are needed, or the links are totally irrelevant.Zzzzdyd-"I guess some failed to notice, refuse to acknowledge, or maybe just don't know how to use "links" that I offered several options about the Maps. One link even offered them!"
http://www.appalachiantrail.org/site...QKtH/b.851151/
“Maps are strongly recommended for all hikers. Even though the Trail is well-marked, in an emergency you need to know how to get off the mountain as quickly as possible. Elevation profiles on the official maps also provide a graphic representation of how much up and down there is in each section.”So the reference you used, above, has maps the site says aren't intended or adequate for hiking-brilliant!http://rhodesmill.org/thefox/maps.html
“National Park Service maps are graphical documents designed and produced as general orientation and route finding maps for the lay public. They are NOT intended for backcountry hiking, navigation, GPS referencing, mountaineering, and other specialized uses for which U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) topographic maps are normally used.”
http://www.trails.com/appalachian-tr...FQEpxwodVQ_DQg Totally uselesshttp://thru-hiker.com/materials/index.php totally useless and nothing to do with maps
Last edited by The Old Fhart; 10-14-2008 at 22:40. Reason: forgot n't
Sorry that's just dumb. Too many changes, several places to make grave mistakes that can cost you. Yea I've made them.Originally Posted by bobbyw
Dogs are excellent judges of character, this fact goes a long way toward explaining why some people don't like being around them.
Woo
Note to self: If someone asks if they can look at my map, politely ask "where is yours?" as I fold mine up and put it away.
All those who sight the convenience and safety aspects of maps are correct. I'll just add that the "long green tunnel" can get pretty boring at times. Maps provide a bit of ongoing interest to a hike. Yes. We read of injuries and other mishaps that sometimes force the end of a thru hike.
But there is nothing like boredom to magnify minor hurts and ills into trail-killing reasons for quitting.
Weary
Funny thing. You pull out a pack of cigarettes and a guy bums one off you, your first impulse is to suggest he purchase his own if he's gonna smoke. You pull out a quart of Gatorade you just brought from town and a guy asks you for the first belt off of it, you'd give him a funny look. You dig out a Snickers Bar and some guy asks you for a bite, you'd tell him to jump off a cliff. You're working on a burger in a Trailside restaurant and a hiker you barely know asks you to buy him lunch and a beer, you'd think he was nuts.
But just about EVERY time you take out a map with other folks around, some cheapskate mapless dude is guaranteed to ask if he can borrow it for a few minutes. It happens all the time.
Mooching is mooching. Don't do it.
Tin Man,
AMEN, AMEN, AMEN!!!
Unless they are in real danger or injured, let those who refuse to be prepared suffer.
This is how hard headed people learn!
It has been said that a journey begins with a single step. I say hogwash! It starts with a dream.
Jack Tarlin,
Absolutely correct!!
It is a matter of personal responsibility, some of us have it, some don't!
Sad.
It has been said that a journey begins with a single step. I say hogwash! It starts with a dream.
Also, anyone who really knows how to use a map and compass would not be caught without it, just like toilet paper!
If you don't know how to use a map, thru hiking is a great opportunity to learn, while you already know where you are, you can't learn when you are lost and hungry!
Get a book, or take some classes, don't be stuck on stupid!
It has been said that a journey begins with a single step. I say hogwash! It starts with a dream.
I'm guessing many who don't bring maps are stuck on stupid, both in terms of map literacy and essential gear literacy. I am done sharing, but I offer lessons... if the one asking has a map.
This reminds me of a few thru-hikers we ran into in NH this year looking to mooch something. No joke, a couple of folks asked if we had any water to spare AFTER they just passed a water source a mile or so before we saw them. Others were putting on some kind of yogi act when they saw us eating. After I educated my brother on what was what, we always ignored or replied no to any implicit or explicit mooching requests. I started thinking that talking to thru-hikers was not such a great idea.
I'm doing Shenandoah soon - it has all kinds of trail signs, granite markers and everything to mark the trail. Still I am carrying maps. I don't leave home without them. They are like having the right sleeping bag for the temps, a container for water, and food for the trip. They are a necessity not a luxury, because one can never bank on what may happen on a journey....
And another thing....there's some VERY pretty stuff in Shenandoah Park that isn't on the A.T. This includes views, waterfalls, you name it, and lots of this stuff is just minutes from the Appalachian Trail.
Without a map you might never know it was there.
speaking of maps... which ones are the most useful and the lightest?
Hiking Navigation 101, for those who don't know or understand the basics.
Click on compass navigation at bottom of page for further instructions.
WALK ON
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