The slumping economy - impact on the trail?

[chief]

Thanks, Weary.......for making our corporations pay more for their workers......which in turn, makes the product more expensive........which makes more people unable to afford their product........which makes people purchase said products from another country at a lower price.......which makes said company fire more overpaid workers.......which makes more people unable to buy said overpriced items.....which..........

What's the use..........

Let's do it the other way...

Banish all unions and orgs who would demand decent wages - these people need to get with it, they are ignorant, blue collar peons and not deserving.
Our companies will pay less for their workers - our products will be less expensive.
We will export our inexpensive products to THAT RICH COUNTRY.
Oops, we are THAT RICH COUNTRY, where there's no market for our cheap products since we've decided our workers really don't need much!
Never fear, working children in Bangladesh are making great strides in buying power.

[Bulldawg]

Jesus Christ, Does anyone north of let's say Maryland think that a worker should EARN his money rather than have some Union big wheel intimidate management into giving it to him. Since Weary told his story, let's try this one on for size.

I do not belong to a Union. I have never ever thought I wanted a Union. I make a decent wage. I am able to pay my bills. We do not drive brand new cars. We live in a fair sized house, with the heat and AC we need to feel comfortable. I had a fine TBone steak last night from a cow I happen to have helped fatten up and slaughter. That steak was enjoyed with a baked potato out of my garden. I don't go to a gym to exercise, I hike a little bit here and there, in between working to earn my wage, working in my garden, or with my animals. I still wouldn't join a Union if the opportunity arouse. Even if it meant higher pay where I would not have to garden to afford all the food we wanted. Even if it meant higher pay where I would not have to raise cows and pigs to afford all the food we wanted. Even if it meant higher pay where I would not have to raise laying chickens to afford all the eggs we wanted. Even if it meant higher pay where I would not have to hike to get all the exercise we wanted. Unions have done exactly what everyone here with the exception of a few here have claimed. They have driven up the price of American goods to a point where we can no longer compete on the world market. Thanks a lot Weary!!

[rafe]

Unions have done exactly what everyone here with the exception of a few here have claimed. They have driven up the price of American goods to a point where we can no longer compete on the world market. Thanks a lot Weary!!

Another ignorant fool blaming unions for all that ails America. How many union salaries equals one Tiger Woods annual endorsement contract or one CEO salary?

[oldfivetango]

Like an Estwing or Stanley hammer?
They are still made in the US.
I worked for many years in the steel industry and also in foundry and casting. I agree that a lot of foundry work has gone to Mexico and China, but there are still a lot of tools manufactured in the US, especially professional quality tools.

http://www.stillmadeinusa.com/tools.html#handtools

Thanks for this info.The day I was looking for a hammer
2 years ago at Ace and Loewe's,I could not find a Stanley
and the hammers they had were all made in China.So I
bought one and it is driving nails just fine but I would rather
have bought American.
Oldfivetango

[oldfivetango]

Another ignorant fool blaming unions for all that ails America. How many union salaries equals one Tiger Woods annual endorsement contract or one CEO salary?

I dont have to buy anything from Tiger Woods.
CEO's get what their boards and stock holders think they
have to pay in order to have the services of the CEO lest
he/she goes elsewhere.

A guy making $8 bucks an hour is not going to be able to
buy one from somebody in Detroit making $80 an hour
but he might stretch and buy the one made in Tenessee
by Honda who is paying about $48 an hour.(provided it is
"pre-owned) of course!
Oldfivetango

[mudhead]

Has Stanley moved their corporate back onshore?

[4eyedbuzzard]

Has Stanley moved their corporate back onshore?

Never moved to my knowledge. A move to Bermuda(tax haven) was considered in 2002 but never happened. I think they're still in CT.

[Bulldawg]

Another ignorant fool blaming unions for all that ails America. How many union salaries equals one Tiger Woods annual endorsement contract or one CEO salary?

Are you jealous you don't have Tiger Woods' salary and talent?

[4eyedbuzzard]

Lets all please tone down personal remarks.

KEEP IT POLITE PLEASE

Thank you

[Bulldawg]

Another ignorant fool blaming unions for all that ails America. How many union salaries equals one Tiger Woods annual endorsement contract or one CEO salary?

I'm outta this fight Terp. You seem like the ignorant fool for thinking you could change my mind.

I stand behind the notion that I don't need or desire a union to get my salary for me, I will continue to do it the old fashioned way, the way that made this country great, by EARNING it. I don't need or desire hand outs. If the nation continues to slip into oblivion, I will be OK because I do not need to rely on anything other than the sweat of my brow to get by. So take the ignorant fool comment back to the hand out line Turd, because there I will not be, so there I will not see you.

[Lone Wolf]

moderators calling non-moderators names. what's this site coming to?

[Rockhound]

my only beef with unions is the lowered productivity that frequently occurs. 3 men doing the job of 1, leaving early for breaks, coming back late, milking jobs rather than getting the job done. weve all seen our fair share of shovel leaning as we pass construction crews on the highway. Need I mention the Big Dig in Boston? Protecting a workers rights and benefits is fine but when the result is a lazy unproductive workforce there is a problem

[Bulldawg]

my Only Beef With Unions Is The Lowered Productivity That Frequently Occurs. 3 Men Doing The Job Of 1, Leaving Early For Breaks, Coming Back Late, Milking Jobs Rather Than Getting The Job Done. Weve All Seen Our Fair Share Of Shovel Leaning As We Pass Construction Crews On The Highway. Need I Mention The Big Dig In Boston? Protecting A Workers Rights And Benefits Is Fine But When The Result Is A Lazy Unproductive Workforce There Is A Problem

Exactly!

[nitewalker]

my only beef with unions is the lowered productivity that frequently occurs. 3 men doing the job of 1, leaving early for breaks, coming back late, milking jobs rather than getting the job done. weve all seen our fair share of shovel leaning as we pass construction crews on the highway. Need I mention the Big Dig in Boston? Protecting a workers rights and benefits is fine but when the result is a lazy unproductive workforce there is a problem

ditto. the unions are for the weak who cant handle things on their own..self reliance and plain old ambition is all i need...raising chickens for the eggs is as good as it get.....peace

[weary]

Jesus Christ, Does anyone north of let's say Maryland think that a worker should EARN his money rather than have some Union big wheel intimidate management into giving it to him. Since Weary told his story, let's try this one on for size.

.....Unions have done exactly what everyone here with the exception of a few here have claimed. They have driven up the price of American goods to a point where we can no longer compete on the world market. Thanks a lot Weary!!

Bulldawg, you've read and believed too many myths about unions. Most locals have no "Union big wheel to intimidate management."

Most unions are run by volunteer workers in the plant or workplace. Unions are simply groups of workers who get together to negotiate a contract with their employers, just as employers get together with suppliers to negotiate favorable contracts for the goods and services they need.

The union we created in a Chicago factory had no employees. It simply got together with management and negotiated a contract they both could live with. The president and chief negotiator worked in the maintenance machine shop, turning out parts for machines that he had helped design and which occasionally broke down.

I worked for the largest newspaper in Maine. But the union had no employees. The President was a copy editor, during most of my time at the paper. Now it's an editorial writer.

Negotiations for new contracts occurred every two or three years. Negotiations typically lasted many months, sometimes more than a year. Settlements were usually based on member prospects for backpay, and management's boredom with having to spend a half day every couple of weeks rehashing working arangements and pay schedules.

These examples are not unusual. It is how most union locals function.

Sometimes locals hire skilled negotiators to help break a deadlock. But that doesn't involve intimidation. Intimidation doesn't work. Negotiation consists of convincing management to agree to a contract that is mutually advantageous.

Weary

[Bulldawg]

Bulldawg, you've read and believed too many myths about unions. Most locals have no "Union big wheel intimidate management."

Most unions are run by volunteer workers in the plant or workplace. Unions are simply groups of workers who get together to negotiate a contract with their employers, just as employers get together with suppliers to negotiate favorable contracts for the goods and services they need.

The union we created in a Chicago factory had no employees. It simply got together with management and negotiated a contract they both could live with. The president and chief negotiator worked in the maintenance machine shop, turning out parts for machines that broke down.

I worked for the largest newspaper in Maine. But the union had no employees. The President was a copy editor, during most of my time at the paper. Now it's an editorial writer.

Negotiations for new contracts occurred every two or three years. They typically lasted many months, sometimes years. Settlements were usually based on member prospects for backpay, and management's boredom with having to spend a half day every couple of weeks rehashing working arangements and pay schedules.

These examples are not unusual. It is how most union locals work.

Sometimes they bring in skilled negotiators to help break a deadlock. But that doesn't involve intimidation. Intimidation doesn't work. Negotiation consists of convincing management to agree to a contract that is mutually advantageous.

Weary

the unions are for the weak who cant handle things on their own..self reliance and plain old ambition is all i need...raising chickens for the eggs is as good as it get.....peace

..

[weary]

my only beef with unions is the lowered productivity that frequently occurs. 3 men doing the job of 1, leaving early for breaks, coming back late, milking jobs rather than getting the job done. weve all seen our fair share of shovel leaning as we pass construction crews on the highway. Need I mention the Big Dig in Boston? Protecting a workers rights and benefits is fine but when the result is a lazy unproductive workforce there is a problem

Productivity is a function of management.

Weary

[TD55]

moderators calling non-moderators names. what's this site coming to?

Looks like a debate between the know nothings and the know it alls.

[gaga]

Looks like a debate between the know nothings and the know it alls.

actually is really healthy to let it out, and let other people see that hikers are not just some dumb, backpacking, dirty,ignorant,uncivilized,lazy,smelly...people, and YES the "economy" will affect the nr.of people going on the trail,because many of them already have the gear but will not have the $$$ to support themselves with(food,food... ) you can be the champion of the minimalists... but you need food in your belly to live and that costs money, if food was free i`l stop working today. it all comes down to money,sad but true.it happened to me this spring...i wanted to go(baaaad) but i had to stay and work for: money !!!

[Rockhound]

Productivity is a function of management.

Weary

productivity is the resposibility of each individual.