Skills you can use on the AT for first timers...

[Wise Old Owl]

There isn’t really a good way to start this thread, we have all done it, we buy things thinking “I need that” Well after a few years of messing around I came to a conclusion that we don’t need this or that. But when you are on the trail there is one thing we all need to survive and that is fire making skills in a downpour. And look at all the confusing things that are floating around out there. I have played around a lot in the field and watched some of those survival shows to dismay. I have watched hundreds of scouts collect firewood in the field and they just don’t get it. There is not a right or wrong answer; there is a bottom line…. Can you start a fire in a downpour? Have you tried? On the AT that in my mind will make the difference. No I am not testing survival skills here, but you need to know a few things that might make a difference. I think this is an important skill that needs to be posted here for first time readers. First the scout that got off trail in the whites made fire with hand sanitizer in snow. Could you do that? Some of us can, others can’t.

First when gathering wood does something unusual! Collect pine if you can. Not hardwoods. We are not going to screw up a chimney with creosote. Pine is loaded with pitch a natural source of turpentine, the “maple syrup” of pine trees and it’s highly flammable, the bark protects the pine tree to a degree from exploding in a fire. You are making a survival fire not a cooking fire.

Second you need to collect large quantities of ½ inch dead fall or smaller. (No logs) If you find a working log that’s great, but this is useless for the first hour in a storm. When I say a large quantity I am talking about collection the size of your car engine – not a bread box collection. Collecting a fallen branch or two makes collection easy, drag the whole thing to your camp spot, otherwise remove all the deadfall from the site and pile it up make sure you collect large amounts of twigs.

So you are going to need to remove the bark in a rain storm and keep the wood dry until you light it. Yep your poncho or tarp needs to go up first, not the fire. Shelter is number one. You pitch that before anything else. Then you can work with a rain jacket or Gortex Jacket and collect the pile you need to start with. Keep in mind if you are successful you are going to be able to dry things out! But you need to carry a lightweight very sharp knife (hopefully not a China knockoff) Small and lightweight such as a easy to find CRKT Drifter.

So now we reach for a starter out of the pack – here again I take opposition to what is available. Today there is so much more than doing old stuff like Vaseline covered cotton balls to catch a spark. 200 years ago it was patches of carbonized cotton to light a candle with flint & steel. Today we have chemicals! Science! Before you go out and buy another flint and magnesium block, wax soaked wood shavings, paper, junk matches, strike anywhere blue and a host of other fire starting stuff. I am going to narrow it down for you. The GI use a cooking chemical in a pinch that is found at some Army Navy stores, I have a few packs but they are not easy to find. So a good starter would be something that lasts five minutes and dries out the wood and gets it going under all circumstances. Esbit is such a chemical that does the job. Storing it in a 35 mm can with some wind matches from REI and a striker is a better answer than any magnesium block striker. And can be lighter in weight. This is over and above a second runner up of the liquid Heat or wood grain alcohol as we don’t have to wait a minute or two for the alcohol to soak in before lighting. The bigger danger is adding alcohol when it somewhat goes out. Tossing in a second Esbit is far more safer. So I will open it up for safety skills and other thoughts on this subject with a caveat-If you have never had to try to make a fire in a down pour tell us so. I just hiked some 18 miles yesterday on the AT in a downpour so know you know why I was thinking about this…

[Jack Tarlin]

Nice photo, but in my experience, Coghlan "waterproof" matches are pretty much worthless, as ANY degree of moisture whatsover, despite how well you wrap them, will render them worthless.

My guaranteed firestarter has worked like a charm for many years now, and it isn't made by Coghlan.

It's made by the Zippo people of Bradford, Pennsylvania.

If it ain't broke, don't mess with it.

[Wise Old Owl]

Nothing wrong with a Zippo, but dunk a Bic or have a high humidity and Bic won't light, I was including a picture of a Wind Match and recommended the Rei version not Coglans. But for photography all I had was Coglans lying around. This is for folks just joining up....

[DaveJohns]

Good start! are you going to make this a "step by step" instruction? I have had the fun of trying to get a fire going in nasty conditions, it is a challenge when everything goes right. Possibly a list of things to do/things not to do, would be useful. BTW, good point about getting the twigs and such under cover. When I am hiking in the rain, I will start grabbing a few twigs and putting them in my pants or jacket pocket a couple of hours before I plan to stop. My body heat will help get them dried out as I move. When I get to my campsite, I know I at least have dry tinder in my pocket.

for anyone who is reading this who has never had to light a fire in bad weather, this is absolutely essential knowledge that can save your life! Next time it is raining at home, go outside and see what kind of luck you have getting a small fire started... It can be a humbling experience.

Also, for those who say "I have an alcohol/coleman/whatever stove, I dont need to make a fire" -- those won't dry you out and keep you warm in an emergency. Its worth having the knowledge and practice under your belt just in case.

[DaveJohns]

Argh for not being able to edit posts. Another critical thing is CARRY 3 WAYS to make fire. (and be skilled at all 3!) I carry a bic or two, a firesteel with cotton balls and esbit tabs, and waterproof matches.

[nox]

my never-fail fire starter is my pocket rocket and a light my fire -fire steel. The fire starter sends a spark no matter what. Fresh out of the river it took me 2 flicks and i had sparks spraying. The pocket rocket does the rest. Just make sure you have collected your twigs, branches and whatever else you intend to burn handy and make a nice tight bundle and put it above. DON"T LEAVE THE STOVE UNDER THE FIRE!! as soon as it is burning under its own power remove the stove so you don't become a victim of tank explosion.

[Erin]

Very good suggestions and thank you. I am not a good firestarter in bad conditions. However, a damp lighter? Shake it hard upside down and rub the starter, the thing one flicks two or three turns quicly on dry clothes and it will usually start right up. That is an old smoker's tip. I do carry those starter sticks and the waterproof matches for safety. I would like to learn how to use a firesteel. I have stuffed sticks in my pockets to have dry tender only because I learned that from someone else. Good tip. I have never been in a situation to need a fire for survivial, but the above poster is correct. I need to learn how, just in case.

[Tractor]

A little add..... once you have finally nursed a little fire before a real downpour you might be able to save it if you can find a couple of support rocks and one cover rock. Make a little oven, so to speak, and roll the top rock off after the big rain. Still may need to tend it well if there is a lot of "tree rain" later though. Funny how that tree rain can last hours after isn't it......

[SunnyWalker]

Pitch wood is what you need for a fire in bad weather.

[Wise Old Owl]

Pitch wood is what you need for a fire in bad weather.

I mentioned that, However you do not need to bring your own in you pack....you can collect that on the trail.

Pitch Wood is from very old pine stumps where the pitch has dried up to a very fragrant solid wood that lights with a single match.

Dave Jones - starting a fire with a Pocket Rocket is an excellent idea, only I take that on long trips, not the short ones.

[Wise Old Owl]

Between a micro bic and a couple of windmatches and single esbit in a 35mm can - the flint & steel & magnesium bars can stay home.... The bic will give you hundreds of lights and if it fails you still have a few wind matches. total weight 1oz vs the several oz's of the other suggestions..

[DaveJohns]

I mentioned that, However you do not need to bring your own in you pack....you can collect that on the trail.

Pitch Wood is from very old pine stumps where the pitch has dried up to a very fragrant solid wood that lights with a single match.

Dave Jones - starting a fire with a Pocket Rocket is an excellent idea, only I take that on long trips, not the short ones.

Sorry, t'werent me. I go woodburner all the way.

[Mags]

...and while you are all getting a fire going in the pouring rain I'll be in my shelter, tucked in a warm sleeping bag (insert a wonkish discussion on secret Army manuals that discuss fiber construction of the baffles of down or some crap like that) and writing in my journal. Why? Because I carried my shelter and sleeping bag! And that's going to keep me warmer than a fire....

[vamelungeon]

my never-fail fire starter is my pocket rocket and a light my fire -fire steel. The fire starter sends a spark no matter what. Fresh out of the river it took me 2 flicks and i had sparks spraying. The pocket rocket does the rest. Just make sure you have collected your twigs, branches and whatever else you intend to burn handy and make a nice tight bundle and put it above. DON"T LEAVE THE STOVE UNDER THE FIRE!! as soon as it is burning under its own power remove the stove so you don't become a victim of tank explosion.

I have a Light My Fire steel as well, and they are great. I'd rather have it than a Bic or my old Zippo.

[Hokie]

Helpful post. If someone wants a fire steel, the small Lite My Fire version weighs 14 grams (0.5 oz) and strikes 3000 times before it wears out. The small Sparklite weights 6 grams for 1000 strikes.

[fredmugs]

1,580 miles hiked so far and I've yet to build a fire. Tell me why I need this skill in order to survive?

[Lone Wolf]

[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]There isn’t really a good way to start this thread, we have all done it, we buy things thinking “I need that” Well after a few years of messing around I came to a conclusion that we don’t need this or that. But when you are on the trail there is one thing we all need to survive and that is fire making skills in a [B][I][U]downpour.

huh? i don't think so. you need a good brain to survive

[Lumburg54]

fredmugs - If you hike that many miles chances are that you may find yourself hiking or camping, maybe even hunting somewhere that could put you in a survival situation. If it were a planned event, it wouldn't be survival. In my humble opinion, anyone stepping foot into the woods should at least know basic first aid and have the ability to start a fire.

I don't wish a survival situation on anyone but it should would help if we all had these two basic skills, just in case.

Who knows, maybe someday you save MY life on the trail with a survival fire

Okay - Preaching done

[Spokes]

...and while you are all getting a fire going in the pouring rain I'll be in my shelter, tucked in a warm sleeping bag (insert a wonkish discussion on secret Army manuals that discuss fiber construction of the baffles of down or some crap like that) and writing in my journal. Why? Because I carried my shelter and sleeping bag! And that's going to keep me warmer than a fire....

I tend to agree with Mags although following this thread has been interesting.

BTW, someone in another post mentioned construction adhesive (carried in a small bottle) was a great fire starter. They said even if it dried out the stuff would burn hot, long and crazy. Who'd a thunk.........

[Slo-go'en]

This only works in New England, but the best fire starter is White Birch bark. There never seems to be any near a shelter, so pick it up along the trail, but don't peel it off of live trees!

On my little LT/AT Vermont hike this fall, one day it drizzled all day. I had a nice little fire going at the shelter when a collage group showed up at about dusk. Since there were already 4-5 of us in the shelter, the collage group went off to set up tarps. A little while later, three of the kids came over and asked me "Sir, where can we find dry fire wood?" It was real hard not to say "What, you didn't carry some with you?"