Seam Sealing a tent

[Don H]

I seam sealed a 3 year old Eureka Spitfire tent fly and now the sealing is peeling off. I called Eureka before I sealed it to verify that I should use regular tent seam seal even though the fly appeared to me to be siliconized nylon.

Any ideas on why it's peeling?
What's the easiest way to remove the old sealant so I can reseal it?
What type of seal should I be using, regular seam seal or silicon seal?

Thanks!

[frisbeefreek]

Another question along a similar thread--

Can I dilute silicon sealant with white gas (I don't have any mineral spirits around the house)?

[Pacific Tortuga]

I do not think there are any "easy" ways to remove old sealant.

Mix silicone caulk with mineral spirits (thick paste) apply with thin foam brush.

That is what I would do but I'm sure there are better sealing/removal ways out there by someone here on WB's.

[butts0989]

us McNetts SilNet, the stuff is amazing, NEver peels

[Don H]

Another question along a similar thread--

Can I dilute silicon sealant with white gas (I don't have any mineral spirits around the house)?

Yes I believe so but mineral spirits are recommended.http://www.tarptent.com
"Silicone is the only material that will stick to the fabric. Urethane sealer will flake off. An inexpensive product that works well is GE Silicone II clear sealer/glue. It is available as a squeeze tube in most US hardware stores or in the Tarptent Store. Set up the tent ouside in a in a well-ventilated location. Mix about a tablespoon of silicone with a couple of tablespoons of mineral spirits(paint thinner) and then apply the solution with a small foam brush. Add more mineral spirits if the solution gets too thick. Avoid skin contact and breathing fumes."

?

[Don H]

us McNetts SilNet, the stuff is amazing, NEver peels

It won't peel on regular urethane coated nylon? SilNet is designed for silicon nylon. If Eureka had told me it was silicon nylon when I called and asked I would have uses SilNet. I have some and use it on my Tarptent Rainbow. Even Eureka's website states "We recommend use of a sealer such as Kenyon Seam Sealer 3 or McNett Outdoor SeamGrip". I used Kenyon Seam Sealer, note they do not mention SilNet.

So how do I get the old stuff off?
Is the fly siliconized nylon?

[mudhead]

Worth it to buy the no or low odor mineral spirits. Worth the trip to Depot.

Ventilate. Even the no/low odor smells some, but is way better. Pass on the gas.

[butts0989]

ya i emailed shires about this, Silnet is a silicon based sealer, ive had it on my contrail for a solid 2 years and numerous trips, its been amazing

[butts0989]

oops sorry forgot to read that last post, thought you were dealing with sil nylon

[Franco]

I have no idea what Eureka is using but if it is siliconized nylon the fabric will feel the same on both sides, IE slippery.
For that you need to use SilNet or 100% pure silicone and dilute it, or Permatex followable silicone.
Note that the standard windows/floor silicone (usually in 12" cylinders ) is not the same stuff as 100% silicone sold in 3 oz tubes.

If the underside feels a bit rubbery , then it is a PU coating, and that needs Seam Net or similar stuff.
Note when mixing that it is much easier to start with a blob of silicone and a few drops of thinner and then gradually add thinner to it. Same as making white sauce and adding milk...
Franco

[Toolshed]

Which Spitfire model do you have? the 1/2 or the UL? I believe the UL has a silnylon fly with an interior PU coating.
Also, I believe the Kenyon is a water-based seam sealant, but I don't understand why the original need to seam seal a fly with taped seams?

[Tinker]

I'm pretty sure the Spitfire has a fly which is siliconized on the outside and polyurethane coated on the inside. If it is (was) taped on the inside, that's what it is. Do not use silicone on the inside if this is the case. Use McNett Seam Grip. It is designed to stick to polyurethane, and does a great job. I just sold a tent which I sealed 12 years ago. The Seam Grip was like new.

[Don H]

I have the Spitfire UL. It seems to have a rubber (urethane) coating inside but is slick like siliconized nylon outside. The seams are taped inside. So I guess the answer is scrape off the loose sealer and leave it since it was taped anyway. The directions from Eureka are contradictory and confusing which is why I called customer service and asked what to use. The directions state "Decide which seams need to be sealed. For example, seams that will be exposed to rain, runoff, or ground level water are a must for sealing, while seams on uncoated nylon or mesh panels won't need treatment. You won't need to seal the seams in the roof or the factory taped seams either. We recommend sealing both floor & fly seams and reinforcements."

[Toolshed]

Yeah... clear as mud.... The only areas on any tent that I have had to seam seal are the reinforcement tie out areas on the floor - These are the round double fabric sections near the bottom of the tent body on the side walls or on corners to reinforce tie-outs, where the stitching is not taped.

[Powder River]

Is it possible that Eureka has no idea what their tents are made of?

I just sealed my GG tent and used a food syringe with mineral spirits/silicon. I made the mix somewhat runny and was able to apply a bead along every seam, then use a foam brush to rub it in. Easiest seam job I've ever done, and no chance of peeling since it is so thin. I would recommend this method if you're going to try again.

[drifters quest]

Was the stitching clean when you applied the sealant? I know on the silnet it says on used tents to first clean with alcohol. I don't know if that might have anything to do with it.

[Roland]

Don H,

You were right to call Eureka to find out what type of fabric they use. As you know, silicone impregnated nylon and PU coated fabric require different seam sealants.

Silnylon must be sealed with a silicone based sealant. These can be thinned with mineral spirits. Some folks use silicone caulk, and thin with mineral spirits (as HS advises). Others prefer buying a sealant made specifically for the application. In my opinion, McNett's ready-to-use silnylon sealants are way too thick to do a nice job, so I thin these, as well.

PU coated fabric must be sealed using a urethane sealant. Here's where things can get tricky. Some urethane sealants can be thinned with mineral spirits, but others are water-based and cannot be thinned with spirits. Reading the packaging is important.

Franco gives good advice on determining what kind of fabric you have.

Based on the information you provided, I believe you have a PU coated tent. You should use a urethane sealant; which you did.

Why did it peel? Poor adhesion. You mentioned it was a 3-year old tent. Unless you cleaned it, you applied the sealant over dust and dirt. Your sealant simply did not stick. Most ready-mix sealants I have seen are too thick to penetrate into thread holes; the stuff just sits on top of the seam and does not bond well. Unless you have a clean surface, it will peel.

Have you ever applied DWR to the tent? This, too, could lead to poor adhesion of seam sealants.

The solution is to peel the sealant that is loose, clean the area with alcohol and reapply.

Good luck.

[Don H]

The tent was new when I sealed it but that was 3 years ago, sorry for the confusion on that point. This is my son's tent that he uses when backpacking with the Scouts. Several boys bought these tents from a local sporting goods store that had a great sale on them at the time.

I think I'm going to peel off what's loose and see if it leaks. I'm thinking it shouldn't since the seems are taped. I'll also seal the tie out points.

Thanks for all the great advice!