Beligerant son

[squeezebox]

Beligerant Son !!
I want to do a 2 week section with my son in Aug.
my son wants to hang out with his friends all summer, not cut the grass, or help do anything, video games. My ex-wife doesn't make him do anything. WE argue less than we uses to. all 3 of us. she would like to see him go, but is unwilling to to put any pressure on him , extreme conflict avoidance, but dumps on me afterwards.
I'm afraid Colin and I would get into a big argument on the trail, trail folks would back him up. " He's 16 can make his own decisions" I would be tempted to take ALL the equipment and let him fend for himself. I am very tired if his biligerance. and am very tired of her not showing any consequenses of his bad behavior and undermining me if I try to show consequences to bad behavior.
But last night he and I cut the grass together sat down and watched TV a while , generally did some cooperative quality time.
So what to do about the beligerant son??

[jbwood5]

Beligerant Son !!
I want to do a 2 week section with my son in Aug.
my son wants to hang out with his friends all summer, not cut the grass, or help do anything, video games. My ex-wife doesn't make him do anything. WE argue less than we uses to. all 3 of us. she would like to see him go, but is unwilling to to put any pressure on him , extreme conflict avoidance, but dumps on me afterwards.
I'm afraid Colin and I would get into a big argument on the trail, trail folks would back him up. " He's 16 can make his own decisions" I would be tempted to take ALL the equipment and let him fend for himself. I am very tired if his biligerance. and am very tired of her not showing any consequenses of his bad behavior and undermining me if I try to show consequences to bad behavior.
But last night he and I cut the grass together sat down and watched TV a while , generally did some cooperative quality time.
So what to do about the beligerant son??

See if he will go if one of his friends goes.
Unfortunately, your problem is not that uncommon and it can be a bad problem. Push for the hike.

[weary]

Time often heals problems. I figured that sometime between their ages of 10 and 12 I lost control of my kids. From then on I could set examples, and nudge, but not command. The three turned out to be good and responsible citizens, nevertheless.

They also come by from time to time to help out with the aging handicaps. They and my grandkids even spend multiple hours working on the 22 miles of town land trust trails that I'm responsble for maintaining.

[wythekari]

A couple of ideas ...
Let him go his own way but after a talk about how family responisibility earns car keys and work around the house earns cash - if he wants more he is welcome to work outside the home for it. Or...
Plan the trip and keep up the attempts at communicating - a break through can happen at anytime. I planned a Grand Canyon rim to river and rtn hike w/my 15 yr old several years back. He didn't care for the spring training regimen I put in place (get up early, hit the trail head, then up and down) for Saturdays. But by time we did the hike we had been to elevation (11k ft) and could go 11+ miles in a mtn day w/o trouble. That father/son trip helped cement us forever - he now lives in LA and leads his friends on hikes in the hills and after many wkends we connect on where we each hiked. Plus, when he visits he always wants to get outside to a new place together.
Good luck.

[sbhikes]

Does he want to go hiking with you? If not, maybe some time away from him and the wife will do you all some good.

[kanga]

Beligerant Son !!
I want to do a 2 week section with my son in Aug.
my son wants to hang out with his friends all summer, not cut the grass, or help do anything, video games. My ex-wife doesn't make him do anything. WE argue less than we uses to. all 3 of us. she would like to see him go, but is unwilling to to put any pressure on him , extreme conflict avoidance, but dumps on me afterwards.
I'm afraid Colin and I would get into a big argument on the trail, trail folks would back him up. " He's 16 can make his own decisions" I would be tempted to take ALL the equipment and let him fend for himself. I am very tired if his biligerance. and am very tired of her not showing any consequenses of his bad behavior and undermining me if I try to show consequences to bad behavior.
But last night he and I cut the grass together sat down and watched TV a while , generally did some cooperative quality time.
So what to do about the beligerant son??

seriously? i don't blame him then for not wanting to go with you. that is the action of an irresponsible ass, not a loving concerned parent. he's 16. you lost the chance to gain his respect a long time ago. if he doesn't want to hang out with you then there's probably a reason. sounds like your son is paying for you and your wife not having good parenting skills. i feel badly for him.

[Old Hiker]

Had the same type of problem 15 years ago. Wife and I let sons take a friend along for a 6 day AT trip. We let them go ahead or behind and as long as we knew where they were camping (had to be within 1/4 mile), they could do their thing. Caried all their won gear, food, etc. 3rd day - they were staying fairly close. 50/50 on success - #1 is doing OK, #2 is not. 35 and 31 y/o now. Good luck.

[shorembo]

As an example of 'all is not lost', here's my experience with my son.

When we were in scouts , I had a hard time getting him to do any physical activity, including hiking. At 15, he chose not to go on our troop's hike on the AT but stay at the base camp with the younger scouts.

Now, he is 20 and when I offered a week hike on the AT this August, he said OK with no problem.

Go figure.

[Tipi Walter]

I can't even find adult hikers to go out backpacking, so what's the problem? They either complain about the heat and humidity, or whine about the rattleheads, or squirm under load during a 3,000 foot climb, or chortle and wince at the thought of camping in a blizzard at 0F. I'd say your son is totally normal. What kid wants to hump 75 lbs on a 21 day trip with me, or with anyone?

But seriously, it may be that the worst part of the whole endeavor is getting him out and actually on the trail. The lead-up could kill you. Then, once hiking and sleeping outdoors, he probably will adjust and find some amount of joy to be with you in a natural setting one-on-one. It would really help if you had a few swimholes along the way.

[Snowleopard]

Beligerant Son !!
I want to do a 2 week section with my son in Aug.
my son wants to hang out with his friends all summer, not cut the grass, or help do anything, video games. My ex-wife doesn't make him do anything. WE argue less than we uses to. all 3 of us. she would like to see him go, but is unwilling to to put any pressure on him , extreme conflict avoidance, but dumps on me afterwards.
I'm afraid Colin and I would get into a big argument on the trail, trail folks would back him up. " He's 16 can make his own decisions" I would be tempted to take ALL the equipment and let him fend for himself. I am very tired if his biligerance. and am very tired of her not showing any consequenses of his bad behavior and undermining me if I try to show consequences to bad behavior.
But last night he and I cut the grass together sat down and watched TV a while , generally did some cooperative quality time.
So what to do about the beligerant son??

I've been through some of this. It's tough when ex-spouses don't agree on discipline.

Try for more 'cooperative quality time'.
It sounds like he doesn't want to go on this hike and I'd say don't make him go.
It might make sense to sit down with him and figure out a vacation that you would both enjoy. For me and my sons, one time that worked out well was 2 weeks around Seattle and Vancouver, one week spent in the cities staying in hostels (they love cities and I enjoyed it too) and one week of relaxed camping in the Cascades with visits back into towns when it rained.

[Gaiter]

start doing day hikes with him but let him bring a friend on those hikes, get him talking about the up coming section, if his friend thinks its a cool thing then his mood will be better about, to teenagers a friend approval is very important...

i'll also throw in a suggestion of looking for a section with a good swimming hole, nothing like a nice swim on a hot day to relax the body and wash away a bad mood...

and two weeks can be an awful long time to a teenager, maybe cut it to a week with him and then a week by yourself...

but what ever you do if he really really doesn't want to go then don't force him to go on the hike, you will both be miserable

[Hoop]

Remember when you were a teenager?

[max patch]

I can't imagine anything worse -- for both of you -- than forcing someone to do a 2 week hike who doesn't want to do it. I'd make other plans. Good luck.

[Tipi Walter]

I can't imagine anything worse -- for both of you -- than forcing someone to do a 2 week hike who doesn't want to do it. I'd make other plans. Good luck.

You can lead a horse to water . . . . . .

[spoons]

I would definitely NOT force him to go, I don't think that would turn out to be a fun trip. Just make sure he understands how much the trip means to you and maybe he'll come around. Teenagers don't like to have to do things, it's just how we all are.

I really wish I had parents that wanted to take me hiking. But then again I would be really mad if I was forced to go to a football game or something. If you really think he would enjoy it try to convince him, but it might not be his thing regardless of his laziness this summer.

[mister krabs]

Bring him, don't ask him if he wants to go. "we're going hiking next week" is all the conversation should be.

Don't share equipment, food or water. Give him everything he needs to be self reliant on the trail, then leave him do that without any discussion of it except "let me know if you need any help." Anything he ask your for, give it to him. Any help he requests, give without comment. Don't offer any unsolicited advice. If he whines, tell him to man up. Then tell him he made you proud when he does. Make him feel like a man. Give him a sip of your whiskey. If he wants to rest and you don't, tell him you'll meet him up the trail. Vice versa with "you go on ahead." If he doesn't want to gather wood, don't have a fire. If he wants a fire, let him know that you could take it or leave it, and that he can make it if he wants it. Tell him how nice his fire is. Bring a slingshot to have some healthy competition.

Bottom line, treat him like a man, act disinterested in his failings and whining, praise him for acting like a man. Do everything you can not to nag and b!tch.
Spend time with him now while you can, bring a xanax for yourself so that when he starts driving you bat$hit you don't go off on him. Again, spend time with him now while you can, you'll not regret it in the long term.

[WingedMonkey]

Bring him, don't ask him if he wants to go. "we're going hiking next week" is all the conversation should be.

Don't share equipment, food or water. Give him everything he needs to be self reliant on the trail, then leave him do that without any discussion of it except "let me know if you need any help." Anything he ask your for, give it to him. Any help he requests, give without comment. Don't offer any unsolicited advice. If he whines, tell him to man up. Then tell him he made you proud when he does. Make him feel like a man. Give him a sip of your whiskey. If he wants to rest and you don't, tell him you'll meet him up the trail. Vice versa with "you go on ahead." If he doesn't want to gather wood, don't have a fire. If he wants a fire, let him know that you could take it or leave it, and that he can make it if he wants it. Tell him how nice his fire is. Bring a slingshot to have some healthy competition.

Bottom line, treat him like a man, act disinterested in his failings and whining, praise him for acting like a man. Do everything you can not to nag and b!tch.
Spend time with him now while you can, bring a xanax for yourself so that when he starts driving you bat$hit you don't go off on him. Again, spend time with him now while you can, you'll not regret it in the long term.

While you're mixing all that Xanaz and booze for yourself, encourage him to stay off drugs or he will be like you.

[10-K]

No way would I force my 16 year old to go hiking.

I can barely get him to the barber....

You probably know that kids are different and what would work for one kid is the exact wrong thing to do with another.

And parenting styles are all over the map as well....

[Beachcomber]

A strong second for the idea of taking some shorter hikes first. Two weeks, or even one, can be a lot when you don't have any experience. I'm planning a week on the AT, and for lots of reasons am doing it solo. But on a couple of weekend shake-downs this spring, I invited my 15-year-old son, and he accepted. We had an excellent time, but on both occasions I saw he was wearing out mid-way through the second day, wanting to take easier (road-walking) shortcuts than I'd planned. We did it his way, and it was fine ... but I would not even suggest a longer trip to him until he's really ready, both physically and psychologically. Maybe next year, after some more 2 and 3-day hikes.

[mister krabs]

While you're mixing all that Xanaz and booze for yourself, encourage him to stay off drugs or he will be like you.

I'll encourage him to make his own decisions, be responsible and to spend time with those he loves. Mixing anti anxiety meds with alcohol is a bad idea, treating a 16 yo like the man man you want him to be is a good one.