Can you use an Ursack?

[Big Suave]

I know you can't use one in Yosemite, but is it practical enough to avoid the other three areas you can't use them to avoid having a canister or do I just need to bite the bullet and buy a canister? Thanks, Preston

[Helmuth.Fishmonger]

the ursack isn't legal in any Sierra park and wilderness, if used as advertised (tied to a tree). You can hang it in some regions (south of Yosemite up to Pinchot Pass), but you can hang any bag there.

Don't want to get into the details, but rangers have more or less found that bears will get food rewards from these things, even if it takes them an hour to get a drizzle of pulverized food to come out of the bag, while properly hung, they don't get to mess with the bag like that and you have time to get up and scare the bear away.

Get a canister if you want to sleep well. Bears just ignore these things and go to an easier to obtain food source.

[schnikel]

I agree with the above thread. Bear canisters are the way to go. You wouldn't have to but the can unless you wanted to. You can rent bear canisters from Yosemite, or from wildideas.com. I think the park charges 10$ a week, pretty cheap IMHO. Just mail it back when your done.
Schnikel

[ChinMusic]

I agree with the above thread. Bear canisters are the way to go. You wouldn't have to but the can unless you wanted to. You can rent bear canisters from Yosemite, or from wildideas.com. I think the park charges 10$ a week, pretty cheap IMHO. Just mail it back when your done.
Schnikel

Park charges $5 per week

[Big Suave]

I appreciate the info. Does anyone know what kind of canisters they rent? Kind of a silly question, but if it's one of the really heavy ones I may just buy my own. Thanks, Preston

[AaronMB]

Does anyone know what kind of canisters they rent? Kind of a silly question, but if it's one of the really heavy ones I may just buy my own. Thanks, Preston

The rentals will probably be the ol' Garcias or the Berikade.
Here's an FYI, just in case: http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/containers.htm

[leaftye]

I don't know about it being the Bearikade since the Inyo NF rangers didn't recognize mine.

[Helmuth.Fishmonger]

I appreciate the info. Does anyone know what kind of canisters they rent? Kind of a silly question, but if it's one of the really heavy ones I may just buy my own. Thanks, Preston

the parks rent the heavy ones.

you can rent the carbon fiber Bearikades from wildideas.net directly, flat charge for a JMT hike (something like $65 last time I saw that number).

[Helmuth.Fishmonger]

make that http://www.wild-ideas.net/contact.html - just call them about the rental. These guys are the best, and there is no better bear canister.

[No Belay]

I just questioned the IGBC about this and here is a copy of their reply. If you read between the lines, I'd say the Ursack is getting some serious consideration. It's about time. My Bear Vault weighs 2lb 9oz and is a PIA to pack. Though I'll have to admit it makes agreat camp stool.

TaTonka


Hi Ta,
Interagency Grizzly Bear Committee commented on their Wall post.
Interagency Grizzly Bear Committee wrote: "At its January 19-20, 2011 meeting, the Interagency Grizzly Bear Committee decided to revise
its bear-resistant container testing program. The protocol providing information and guidance
related to this important program is being updated and will be available at this website in the
near future. For information regarding product testing during this time, please contact:
Patti Sowka, Living With Wildlife Foundation (www.lwwf.org), (406) 544-5307 or
[email protected]"

[Helmuth.Fishmonger]

I don't know about it being the Bearikade since the Inyo NF rangers didn't recognize mine.

they didn't recognize a Bearikade? What kind of noobs were they? Bearikade has been around for years and is the prime choice of regulars.

They don't rent them, but you can rent the Bearikades directly from the folks that make them at a flat rate for the JMT ($50 or in that ballpark). The stuff I saw for rent in Yosemite was the old Garcia type and unless you like to carry ballast, I'd recommend to plan ahead and rent a Bearikade.

[Helmuth.Fishmonger]

Usack will never be legal in the National Parks. It provides "food rewards" for bears that try to get into them. Irrelevant that the bags more or less hold together, but if used as advertised, bears still can get food from the bags, even if it is just traces of your completely destroyed and crushed contents. That's the end of the Ursack story, no matter how much they try to get the product authorized through legal attempts. It simply doesn't work. Food gets crushed into powder, food comes out of holes and poorly tied openings. Improper use is also more likely than with an canister. The ONLY reason this is still being discussed is the current ultralight mania that has people push for completely ridiculous solutions when proven solutions are available, all in the name of saving a few ounces.

Treat the weight of the bear can as the price of admission into National Park bear country, as well as peace of mind solution, and you can stomach the extra weight a little easier. As long as rangers who actually know what happens up there in the mountains have a say in what is working and what is not, the Ursack will only be tolerated in the areas that allow hanging when properly counterbalanced across a tree branch, but you can do that with any bag that is lighter and cheaper than the Ursack, however, you're not gonna do the entire JMT that way legally. Doesn't mean it isn't done every summer by dozens of PCT hikers with the typcial "we know better" attitude, or the "I only use bear cans to protect myself from rangers" BS a certain professional ultra hiker spreads on his web site.

[hikingshoes]

I love my Ursack Minor!! I hang All my food and never had a problem with any bears. I've ran in to one bear as i was hiking and it seen me and i seen it and it was gone.lol,Not to say I wasnt ready to leave but thank god it left but i did get a pic. of it.HS

[No Belay]

Usack will never be legal in the National Parks. It provides "food rewards" for bears that try to get into them. Irrelevant that the bags more or less hold together, but if used as advertised, bears still can get food from the bags, even if it is just traces of your completely destroyed and crushed contents. That's the end of the Ursack story, no matter how much they try to get the product authorized through legal attempts. It simply doesn't work. Food gets crushed into powder, food comes out of holes and poorly tied openings. Improper use is also more likely than with an canister. The ONLY reason this is still being discussed is the current ultralight mania that has people push for completely ridiculous solutions when proven solutions are available, all in the name of saving a few ounces.

Treat the weight of the bear can as the price of admission into National Park bear country, as well as peace of mind solution, and you can stomach the extra weight a little easier. As long as rangers who actually know what happens up there in the mountains have a say in what is working and what is not, the Ursack will only be tolerated in the areas that allow hanging when properly counterbalanced across a tree branch, but you can do that with any bag that is lighter and cheaper than the Ursack, however, you're not gonna do the entire JMT that way legally. Doesn't mean it isn't done every summer by dozens of PCT hikers with the typcial "we know better" attitude, or the "I only use bear cans to protect myself from rangers" BS a certain professional ultra hiker spreads on his web site.

Damn Fishmonger! We weren't aware that we had the God assigned authority on "bear canisters" here on WB or I'm sure nobody else would have posted in this thread. The ultralight mania isn't current. It started years ago. If you're content to live "In the box" with you're "proven" solutions fine, but get off the arse of forward thinking hikers that aren't. As far as Rangers that actually "know" what goes on up there, one of the post spoke of a Ranger that didn't know what a Barricade was. Duh ! I have a good friend that's a NPS LEO ranger and she carried a gun for almost a year that wouldn't fire and didn't know it until qualifying the next season. If you believe they're the authority on what's going on "up there"
you may be a bit confused.

[attroll]

Usack will never be legal in the National Parks. It provides "food rewards" for bears that try to get into them. Irrelevant that the bags more or less hold together, but if used as advertised, bears still can get food from the bags, even if it is just traces of your completely destroyed and crushed contents

This makes sense.

[Helmuth.Fishmonger]

Damn Fishmonger! We weren't aware that we had the God assigned authority on "bear canisters" here on WB or I'm sure nobody else would have posted in this thread. The ultralight mania isn't current. It started years ago. If you're content to live "In the box" with you're "proven" solutions fine, but get off the arse of forward thinking hikers that aren't. As far as Rangers that actually "know" what goes on up there, one of the post spoke of a Ranger that didn't know what a Barricade was. Duh ! I have a good friend that's a NPS LEO ranger and she carried a gun for almost a year that wouldn't fire and didn't know it until qualifying the next season. If you believe they're the authority on what's going on "up there"
you may be a bit confused.

The term ranger covers a wide range of skills and duties. I actually know some of the rangers who do have input on the subject, so I am "off my arse" - there is a difference between a backcountry ranger that spends the entire summer in the mountains and a temp helper handing out permits in town or pulling over drunk camper drivers. I doubt they ask the Yosemite traffic cop "ranger" about what bear canisters are proving themselves effective in the backcountry.

And one more time to make it clear - it is not about what stays in the ursack after a bear attack. It is about completely discouraging bears from even trying to get your food, and only a hard shell sealed canister provides zero incentive to continue trying. A bag that will drizzle out gatorade powder once in a while will ony have bears come back and keep tearing on the bags to get these things figured out. Bears are smart and will not waste energy on efforts without a reward, but the ursack keeps rewarding, be it in small amount, almsot like a tease, a problem to solve for the bears. It keeps them interested. They will be in camp for a long time, won't leave once they start tearing up a bag. A proper canister gets completely ignored, and bears won't even bother to get into them any longer.

But be my guest and try it yourself.

[tuswm]

Damn Fishmonger! We weren't aware that we had the God assigned authority on "bear canisters" here on WB or I'm sure nobody else would have posted in this thread. The ultralight mania isn't current. It started years ago. If you're content to live "In the box" with you're "proven" solutions fine, but get off the arse of forward thinking hikers that aren't. As far as Rangers that actually "know" what goes on up there, one of the post spoke of a Ranger that didn't know what a Barricade was. Duh ! I have a good friend that's a NPS LEO ranger and she carried a gun for almost a year that wouldn't fire and didn't know it until qualifying the next season. If you believe they're the authority on what's going on "up there"
you may be a bit confused.

how many rangers would carry a gun if they didnt have to?

[bamboo bob]

I used a canister in the Sierras as required. But since I couldn't fit all my food into it I had to use my food bag too. I hung the food bag but never saw any bears except when hiking near the car camping spots. Also I ran out of food and had to stop at VVR to resupply. I guess the canisters do the job, tough to tell since I saw no sign of any bear in the high country. I'm told that California bears are so much smarter than East coast bears, I don't understand how that can be.
Truthfully I just think it is a "rule" and must be obeyed.

[Rasty]

East coast bears are probably smarter than west coast bears. A female bear named Yellow Yellow has defeated the bear vault brand.http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/25/ny...pagewanted=all

[Rasty]

Sorry the link did not work.look up yellow+yellow+bear+adirondacks