The prejudice we face.

[Amanita]

Quote from this thread. http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...ry-Start/page3

I honestly believe this young women should not take on this journey. Although the information being provided for the most part is excellent for a winter hike, encouragement is not responsible IMO.

I've been backpacking, canoeing, spelunking since I was a kid. And I have a 25 year old daughter who has only limited backpacking experience (for the most part she always had other things to do when Dad wanted her to come along).

If she came to me wanting to hike the AT and asking advice I would be ecstatic. I would help her in anyway I could. But if she came to me with the idea of a solo January start I would strongly advise against it. She is an athlete, was captain of her College Swim Team and in excellent shape. She now competes in Triathlons. It still doesn't matter. She does not have the experience to succeed in a solo winter hike. And my daughter is 25 and at 25 most would agree she has a better set of life skills than she would have had at age 20 like the OP.

Might I feel different if it was my 22 year old son who has some decent experience on the trail? Sure. First he has some experience and secondly, and I suppose this will be construed by many to be sexist, but he is a male. He does not have to deal with the woman issues that are inherent to the trail. A young female hiking alone where she does not have the protections of a group is simply asking for trouble IMO.

THIS is the kind of attitude that keeps girls from wanting to take part in outdoor activities like hiking. THIS is why there is a whole thread about "where are all the girls?" THIS is the kind of attitude I expect from someone who has never been hiking, and never raised a daughter. It makes me sad that there are wonderful, athletic, adventurous girls who will be shuffled into "girl sports" and "safer" sports because of people like this.

I think that most ladies would agree that they have never been in a situation where they felt in danger on the trail because of their gender. And if we do I think it can be handled just as you would handle it in "civilization."

So how do we get young women out on the trail in the face of attitudes like this?

[Lone Wolf]

pay no attention to him. he lives near the trail but doesn't long distance hike

[Lone Wolf]

and it's also my observation that women are tougher mentally and physically than men on the AT.

[Scratch]

We already put up with far more mental and physical issues as a woman before taking on something like this. I would just like to see him go through one period. Or childbirth. Just saying. And yes I know these issues are different from those faced on the trail, but it does help me to realize already how much pain and mental crap I can put up with.

[Ender]

and it's also my observation that women are tougher mentally and physically than men on the AT.

I completely agree with this. A lot of the men out there whine incessantly, but very few of the women do. At least from my experience.

[Trailbender]

and it's also my observation that women are tougher mentally and physically than men on the AT.

I'd have to say this is unlikely, purely on a biological standpoint.

[10-K]

This is anecdotal of course but I would agree that women are not "tougher" but they do tend to be "smarter" when it comes to making decisions.

But it's not black and white. As we all know, there are crazy men and women out there - no gender has a lock on being better (or worse).

[coach lou]

As a parent of a young woman, I disagree with him 98%. The safety issue is real, and if my daughter was 45 I would still not want her out on the trail alone. Many times I've come up on a shelter that was close to a road and dunken partyers were there all messed up. We read worse things every day.

[curtisvowen]

"purely on a biological standpoint" define that.
Women naturally have more leg muscle mass, conducive if applied to hiking long range.
More body fat? Yes, helps when you're near death....
Ever had a baby? Pain tolerance?
Mother Nature created women for survival....not Man....he's a dime a dozen.
I'm just saying that if a women puts her mind into a "project" then it will be done.
I've 2 pre-teen daughters.....they'll be raised to kick your ass and look good while doin' it.....but most importantly they'll know how to get out of stupid circumstances brought on by the "male" species.

[max patch]

Listen to the FatMan...an inexperienced backpacker - man or woman - should not start a solo thru in mid-january.

[bfayer]

If my 17 year old daughter told me she was going to do this, I would make sure she had the right gear, hand her my SPOT and tell her to have fun.

She does not run triathalons, and she is not a track star. she has some but not extensive backpacking experience.

The AT is not an Everest expidition, and winter hiking is only dangerous if you are stupid or don't have the right gear.


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[Cookerhiker]

...I think that most ladies would agree that they have never been in a situation where they felt in danger on the trail because of their gender. And if we do I think it can be handled just as you would handle it in "civilization."...

I'm glad you said "most" and not "all" because it does happen - and has been reported publicly on WB and trailjournals.com plus I'm aware of other instances not reported on-line.

and it's also my observation that women are tougher mentally and physically than men on the AT.

Agree for the most part. Anecdote FWIW: last winter about 10 of us WBers did a winter day-hike together. One woman and the rest were guys. Guess who was the strongest hiker?

As a parent of a young woman, I disagree with him 98%. The safety issue is real, and if my daughter was 45 I would still not want her out on the trail alone. Many times I've come up on a shelter that was close to a road and dunken partyers were there all messed up. We read worse things every day.

Not likely in the dead of winter. For the case in point, the more serious concerns are weather/season related.


I would note that most of the respondants encouraging the OP to go ahead with her winter hike are guys and the detailed advice they're rendering re preparation, gear, etc. is not gender-specific.

[Tipi Walter]

Listen to the FatMan...an inexperienced backpacker - man or woman - should not start a solo thru in mid-january.

Thousands of newbie---inexperienced---backpackers start the AT every season. The only difference is a mid-January start. Is it daunting? Sure. Avoid at all costs? Naw.

The AT is not an Everest expedition, and winter hiking is only dangerous if you are stupid or don't have the right gear.


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Agree. It's not a death-defying adventure. Read the Trail Journals on winter starts and you'll find most of them bail to the closest town when the first big snowstorm hits. Why? For many reasons mostly having to do with Effort Expended (postholing) and the unwillingness to carry the weight in clothing and food to stay put for a week thru a bad storm. Otherwise they bail to a motel and sit it out or quit.

[JenHikes]

Usually I'm the only female in the groups I backpack with. Most of the time, I'm the one who takes charge, starts the fire, maintains it so it doesn't go out (my husband admits to be the worst fire-tender known to man), the one who cleans up for the night, etc. I enjoy backpacking as the only woman in the group and it gets me a lot of respect from a lot of people, hikers or not. FWIW, I try not to listen to people who think I'm a damsel in distress and that I'll surely be raped and murdered on the trail next year. Some concerns are genuine, but unless someone knows me, it's not their business anyway.

[bfayer]

Thousands of newbie---inexperienced---backpackers start the AT every season. The only difference is a mid-January start. Is it daunting? Sure. Avoid at all costs? Naw.



Agree. It's not a death-defying adventure. Read the Trail Journals on winter starts and you'll find most of them bail to the closest town when the first big snowstorm hits. Why? For many reasons mostly having to do with Effort Expended (postholing) and the unwillingness to carry the weight in clothing and food to stay put for a week thru a bad storm. Otherwise they bail to a motel and sit it out or quit.

I never said she would make it

We learn more from our failures sometimes than we do from our success.

I would let my daughter or son do this knowing that although they may not last long, they will learn more about themselves than they would doing just about anything else.

It is more dangerous to drive in the winter than it is to hike.

Worst case she gets cold and tired and calls me to come get her. She comes home, does some more planning any starts where she left off come March. But she will sart back up a much wiser person.

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[10-K]

Worst case she gets cold and tired and calls me to come get her. She comes home, does some more planning any starts where she left off come March. But she will sart back up a much wiser person.

Correction: I would call this "The best case"...

[Red Beard]

Quote from this thread. http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...ry-Start/page3



THIS is the kind of attitude that keeps girls from wanting to take part in outdoor activities like hiking. THIS is why there is a whole thread about "where are all the girls?" THIS is the kind of attitude I expect from someone who has never been hiking, and never raised a daughter. It makes me sad that there are wonderful, athletic, adventurous girls who will be shuffled into "girl sports" and "safer" sports because of people like this.

I think that most ladies would agree that they have never been in a situation where they felt in danger on the trail because of their gender. And if we do I think it can be handled just as you would handle it in "civilization."

So how do we get young women out on the trail in the face of attitudes like this?

In all honesty, attitudes like this are purely bigoted. I believe that women should have the same opportunity to hike the trail, as anyone else. This is how it is done in a free society. That said, this thread has turned into a feminine aggrandizement echo-chamber. Folks don't even realize they're being just as bigoted towards men with statements like:

and it's also my observation that women are tougher mentally and physically than men on the AT.

Men, get over yourselves, women get over yourselves! No sex is better than the other. The differences make us who we are, and frankly I prefer it that way.

[Feral Bill]

I would be delighted if my very fit 21 year old daughter decided to make a solo through hike in the usual season. Lacking winter experience, I would strongly discourage her from a January start. My 19 year old son has some winter experience, and I would not encourage him at this point either. Not a matter of sex, just experince in a harsh conditions.

[Pedaling Fool]

Listen to the FatMan...an inexperienced backpacker - man or woman - should not start a solo thru in mid-january.

That really wasn't the thing though. Look at what the OP put in bold: "A young female hiking alone where she does not have the protections of a group is simply asking for trouble IMO."

And more of his post is centered around a lone female, as opposed to simply starting solo in mid-January, regardless of sex.

From what I've heard women generally are more sensitive to pain, but are better able to handle it compared to men. I've also heard that they can do better in a pilot seat then men. And based on my own observations in my time in the military working around guns I've noticed women who've never shot before surprisingly are pretty good at shooting and many of them outshoot first-time male shooters.

But if you notice all the world famous chefs are men. That's because we really love food

[Feral Bill]

.

It is more dangerous to drive in the winter than it is to hike.

Worst case she gets cold and tired and calls me to come get her. She comes home, does some more planning any starts where she left off come March. But she will sart back up a much wiser person.

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For a beginning hiker, maybe not more dangerous to drive (and would you want a daughter with little driving experiece driving in a blizzard?).

Actual worst case: She gets soaked to the skin, develops hypothermia, and dies alone in the mountains..