can somebody explain to me the advantage of a quilt over a bag?

[MuddyWaters]

This is the most informative thread on quilts that I have read (well, leaving out the dinosaurs and Gumby), and the video that HikerMomKD attached finally enabled me to understand how to cinch a quilt around your shoulders. Sometimes one fails to comprehend the obvious. Does anyone have any experience with the cuben fiber lined down quilts? Are they made with breathtable or nonbreathable cuben fiber? Do they get clammy? Does the down retain moisture? Are the temperature ratings accurate? Are they ligher because of the cuben fiber materail or do they contain less down?

I dont have any personal experience with the cuben quilt , but considered it.
Only previously made by EE as a stock item I think, others may have provided on on a custom basis.
They are made with impermeable cuben to be moisture resistant.
Basically, they are also mostly airtight, so they wont loft without filling the quilt with air thru a vent tube.
This prevents loss of loft due to body moisture condensing in the fill in cold weather. The only other way to avoid loss of loft on a prolonged trip is thru use of a vapor barrier.
Yes they are clammy obviously if you have to snug up tight in cold conditions.
No reason for temp rating not to be accurate.
They are lighter because of the cuben weight. Just throwing rough #s out here based on memory, but say a 40 F quilt that has ~8oz fill weighs ~ 17oz in 30d (1.1oz/yd) , and 14 oz in 10d (0.65 oz/yd) , might weigh 12.5 oz in 0.51 cuben (0.51 oz/yd) and even less in 0.3 cuben, possibly 11 oz .
It can be a substantial enough difference, to put up with the clamminess for some.

[gizzy bear]

We’ve seen several wearable sleeping bags in the outdoor market recently. Most of them are pretty laughable. In fact, they usually remind me of Gumby® or the Stay Puff Marshmallow Man.


But now Doppelganger Outdoors has released a wearable sleeping bag that is almost cute. It seems to be geared towards women because you can wear it as a skirt combo. In fact, you can wear this sleeping bag as a jacket, a jacket with skirt attached or zip on the last portion for a complete sleeping bag. Ready for bed? Attach the last section and you are ready to go. This is a case where camping fashion and camping essentials cross paths.

It comes in purple too!!!!

i couldn't see this on my phone last night...but now that i can actually see it, this is OBVIOUSLY for the narcoleptic/ambien hiker....where one is walking along and just goes all stiffy goat and passes out(look it up they are hysterical) and just hope some kind soul will come zip on their bottom half...
i bet the bermuda short version is equally as attractive.

[HikerMom58]

i couldn't see this on my phone last night...but now that i can actually see it, this is OBVIOUSLY for the narcoleptic/ambien hiker....where one is walking along and just goes all stiffy goat and passes out(look it up they are hysterical) and just hope some kind soul will come zip on their bottom half...
i bet the bermuda short version is equally as attractive.

I can't stop laughing at ur comment gizzy... Oh gosh! Are you sure you don't want it to take the HMW? I like the concept. I think they are on 2 something but this one?-not so much! Ha Ha!! I don't think it's very warm.. this one!

[Rain Man]

I apologize if this has been said already, but in a sleeping bag, if I roll on my side, my knees and butt press against opposite sides of the bag. If the bag contorts at all (which it does), that crushes the down similar to laying on it. Result is that my knees and butt get cold. With a quilt there is less contortion of shape. My knees might press out one side, and my butt the other, but it has more "give" and thus maintains its loft better.

At least, that's my opinion.

Rain Man

.

[gizzy bear]

I can't stop laughing at ur comment gizzy... Oh gosh! Are you sure you don't want it to take the HMW? I like the concept. I think they are on 2 something but this one?-not so much! Ha Ha!! I don't think it's very warm.. this one!

hehehe!! i couldn't quit giggling at those pics...thanks for sharing ...those silleh chinese ... i bet all the pants would be highwaters and the popular colors are red with orange :P

[Prime Time]

Does anyone have experience with Jacks R Better quilts? I'm specifically looking at the Shenandoah 45 degree quilt for between Mt. Rogers and the Whites.

[The Ace]

I dont have any personal experience with the cuben quilt , but considered it.
Only previously made by EE as a stock item I think, others may have provided on on a custom basis.
They are made with impermeable cuben to be moisture resistant.
Basically, they are also mostly airtight, so they wont loft without filling the quilt with air thru a vent tube.
This prevents loss of loft due to body moisture condensing in the fill in cold weather. The only other way to avoid loss of loft on a prolonged trip is thru use of a vapor barrier.
Yes they are clammy obviously if you have to snug up tight in cold conditions.
No reason for temp rating not to be accurate.
They are lighter because of the cuben weight. Just throwing rough #s out here based on memory, but say a 40 F quilt that has ~8oz fill weighs ~ 17oz in 30d (1.1oz/yd) , and 14 oz in 10d (0.65 oz/yd) , might weigh 12.5 oz in 0.51 cuben (0.51 oz/yd) and even less in 0.3 cuben, possibly 11 oz .
It can be a substantial enough difference, to put up with the clamminess for some.

Thanks. Sounds like this is better for a lower humidity environment than that of the Appalachians.

[MuddyWaters]

Thanks. Sounds like this is better for a lower humidity environment than that of the Appalachians.

On the contrary, high humidity and cold conditions is where it will excel.
It will just be clammy. Nothing wrong with warm and clammy.
That is better, than a wet, de-lofted bag after several days of 35F rain, which breatheable fabric encased down will experience.

As an aside, another good benefits of quilts, is if you use a separate down hood in cold temps, it turns with your head when you twist your neck to side, unlike a sleeping bag where your face tends to move off of the opening.

[The Ace]

On the contrary, high humidity and cold conditions is where it will excel.
It will just be clammy. Nothing wrong with warm and clammy.
That is better, than a wet, de-lofted bag after several days of 35F rain, which breatheable fabric encased down will experience.

As an aside, another good benefits of quilts, is if you use a separate down hood in cold temps, it turns with your head when you twist your neck to side, unlike a sleeping bag where your face tends to move off of the opening.

So, the trade-off with a cuben fiber lining is that it protects the down from moisture, but keeps it trapped around or on my body?

[MuddyWaters]

So, the trade-off with a cuben fiber lining is that it protects the down from moisture, but keeps it trapped around or on my body?

Yes. Same thing a vapor barrier liner would do, or vapor barrier clothing.
Below about freezing, the dewpoint typically is inside the fill (bag surface is very cold), and body moisture otherwise condenses in the fill.
After a few nights of that, a bag is substantially less lofty and colder than it was in dry condition.
This can also happen in any really humid and cool (cool and rainy) condition.

When using VBL , you usually only wear a very light thin baselayer. helps keep you comfortable, but doesnt get all your clothing moist. When you wear VB clothing (silnylon suit ), you can wear your clothing over it for extra warmth, because the clamminess will be inside. Getting out of a VBL, with damp baselayer on a cold morning will freeze you pretty darn fast if not careful. Small price to pay to keep insulation intact.

[Kookork]

To Sum Up the pros and cons of quilt Vs Sleeping bag

Pros:
Cheaper
Lighter
Shines in warmer nights
less claustrophobic
No zip jam or noise

Cons:
Needs a more reliable sleeping pad
slower learning curve to use
Not the best in extreme conditions

Ps: According to one post if the dinosaurs were using quilt they were still roaming around . Right?

Are you convinced Hikerboy now ? Extinction is around the corner if not.

[scope]

Does anyone have experience with Jacks R Better quilts? I'm specifically looking at the Shenandoah 45 degree quilt for between Mt. Rogers and the Whites.

Their stuff is top notch. There are other very good mfrs, none better.

[MuddyWaters]

Does anyone have experience with Jacks R Better quilts? I'm specifically looking at the Shenandoah 45 degree quilt for between Mt. Rogers and the Whites.

Theres a bunch of good mfgs that are all top notch.
Most of them will do you a custom job too, whatever you want if you have the wait time.
Some work with different fabrics than others, that may be important to you.
You should know if you want pertex, M50, 30D, 10D, etc.
Also know what type baffles, baffle spacing, loft, amt fill, etc.

If you are in a hurry, it may come down to stock items, stock width, stock features, and stock price.

If not, you will probably be happy with a custom item from most of them. JRB has a good reputation.

[Prime Time]

Theres a bunch of good mfgs that are all top notch.
Most of them will do you a custom job too, whatever you want if you have the wait time.
Some work with different fabrics than others, that may be important to you.
You should know if you want pertex, M50, 30D, 10D, etc.
Also know what type baffles, baffle spacing, loft, amt fill, etc.
If you are in a hurry, it may come down to stock items, stock width, stock features, and stock price.

If not, you will probably be happy with a custom item from most of them. JRB has a good reputation.

Thanks MuddyWaters. This is good info that gives me a good idea what I need to study up on and decide.

[The Ace]

Thanks MuddyWaters. This is good info that gives me a good idea what I need to study up on and decide.

Another good source that I found (in addition to here) is the Outdoor Gear Lab Review of bags and quilts. They seem to have a bias for quilts, but they provide a lot info. Here is the link:

http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Backpa...ng-Bag-Reviews

[Sly]

I've used my sleeping bag as a quilt on many occasions simply by unzipping it and throwing it over me and it's worked fine. If I had a sewing machine and sewing skills I'd try modifying an old bag but have neither.

[Tipi Walter]

Sleeping pad, same as you do in your bag. With a bag though, the the insulation you're laying on gets compressed, effectively rendering it useless.

This is the standard myth kept alive over and over again. In reality, for me at least, a zipped up mummy bag needs full coverage because I toss and turn all night, so what was under me 20 minutes ago is now on my side or on top, etc. So, in effect, the bottom insulation is not "useless" since it doesn't stay on the bottom for long.

the bottom of the bag gives you little in the way of insulation as you lay on it -its added weight from this perspective compared to a top quilt

See above.

well in my case its not really true. i have a wm highlite mummy style as im a side sleeper and the bag just moves with me when i turn in my sleep, so im compressing different down at different times. i do understand the compression on the bottom. my winter bag is a BA lost ranger, their bags are designed with a sleeve for your pad and all the down on top, on the same principles as youre describing.im not sure i would be comfortable sleeping directly on my pad.
i need you to convince me so i can justify throwing away $1200 worth of sleeping bags and blow some more money on quilts!!

"The bag just moves with me" about says it all.

but i still have the same pad insulation as you do. the bag stays wrapped around me as i turn in my sleep.not so sure the same can be said for the quilt. those nights its that hot, i sleep on top of my bag anyway

Yup, the zipped up bag is full enclosure with full protection from cold spots, the bane of quilts.

unzip your bag all the way. Turn it until opening is on the bottom. You will be able to see what its like to use a top quilt. Just imagine the extra material on the sides being gone making it lighter.

This is exactly what I do most of the time. On my last two winter trips (36 days) in Jan/Feb I didn't once zip up my overkill WM Puma down bag and instead used it as a quilt. One night it got down to 15F and I almost zipped it up. See, that's the point---I had the option, the all-important option, of zipping up if the temps reached 10F or 0F or below. No quilt can do this.

I select a sleeping bag that will unzip all the way to the feet, having a small foot box. My prefered method is to leave the sleeping bag unzipped in this fashion, basically turning the bag into a quilt.

For nights where it is cold I like the option of zipping it all the way up.

In this way I feel I get the best of both worlds.

Exactly right. I enjoy sleeping under my bag like a quilt most of the time and then mummy up when temps go south.

I think quilts make the most sense if your a hammocker, but for a ground dweller like me, I'll stick to a bag. I can use a bag like a quilt, but I can't use a quilt like a bag. I also didn't see enough weight/bulk/cost difference to make a quilt win over a bag. I really wanted to justify buying a quilt, but I just couldn't do it.

A bag offers more protection options in tough conditions.

I've used my sleeping bag as a quilt on many occasions simply by unzipping it and throwing it over me and it's worked fine. If I had a sewing machine and sewing skills I'd try modifying an old bag but have neither.

Exactly again. Really, the question of A Quilt is the question of trip temperatures and how cold it will get. Anybody can use a quilt in the 3 seasons, but if the conversation is about winter camping in winter conditions with 10F or below, even -10F, very few people I know would discard their standard zippered mummy bag and go with a quilt.

[scope]

Not a myth, but there is truth in what you say about rolling around. In theory at least, you should be able to stay warmer with a quilt by having the pad and quilt stay where they are while you roll around inside, making for no cold spots in your insulation as you would have on the section of a bag you were just laying on. Your body heat is required to heat those sections up again as they expand in order to be insulative again.

That said, its about being able to manage your rolling around in semi-conscious state, and that's where a bag assists in keeping warm air around you while sections of it are going through the process of being compressed and uncompressed. Its easy with a quilt to mess up during the night and let cold air in. Its also not that hard to manage it well and reap the benefits of using a quilt. As always, different strokes, and HYOH.

Of course, you could just get a hammock and nix the whole rolling around thing. Sorry, couldn't help myself.

[Mags]

Exactly again. Really, the question of A Quilt is the question of trip temperatures and how cold it will get. Anybody can use a quilt in the 3 seasons, but if the conversation is about winter camping in winter conditions with 10F or below, even -10F, very few people I know would discard their standard zippered mummy bag and go with a quilt.

Wow..I actually I agree with TW. (Truth be told, I suspect he and I probably agree on more than things than disagree )

I have started enjoying a quilt for three-season backpacking...don't think I personally could use one for winter.

Then again, some people love them for winter. http://www.rayjardine.com/adventures...Pole/index.htm


I just don't think I'll be one of them!

[MuddyWaters]

I think, if you use a quilt in deep winter, it ought to be much lower rated than you need, and then the drafts wont matter as much to your overall comfort.

I personally have found any bag insulation under me to be not needed for warmth, the pad does do it all basically.

Rolling with the bag, puts you off to the side of where you were laying on your back, basically off your pad. If you want to get back in the middle of your pad, you are going to have to fidget and schooch back to center. Trying to stay in one spot and roll over in a bag, kind of wraps and tangles you up in it.
A quilt is superior for shifting from back to side to me for that reason.