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  1. #1

    Default Down Jacket vs Synthetic Jacket

    I'm going to be thru hiking next year 2014 and I'm having a tough time deciding between a down and synthetic jacket. I'll be starting around March 1st. Right now I have my eyes on the Rab Xenon Jacket not the Xenon X which is about to be released. What do u guys think that have thru hiked? Synthetic or Down? I will be layering either with a hard shell as well.

  2. #2

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    For the AT with a March 1 start date that piece seems on the money. I like PrimaloftOne for synthetic jacket insulation and the PertexQuantumGL shell has good water resistance with its DWR and thread count. The Quantum in 10D though is a little thin. This has led RAB to go to a heavier wt and more durable and prolly very sightly more water resistant denier. The heavier denier is added to the Xenon X for usage in higher abrasion areas such as wetter alpine environs. I think it's primary target market is for those who will be using it in those areas. Another popular alternative is the Montbell Thermawrap which is probably a little less warm based on a simple single piece verse single piece comparison. But, as we know you'll be wearing otehr torso pieces and accessories at times in conjunction with either jacket so you have to look at the entire clothing equation cumulatively.You're not going to need this piece for the entire duration of your AT thru-hike though. It's prolly just going to be most useful the first two months of your AT thru. It's going to be less and less useful to hike in as you get into the hike.

    Based on your anticipated hike, provided you can maintain down loft or reloft a down jacket in town, a down jacket piece could be use also.

  3. #3
    Garlic
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    Here's a bit of wisdom I learned here: Down is always better until it isn't. Welcome, not only to Whiteblaze, but to one of the toughest arguments and decisions here. For every ten responses you'll probably get eleven opinions.

    On my April start, I used a synthetic Marmot Driclime jacket for hiking but carried a down vest for extra insulation when not hiking. I never actually hiked with the down vest on but was glad to have it during two severe late season storms in the high country. So I think a little of both is a good solution. Like Dogwood says, don't depend on one garment.

    The best garment in the world is useless if you lack the experience to keep it dry. Wet synthetic is better than wet down, but it's still wet synthetic and it may not work well enough.
    "Throw a loaf of bread and a pound of tea in an old sack and jump over the back fence." John Muir on expedition planning

  4. #4
    PCT, Sheltowee, Pinhoti, LT , BMT, AT, SHT, CDT, TRT 10-K's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garlic08 View Post
    The best garment in the world is useless if you lack the experience to keep it dry. Wet synthetic is better than wet down, but it's still wet synthetic and it may not work well enough.
    You can't really say it any better than that....

    It gets danged cold at higher elevations when the wind whips up so whatever you take it's a good idea to have your rain jacket large enough to fit over your coat without compressing it.

  5. #5
    Registered User Drybones's Avatar
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    Check the extended weather forcast before you leave and plan accordingly. I took a down jacket last spring and never used it, sent it home at Fontana. Took a down jacket this spring, slept in it at night and still froze my butt off. If it's not cold enough for down I take a lightweight $2.00 fleece I got at a thrift store. As for down vs synthetic, I'd choose down and make sure I kept it dry, always put mine in a dry bag, only need it at camp...you can't beat what mother nature has provided.

  6. #6
    PCT, Sheltowee, Pinhoti, LT , BMT, AT, SHT, CDT, TRT 10-K's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drybones View Post
    Check the extended weather forcast before you leave and plan accordingly.
    On a thru hike that would be the super-super extended forecast.

  7. #7
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    good advice from everyone here. I like Garlic's advice: a synthetic jacket like a Montbell U/L Thermawrap, and a Down vest like the Montbell U/L Down vest. A good down vest only weighs around 5 oz., and u can use it for a pillow also at nite. 10-K's advice is good too, make sure you have a hard shell/rain jacket long/large enough to fit over your insulating layer. remember, 4 legs good, 2 legs bad.

  8. #8
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    Synthetic. I ran into a thru hiker a few years ago who was SOBO, ton of rain in Maine, said that his Mont Bell synthetic jacket as pivotal. I made the mistake of buying a synthetic jacket without a hood. Like most, when I am done for the day I am setting up camp, getting into my (down) bag and eating. If standing around and its not raining, have most/all of my clothes on (if cold) so I stay warm (MUCH easier than getting warm).

    I have been cold enough where I drape my down bag around me before going to bed.............standing around a fire, sitting in a shelter with tent pitched a ways off, etc

  9. #9

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    Thanks for all the responses! I'm very careful with my gear and for that reason I now think I'm leaning towards a down jacket. Does anyone have a recommendation between the MOUNTAIN HARDWEAR HOODED GHOST WHISPERER & MONT-BELL MIRAGE & MONT-BELL ALPINE LIGHT DOWN PARKA?? I will primarily be wearing it only at camp and also have a Columbia Triple Trail 2 Shell to wear over it. My concerns are that the MIRAGE might be too puffy to wear under a shell and that 7 Denier might rip? And that the GHOST might not be warm enough. I don't know as much about the ALPINE LIGHT. What are everyones thought?

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wmwood2001:1518238
    Thanks for all the responses! I'm very careful with my gear and for that reason I now think I'm leaning towards a down jacket. Does anyone have a recommendation between the MOUNTAIN HARDWEAR HOODED GHOST WHISPERER & MONT-BELL MIRAGE & MONT-BELL ALPINE LIGHT DOWN PARKA?? I will primarily be wearing it only at camp and also have a Columbia Triple Trail 2 Shell to wear over it. My concerns are that the MIRAGE might be too puffy to wear under a shell and that 7 Denier might rip? And that the GHOST might not be warm enough. I don't know as much about the ALPINE LIGHT. What are everyones thought?
    The Alpine Light Parka is the bomb. Very warm.

  11. #11

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    Before you abandon the RAB Xenon have you checked out Outdoor Gear Labs's very good review of this piece? Also, check out Mark Verber's gear reviews. Mark does a good job summing things up and keeping his gear info accurate. He's an engineer I think so he does his speck homework well.

    http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Insula...iews/Rab-Xenon
    http://www.verber.com/mark/outdoors/gear/

    Again, I don't look at any jacket as a stand alone piece. Think layering, versatility, and variety at that time of a start as the season changes into spring. You might better explore that broader mindset. It could serve you well. I do this with a UL mindset which DOES NOT mean you HAVE TO suffer either.

    For what it's worth, I personally, based on your anticipated hiking parameters, would start off with a UL WP shell(w/hood), Montbell Down UL Inner Jacket(no longer made, now wish I had three) or MB Thermawrap Jacket, mid wt(as far as temp. rating) merino tee, mid-heavy wt wt long sleeved 1/4 zip merino top(prolly a Smartwool or Icebreaker or Ibex) and accessorize for my top(merino beanie, gloves/mittens) to complete my top half. This would give me many combinations based on conditions. The mix of a synthetic MB Thermawrap Jacket and the merino pieces are a nice combo providing some added warmth insurance under varying weather patterns and hiking conditions. If I thought of the MB Thermawrap BY ITSELF for warmth I could easily run into times being very cold. AGAIN, think of the clothing picture as far as warmth cummulatively. And, that does not just include what's on your torso. My torso pieces and accessories decisions take into account what's on my feet, legs, hands, anticipated MPD averages, pack size, weather extremes, availability of shelters/assistance/escape routes, personal hiking style, shelter I'm carrying if any, sleep system, etc. I call it kit integration mindset.

  12. #12

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    Thanks for the info. I had not seen the Mark Verber site it is great! I love outdoor gear lab. I will definitely be layering. I have icebreaker wool base layers already and a rei synthetic jacket that I currently wear under my Columbia Triple Trail 2 hard shell with Omni Heat. I wore this combo on Mt Leconte in the Smokies this past march at 0 degrees right off AT and froze! So that opened my eyes that I might need something warmer for my insulation layer. I know this temperature is extreme and most likely not common place on the AT so maybe I am being a bit over cautious. I have some extra space in my UL pack setup. I'm currently at a base weight of 18 pounds. So I might take both a synthetic jacket for layering and also a warmer down jacket like the Mont-Bell Mirage or Alpine Light for cold nights with no rain. I will be tent camping at all times possible in my MLD cuben Duomid. Trying to avoid shelters.

  13. #13
    Hiker bigcranky's Avatar
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    The Alpine Light Parka is a terrific value for the money, and right on target for a March thru-hike start.
    Ken B
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    Our Long Trail journal

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by garlic08 View Post
    On my April start, I used a synthetic Marmot Driclime jacket for hiking but carried a down vest for extra insulation when not hiking. I never actually hiked with the down vest on but was glad to have it during two severe late season storms in the high country. So I think a little of both is a good solution. Like Dogwood says, don't depend on one garment.
    Thanks for all the responses. I have decided to do like Garlic08 suggested above, a little of both. I already have a Rei Synthetic jacket that is lightweight and happened to have a 50% off coupon up to 4,000 bucks to Patagonia so I purchased, along with a ton of other gear, the Patagonia Ultra Light Down Hoody that I will use at camp. I also bought the Patagonia Torrentshell Stretch Jacket to wear over both as my rain jacket/hardshell. Thanks for all of the help! March can't get here quick enough!

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