Hey elf, Smaug is coming back & she's still POed.
Miles to go before I sleep. R. Frost
Here's an interesting article on Spotting Dangerous People on the Appalachian Trail. It could apply to just about anywhere.
I've met a couple of guys and one gal on the trail, over the years, that I considered "creepy" .... The kind of person that makes the hair stand up on the back of your neck .... They usually start asking questions that are, well, "odd", you have to listen to that little voice .... And some people will likely be misjudged. I can also share this, before I remarried, in my early 40's, and being a friendly guy, it was amazing to me how many young women would be just down right rude if you were just polite. I am decent looking, dressed well, took care of myself and had good hygiene, but just the age difference was usually enough .... I can remember thinking that many guys my age must be real a-sholes to young women .... As I get older, I'm not sure that is entirely it ....
<Originally Posted by AT Traveler
As an observation.... "Creepy" is a purely subjective term. >
[QUOTE=Another Kevin;1908019]Wow, I didn't know you'd met me on the trail!
I was the one (perhaps one of several?) who followed you for a day, surrounded by a cloud of no-seeums, scratching my ear like a dog with fleas and mumbling versus to the Doors - "Lizard King", and trying very hard to be creepy neutral.
Hmm. How does one go about being creepy neutral. No, wait ... not sure I want to know.
Miles to go before I sleep. R. Frost
Well my observation is that Hikermom has mastered the art--start a thread about avoiding creepy men and then dropping out of sight........
What i am tired of is when someone Labels somebody without an informed oppion, they meet somebody then come on WB and call that person a creep why because that person has long hair hasn't shaved in a while, Don't label somebody without an informed oppion. most of all the people that have been labeled as creeps are not.Originally Posted by Sarcasm the elf
and when you dog climbs all over my gear that gives me the right to come on the Dog forum and spout my mouth off period.
I totally agree about the witch hunts, I hate them. Everyone has the right to be on the trail, even the homeless and mentally ill.
However, I'm pretty sure no one in this thread has called all long-haired, unshaven, male hikers, "creeps". I may be wrong, but I feel like you're being a little harsh. The sad fact is that 1 in 5 women are victims of an attempted or completed sexual assault. I guarantee there are women hikers who may not have been assaulted on the trail but have been assaulted before. Please keep that in mind when you're judging women for being overly cautious.
Well the lady folk seem to have left the building. But I suspect that creepie-ness is (WARNING:Completely un-pc comment) both subjective and situational.
Miles to go before I sleep. R. Frost
+1
Already posted a creepy man story in the General sub-forum and don't feel like repeating it here. Thankfully I haven't really come across "creepy" hikers yet. Odd? Yes. Obnoxious? Yes. But not creep status. Solo hitch-hiking is a different beast entirely...
Would tell women to listen to their gut feelings when it comes to this. If there is something "off" about a man, even if you aren't fully aware of what it is, be careful and avoid if you can.
This is really a negative sad thread that may be a first for the female's forum. First - I am totally dismayed at the men not able to stay out of the forum, I may be old school, but guys I most likely have less than 20 posts or less in the years I have been registered. We do not need or justify being part of this communication other than the community at large.
That being said we as a group of enthusiasts are at times poor judge of character, and camaraderie amongst the passion of backpacking or hiking - Find the good in people around you or hike faster alone. There is nothing wrong hiking alone... many have done this and are better because of it.
THINK - Both Men and Women have been accosted or murdered over the years on the AT, by psychopaths, a terrible tragedy.
Remember this - There are only two types of terrifying men on the trail, young and old - they are all annoying....The owl has spoken.
Dogs are excellent judges of character, this fact goes a long way toward explaining why some people don't like being around them.
Woo
Spotting Dangerous People on the Appalachian Trail.
"Everyone has the right to be on the trail, even the homeless and mentally ill. However, I'm pretty sure no one in this thread has called all long-haired, unshaven, male hikers, "creeps".
Oh no. I was feeling good about myself because I had weeded myself from the creepy person category because I have short hair and I'm clean shaven, not homeless, and not mentally ill(as far as know but....). Then, I read psychopaths are charming and manipulative. I wonder if that simply makes me a capitalist business man or I really am a creepy psychopath? Are they one and the same?
Two years ago on my first long motorcycle ride of the year; mid point at 500 mi at a McDonalds in Danville. I happened to walk into the wrong bathroom. I'm used to the boys on the left. I was tired and walked to the left door. This doesn't work at this location. Two seconds in and out. Somewhat disconcerting to find no urinal. F#$% me!!!!!! Older lady outside laughing at me.
I do not hang out in the womens forum.
I saw Hiker Moms tag and decided to come on in.
Experiencing the same uncomfortable feeling.
But for different reasons. Can you imagine the uproar over a Male hiking forum?
One of the funny things about this whole issue is that given a certain statement, ? , non verbal stuff etc. 1 woman will take offense another won't.
I've had the experience of saying " Hi how are today? nice day isn't it? " the woman didn't make eye contact and picked up her walking pace.
I was chastised by a co-worked for saying hello to some kids walking home from school. Why did I say hello? Just to acknowledge your existance.
It's not easy being male and not knowing how a simple friendly statement might be taken the wrong way.
I'm following the conversation because I don't want to be taken as a creapy guy.
It's not easy being male, middle-aged, and straight. WE are becoming the minority.
The important thing is to realize that women are people just like you who want to be treated like decent human beings. But at the same time....
It makes total sense for women to be suspicious of strange men
I often travel and hike solo, and I don't think women should be afraid to do so. But as others have pointed out, many women have experienced physical or sexual assault, especially "minor" things like groping. (myself included) And ALL women have experienced verbal harassment or unwanted attention like staring. It's hard for men to imagine what this is like. As a woman, you can't even walk down the street without the possibility of a vulgar comment, or worse.
In the blog from the OP, the author woke up to find a man she barely knew stroking her back. As a man, how would you feel if you woke up in a hotel room with another man stroking your back? You would be pretty freaked out, right? And what if people blamed you for sharing the hotel room in the first place? And what if you couldn't physically take him in a fight, if it came to it? That is like 1% of how women feel ALL THE TIME!!
As someone pointed out, men sometimes think a smile or polite response from a woman is a signal of sexual interest. That's why women might offer their "bitch face" or just leave - they don't want to risk it.
But it doesn't have to be this way!!
I have lived in Munich, Germany for a year, and for the first time in my life I can go for runs without fear that I will be harassed. No matter how I am dressed or how slow I run nobody says one thing to me - not the Turkish-German teenagers playing basketball, not the old men sitting on a park bench, and not even the construction workers. I can hardly describe how amazing it is!! I don't have to change my route or wear baggy clothing!! I don't have to worry about what time it gets dark!!! I can just go for a run like a normal human being who isn't afraid of anything!!! (I guess this is how men feel all the time??)
So as a man, what can you do?
The easy part is to obviously not do it yourself. The much harder part is to call it out when you see it. A woman might not say anything, or might even smile, because she wants to end this interaction as quickly as possible. (Am I happy when a man yells "Hey cutie!" at me? Of course not! But I will smile anyway because he might respond with violence if I react in a way he doesn't like. Or I could put on my "bitch face," depending on the situation.)
And the even harder part is to do the same with your friends. It's actually easier to call out a stranger than a friend who makes a sexist remark. But both are important if we want to have a society where harassment of women is not acceptable.
Sorry for the long post but this topic is obviously close to my heart. And I think it's good that men want to participate in this conversation, because that is the only way we can solve these problems!
Oh man if anyone offers me a honey bun on the trail I'm takin it whether they are creeps or not
If I deem them on creep status....the plan is to snatch it and run away....win win situation
Now you have me worried. I am the kind of guy that holds doors open for women. I also have a habit of saying "Thank you sweetie" Or Honey. I DEFINITELY
do not mean anything by it nor do I expect anything in return. It is just a habit of mine. So if we meet on the trail please don't take offense at what I say.
Blackheart
As a female, I can say that I have solo hiked in quite a few places. Generally, I run into solo guys or couples. I have met some really nice people over the years..Enjoyed great conversations, hikes, and even lunch with strangers. I also have crossed paths with a creeper a couple of times. One sticks out... He looked very nice..average joe kind of guy...from appearances alone...ok. But once I got close to him and we exchanged hellos... Then The creep vibe hit hard...like I could feel the hair on my neck stand up. There was nothing he said that did it.
I quickly moved on and totally changed my plans for the night. I hiked back to my vehicle and moved to a completely different section of the park I was visiting. Even had problems sleeping alone that night...even though I knew he was miles away.
The fear factor can be visceral at times. It is like our unconscious mind can pick up on bad intentions...or maybe my imagination just went into fearful overdrive in this instance. Who knows?
But you are talking about friendly comments, which is not the same as harassing someone. So what's the difference? Politeness! I grew up in the South so that is very important to me.
If I was going inside a store and a guy opened the door for me and said, "There you go, hon" I would just say, "Thanks!" But if I was walking alone at night and a guy standing on the corner said, "There you go, hon!" I would be really creeped out! Same words, but one is a nice comment and the other is totally creepy.
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