Firing up an old stove

[Ashman]

I have an old MSR white gas stove. The kind that has a hose that goes into a pump that you prime. You attach everything and open the valve and a small amount of gas goes into a small pan beneath the burner. You burn that small amount to heat up the element. You then turn the gas on and light the burner. I haven't used this thing in over 15 years. I still have some gas in my MSR bottle (again 15 years old). I tried to fire the thing up, no luck. Here is what I did:

1) Screwed the prime pump onto the Bottle
2) attached the stove hose to the pump
3) Pumped the primer about a dozen times
4) Opened the valve to get some gas on the pan under the burner

Nothing happened. A little gas leaked at the valve, I could hear air coming out but no gas.

What am I doing wrong? Can I take the stuff into an REI and have them look at it? Any tips, wisdom, or insight would be greatly appreciated

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

Sounds like the rubber gaskets in the pump may have deteriorated and not be raising the pressure enough to cause the fuel to flow. You might try pumping until the plunger won't move. The pressure won't build to that point if the problem is a deteriorated gasket.

[EWS]

Your pump seals are bad. Take the pump apart and lube the o-rings and leather-flap-thingy, if they're serviceable, or replace them if they're shot. 15 year old gas ain't worth a hoot either.

[NICKTHEGREEK]

Your pump seals are bad. Take the pump apart and lube the o-rings and leather-flap-thingy, if they're serviceable, or replace them if they're shot. 15 year old gas ain't worth a hoot either.

May I also add, do it outside.

[Ashman]

I knew I could count on you guys for some good info. How do I lube the O rings? How do I tell if they are shot? I thought the old gas might not be to useful. Can I use it just to see if the thing will work? I don't want to go by new gas just to find out the stove is shot. Dino I will try the pump till I can't no more thing.



Outside of course

[EWS]

If the o-rings are cracked, flat, or not springy they're shot.

The lubricant I have came with my stove's kit, I *think* *am not certain* than you can use vasoline. At the worst it'll just break down.

[veteran]

You can use silicone grease to lubricate the O-rings. Auto parts supply
stores carry it in a small tube.

[Ashman]

I took apart the assembly. I didn't see an O ring. There is a leathery doughnot shaped ring at the bottom of the plunger. I took everything apart and put it back together. Went back out and pumped. I got liquid at the bottom of the base and fired it. After the element was warmed I turned on the stove. It lit but the flame was real weak and sputtering. Could that be the old gas?

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

Most likely is the old gas.

[Ashman]

What is the best way to dispose of the old gas?

[EWS]

Set fire to something.

[Ashman]

OH How I would love to! We have some pretty severe water and outside fire restrictions on right now but I like the way you think!

[peakbagger]

Silicone grease works the best on the o ring and pump cup but vaseline will work.

Your best idea is to work your way through the stove. Before assembling the pump into the fuel bottle, disassemble the pump and grease the leather pump cup, it may have dried out and shrunk so you may have to carefull stretch it out so that it matches the diameter of the pump body after greasing it thoroughly. Next thing is inspect the ball check at the base of the pump. It may be gummed up or stuck. (if it is gummed up, you might as well buy a rebuild kit, strip the entire stove and degum everything). If you have a fuel screen on the end of the fuel pickup tube, check to see if it is not plugged.

Now go outside away from any ignition source, assemble the pump into the fuel bottle with a small amount of fuel, give the pump a few pumps and open the fuel valve pointing the opening away from you. If you see and here a cloud of mist spraying out, go on to the next step, otherwise, go back repeat the previous steps and remove the fuel screen from the fuel pickup. Dont waste your time playing with the rest of the stove until this step is successfull.

The next thing is to do is assemble the fuel tube to the fuel bottle (after greasing the o-ring), give the bottle about 10 pumps and slowly open the fuel valve. You should hear some noise and fuel should dribble into the primer cup. Look carefully at the joint between the fuel tube and the fuel bottle for any signs of leakage, if you see any leakage, replace the o-ring, before attempting to light the stove. If the primer cup doesnt fill, disconnect the stove from the fuel bottle and remove the jet just above the primer cup. Clean it with a pin on the tool that came with the stove. Look through it at a bright light to make sure it is clear.

Repeat trying to fill the primer cup, if it doesnt work, the cable inside the fuel tube may be gummed up. Slip the cable out of the tube and clean it then reassemble it. Repeat the priming step. If it doesnt work, list the stove on E-bay and buy a new stove .

As for old fuel, as long as its not gummed up, it will burn, it just may not have the same heat output.

[Roland]

What is the best way to dispose of the old gas?

Pour it into your car's gas tank. A few ounces of old gas, mixed with gallons of new gas, won't have much impact on engine performance.

[take-a-knee]

You need to order a rebuild kit, not the annual maintenance kit, tear the stove down (schematics are on MSR's site) and install those parts. If you don't do this, you are toting a fire hazard around. Those who ignore this will, sooner or later, kick their MSR stoves/fireballs into the creek like a friend of mine did. Those stoves HAVE to be maintained.

[Uncle Silly]

Pour it into your car's gas tank. A few ounces of old gas, mixed with gallons of new gas, won't have much impact on engine performance.

He said this is old white gas, not gasoline, so this is probably not a good idea. Given the amounts there probably wouldn't be much ill affect, but I wouldn't chance it.

[EWS]

For about twice the price/$25 more of a rebuild kit, you can just get a new liquid fuel stove: Primus Multifuel $55.

[weary]

Your pump seals are bad. Take the pump apart and lube the o-rings and leather-flap-thingy, if they're serviceable, or replace them if they're shot. 15 year old gas ain't worth a hoot either.

It's my guess that the gas may be still okay for use in a stove. I once filled my oil tank to use as a backup to a wood boiler in my house. I didn't use the oil for 18 years. But despite all the people who insisted I needed to pump out the oil and buy new, it burned as well as ever.

Weary

[veteran]

MSR Pump Parts

[Toolshed]

Just curious, but how much gas do you have in your bottle, if only a little, it will take more than a dozen pump strokes to build up enough pressure to operate the stove properly. That is the first thing I would do - If less than 1/2 tank in a 22 oz bottle, Pump it with at least 30 strokes or more.

Higher pressure will help you determine if you really have leaks in your o-rings - don't light the stove yet, let the pump/tank lie outside on a piece of paper towel, if fuel is leaking the paper towel will absorb it and you'll easily see it. If this is fine, then attach the stove assembly - use a little spittle to make sure the male end slides into the female port easily.
Open the stove a bit and let a little fuel into the primer cap and prime the stove as you normally do. After you have it lit and going, experiment with various fuel flow levels with the control valve to make sure the o-ring at the pump/stove connection isn't leaking either.

If you do have leaks from bad o-rings, just take the pump assembly to Home Depot and find the perfect replacements.

As for the gas, it'll burn OK, I am using some coleman fuel from 1984 now (got 4 cans when an 89 year old aunt died) and it burns just fine.

As for the stove being 15 years old, as long as that leather one way check-valve is supple, and the o-rings are not cracked, split or deteriorated, that stove should operate like it did when it was new. Having worked for 25 plus years with much larger one way pressure pumps with the same operating principle and designs, we used household oil, motor oil, salad oil and even olive oil a few times and they all worked well. I use silicon grease on my plastic pump housings and o-rings and that works well too, although I don't know if a leather check-valve will absorb silicon grease to maintain suppleness.

If you want to really clean the stove burner, you can easily dissamble the burner in about 3 minutes with a screwdriver and put the parts in the dishwasher.
Good Luck!!