Gear weight vs. Safety

[sbhikes]

Thousands and thousands and miles of backpacking among us.

...and not one gear discussion.

People who have limited outdoor experience in a narrow environment (Southern Appalachians perhaps?) discuss gear ad infinitum and ad nauseum.

Get outdoors...and outside a narrow area and way of hiking.

To be fair, this topic hasn't exactly been about gear. I mean, boring gear discussions like "what brand of xyz should I get" gear talk.

I remember when I was hiking near Mt. Hood and this guy was getting set to do a section from Barlow Pass to Cascade Locks. He had just bought all this ultralight gear and he was so excited to meet a hiker with gear like his. He wanted to talk gear talk with me. What brand of pack do you have? How much does it weigh? That kind of thing. I just wanted to get the heck away from him. I couldn't care less what brand of pack or tent I had and I cared even less what kind he had. The only thing I wanted to talk about was what's for lunch at the Timberline Lodge!

However, when I met other hikers with towering loads and they asked me how I could be out there with so little, I was happy to discuss it with them. Being able to hike far with a light load enabled me to experience the PCT. When people learn backpacking doesn't have to be painful and slow, they realize maybe they could also do a thru-hike. It doesn't have to be a superhuman endeavor. It opens up their world.

[Wolf - 23000]

My point is not about testosterone posturing, it's about staying out in the woods longer and in towns less. Would you say the same "test their manhood" thing to ULers who punch out 30 mile days?

Tipi Walter,

As SGT Rock pointed out there are several places you can pick up supplies right on the trail between Damascus to Springer, Mt.

As for "staying out in the woods longer and in town less" that is something I would agree with you on. There are a few hikers that spend more time on the trail and little time in town but they are getting fewer and fewer.

Wolf

[Wolf - 23000]

To be fair, this topic hasn't exactly been about gear. I mean, boring gear discussions like "what brand of xyz should I get" gear talk.

I remember when I was hiking near Mt. Hood and this guy was getting set to do a section from Barlow Pass to Cascade Locks. He had just bought all this ultralight gear and he was so excited to meet a hiker with gear like his. He wanted to talk gear talk with me. What brand of pack do you have? How much does it weigh? That kind of thing. I just wanted to get the heck away from him. I couldn't care less what brand of pack or tent I had and I cared even less what kind he had. The only thing I wanted to talk about was what's for lunch at the Timberline Lodge!

However, when I met other hikers with towering loads and they asked me how I could be out there with so little, I was happy to discuss it with them. Being able to hike far with a light load enabled me to experience the PCT. When people learn backpacking doesn't have to be painful and slow, they realize maybe they could also do a thru-hike. It doesn't have to be a superhuman endeavor. It opens up their world.

sbhiker,

I know how you feel. I've been bored to death for years with hikers asking questions on gear, brand pack, home made. I don't mind helping someone out but sometimes some hikers were pretty annoying, some went as far to want me to drop everything I was doing and unpack my pack right on the trail. If you ask me, there are to many gear heads out there.

Wolf

[Nevermind]

Tipi Walter,

As SGT Rock pointed out there are several places you can pick up supplies right on the trail between Damascus to Springer, Mt.

As for "staying out in the woods longer and in town less" that is something I would agree with you on. There are a few hikers that spend more time on the trail and little time in town but they are getting fewer and fewer.

Wolf

Not a gear question (I think), just a personal philosophy question:
Is it better to have a heavier pack that would allow you to comfortably carry more weight but move slower, or a lighter one that would let you move faster but require you to resupply more often? And by "is it better" I'm asking about opinion/preference. No right or wrong answers.

For example, assuming the same base weight otherwise, I could take a big 6 pound pack that would allow me to comfortably carry 10 days of food between resupply points (though moving slower). Or, I could take a 2 pound pack that would comfortably carry 6 days of food, and I could move faster, but would have to get off the trail more often to resupply.

Enjoy hiking by carrying less weight? Or enjoy hiking by taking fewer trips off the trail?

Caution: The numbers I chose are arbitrary and not the intended point of discussion.

[prain4u]

I think that the frequency of resupply can also be attributed (in part) to each person's basic personality "type".

Some people tend to gain strength and renewal from being around other people. Thus, being at a store, and being around other people, would be something that they would look forward to. It would be refreshing for them. Such people probably enjoy (and actually look forward to) the "social aspects" of the AT. It "recharges their batteries".

For other individuals, being around other people tends to be somewhat "draining". They don't necessarily dislike being around other people. However, they don't always look forward to it either. They actually feel more "refreshed" from solo activities than from group activities. They prefer their social encounters to come in more limited (and less frequent) doses. They prefer the "solitude" of hiking to the more "social aspects" of hiking.

Studies have shown that such preferences tend to be "hard-wired" into us--from infancy (or even earlier). Thus, I would guess that such "core" preferences would also play a role in the frequency of our resupply. Some people feel refreshed after stopping at a store--other people don't.

When hiking, if there were unstaffed food caches and unstaffed hot showers located at various locations "in the woods"--I would personally not see much need to EVER stop in a town or to be around other people.

HERMITS UNITE!

[garlic08]

I think that the frequency of resupply can also be attributed (in part) to each person's basic personality "type".

Some people tend to gain strength and renewal from being around other people...For other individuals, being around other people tends to be somewhat "draining".

Excellent point. I never thought of it that way, but it makes sense.

Another, more minor, affect on hiking style may be an interest in sociology. I also enjoy getting a off trail to resupply in order to walk into and around a town, to get an idea of how people live--what the farms look like, what kind of interesting junk is in peoples' yards, what kind of characters hang out at the diner or the hardware store, etc. Hitching a ride, you can really meet some interesting people. One thing I enjoyed about the AT was seeing the social change from South to North, maybe because I've never lived in the East.

[Wolf - 23000]

Not a gear question (I think), just a personal philosophy question:
Is it better to have a heavier pack that would allow you to comfortably carry more weight but move slower, or a lighter one that would let you move faster but require you to resupply more often? And by "is it better" I'm asking about opinion/preference. No right or wrong answers.

For example, assuming the same base weight otherwise, I could take a big 6 pound pack that would allow me to comfortably carry 10 days of food between resupply points (though moving slower). Or, I could take a 2 pound pack that would comfortably carry 6 days of food, and I could move faster, but would have to get off the trail more often to resupply.

Enjoy hiking by carrying less weight? Or enjoy hiking by taking fewer trips off the trail?

Caution: The numbers I chose are arbitrary and not the intended point of discussion.

Nevermind,

In terms of weight and miles, it really all depends on you and what you are after while hiking. You can hike the AT with a 10 pound pack or a 50 pound pack and resupply every 5 days and still covering the same distance. The different is with a 10 pound pack, you are not going to notice the miles the same compare to carrying an extra 40 pound on your back - making a lighter weight hiker more likely to travel farther.

Many hikers believe that if you hike lightweight you have to resupply more often. Well, the more miles you travel per/day gives you more options to resupply but sometimes those resupply really can be more annoying than they are worth. I know some hikers will only carry 2 - 3 days of food before resupply point then go several miles off the trail to resupply. Personal I try to get off the trail as little as possible. Sense food is the heaviest item I carry I normal will only travel with the most 5 days of food. On the AT there really is no need to carry more.

Wolf

[OnThePath]

Of course I agree with you, but that's what they keep selling people. It's even harder to find a light pack in children's sizes. Don't even get me started on boy scouts. There's a perfect opportunity for them to develop and make available a line of packs suitable for children and teenagers. They fail miserably. Why? If they don't get it right, what the heck are they doing? They are supposed to be the experts. School packs is another. Too heavy even before the books go in. Have you seen school yards lately. That can't be good.

I am new to hiking and bought a osprey aether 70 it wieghs 5 lbs 3 ozs. would this be something i should think about returning for a lighter pack?

[prain4u]

I am new to hiking and bought a osprey aether 70 it wieghs 5 lbs 3 ozs. would this be something i should think about returning for a lighter pack?

In my opinion, yes! (Though some would disagree)

Look at this pack instead (ULA Catalyst):
http://www.ula-equipment.com/catalyst.asp

Just 2 lbs 15 oz. and will probably do the trick for many hikers.

(Here is the Osprey Aether for comparison:
http://www.ospreypacks.com/detail.ph...ab=description )


The Osprey Aether is a nice pack and perhaps has some features that the ULA Catalyst doesn't--but the packs are comparable in many ways--including price and approximate size.

Catalyst weighs over 2 lbs less. That is a big thing for me.

Some would say the Aether has a better load bearing suspension. It also has more compartments and more pockets and more openings to access your gear. It also comes with a detachable "fanny pack"/top cover. However, you pay for all of that that in the added weight.

For me, the savings in weight is more important than having the added features. (Some people would decide just the opposite).

[Wolf - 23000]

I am new to hiking and bought a osprey aether 70 it wieghs 5 lbs 3 ozs. would this be something i should think about returning for a lighter pack?

Are you happy with it? In general the heavier packs can handle heavier loads better. How much weight do you want to carry? You can always travel lighter but lightweight hiking is not for everyone. If you get a lighter pack, will you be carrying a light load to match it? The only person who can really say if you should return the pack for a lighter pack is you.

Wolf

[Graywolf]

I really enjoyed reading this topic..One reason I signed on here..Lots of view points and all very informative..

The best thing that happened to me last year on the section hike was the battle torn pack finally giving up its ghost..It took that incident to finally graduate to internal, lightweight packs..But I do still look at ones that I can carry more food with as I like to be out more than in town..But the fact that I finally went lighter helped..

One statement here I seen was the hiking style: Hike slower starting out and dont rush it, especially at the beginning..I believe this statment heartedly..I enjoy taking my time anyway, as I like to look around and smell the roses.."Live the Experiance" is what I say..

One item I still have trouble is with the foot wear..I still wear boots, but light weight ones.. I have no problem with trail runners or tennis show style shoes, but after an accident in the Davis Mountains in Texas 15 years ago, my left ankle has a tendacy to want to "buckle"..So I use the boots as an extra measure of precaution..I say this for one point: Listen to your own body and its needs..Weigh out the options you have when choosing gear and pick the ones that correspond to your bodies needs, not the needs of someone else..

And for the main point: Choose gear that is going to allow you to enjoy being out in the wilderness and experiancing the trip..

Graywolf

[prain4u]

Are you happy with it? In general the heavier packs can handle heavier loads better. How much weight do you want to carry? You can always travel lighter but lightweight hiking is not for everyone. If you get a lighter pack, will you be carrying a light load to match it? The only person who can really say if you should return the pack for a lighter pack is you.

Wolf

You are very correct on one important factor--the difference in carrying capacity between the two packs.

I failed to mention that the Osprey Aether can apparently carry up to 60-70 lbs at the upper end of it's range. The ULA Catalyst has a recommended load limit of 40 lbs or less.

For me, I can't envision carrying over 40 lbs anymore (particularly for the AT and similar trails). Parts of the PCT and other trails could be a different story--with longer distances between resupply points and water sources.

[sbhikes]

On a long hike I'm pretty much limited by my stomach. I carried a quite large pack but it was mostly just a big bag of food. After 4 days it would be pretty much empty and the only thing on my mind was what I was going to eat at the next town. For me on the PCT, going light with my gear was how I could carry enough food so I could run to the next big meal in town. I guess that's sort of sad, but it's how it was for me.

I also liked visiting each town and wondering if I could live there someday and be a trail angel in my old age.

[Wolf - 23000]

You are very correct on one important factor--the difference in carrying capacity between the two packs.

I failed to mention that the Osprey Aether can apparently carry up to 60-70 lbs at the upper end of it's range. The ULA Catalyst has a recommended load limit of 40 lbs or less.

For me, I can't envision carrying over 40 lbs anymore (particularly for the AT and similar trails). Parts of the PCT and other trails could be a different story--with longer distances between resupply points and water sources.

Prain4u,

Personally I would not carry even close to 40 pounds on either the AT or PCT. I generally keep my pack extremely lightweight, while others may not mind carrying 40 pounds on their back and don't think anything of it. Normal someone carrying 40 pounds will spend more time at camp than a lighter weight hiker. In the end, either way is a good way of doing the trail. It just depends on how someone wants to do the trail.

Wolf

[prain4u]

Prain4u,

Personally I would not carry even close to 40 pounds on either the AT or PCT. I generally keep my pack extremely lightweight, while others may not mind carrying 40 pounds on their back and don't think anything of it. Normal someone carrying 40 pounds will spend more time at camp than a lighter weight hiker. In the end, either way is a good way of doing the trail. It just depends on how someone wants to do the trail.

Wolf

I agree. I made the 40 lb comment only because it is my understanding that there are SOME drier sections of the PCT that require hikers to carry a "substantial" amount of water (Some writers suggest up to 2 gallons --or 8 liters--and water weighs about 2.25 lbs per liter).

This summer, I did a 10 day hike on Isle Royale National Park. On that trip, my pack (at its heaviest) was 40 lbs. That was unusually heavy...but some unique situations pushed me to the heavier weight.

Resupply was "iffy" (especially late in the hiking season and I also have special dietary needs). So, I carried 11 days worth of food. The National Park Service recommends using BOTH water filtration and chemical water purification treatment. The low temps could get into the upper 20s or low 30s--so my clothes and sleep system were slightly heavy. Not all campsites are appropriate for hammock hanging--so I had to go a bit heavier with my shelter needs (if I also wanted protection from insects). I was also carrying some extra equipment that I was experimenting with. EVEN with all of that, my pack hit just 40 lbs on the heaviest day (with 11 days of food and 2 liters of water).

It was my first time on Isle Royale--so I listened to the (non-lightweight) advice of previous hikers. In the end, I had roughly 6 pounds of stuff that I did not use--or barely used. Thus, on a second trip, I could easily do a sub-30 lb pack for 10 days on Isle Royale--with no resupply. If I mailed my food resupply to the island--I could probably get away with a 20-25 lb. pack.