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  1. #1
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    Default Questions? Solutions? It Depends

    In a recent post of mine, I stated I would still speak out on issues that I feel are relevant and important to the safety of the trail. So I will make my comments and answer those who wish a response.

    Iíve moved my responses here instead of, Training Dogs for the Trail, so that thread can stay on subjectÖ

    Quote from Blue Jay: Sorry, I was out hiking. All this vitriol and then you apologize

    The apology was to Saraphim and for getting off topic and in no way an apology to you.

    However, it was a nice attempt to hide from having to answer the questions. The full message written to Blue Jay which he refuses to answer, (Along with many other questions in the thread, are:

    http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...?t=6725&page=3 Message #96.

    Just to save time here are the 2 main questions:

    Quote from Blue Jay about knowing the Hells Angels: ďI know most of the local Angel chapter as Blue JayĒ

    Simple question:.
    1. Since youíre such good friends with them, please prove it. Take a video cam and go yuck it up with the boys.

    Don't forget, we need a way to verify that they know what their picture is being used for.

    When will you be sending us this information?

    Quote from Blue Jay: "I would be thrilled if they would hike the trail."

    Simple question:
    2. Why not take a poll and see how many of your fellow hikers here on White Blaze would, "Be thrilled if they would hike the trail."?

    (Iím sure you know how to start a poll, so why not see how many would be thrilled?)

    I wonder how many females on the trail would feel safe if Blue Jay, or anyone else for that matter, sent a letter to any of the Hellís Angles, and other outlaw motorcycle gangs, informing them of Shelter locations and how many single female hikers are on the trail and invited them on out?

    I will continue to post these comments and questions to you until either you answer or retract them.

    White Oak:
    Iíll answer your question, but I have one for you 1st. Why did you send me this private message?

    Fun
    Come on down to Arkansas and I guarantee I'll give you a climax. Even if I have to spend 40 minutes licking that prescise spot!

    So White Oak, Iíll need a precise address. Please send a phone number as well so you can be notify ahead of time to rest that tongue of yours up beforehand.. I also get the feeling; the animal wild life has gotten either too fast or bored with you?

    However, I will answer your questions in post # 105 on Training Dogs for the Trail.

    What's the beef, Jill?

    Untrained dogs on the trail, and people who donít respect others space or property. Pretty simpleÖ

    Didn't let go and enjoy life when you were young?

    Enjoyed life both then and now and you?

    Bitter now? Nope.

    Somehow, because I make a statement here at White Blaze, about alcohol and drug abuse on the trails and in shelters, there are a few who would like to turn it into something else.
    However, itís ironic and remarkable, how the party crews on the trail would criticize other crews with a lot worst then what Iíve said here.
    Behind each otherís back, they would rip each other to shreds. You would hear, them talk what a ďHoĒ one girl is. How big of a**hole someone else is. How next time they mouth off, someoneís going to get their ďa** kickedĒ. So not only hypocrisy, there was self-righteousness amongst them as well. They felt they were better then another crew because they can hold their liquor better, didnít make a big scene, didnít barf, and a host of other petty complaints. You would get, the constant bitching from one crew about another whoís parents were paying for the adventure and between those who had to beg, borrow or steal to get drunk and high. While one crew was in recovery mode, they loved to complain, how one crew kept them up by their drinking and loud noise. They're the oneís who would love to bitch about any noise in which, someone either kept them awake or woke them up by, talking, snoring, packing, unpacking, and cooking. This was not just in the shelters, but in the hostels as well you could listen to the bitching. Yet when I would see them run into each other, they would be so pleasant and not say a thing.

    So let me state this again. I donít care how much someone wants to party. If they want to get drunk, high, stoned and have an orgy is none of my business. All I ask is that you have respect for other hikers.

    However, lets be clear, there are many ways; the crews affect many aspects of the trail. IMO, Iíve seen many blue or yellow blaze from one shelter to the next. (That their right as well) However, its no big deal how much sleep they get, or how many miles they do that day, for theyíre not on a schedule. Those who are there to hike the whole trail as best as possible suffer from lack of sleep and having to hike farther at times to try and stay ahead of a party crew.

    Hostel owners have talked about how they would stay and not pay. I heard more then one hostel owner say, "They have money to get drunk, but can't pay me". There are fewer hostels on the trail and Iím not blaming it on just the party crews. However, go to Hanover and try and find a place to stay. The college use to be hiker friendly, but after so many incidents with drunken hikers now there are only a few, (And very expensive) choices for places to stay.

    So whatís the solution?
    Thereís the quote, ďBad things happen when good people do nothing. So, Iím trying to find answers and solutions here. Here at White Blaze, is a place, where the fists canít fly, and some nut canít pull a knife or worst.

    A message to Blue Jay. Once again, until you answer these 2 questions, posted at the beginning of this post, then, I feel you have nothing to offer.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by JillJones
    Here at White Blaze, is a place, where the fists canít fly, and some nut canít pull a knife or worst.
    Yeah, but unfortunately it's also a place where people can say stuff they'd never dare say in person. And I'm not talking only for fear for their safety. Not meant as personal criticism, just to give the reverse side of the coin. A lot of people get pretty daring on these internet forums...

  3. #3
    Registered User A-Train's Avatar
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    Maybe we can hook "Jill" and Lobster up for a meeting of the Trolls
    Anything's within walking distance if you've got the time.
    GA-ME 03, LT 04/06, PCT 07'

  4. #4
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    Default Whatís the alternative?

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket04
    Yeah, but unfortunately it's also a place where people can say stuff they'd never dare say in person. And I'm not talking only for fear for their safety. Not meant as personal criticism, just to give the reverse side of the coin. A lot of people get pretty daring on these internet forums...
    I agree it's easy to jump in and say something and run. I've not done that. If I feel I've made a mistake or could have said or done something better, then I try to make it right, apologize and move on. If someone asks a question, then I will try and answer it. Is this not the place to talk about serious issues? I made a mistake by not sending a private message to someone with who I had a problem. I've written and posted that I was sorry. I sent this person a private message telling them I was sorry. Here I'm talking about an issue that affects us all on the trail. I appreciate your comments and don't take it as a personal attack or criticism.

  5. #5
    Springer - Front Royal Lilred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JillJones
    In a recent post of mine, I stated I would still speak out on issues that I feel are relevant and important to the safety of the trail. So I will make my comments and answer those who wish a response.

    I’ve moved my responses here instead of, Training Dogs for the Trail, so that thread can stay on subject…

    Quote from Blue Jay: Sorry, I was out hiking. All this vitriol and then you apologize

    The apology was to Saraphim and for getting off topic and in no way an apology to you.

    However, it was a nice attempt to hide from having to answer the questions. The full message written to Blue Jay which he refuses to answer, (Along with many other questions in the thread, are:

    http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...?t=6725&page=3 Message #96.

    Just to save time here are the 2 main questions:

    Quote from Blue Jay about knowing the Hells Angels: “I know most of the local Angel chapter as Blue Jay”

    Simple question:.
    1. Since you’re such good friends with them, please prove it. Take a video cam and go yuck it up with the boys.

    Don't forget, we need a way to verify that they know what their picture is being used for.

    When will you be sending us this information?

    Quote from Blue Jay: "I would be thrilled if they would hike the trail."

    Simple question:
    2. Why not take a poll and see how many of your fellow hikers here on White Blaze would, "Be thrilled if they would hike the trail."?

    (I’m sure you know how to start a poll, so why not see how many would be thrilled?)

    I wonder how many females on the trail would feel safe if Blue Jay, or anyone else for that matter, sent a letter to any of the Hell’s Angles, and other outlaw motorcycle gangs, informing them of Shelter locations and how many single female hikers are on the trail and invited them on out?

    I will continue to post these comments and questions to you until either you answer or retract them.

    White Oak:
    I’ll answer your question, but I have one for you 1st. Why did you send me this private message?

    Fun
    Come on down to Arkansas and I guarantee I'll give you a climax. Even if I have to spend 40 minutes licking that prescise spot!

    So White Oak, I’ll need a precise address. Please send a phone number as well so you can be notify ahead of time to rest that tongue of yours up beforehand.. I also get the feeling; the animal wild life has gotten either too fast or bored with you?

    However, I will answer your questions in post # 105 on Training Dogs for the Trail.

    What's the beef, Jill?

    Untrained dogs on the trail, and people who don’t respect others space or property. Pretty simple…

    Didn't let go and enjoy life when you were young?

    Enjoyed life both then and now and you?

    Bitter now? Nope.

    Somehow, because I make a statement here at White Blaze, about alcohol and drug abuse on the trails and in shelters, there are a few who would like to turn it into something else.
    However, it’s ironic and remarkable, how the party crews on the trail would criticize other crews with a lot worst then what I’ve said here.
    Behind each other’s back, they would rip each other to shreds. You would hear, them talk what a “Ho” one girl is. How big of a**hole someone else is. How next time they mouth off, someone’s going to get their “a** kicked”. So not only hypocrisy, there was self-righteousness amongst them as well. They felt they were better then another crew because they can hold their liquor better, didn’t make a big scene, didn’t barf, and a host of other petty complaints. You would get, the constant bitching from one crew about another who’s parents were paying for the adventure and between those who had to beg, borrow or steal to get drunk and high. While one crew was in recovery mode, they loved to complain, how one crew kept them up by their drinking and loud noise. They're the one’s who would love to bitch about any noise in which, someone either kept them awake or woke them up by, talking, snoring, packing, unpacking, and cooking. This was not just in the shelters, but in the hostels as well you could listen to the bitching. Yet when I would see them run into each other, they would be so pleasant and not say a thing.

    So let me state this again. I don’t care how much someone wants to party. If they want to get drunk, high, stoned and have an orgy is none of my business. All I ask is that you have respect for other hikers.

    However, lets be clear, there are many ways; the crews affect many aspects of the trail. IMO, I’ve seen many blue or yellow blaze from one shelter to the next. (That their right as well) However, its no big deal how much sleep they get, or how many miles they do that day, for they’re not on a schedule. Those who are there to hike the whole trail as best as possible suffer from lack of sleep and having to hike farther at times to try and stay ahead of a party crew.

    Hostel owners have talked about how they would stay and not pay. I heard more then one hostel owner say, "They have money to get drunk, but can't pay me". There are fewer hostels on the trail and I’m not blaming it on just the party crews. However, go to Hanover and try and find a place to stay. The college use to be hiker friendly, but after so many incidents with drunken hikers now there are only a few, (And very expensive) choices for places to stay.

    So what’s the solution?
    There’s the quote, “Bad things happen when good people do nothing. So, I’m trying to find answers and solutions here. Here at White Blaze, is a place, where the fists can’t fly, and some nut can’t pull a knife or worst.

    A message to Blue Jay. Once again, until you answer these 2 questions, posted at the beginning of this post, then, I feel you have nothing to offer.

    Good Grief Jill, get a life would you?? Blah.... Blah.....blah.......
    "It was on the first of May, in the year 1769, that I resigned my domestic happiness for a time, and left my family and peaceable habitation on the Yadkin River, in North Carolina, to wander through the wilderness of America." - Daniel Boone

  6. #6
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    Default But what do think?

    Quote Originally Posted by A-Train
    Maybe we can hook "Jill" and Lobster up for a meeting of the Trolls
    You know A-Train, Iíve read many of your posts and they have been helpful, and well thought out. I however, fail to see that Iím a troll because Iím talking about an issue. Is there something I failed to answer for you? The topic is simple. Answers? Solutions? It depends. If you have a comment about something I wrote then state it. If you have a question, then ask it. I take it you must be familiar with this debate. I would really like to stick to what I asked in my post. Very simple. The questions I asked Blue Jay were simple. He is the one who stated he would be thrilled to have the Hells Angels on the trail. Where do you stand on this? Does it make me a troll because I ask? How do you feel, and think about the problem of alcohol and drug abuse on the trail and shelters? If you donít think there is one, then fine. State that and if you want give a reason, thatís your choice to answer or not. However, I fail to see how Iím a troll for what I think is an important subject.

  7. #7
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    Default Thanks for the input

    Quote Originally Posted by Lilredmg
    Good Grief Jill, get a life would you?? Blah.... Blah.....blah.......
    Lidredmg,

    Thanks for the inputÖ Iíve seen many of your posts of what you feel is important to you. It would be simple for me to have jumped in and said a quick insult on any of your posts and run. How long would it have taken you to say, "I donít think there is a problem on the trail."
    Or, "I donít think it would be a good idea of even joking about having Hellís Angels on the trail."
    Of course thatís your decision of what you want to put here. However, you have many posts as well and Iím sure that with each one you place you were hoping for it to stay on subject. I sure you didnít want someone telling you to get a lifeÖ So, maybe itís important to meÖ Is that OK? If you would like to tell me you think I might be taking it too far then that's fine as well. I'm just asking you put it in a friendly way. Your choice as well. I put this is an off topic subject (Even thought it does have to do with the trail) and anyone can read it or not. I knew it would catch some flack and did not want hikers looking for answers to come and see a flame war.

  8. #8
    Registered User A-Train's Avatar
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    Jill-

    Sorry if I assumed you were a troll. Just seems weird that you recently signed up here and so far your sole purpose has been to pick verbel quarrels and dig up a scenario that happened this summer, when it could have been layed to rest then. I admit I haven't read every post about the issue nor WAS I THERE, but it just seems like your beef isn't going to be put to rest on the internet. Why continue it on a seperate thread when it seemingly had died out?

    Just out of curiosity where in Times Square do you live??
    Anything's within walking distance if you've got the time.
    GA-ME 03, LT 04/06, PCT 07'

  9. #9
    Springer - Front Royal Lilred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JillJones
    Lidredmg,

    Thanks for the input… I’ve seen many of your posts of what you feel is important to you. It would be simple for me to have jumped in and said a quick insult on any of your posts and run. How long would it have taken you to say, "I don’t think there is a problem on the trail."
    Or, "I don’t think it would be a good idea of even joking about having Hell’s Angels on the trail."
    Of course that’s your decision of what you want to put here. However, you have many posts as well and I’m sure that with each one you place you were hoping for it to stay on subject. I sure you didn’t want someone telling you to get a life… So, maybe it’s important to me… Is that OK? If you would like to tell me you think I might be taking it too far then that's fine as well. I'm just asking you put it in a friendly way. Your choice as well. I put this is an off topic subject (Even thought it does have to do with the trail) and anyone can read it or not. I knew it would catch some flack and did not want hikers looking for answers to come and see a flame war.

    You are continually fanning the the flame. Get a life pretty well sums it up. Have you nothing better to do?? No one tells me to get a life since I don't spend lengthy posts telling others how to live theirs.
    "It was on the first of May, in the year 1769, that I resigned my domestic happiness for a time, and left my family and peaceable habitation on the Yadkin River, in North Carolina, to wander through the wilderness of America." - Daniel Boone

  10. #10
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    Default Trying to work it out..

    Jill,
    Sorry if I assumed you were a troll. Just seems weird that you recently signed up here and so far your sole purpose has been to pick verbel quarrels and dig up a scenario that happened this summer, when it could have been layed to rest then.

    I understand it might seem like a rant. I really should try and keep it brief. There are many people who read these posts for years and donít sign up for many reasons. However, for me, it started when someone posted a message and I recognized the name. There have been many times when a person is hiking and has a problem with someone, or something. You donít say anything there for a number of reasons. However, Iíve explained completely in earlier posts of why I wasn't able to deal with the issue for (What I felt) was my personal safety at the time. My goal is not to pick verbal quarrels. I realized saying some things no matter how true I think they are, end up causing someone pain. Which is why, Iíve tried to keep it on subject. I admit I went a little bit overboard on how the party crews cut each otherís throats, but I guess I was trying to make a point.

    I admit I haven't read every post about the issue nor WAS I THERE, but it just seems like your beef isn't going to be put to rest on the internet. Why continue it on a seperate thread when it seemingly had died out?

    Good question. The problem was part of it did not die out. Blue Jay made what I felt was serious improper comments. He has a way of hit and run. So, I decided to call him on it in the Off Topic area. Also, after I made my apologies to anyone I felt I offended; there were comments, and private message sent to me so Iíve answered them of them here.
    However, I also know there is a problem with the abuse of drugs on the trail and in the shelters. (Yes, I know itís everywhere) Yes, itís been talked about before. Doesnít mean it canít be dealt with again. I canít say I did it perfect and maybe I should have put the issue with Blue Jay and the drug abuse into 2 different threads. However, itís out there now.

    Just out of curiosity where in Times Square do you live??
    I donít. I work there and commute. A very long commute which is when I write these responses.

  11. #11
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    Default Reading Lengthy Posts

    Quote Originally Posted by Lilredmg
    You are continually fanning the the flame. Get a life pretty well sums it up. Have you nothing better to do?? No one tells me to get a life since I don't spend lengthy posts telling others how to live theirs.
    However, you did seem to spend a great deal of time reading my lengthy posts. Have you nothing better do???? Are you fanning the flame? Look inside yourself as well as it works both ways... See how easy it is to give an insult. I see you still havenít decided to make a comment which is fine, but in the time it took you to read and answer you could of given a thought on how to deal with the issue. That's all... If you don't want to make a comment then fine. You can use the ignore button on me, which I'm sure is not that hard to find out how to use. Or, since this is an Off Topic subject, just ignore it... Sorry to make it sound so blunt, but it seems there are just as many who wish to jump on board the insult wagon..

  12. #12
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    You an actress on Broadway? You sure are dramatic. Type in bigger letters. You're strainin my friggin eyes!

  13. #13
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    Default Sorry

    Quote Originally Posted by L. Wolf
    You an actress on Broadway? You sure are dramatic. Type in bigger letters. You're strainin my friggin eyes!
    Dramatic? Why L. Wolf after reading many of your posts, I feel thats a compliment....

    I have no idea why my posts are in small fonts. On here it says the font is Georgia #3. I will change it to the next level and I hope that makes a difference as I preview each post before I summit it and it looks fine. Please let me know...

  14. #14

    Default From the posts of hers I've read, Jill is not a troll...

    She simply clearly called out Blue Jay and Seraphim when they made statements completely out of accordance with reality, and favoring behavior terribly damaging to the Trail culture. I find that admirable, and applaud her POV.

  15. #15
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    It looks good now. REAL BIG LIKE. I'll stay tuned for more "As Whiteblaze Turns".

  16. #16
    Registered User neo's Avatar
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    i like your style jill,your pretty cool in my book neo

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by L. Wolf
    It looks good now. REAL BIG LIKE. I'll stay tuned for more "As Whiteblaze Turns".
    Hopefully not toooo big nowÖ If anyone is having a problem with my fonts in reading the posts, please let me know. I sure there are a few who would think I just asked, ďDo you think I look fat in this dress.Ē So, if you feel the need for a quick insult, please let me know if this is readable while youíre at itÖ

    ThanksÖ

  18. #18
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    I would check my browser settings. The font is a set thing unless your cookie defaults it to another size for some reason.
    SGT Rock
    http://hikinghq.net

    My 2008 Trail Journal of the BMT/AT

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    -----------------------------------------

    NO SNIVELING

  19. #19
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    Default I'm working on it..

    Quote Originally Posted by SGT Rock
    I would check my browser settings. The font is a set thing unless your cookie defaults it to another size for some reason.
    I checked the setting and theyíre all the same. Iíll try and keep working on itÖ

    Thanks

  20. #20
    Springer - Front Royal Lilred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JillJones
    However, you did seem to spend a great deal of time reading my lengthy posts. Have you nothing better do???? Are you fanning the flame? Look inside yourself as well as it works both ways... See how easy it is to give an insult. I see you still haven’t decided to make a comment which is fine, but in the time it took you to read and answer you could of given a thought on how to deal with the issue. That's all... If you don't want to make a comment then fine. You can use the ignore button on me, which I'm sure is not that hard to find out how to use. Or, since this is an Off Topic subject, just ignore it... Sorry to make it sound so blunt, but it seems there are just as many who wish to jump on board the insult wagon..

    Just for the record, I didn't read it. After the first couple of lines, I saw clearly that you are on a rant.
    "It was on the first of May, in the year 1769, that I resigned my domestic happiness for a time, and left my family and peaceable habitation on the Yadkin River, in North Carolina, to wander through the wilderness of America." - Daniel Boone

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