Ok - how does this grade compare to the AT? The Hancocks. . .

[quilteresq]

It's supposed to be doable in a day hike, but I'm a very slow hiker, so I hiked in to the start of the loop trail and camped at the last crossing of North Branch (of the Pemigewasset). . . Started out at 8:00 am for the summit of N. Hancock. From the loop junction - the final ascent - the trail climbs 1000' in .7 mile, but it goes DOWN first to a stream, so it's more like 1200' in .6 miles. That still doesn't tell the entire story, because the trail flattens out at the top for about the last 1/10 mile. At any rate, it was steep as hell, and since it was my first 4000 footer of the year, it was VERY slow going for me. I wound up exiting the woods around 6:00 pm after summiting S. Hancock around 1:00 - going back to the loop junction from S. Hancock was just as slow as going up N. Hancock because I was hiking alone and was VERY careful so as to not break anything important. it took me almost two hours to get back down to the loop junction.

I loved the col trail between the two summits - great mountain top hiking with typical mountain top flora - that went pretty fast!

Trail kicked my butt. Since just about everyone that passed me going into the climb also passed me going out, I know I'm slow. Just wondering how these grades compare to climbs down south, where I'll be starting. It was discouraging. But I'm at 19 4000 footers and counting. . . I may do something pretty quick to get to 20.

[Moose2001]

There are some steep hils in GA and NC but you won't find any that gain 1200 feet in .6 miles. You might think it does though!

[Driver8]

As you're probably aware, Quilter, the Whites are legendarily harder than most anything south of them in the AT corridor. I did Ammonoosuc Ravine trail to the hut and a little past 10 days ago and it beat me up pretty good over 6.4 miles. A week later I did 10.8 mile loop over Stratton and was well-worked but not whupped. It was cake by comparison, as was a 12 mile hike I did at Greylock in mid-April.

[peakbagger]

There really are no steep climbs down south for a similiar sustained grade. The two spots that gave me a chuckle after reading thru hikers comments in registers were the descent down Dragons Tooth (somewhat typical of White mountains) and the climb up out of Lehigh Gap in PA (very rocky with some minor boulder scrambles but less steep). There was also interesting comments about the stretch running along Burkes Garden. In all three cases there was a fair amount of complaints in the register that the trail conditions were "unacceptable" or the builders were sadistic. Of course to someone used to hiking in the whites, the trail segments were what we hike on every weekend. It is easy to get spoiled down south, the trails are so well contoured in most places that when someone has to break stride it slows them down.I expect its the reverse up in the whites, most trails are so rough that getting a good stride going is much rarer. Using your Hancocks experience, just think of 40 or 50 miles similar to the trail bed from the Hairpin Turn to the turnoff of of Cedar Brook except with better drainage.

If you are concerned about solo hiking the 4ks check out the various meetup.com groups that cover the area, there is usually many folks working on the 4Ks and with the number of groups with different age limits, you can usually find one who meets your pace.

[quilteresq]

Whew! Glad to hear all of this. Doing if for a couple of days is one thing, but hiking like that for 6 months sounds hard as hell! Since I'm planning on doing the approach trail, I'm figuring that after the stairs, it will seem like it's home free. 11 summits left to go this summer if I want to finish my 48 peaks on the AT hike.

[Driver8]

Whew! Glad to hear all of this. Doing if for a couple of days is one thing, but hiking like that for 6 months sounds hard as hell! Since I'm planning on doing the approach trail, I'm figuring that after the stairs, it will seem like it's home free. 11 summits left to go this summer if I want to finish my 48 peaks on the AT hike.

Personally, I'm jonesing for the challenge of the really hard stuff in the Whites. I've set a goal of getting up Longs Peak by 2016, and the Whites are the nearest mountains which approximate the difficulty of the terrain in the Rockies. They can't provide the same altitude, but elsewise they're a good training ground. One of my metrics is to be able to get up and down Washington via the Great Gulf Trail from Dolly Copp Campground or thereabouts (maybe descending via Wamsutta or Nelson Crag since GG descent is contraindicated). It's 5K up and just over 7 miles - comparable to the "civilian" northerly ascent of Longs via the Keyhole Route. Once I've done that Washington via that route, the plan is to do higher elevation stuff, working my way up to 14K. Hope to ascend and descend W within the next two months, probably via Jewell and down via Ammo. I'm building towards it, losing gut and other flab en route.

Good luck on your thru - which 4Ks do you lack yet, Quilter, and which have you best enjoyed of those you've done?

[jakedatc]

Easy? Do the Mt Tecumseh loop. easiest 4k you can do. the Osceolas are also supposed to be easy.

Driver you want a challenge? Moosilauke is 4800' 3100' in 3.8mi apparently has one of the steepest miles on the AT (NOBO's have to go down it). I don't know if you can do it as a day hike but South Twin in the Pemi wilderness is like .8mi 1150' up to 4900'

(doing the Pemi wilderness loop is a kickass way to do a ton of 4k's in 4-5 days )

[quilteresq]

Ok - done 19 of the 48 so far. But I started in 1987 - with Moosilauke - dumb, but hey, I was a lot younger then! To do before the AT if I want to finish my 48 on the AT: Passaconaway and Whiteface, the Tripyramids, Isolation, Cabot, W. Bond (seriously, a blizzard the day I was up that ridge in 1989), E. Osceola, Galehead, Flume and one of the Twins - forget which one. Summer project / training hikes.

[jakedatc]

those are the ones you have done? or the ones you want to do.

if you haven't, Tecumseh is super easy.. my gf isnt a super fast hiker either and we did it in an afternoon.

isolation is a good 1.5 day. we hiked to the campsite, dropped packs, hit the summit, slept in and hiked out by lunch time.

[Chaco Taco]

I grew up in NC and have hiked the section of the AT along that area a few times. I recently moved up to New Hampshire and the hiking is totally different in term of elevation gain. You also have to take into consideration the varying terrain between north and south. Im also trying to finish up my 48 in the next couple of months and am going for Hale, Willey, Tom, Field and North Twin on Friday Sat Sun. Most of the hikes up here on the 4000 list are doable in a day, fast or slow, you can get up or down in a day. Just start early. The Osceola's are a challenge, West Bond is an overnight trip. Cant really tell either if you have done them or not. Oh well, its been fun being able to get out so much, rain during the week, sunshine on the weekends. Have fun

[peakbagger]

West Bond or any of the other 4000 footers do not require an overnight. Usually the longer day hike is offset by having to carry far less gear. That being said, a sunset view from West Bond would be spectacular.

I am a decidedly "pokey hiker" and have done the Zealand, Bond West Bond and Boncliff hike at least twice as a long day hike. It requires a car spot and most do it as a group.

There are also some abandoned trails that folks use to make loops. Hale has the Firewardens trail which allows a loop of Zealand, N & S Twin and Hale with no car spot (there is a road walk up Zealand Road). Passaconaway and Whiteface has the Downes Brook Slide trail which makes a nice day hike loop from the Downes Brook Trailhead.

[Driver8]

Easy? Do the Mt Tecumseh loop. easiest 4k you can do. the Osceolas are also supposed to be easy.

Driver you want a challenge? Moosilauke is 4800' 3100' in 3.8mi apparently has one of the steepest miles on the AT (NOBO's have to go down it). I don't know if you can do it as a day hike but South Twin in the Pemi wilderness is like .8mi 1150' up to 4900'

(doing the Pemi wilderness loop is a kickass way to do a ton of 4k's in 4-5 days )

I did Moosilauke the easy way a couple weeks ago - up the east side along the brook from the Dartmouth Lodge. Plan to head back and take on the northside ascent this year, maybe a SOBO A.T. traverse with a friend coming along. I also did the Ammonoosuc Ravine Trail up to the hut on the 12th, abandoning an attempt on Washington or Monroe when greeted with stiff winds above tree line. Was knocked over a time or two and was glad the hut was there for shelter. The Ammo was the hardest thing I've done yet - legs, back and butt were sore for a couple days after. Doing it, with a bit of snow and need of traction was a confidence booster for me. Looking forward to many more stern tests and great views in the Whites in coming months.

Ok - done 19 of the 48 so far. But I started in 1987 - with Moosilauke - dumb, but hey, I was a lot younger then! To do before the AT if I want to finish my 48 on the AT: Passaconaway and Whiteface, the Tripyramids, Isolation, Cabot, W. Bond (seriously, a blizzard the day I was up that ridge in 1989), E. Osceola, Galehead, Flume and one of the Twins - forget which one. Summer project / training hikes.

[Driver8]

Ok - done 19 of the 48 so far. But I started in 1987 - with Moosilauke - dumb, but hey, I was a lot younger then! To do before the AT if I want to finish my 48 on the AT: Passaconaway and Whiteface, the Tripyramids, Isolation, Cabot, W. Bond (seriously, a blizzard the day I was up that ridge in 1989), E. Osceola, Galehead, Flume and one of the Twins - forget which one. Summer project / training hikes.

Meant to reply to your post, too, Quilter, in my prior. Sounds like you will be very well trained and conditioned by the time you depart for Georgia. What were your favorite 4K hikes in the Whites? I very much enjoyed Moosilauke and, though it didn't result in a bagged peak, found the Ammo trail very beautiful.

[quilteresq]

Oh dear - my favorite hikes? I love all the views up there, so it's hard to pick. But Moosilauke stands out certainly, it was a spectacular day I climbed that. i've looked at trail maps of Moosilauke, though, and for the life of me I can't recall which trail I went up. I think I climbed from the north side, but I'm really not sure. Carrigain was the hardest - my husband and I ascended via the Isolation trail and descended via the Signal Ridge trail. We were packing pretty heavy packs at the time - back in the late 80's or early '90's - I forget. Tecumseh was NOT fun - dragged along some children, including my own, who whined all the way up it. I believe it was the first and last mountain she climbed. Definitely the better hikes were when the weather was good. Waumbek was memorable because of the lack thereof - one of my hiking companions mentioned the "incredible view. You can see for at least three FEET!" (fog that day.) At least that one is easy to redo when I get through the list!

Despite the disastrous end to my 1989 five day backpack through the Pemi Wilderness, I think I liked that hike the best. I had just sold my business in Plymouth, NH and was de-stressing after two years of 6 day work weeks with basically no vacations. It wasn't easy to look north for those two years and not have time to be in the woods. I remember having customers in a Rhode Island state license plate car and using a state credit card, loaded with backpacking equipment. Raising my eyebrows, I asked them if they were ons state business headed to the far north to contemplate invading Canada, and they laughed. I was jealous, though.

At any rate, my the five day pack through Lincoln Woods and Thoreau Falls past Zealand, up to Guyot shelter, over the Bond ridge, and back out to the Pemi. After having my first and worst asthma attack on the mountain top in a 50+ mph wind, I broke my arm just after getting back below tree line and hiked out through the Lincoln Woods trail - escorted by rangers from about 1/2 way between the mountain and road. I handed my car keys to my hiking companions I had just met on top of the mountain so they could fetch their car and give me a ride to the hospital when I got out. No problem there! One thing I noticed during that trip was that the end of only five days I was hiking a LOT faster. It give me some hope for the AT. I also notice that when I got back to Plymouth, just south of the Whites, it was a breezy day, but warm and pleasant. Huge difference 4000' elevation and above tree line can make in the weather!

[peakbagger]

Waumbek now has a view (on a clear day ), its about 75 feet past the summit in a small blowdown patch that has been growing. Great view of the AT ridge from Adams to Crawford Notch.

[jeffmeh]

My favorites in the Whites are definitely the Northern Presidentials for sheer ruggedness and awe inspiring views when one gets them. Not that I would complain about too many summits....

[quilteresq]

Oh - saving the Presidentials for the AT hike! I figure I'll be hiking with friends I make on the trail, which will make it better. The only presidential I've done is Jefferson. Besides - if I can kick out my 13 this summer, I'll finish the 48 on the AT hike. That will be fun.

[Driver8]

Oh dear - my favorite hikes?

Sounds like that Pemi hike was quite an adventure! Hope the arm fracture wasn't too severe. I am very much looking forward to hiking in the Pemigwassett Wilderness. The Bonds and Zeacliff sound beautiful, as do Hancock and Carrigain. On my next trek up that way, maybe this weekend. I'm thinking about hitting Franconia Ridge, maybe Falling Waters to Lincoln and, if the legs are willing and able and the weather cooperates, on to Lafayette and down via Greenleaf and OBP. If the weather is less friendly or threatening t-storms, I may opt for a lower summit or two, maybe Pierce and Jackson. We'll see.

[quilteresq]

Yeah - watch the weather - chance of thunderstorms this weekend.

The Pemi Wilderness is awesome, although I'm looking forward to Passaconaway - also a wilderness area - part of that forest between Passaconaway and Whiteface was saved from logging, and is old growth forest. Not much of that left in NH! The views up there toward the lakes region are great.

[jakedatc]

Quilter when are you doing Passac and whiteface? i'd do that loop with ya some time.

I might do something sunday. i'm climbing fri and sat at Rumney