Big learning curve

[Doctari]

Don't know about the rest, I have a byer, but seems that there is a large learning curve with a hammock.
Re, the Byer: what I have learned;

1) 16' is way to far apart for the trees. 10' works, but I have to tie at the highest point I can reach above my head. 12' is (so far) best, alto I suspect that 12.5' to 13' MAY work a bit better.

2) There is a "break in period" it has taken 2 overnighters to stretch it out, & I ain't sure it's done. Altho last night I started out 14" above the ground, ended at 13" so,,,,,

3) I can marginally lay on the diagonal, which is more comfy than in line. But, I can't seem to stay that way. However: I am sleeping on a T-Rest, which may be part of the problem. I am going to convert a old sleeping bag to a underquilt (for testing purposes here at home only) to see if that is the problem. Sleeping in line is hard on my knees, and causes my feet to be above my head, giving me a RAGING HEADACHE by morning.

4) My best night sleep was last night (maybe cause of the 72+ hours at work last week) but to get that I had to forego the bug netting. Havn't figured that out yet, but it is more comfortable and I can lay diagonal better without the netting. I think it is the "breaking in" thing. The side with the enterance is more stretched than the other side, forcing me to sleep on the opeining side, thereby worsening the problem. I (think) I have fixed it, will try again tonight, netting in place.

5) The suspension (stretchy) cord for the bug netting is way long, I may be attaching it wrong. The stretchy cord had to be shipped later, got left out when hammock was shipped. Byer shipped the same day I e-mailed them, WOW!! Great service from Byer.

6) The hammock seems very well made, very well made indeed. The bug netting even supported my full weight for a few seconds (first tab) and a few minutes (2nd tab) so if the netting can support me, , ,

7) I made my own "tree huggers" out of 2 dog leashes from the dollar store, they suppported me all night even with getting ine & out about 10 times or more with trying it out & potty breaks.

8) My tent takes 2 minutes to set up, from "I am going to camp here" to "I am in my tent" My best time with the Byer, was about 5 minutes, WITH HELP. I am sure I can get that time down with practice.

9) My tarp worked well, even tho it is over 10 years old.


So, that is my inital report on the Byer Moskito traveller. I am still learning so this isn't the final report. I think I like hammocking. Not sure, may change, but: I think I like hammocking, so far at least. I do indeed like not having to crawl on the ground to go to bed or to go pee.


Doctari.

[Just Jeff]

Great that you like it! Some comments:

1-2 - sounds pretty consistent with what everyone else has found

3 - Are you hanging the foot a bit higher than the head? This is kinda counterintuitive, but try it. Since males' center of gravity is in our chest, and in a hammock the COG goes to the lowest spot, our chest tries to slide to the middle of the hammock...which pushes the feet higher into the hammock. Hanging the foot a few inches higher than the head end (i.e. the hammock isn't level) allows your body to stay centered in the hammock.

Also, pulling the hammock too tight when you hang it can make it tough to stay on the diagonal. Hang it with more sag, or put in a structural ridgeline to hold the sag consistent, and you might find it easier to stay diagonal.

Re: the pad, sometimes it tough to get the pad to stay diagonal without trimming it, but you can still lay diagonally across the pad. Of course, the underquilt will solve that problem.

4 - Risk had the same thing happen with one of his hammocks - always getting in and out on the same side causes that edge to stretch and become flappier than the other side. Flappy sides may or may not be a problem, though.

8 - What's a few more minutes if it means a better night's sleep? Of course, for the folks that don't get a better night's sleep from it it's just wasted time....

[Doctari]

Great that you like it! Some comments:

3 - Are you hanging the foot a bit higher than the head? This is kinda counterintuitive, but try it. Since males' center of gravity is in our chest, and in a hammock the COG goes to the lowest spot, our chest tries to slide to the middle of the hammock...which pushes the feet higher into the hammock. Hanging the foot a few inches higher than the head end (i.e. the hammock isn't level) allows your body to stay centered in the hammock.

Also, pulling the hammock too tight when you hang it can make it tough to stay on the diagonal. Hang it with more sag, or put in a structural ridgeline to hold the sag consistent, and you might find it easier to stay diagonal.

Re: the pad, sometimes it tough to get the pad to stay diagonal without trimming it, but you can still lay diagonally across the pad. Of course, the underquilt will solve that problem.

4 - Risk had the same thing happen with one of his hammocks - always getting in and out on the same side causes that edge to stretch and become flappier than the other side. Flappy sides may or may not be a problem, though.

8 - What's a few more minutes if it means a better night's sleep? Of course, for the folks that don't get a better night's sleep from it it's just wasted time....

3, I have tried that, seemed to make it worse. Will try again tho. & I gots vacation (last minute "Use it or loose it") comming, so will play with it lots next week.

Have tried looser/tighter etc. None let me lay diag. looser puts me ON THE GROUND. Well, except for the 10' apart trees, but then I have to hang so very high, it seems unreasonable after a long hike. Was hard even fully rested. Have thought to put in a structural ridgeline to hold the sag consistent, but I need to find that "perfect sag" first.

4, Opeinig side was very flappy, and getting worse. When in it with netting, I CANNOT get on the other side. My fear is that I am heading towards laying 1/2 on the hammock & 1/2 on the netting. So, yes Flappy sides are going to be a problem. Slight turn of the head lets me see out of the hammock on the opening side, CANNOT see out the net side, no matter how hard I try. I think, that if during a break, OR, when first in camp, I set up the hammock net side down, & sit on it I'll reduce the opening's flappyness.

8, My thoughts too. Time will tell. AND, that 5 minutes is during "learning time" so,,,,,,,,


Thanks for the hints.

I am willing to try them all out so if any have more, feel free to submit.


Doctari.

[rpettit]

Have you tried a HH ULB? Eliminates all the set up issues (correct sag) that you, and previously, I experienced with the Byer. The HH provides a much more consistent set-up, plus it doesn't have all those dang cords you have to untangle to get it to hang right.

[Doctari]

Have you tried a HH ULB? Eliminates all the set up issues (correct sag) that you, and previously, I experienced with the Byer. The HH provides a much more consistent set-up, plus it doesn't have all those dang cords you have to untangle to get it to hang right.

I suspect that somewhere down the line I'll get a HH. But for now lack of sufficent $$$$$ prevents that. So, what I am doing is learning from the Byer, figuring that once I can afford a Hennesy, I will be so good at setting up a hammock I can do it in my sleep.

And, my first full night in one was good enough, considering I was sleeping in the middle of town.

Thanks for the hint


Doctari.

[Just Jeff]

A structural ridgeline will set the sag for you, so you can hang it all the way tight, as high or low as you want it, and the sag won't change. I found my optimum sag because I added the ridgeline, rather than afterwards.

Here's an easy way to add an adjustable ridgeline:
- Get a cord, relatively non-stretchable, about 9' long. Probably want a couple hundred pounds working load, at least.
- Tie an overhand on a bight on one end to form a loop. The loop should be big enough to fit over the hammock support but small enough that it won't slide over the hammock.
- Thread the hammock support through the loop and pull the ridgeline down to touch the hammock. If the loop is too big and looks like it might slide over the hammock, you can twist the loop into a larkshead and it'll pull tight on the hammock support.
- Hang the hammock with some sag. The ridgeline should be just hanging down on the ground now.
- Pull the ridgeline over to the other end of the hammock, wrap it around the hammock support, and pull it tight. As you pull it tight, the hammock's ends will come closer together and you'll see the hammock's sag increase. You might have to hold the support/ridgeline as you pull it tight, or else the ridgeline will slip over the hammock and won't stay there long enough for you to...
- Use the Hennessy lashing (aka lineman's knot or figure-8 lashing) to secure the ridgeline to the other support.
- Get in and test it!

When you want to adjust it, just unwrap the figure-8 lashing and change the length to increase or decrease the hammock's sag. Once you get the right distance for your hammock, you can measure it and tie loops at both ends if you want to keep it permanent. That's what I'm gonna do when my Air Core from BPL arrives.

[Doctari]

I couldn't wait, tied on a "structural ridgeline" as Jeff suggested (10' BTW) and WOW, it works. I still have to hang a bit more above my head than I would really like, but it works, I can lay diagonally & everything. As I am at work, can't test properly, so perhaps 10' 6" may be better, I'll work out the fine tuning when I get home tomorrow, but I am totally psyched.

Thanks all for your help!! I was ready to give up & go back to sleeping on the ground.


Doctari.

[MedicineMan]

you have evolved into a higher being...no backsliding permitted...and remember that hammocking isnt just for hiking, bring it into your other world too, get that hammock stand(s) set up in the house

[Just Jeff]

Yep - slept in my down hammock the past two nights!

[Alligator]

Yep - slept in my down hammock the past two nights!

Next time just tell her you're sorry!

[Doctari]

I couldn't wait, tied on a "structural ridgeline" as Jeff suggested (10' BTW).

Um, re-tyed, It's now (about) 9' I then had to actually work, so still need more testing at home to determine EXACT length of ridge line. I did discover that as little a change as 6" can make a big difference. This has been fun, I love a challange.

Thanks to all for your support!!

Doctari.

[MacGyver2005]

Doctari, you'll have to let me know what you find to be ideal for the ridgeline. I'm still waiting for mine to show up, so it's been great reading what you've discovered with this hammock already!

Regards,
-MacGyver
GA-->ME

[Doctari]

Some hints to using a Byer Hammock. Remember, I am still learning so this is all preliminary stuff. But if you are going that route to hammock camping this may help, at least give you a start. YMMV.

Me: I’m 5’7”, 220 Lbs (Yea, I know), all tests were done with no gear in hammock, & me in shorts, tee and shoes.

1) a> Practice without the bug netting suspended. That way if you fall out, you actually fall OUT & not get trapped in the bug net as I did. b> If the stretchy cord isn’t included, do not substitute a rope, it don’t stretch, & if you fall into the bug netting, the loops will pull out.

2) A ridgeline tied between the loops makes the hammock sag at the proper rate almost no matter where you hang. I have found that for me anyway: 11’ is minimum distance between trees (etc.) and 16’ is absolute maximum. At the 16-foot distance I MUST tie to the trees a minimum of 6‘ 8” or I touch the ground, I can only easily reach 6’ 8.5” so. . . .
At 12’ I can tie at 6’ & I like that better. Optimum seems to be 12” to 14’. This is all with a 8’ 9” ridge line of 8 mm 1200 lb test accessory cord. My ridgeline is semi permanently attached (tied actually) to the loops of the hammock. The hammock is attached to the tree huggers by separate cords. I tried all in one, didn’t seem to work very well, switched to separate rope, & magic. Too tight, and you cannot sleep on the diagonal. A difference as little as 7” in the ridge line can make a difference. A 10’ ridge causes me to slowly slide to the center of the hammock, a 8’ ridge, & I either touch the ground or have to hang the thing 7.5’ off the ground, requiring me to carry a step stool. As it is, I’m 6.5” off the ground in the sleeping position. 9’ is slightly better than the 8’ 9” but not enough for me to “fix”, and as the cord is still stretching somewhat, so I figure that a few nights in the hammock will cause the ridge to be 9’ long & I’ll be happy.

3) I tie the hammock as tight as I can. With the ridgeline, it hangs perfectly. Anything less than as tight as I can get it increases the sag. The further apart the trees the tighter the hammock must be. Again, with the ridgeline, it’s a perfect hang each time.

4) The MINIMUM diameter of 4” for the trees should be religiously adhered to. Anything less & the tree will give, as much as 7” which caused ME to touch the ground. 2 of my 6” diameter trees didn’t budge an inch, they are 14’ apart.

Misc comments:
I have pictures, but in a film camera, so have to wait, for development or me buying a digital camera.
My homemade (from 2 dog leashes) “tree huggers” are already showing signs of wear, but are sufficient for testing.
The stretchy cord for the bug netting is VERY LONG, be prepared to make adjustments.
In cool weather, i.e. no bugs, the bug netting is perfectly cut to hold a pad under the hammock if you flip the hammock upside down. I’ll test it soon, it fits, but I haven’t slept in it this way yet.
At 12’ apart, the 6’ off the ground sags to 5’4” from the ground.

Doctari.

[Just Jeff]

Sounds like the hammock supports are stretching. Replace the supports with non-stretchable cord or webbing and I bet you won't have the problem of almost touching the ground.

[Doctari]

Sounds like the hammock supports are stretching. Replace the supports with non-stretchable cord or webbing and I bet you won't have the problem of almost touching the ground.

The ropes I am using do stretch, but do not go back, so once stretchd to max (I'm told about 8" for the 20' I bought), so a few more inches & I'm done.

Almost touching the ground, is only temporary, I hope Going to test in "for real" tomorrow night, maybe for 2 nights even. And, it may have been the trees I used, soooo,,,,,,,


Doctari.

[MacGyver2005]

Awesome, thank Doctari. Mine finally showed up yesterday, so hopefully this weekend I can find time to work it out. The ridgeline information should be quite helpful. That was my first thought after looking at the hammock, since my only other hammock experience has been in a Hennessy. I will have to get some cord and see how it works for me. Hopefully between the two of us we can get this worked out to a science! Between you at 5'7" 220lbs, me at 5'9" and 170lbs, and finally my fiancee at 5'0" and 115lbs we have the spectrum pretty well represented.

Regards,
-MacGyver
GA-->ME

[Alligator]

I've been avidly following this thread. I haven't any suitable trees in my yard to try mine out . I think I'm going to take in to work and use it for a lunchtime nap. I'm 6'2", 179#. Not sure I am actually going to fit well in it.

Can you hang your tarp off the structural ridgeline suggested by Just Jeff to set the sag? Or is a second ridgeline necessary?

[hammock engineer]

Can you hang your tarp off the structural ridgeline suggested by Just Jeff to set the sag? Or is a second ridgeline necessary?

I may of missed this post, but I would not hang my tarp on the ridge line. This adds to the sag in the tarp. Plus with a seperate tarp, you can have a dry place to set up the hammock.

I use the McCat tarp. It does not use a ridge line. It uses pullout points. If it was a square tarp on the diagonal, use 2 corners for the tieouts to the trees and 2 for the side tieouts to the ground.

A tarp resting on a ridge line may develop holes from rubbing on the rope.

[Just Jeff]

The ridgeline on the hammock won't stay inline with the hammock supports when you get in the hammock - it'll look like this: \_/ (where the diagonal lines are the supports and the horizontal line is the ridgeline). So you'll need to find a different way to hang the tarp, I think.

[Alligator]

I may of missed this post, but I would not hang my tarp on the ridge line. This adds to the sag in the tarp. Plus with a seperate tarp, you can have a dry place to set up the hammock..

#6-Jeff.

I may be having terminology difficulties. The structual ridgeline in a hammock is used to set the sag, or is this a modification? So in general most users do not use any ridgeline for their tarps, but rather tie separate strings on opposite ends along the axis parallel to the hammock? I never tie my tarp like this (ground sleeper). I always use a ridgeline. I only like two setups though, modified A-frame (one eave off the ground) and teepee style. Are you saying that the tarp will sag more with an independent ridgeline rather than tying it with two strings to grommets or are you saying that it will sag more because it's attached to the structural ridgeline of the hammock?

A tarp resting on a ridge line may develop holes from rubbing on the rope.

For a hammock user with a fixed tarp configuration I can see this could be a potential issue. (IMO this is an overrated problem for ground tarp users.)