Aqua Mira doesn't kill giardia?

[VictoriaM]

What's the use of it, then? I was just about ready to ditch my big and heavy filter when I found this out. I'd really like to use a chemical treatment next year to save weight and space, but since giardia is the big (biggest?) risk, I want something that treats it. Cost is an issue, too. What does everyone here use, and how well does it work?

[Just Jeff]

Where did you hear that AM doesn't kill giardia?

[Skidsteer]

Yeah.

Say what?

[MOWGLI]

Giardia, in many peoples opinion (and in the opinion of some researchers out west) is more often transfered between humans as a result of the combo of poor hygiene and sharing food.

Lots of folks use AM on the AT. I used it on the JMT this summer. Compared to the cost of Polar Pure, which I used during my thru-hike, AM is prohibitively expensive. Long term use of iodine could also carry a pricetag however. I suggest you speak to your physician before going that route.

I've also heard it said that Polar Pure doesn't kill Giardia cysts when the water is below a certain temperature.

Good luck on whatever system you choose. I think you'll be just fine.

[A-Train]

Yeah, you guys might wanna do some research on AM. I was as shocked too. I've used it for 4000+ miles of hiking and was always under the impression it was as effective as a filter. Not till I started working at an outfitter did I realize how inadequate it really is.

That being said, I agree with Mowgli and those who echo his sentiments. Most of the time, it's human interactions that pass giardia.

[Egads]

What do you know about Chlorine-dioxide tabs other than they are slow acting

[Just Jeff]

You guys have any sources saying AM doesn't kill giardia? Everything I've read says it does.

[PJ 2005]

while you're at the doctor's office, ask about bleach. yep, bleach. i used it from pearisburg to the end and loved it - a one ounce dropper is all you need for 1,200+ miles.

doesn't sound right, but i talked to a hydrogeologist in the bottled water industry and he said it would chlorinate the water sufficiently. also checked out with a reputable pharmacist.

2-4 drops per liter, depending on the water quality. wait half an hour. i treated maybe 2/3 the time.

some crystal light on-the-go helps with the taste, but honestly, i was too thirsty to care most of the time.

it's dirt cheap!! and easy to find (once you have a dropper)!!

plus, it's delightfully convenient to fill up, drop drop, and go. no waiting for chemicals to react.

about 75% of the people i hiked with had adopted this method by the time we finished.

[Austexs]

Originally Posted by VictoriaM

What's the use of it, then? I was just about ready to ditch my big and heavy filter when I found this out. I'd really like to use a chemical treatment next year to save weight and space, but since giardia is the big (biggest?) risk, I want something that treats it. Cost is an issue, too. What does everyone here use, and how well does it work?

Are you sure you are not thinking of Cryptosporidium?

[Just Jeff]

According to most places that sell it, and I think the AM tech sheet I read a while back (posted on another thread here, IIRC), AM kills crypto. Iodine does not. But I've always heard that both kill giardia.

[RedneckRye]

Drinking water treated with AM will kill you. Or not.
I work at a gear shop, and as it has been explained to me, all that AM does is "improve the taste of potable water". I've also been told that the reason for that explanation being on the package is that it would cost way too much for McNett (the company that makes AM) to submit AM for testing to all of the various government agencies that check that stuff to get it certified as a purifier.
The government is here to make life safer and better for us. Trust them. Or not, and just dip and drink.
RYE

[bfitz]

I think all you need is one or two drops of clorox.

[SGT Rock]

I have not heard this about AM. Waiting to see what evidence there is either way. Last I read on their site they were waiting for FDA approval to make certain claims about the product anyway. I tried it and didn't like the taste.

As to bleach. If you go that route use unscented. The scent stuff is a poison and will make you sick or worse. And if you follow the recommendation of survival class, CDC, or FEMA you should treat, wait 30 minutes and smell the water. If you cannot smell the chlorine in the water, you have to add the same amount again and wait another 30 minutes and smell again. If you cannot smell the chlorine yet, then you are supposed to dump it and find another water source - that source is too contaminated for bleach to kill it and still be safe to drink. So basic rule of thumb is if you cannot taste or smell the chlorine, you are not using enough.

As to iodine - Basically if you encounter water that is lightly to moderately contaminated and follow the package recommendations, then you are probably going to be fine. And the entire time the iodine is in the water, it is working. So if you take a drink at a half hour, you have less protection than you will when you take another drink from that water 30 minutes later or an hour later - then you are getting a higher protection level than is required by the FDA. When you filter and there is something in the water, it gets the chance to come back as it sits in your bottle. But as to water quality in the back country - there has never been a study of the water on the AT, but from anecdotal evidence (the fact that some people that never treat or filter don't get sick, and the general consensus being that most stomach bugs are probably hand to mouth passing of other diseases) one can assume that the water along the AT is either not contaminated by Giardia or crypto in most places; and in the places it is: the contamination is so low it wouldn't cause most healthy people that drink it to get sick.

To the safety of iodine. You already eat it regularly in salt - read the package, it is iodized. The reason for that is you need iodine in your system to prevent goiters. And a recent article I read said with the low salt craze in America that most people are not getting the RDA of iodine now anyway - so if you increase your iodine intake for a few months it probably won't hurt the average healthy person. Plus you can neutralize the iodine with VitC after it has done it's job.

And as to filters - Roland Meusser, in his book, has data that shows in laboratory controlled tests that filters are only 70% effective against Giardia after they have been used regularly. The stats on filters are only when they are new. Compare that to Iodine treatment in the same study that found the iodine to be greater than 90% effective when used according to the package recommendations. And 99% when given longer periods of time. Plus filters do not stop any viruses - even the filter makers recommend using chlorine or iodine in addition to their filters to protect against viruses. The last big outbreak of illness on the AT was HepA - a virus. I've never heard of a big outbreak of Giardia or crypto on the AT, while there have been many many cases of stomach viruses every year on the AT. Hmmmm....

Anyway, we didn't have filters for years in the back-country and everyone survived without them. Now that filter companies are selling them to backpackers, our water has suddenly become very very dangerous and the battle cry is "I don't want to take any chances" LOL. The best thing you can do is practice good hygiene. If you really don't want to take chances you would bring a filter with iodine and wash your hands like a doctor.

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

This is a link to a 41 page EPA document about the active ingredient in Aqua Mira as used by city water systems. On page 34, it recommends using chloramines in addition to the active ingredient in Aqua Mira to kill everything.
I

In conventional treatment plants, chlorine dioxide (active ingredient in AM) used for oxidation is fed either in the
raw water, in the sedimentation basins, or following sedimentation. To limit the oxidant
demand, and therefore chlorine dioxide dose and the formation of chlorite, it is common
to add chlorine dioxide following sedimentation. Concerns about possible taste and odor
complaints have limited the use of chlorine dioxide to provide a disinfectant residual in
the distribution system. Consequently, public water suppliers that are considering the
use of chlorine dioxide for oxidation and primary disinfectant applications may want to
consider chloramines for secondary disinfection.

I don’t treat water from pristine sources – springs & streams coming off high mountains with no grazing or civilization above. I carry a few halazone tablets (available at any pharmacy by asking pharmacist) and add those to water in heavy use areas. I boil really suspect water – inconvenient and takes forever to cool - but not nearly as inconvenient as getting really sick in the backcountry and it kills everything.

Polar Pure (iodine) takes high concentrations and an hour when water is cold and ph is uncertain. Adding Vitamin C will remove the taste of iodine. Iodine can build up in your body and cause problems. It is not recommended for regular use on extended hikes for this reason.

If I were thru-hiking and planned to treat all water, I'd use a light-weight filter.

[MOWGLI]

Originally Posted by Frolicking Dinosaurs

If I were thru-hiking and planned to treat all water, I'd use a light-weight filter.

IMO, that is probably the best method from a health perspective, BUT, many hikers cross contaminate when using filters. If you go that route, make sure you read ALL of the instructions, and follow them every time.

[Lone Wolf]

dip it and drink. best method out there. 25 years and 100% success rate.

[woodsy]

http://www.bushwalking.org.au/FAQ/FAQ_Water.htm

[SGT Rock]

Excellent link woodsy. Thanks.

[woodsy]

Lots of reading there,
nice bug pictures too

[SGT Rock]

I wonder if the author would be against letting us post the article here too?