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View Full Version : Another one of those "stupid ultra-lite" ideas I recently heard about........



Different Socks
02-11-2014, 17:01
So some people don't carry toilet paper, others drink as much water as possible in the morning so they don't have to carry any, while others go stoveless, etc.

Here's a new one: A hiker that was concerned about the weight of his prescription plastic frames, so he got a new pair of frameless glasses just to lose the ounces he would be carrying on his face.

Really?!! LMAOROTF!!! The sensibilities of losing/reducing the weight you carry never seems to end.

BuckeyeBill
02-11-2014, 17:05
This is pushing Ultra-lite backpacking to its limits. LOL

Coffee
02-11-2014, 17:06
LOL

Here's one: How about using dental floss as a substitute for shoe laces?

martinb
02-11-2014, 17:08
Might as well get a few teeth pulled, too. I mean do you really need all those teeth for gorp? Think of the ozs. you'll save!

BuckeyeBill
02-11-2014, 17:14
Better get an enema and clean the old pipes out while you're at it. For some people this could mean pounds lost cause they are so full of it.

Braves#6
02-11-2014, 17:20
I've been wondering how much weight I can save if I bleach the color out of my gear.

Mags
02-11-2014, 17:35
Almost as funny as the traditional backpacker who brought a 4 season tent in the mid-Atlantic during summer! Or the traditional backpacker who brought a hatchet during open flame bans? or packed 5 pairs of socks for a weekend trip?

Craaaazy! ;)


I'm beginning to think our friend from Montana's has this definition of stupid: "If I don't do it..it must be a stupid idea". :D

takethisbread
02-11-2014, 17:44
hiker deleted apps from their smartphone they don't use everyday


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G2outdoors
02-11-2014, 17:44
Zing!

Sent from my Hammock.

Hot Flash
02-11-2014, 17:48
The idea that one can reduce weight by drinking as much as they can is just ludicrous. You're still carrying that weight, it just happens to be in your stomach, kidneys, or bladder instead of your water container.

squeezebox
02-11-2014, 17:49
The enema thing !!
You could easily rig an enema tube to attach to a Platy bag. 1 to 1 1/2 L is standard.
A few drops of camp soap , and you're good to go !!
(pun intended)

colorado_rob
02-11-2014, 18:05
I'm beginning to think our friend from Montana's has this definition of stupid: "If I don't do it..it must be a stupid idea". :D Very well said, Mags... I'm sooooooo tempted to add to this, but I'll resist....

Last Call
02-11-2014, 18:08
Easiest and best way to save a few ounces is to leave the cellular telephone.

Dogwood
02-11-2014, 18:47
Tanking up at water sources didn't start with nor is it relegated to the UL hiking philosophy and its' not always done to avoid carrying water. Yes, I choose to not carry TP NOT because I'm seeking to save wt or volume. I simply do it because I feel it's not necessary FOR ME to carry white sheets of leaves. Nor, was it, or is it, still necessary in some cultures. Doesn't always have to do with hiking. The whole woods is bursting at the seams with TP. They are called leaves, sticks, smooth rounded rocks, handfulls of grass or ferns, moss, etc.!

I've tried replacing those awfully heavy regular shoe laces :eek: with dental floss. It sucks trying to tie and untie dental floss which is made worse if your hands are cold. Yeah, I'm one of those UL nut cases who has weighed shoe laces. The wt savings by replacing reg shoe laces with dental floss is insignificant IMHO. BUT, before we think how UL stupid this is for individual ULers that's exactly what several running shoe manufacturers have done - go to lighter wt thinner laces(but with more grip) - like Salomon with their speed lacing pull tab system w/ micro laces.

The eye glass no frames simply to save wt seems a bit much but I feel we aren't getting the whole story. Perhaps, that choice was made while factoring in other considerations like how easy eyeglass frames get bent and broken especially during hiking. I know I've broken many a sunglass frames while hiking and that's with spring loaded frames and always using sunglasses with a neck cord so I can hang them from around my neck.

While I know we can pt fingers at someone else's hiking style and gear choices why do we feel the need to be so concerned about what everyone else is doing? Some want to roll with frameless glasses/some don't, with/not with TP, with a cast iron frying pan, dental floss shoe laces, with a Ti widget, with a 5 lb Army sleeping bag, whatever as long as they aren't hurting someone else HYOH.

hoppy from GA
02-11-2014, 18:48
hike naked.

Last Call
02-11-2014, 18:52
Ahhhh.....I just realized my eyeglass frames are titanium....Score!!!

map man
02-11-2014, 18:53
I've worn rimless glasses for the last 25 years because they are light and I like the way they look. I've always gone stoveless since I started backpacking. Luckily I stumbled upon this thread and now know both of these things are stupid.

kidchill
02-11-2014, 18:57
I'm so UL, I don't even hike! Look, in all seriousness, there's a lot of crap that just doesn't make sense...but, as Dogwood pointed out, there's also guys that carry the HEAVIEST stuff possible. I saw a guy that took the headband off of his headlamp to "save weight." Kind of defeats the purpose of the headlamp, doesn't it? Not to mention, it was a very large headlamp, errr, flashlight to begin with. I think my Princeton Tech Byte weighed like 2.5oz, with the batteries...how much lighter does it really need to be? But, remember, HYOH!

Coffee
02-11-2014, 19:03
Wow, the floss as a shoe lace substitute was just a joke... Didn't think anyone actually did that. No offense intended! :)

HooKooDooKu
02-11-2014, 19:20
Here's a new one: A hiker that was concerned about the weight of his prescription plastic frames, so he got a new pair of frameless glasses just to lose the ounces he would be carrying on his face.
Wouldn't he have done better if he just went with contacts... or better yet lasik surgery?

Sarcasm the elf
02-11-2014, 19:27
I cut a lot of weight be leaving my ego at home. Even when I do bring it I always end up losing it by day two.

mak1277
02-11-2014, 19:27
Wouldn't he have done better if he just went with contacts... or better yet lasik surgery?

I would guess that light-weight spectacles would weigh less than contacts+case+solution. But I don't have my kitchen scale in front of me right now.

garlic08
02-11-2014, 19:29
Very well said, Mags... I'm sooooooo tempted to add to this, but I'll resist....

And I can't believe some unnamed person's choice of eyeglasses is the subject of an internet forum thread.

Dogwood
02-11-2014, 19:29
hike naked.

What's the wt of your fig leaf? I like the dehydrated wine pespective.....brandy.

Dogwood
02-11-2014, 19:31
And I can't believe some unnamed person's choice of eyeglasses is the subject of an internet forum thread.

It does make me wonder at times too. I'm eating UL tonite...a Weight Watchers meal and side salad......no croutons! They weigh too much.

MuddyWaters
02-11-2014, 19:47
Easiest and best way to save a few ounces is to leave the cellular telephone.

On the AT you can actually use your phone in many places, especially town.

But leave it off when not in use, and at least leave the 2 lbs of solar charger and extra battery packs, etc.

canoe
02-11-2014, 19:50
Ahhhh.....I just realized my eyeglass frames are titanium....Score!!! Yes but did you drill wholes in the lenses
to make em lighter

Different Socks
02-11-2014, 20:03
Wouldn't he have done better if he just went with contacts... or better yet lasik surgery?

With contacts, you have to carry the bottle of cleaning fluids, so that's ounces right there. I carry both, glasses and contacts with the fluid.

Malto
02-11-2014, 20:15
I'm so UL, I don't even hike! Look, in all seriousness, there's a lot of crap that just doesn't make sense...but, as Dogwood pointed out, there's also guys that carry the HEAVIEST stuff possible. I saw a guy that took the headband off of his headlamp to "save weight." Kind of defeats the purpose of the headlamp, doesn't it? Not to mention, it was a very large headlamp, errr, flashlight to begin with. I think my Princeton Tech Byte weighed like 2.5oz, with the batteries...how much lighter does it really need to be? But, remember, HYOH!

I took off my strap of my Princeton tech head lamp, actually both of them, one a Byte. And it makes perfect sense... I clip my lamp onto the back strap of my visor, often wearing it with the light in the back. When it gets dark and I'm still hiking I flip the visor around and click it on without stopping. So maybe there is something you're missing, like he clips it onto his hipbelt which is very common with trail runners. I also will do this as well. And I love you HYOH..... Meaning "if you're doing something different than me you're stupid, but go ahead." Maybe, just maybe, you can learn something if you take the time to look.

Old Hiker
02-11-2014, 20:21
I cut a lot of weight be leaving my ego at home. Even when I do bring it I always end up losing it by day two.

But when you lose your ego in the woods, doesn't that violate LNT ethics? I mean, do you go back and find it or just leave it for some hiker to step in later? Ewwww.................

And if you lose it in the woods and have to get a new one, can the world really afford that much packaging, manufacturing carbon, etc. etc. ???? Will it add to global cooling,... I mean warming, ........ I mean climate change?

And if it's made overseas, what about those poor little orphans working for 25 cents an hour? The jobs we've lost here in the States?

And, and, .................

I LIKE this thread !!!!!

saltysack
02-11-2014, 20:30
I tried the no TP approach last weekend at roan mtn....ran out of TP...hand sanitizer doesn't get the **** smell off ur hands !!! Had to sacrifice my bandana...ill stuck w tp. The snow near carvers did tighten up the sphincter !


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HikerMom58
02-11-2014, 22:03
I cut a lot of weight be leaving my ego at home. Even when I do bring it I always end up losing it by day two.

This is great! I knew I always liked you for some reason. :D

Some people have such a big ego, it's a wonder they can even walk down the trail! :eek:

daddytwosticks
02-12-2014, 09:07
My hiker rituals I perform before every major section hike: Get a fresh haircut and shave; trim my finger and toenails; clean my ears w/Q-tips; and lastly, exfoliate. (Only kidding about the last item). These items are done for comfort/hygene reasons. Pehaps I should save and weigh what's removed from my body. Maybe save 100 grams? If you have an ear wax issue, this number may be greater. :)

garlic08
02-12-2014, 09:09
... Maybe, just maybe, you can learn something if you take the time to look.

And I just learned something about headlamps from your post--thanks. The headband on my old headlamp is about shot, so now I'll try it without the band and keep using the light with a little less weight.

Same thing happened the first time I met someone hiking without TP. The first reaction was one of disbelief and revulsion, but I ended up learning something and carrying a lighter pack. A similar process happened with stoveless hiking. An open mind is a good thing.

Coffee
02-12-2014, 09:14
I'm thinking about going stoveless until Kennedy Meadows on the PCT next year. I've been reading that eating hot food in the desert isn't exactly something to look forward to (and I can kind of relate to that from my trip last year to the Grand Canyon). The weight savings from not carrying a stove and fuel could at least partially mitigate the heavier water carry for that segment. So there is a lot to learn from UL experts here. I would not have ever considered going stoveless before reading about this UL approach.

Mags
02-12-2014, 09:28
And if there is an open flame ban (meaning alcohol stoves in particular) on the SoCal portion of the PCT , your option would be a canister stove or white gas. If if it is that hot and dry in SoCal, no stove may actually be a welcome way of hiking.

I don't think of this approach as ultralight as the weight savings can be a wash most of the time. However, it is less fuss, easier at times and is a viable option in certain conditions.

Many "experienced" thru-hikers have a narrow outdoor skill set. Hiking from white blaze to white blaze, or even a well defined trail like the PCT with lots of guidebooks does not make a person necessarily open to other options and experiences. A person who section hikes, with lots of weekends off-trail, winter juants or even day hikes, may have more outdoor experience in many ways than a Triple Crowner (the CDT is increasingly more and more defined with better maps, tread and downloadable way points).

So that is why I don't like to use the term "expert". I am certainly no expert. I am always trying to learn new things. Experienced may be a better word for many of us. :)

bfayer
02-12-2014, 09:34
I don't see the idea of lighter glasses to be as much of a joke as others. I have a very strong prescription which by default adds up to heavier eye glasses. I buy the lightest titanium frames and lightest lens material that money can buy. Heavy glasses are a real pain in the butt when you are hot and sweat is pouring down your face.

With heavier glasses I need to wear a glasses strap all the time when hiking, just to keep from having to constantly push my glasses back up my nose. Lighter glasses allow me to go without a strap.

Would I spend extra money on my worn glasses just to save on my overall carried weight if comfort was not an issue? No I probably would not, but everybody has different needs for what they do. If I only carried glasses for reading, I would try to buy the lightest pair of glasses I could afford to keep from carrying the dead weight for 2000 miles.

I am not ultralight by any means. I try to think of myself as "Smart Light". I pack what I need to be comfortable and safe, I try to find the lightest option I can afford, and I try to take as many multipurpose items as possible.

Then again I'm just a weekend, section hiking, day hiking old guy, so take my words with a grain of salt.

Conure
02-12-2014, 09:45
Any sport can be taken to an extreme. UL hiking, being a hiking extreme in itself, taken to the extreme seems to be less focused on casual hiking and more focused toward speed hiking, trail running, etc. It can be difficult to compare the two.

For me, it always comes down to comfort and what comfort I'm willing to sacrifice. UL packing sacrifices too much comfort for me but I can still appreciate those that do and marvel at the myriad ways they find at minimizing weight. It's a spectator sport : )

bfayer
02-12-2014, 09:56
...It's a spectator sport : )

I look at ultralight hikers as the R&D branch of the hiking community. If it were not for the ultralight hiking movement, we would still be carrying two person tents that averaged 7 pounds (Ugg, it hurts to think about).

Everything I carry today is lighter than it was in 1977, and it was the ultralight community that pushed the market in that direction.

So to all the folks out there that push the ultralight envelope, keep it up, but stay safe doing it. My back thanks you :)

Hot Flash
02-12-2014, 10:40
Yes, I choose to not carry TP NOT because I'm seeking to save wt or volume. I simply do it because I feel it's not necessary FOR ME to carry white sheets of leaves. Nor, was it, or is it, still necessary in some cultures. Doesn't always have to do with hiking. The whole woods is bursting at the seams with TP. They are called leaves, sticks, smooth rounded rocks, handfulls of grass or ferns, moss, etc.!



Disgusting. No way am I scraping my butthole with sticks or rocks, nor am I going to wipe my cooch with moss or leaves.

Coffee
02-12-2014, 11:07
Disgusting. No way am I scraping my butthole with sticks or rocks, nor am I going to wipe my cooch with moss or leaves.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but the viability of the no TP method might depend on the consistency of one's "production". Relatively solid and mess free production requires little toilet paper anyway so alternative methods seem viable. Messy production or diarrhea would seem to present greater problems. I have yet to go TP free but my production seems to be more in the solid/consistent variety so I might consider doing so. It is not a totally off the wall idea, although I admit that my first reaction to the concept was similar to yours.

FWIW, if I go TP free it would be to avoid carrying out the TP. The weight is almost inconsequential for the amount that I carry.

Mags
02-12-2014, 11:23
As mentioned in another thread, the problem of TP out on the PCT is so bad, the PCTA released an article about it (http://www.pcta.org/2014/time-action-taking-care-poop-16564/).

Now THAT'S disgusting.

Jerry Brown, who probably knows tread of The Colorado Trail as well as anyone, noticed a lot of TP blossoms springing up as the CT gains in popularity.


Personally, I don't use TP as much (depends on the trip) as the soil out past the 100th meridian is rather dry and not as organically active vs. the Appalachians.

Use a backcountry bidet and use water to mainly clean. "Polish" it off with a few sheets of TP or leaves. Then use hand sanitizer. Works for many people all over the world and is arguably more effective.

As Speshul33 (http://14ersthruhike.com/) said "Go to the river bank. Coat your hand with mud. Now try cleaning it off with TP. Then with water. Which one works better?"



Never mind the weight, it is about the ecology, too.

Different Socks
02-12-2014, 11:35
I agree with bfayer and Conure, and I also do admire what and how the UL people do it, I am just never going to be one of them. I am also never gong to be at the other end of the spectrum. I simply find it amazing that UL people not only look at their clothing and equipment, but anything else they need, use, eat, breath, carry, etc. I am constantly being astounded by what lengths they will go to to lose weight.

Different Socks
02-12-2014, 11:37
As mentioned in another thread, the problem of TP out on the PCT is so bad, the PCTA released an article about it (http://www.pcta.org/2014/time-action-taking-care-poop-16564/).

Now THAT'S disgusting.

Jerry Brown, who probably knows tread of The Colorado Trail as well as anyone, noticed a lot of TP blossoms springing up as the CT gains in popularity.


Personally, I don't use TP as much (depends on the trip) as the soil out past the 100th meridian is rather dry and not as organically active vs. the Appalachians.

Use a backcountry bidet and use water to mainly clean. "Polish" it off with a few sheets of TP or leaves. Then use hand sanitizer. Works for many people all over the world and is arguably more effective.

As Speshul33 (http://14ersthruhike.com/) said "Go to the river bank. Coat your hand with mud. Now try cleaning it off with TP. Then with water. Which one works better?"



Never mind the weight, it is about the ecology, too.

But Mags, if you have to carry something to clean off your hands b/c you don't use TP, then isn't that cleaning agent/towel/wipes weight in your pack also?

Mags
02-12-2014, 11:42
But Mags, if you have to carry something to clean off your hands b/c you don't use TP, then isn't that cleaning agent/towel/wipes weight in your pack also?

"Never mind the weight, it is about the ecology, too."

Likewise with no stoves.

Backpacking is never strictly about weight. Efficiency, "no futz" factor, environmental concerns, because something simply works better and so on all come into play when picking a kit.

MDSection12
02-12-2014, 11:54
This is great! I knew I always liked you for some reason. :D

Some people have such a big ego, it's a wonder they can even walk down the trail! :eek:
I've found I can stuff my hiking one down to a pretty small volume on the trail. At home, I use a full sized one. :)

Son Driven
02-12-2014, 12:02
While hiking endless hours, with the weight of my pack fighting me. My mind spins with thoughts of all that I poses, and what I can make due without. It is a beautiful contrast to our consumer driven culture that exists off trail. It is one of the aspects of hiking I enjoy the most, the realization of how few material possessions are required to be comfortable.

Another Kevin
02-12-2014, 12:23
Many "experienced" thru-hikers have a narrow outdoor skill set. Hiking from white blaze to white blaze, or even a well defined trail like the PCT with lots of guidebooks does not make a person necessarily open to other options and experiences. A person who section hikes, with lots of weekends off-trail, winter juants or even day hikes, may have more outdoor experience in many ways than a Triple Crowner (the CDT is increasingly more and more defined with better maps, tread and downloadable way points).

So that is why I don't like to use the term "expert". I am certainly no expert. I am always trying to learn new things. Experienced may be a better word for many of us. :)

Thanks, Mags! I don't get out near as often as I'd like, but you've described my hiking style: I'm a tourist. Day hikes, oversights, short sections. Peak bags, bushwhacks, snowshoes, it's all good. Thru - hiking doesn't appeal to me much.

But you don't need to mince words with that "experienced" stuff. I'm old. :)

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Miner
02-12-2014, 12:28
Many "experienced" thru-hikers have a narrow outdoor skill set. Hiking from white blaze to white blaze, or even a well defined trail like the PCT with lots of guidebooks does not make a person necessarily open to other options and experiences. A person who section hikes, with lots of weekends off-trail, winter juants or even day hikes, may have more outdoor experience in many ways than a Triple Crowner (the CDT is increasingly more and more defined with better maps, tread and downloadable way points).

So that is why I don't like to use the term "expert". I am certainly no expert. I am always trying to learn new things. Experienced may be a better word for many of us. :)
I know many regular backpackers seem to look up to thru-hikers as some sort of expert. But I've seen enough people complete a hike that should have died doing some really stupid things. I've seen some weekend warrior types that seemed to have it more together then some that arrived at Canada on the PCT. Its probably a good thing that the PCT and AT are often so forgiving of mistakes and that the drive to finish is more important than anything else. But shhhhhh. Don't let it get out or the regular folks may stop giving us their snacks on the trail.

max patch
02-12-2014, 12:31
Many "experienced" thru-hikers have a narrow outdoor skill set.

To paraphrase something sometimes said in business...If you thru-hike you do not have 24 weeks of experience. You have one week of experience repeated 24 times.

bfayer
02-12-2014, 13:14
To paraphrase something sometimes said in business...If you thru-hike you do not have 24 weeks of experience. You have one week of experience repeated 24 times.

Well I'll give thru hikers a little more credit than that :) , but I do believe some thru hikers need to remember that some of us lowly weekend section hiking folks have way more than 180 days in a tent, and way more than six months of hiking experience.

4eyedbuzzard
02-12-2014, 13:37
Back to the glasses. I've had "frameless" eyeglasses in the past. Not so durable and I would think twice about them for a long hike. When you rely on something like glasses or hearing aids or whatever durability trumps miniscule weight savings. I wear those flexible spring titanium frame ones now with lightweight lenses. Lighter glasses are more comfortable to wear even everyday. And with the flexible ones you can damn near tie them in a knot and not break them and they return to shape, which is a big plus on the trail and other places. I don't carry a spare pair and so I really appreciate knowing that I have reduced the possibility of breakage as much as possible. My eyesight is good enough that I could still follow the trail and walk out to a town if necessary - but I definitely couldn't identify many Kodak moments without them.

Should I wonder what the breakeven is on carrying the weight of a razor vs the weight of hair is? No. How about lightweight fillings vs. amalgam? Do I really need those two little toes?

Sometimes I think Colin Fletcher should be cursed for having cut the handle off his toothbrush decades ago. ;)

lonehiker
02-12-2014, 13:48
Do I really need those two little toes?

I've asked a doctor if I could have the second toe on my left food amputated at the first joint. He thought I was joking. Many with Mortons foot will understand this thought process.

Berserker
02-12-2014, 13:52
I first want to prefreace this with the fact that it's probably in bad taste, but I gotta say it anyway. So what's going to be the new fad in ultra light weight hiking? Anorexia?

I already know it was a bad joke, so don't chastise me :)



Use a backcountry bidet and use water to mainly clean. "Polish" it off with a few sheets of TP or leaves. Then use hand sanitizer. Works for many people all over the world and is arguably more effective.
You know I've heard about people doing this and have been intrigued, but I just don't get how it really works. So not to get gross, but I'd like to hear the details of how to do this without potentially getting feces, and more importantly bacteria all over oneself and stuff. So maybe you or someone that has a good system down can post some detail or PM me with some detail. I've thought through the logistics of it, and I just can't see how this can work realistically in an efficient manner. Note that I don't consider myself a germaphobe, but the thought of exposing myself to bacteria from that area in the back country kinda freaks me out.

Sarcasm the elf
02-12-2014, 13:57
And if there is an open flame ban (meaning alcohol stoves in particular) on the SoCal portion of the PCT , your option would be a canister stove or white gas. If if it is that hot and dry in SoCal, no stove may actually be a welcome way of hiking.

I don't think of this approach as ultralight as the weight savings can be a wash most of the time. However, it is less fuss, easier at times and is a viable option in certain conditions.

Many "experienced" thru-hikers have a narrow outdoor skill set. Hiking from white blaze to white blaze, or even a well defined trail like the PCT with lots of guidebooks does not make a person necessarily open to other options and experiences. A person who section hikes, with lots of weekends off-trail, winter juants or even day hikes, may have more outdoor experience in many ways than a Triple Crowner (the CDT is increasingly more and more defined with better maps, tread and downloadable way points).

So that is why I don't like to use the term "expert". I am certainly no expert. I am always trying to learn new things. Experienced may be a better word for many of us. :)

Come on now Mags, this is Whiteblaze, why would anyone ever want to hike a trail that wasn't the A.T.? ;)

4eyedbuzzard
02-12-2014, 13:58
I've asked a doctor if I could have the second toe on my left food amputated at the first joint. He thought I was joking. Many with Mortons foot will understand this thought process.I get it. My wife has Morton's Neuroma in her left foot.

4eyedbuzzard
02-12-2014, 14:14
You know I've heard about people doing this and have been intrigued, but I just don't get how it really works. So not to get gross, but I'd like to hear the details of how to do this without potentially getting feces, and more importantly bacteria all over oneself and stuff. So maybe you or someone that has a good system down can post some detail or PM me with some detail. I've thought through the logistics of it, and I just can't see how this can work realistically in an efficient manner. Note that I don't consider myself a germaphobe, but the thought of exposing myself to bacteria from that area in the back country kinda freaks me out.Yeah, did you ever notice that no one ever really teaches you in detail how to wipe your @$$. They just supply the goods, give you a few tips, and let you figure it out. You'd think there would at least be a kid's book. I doubt things will ever change much in that regard. @$$ wiping is never elaborated on. People say use paper, use a stick, use snow, moss, whatever - but they never tell you how! Take those Three Shells for example. Nobody ever tells how to use the f^(%ing things! [crap, I have just been fined 5 credits for violating the verbal morality standard again].

HikerMom58
02-12-2014, 14:16
I've found I can stuff my hiking one down to a pretty small volume on the trail. At home, I use a full sized one. :)

I meet you in person MD.. you are a fine young man! Once you start making youtube video's to brag about yourself 24/7 then I will start to worry about ya! ;)

Cyber hikers and trail hikers, alike, need to "lighten up" with the ego. Sarcasm made a good point, IMHO.

lonehiker
02-12-2014, 15:14
Jerry Brown, who probably knows tread of The Colorado Trail as well as anyone, noticed a lot of TP blossoms springing up as the CT gains in popularity.


Personally, I don't use TP as much (depends on the trip) as the soil out past the 100th meridian is rather dry and not as organically active vs. the Appalachians.

Use a backcountry bidet and use water to mainly clean. "Polish" it off with a few sheets of TP or leaves. Then use hand sanitizer. Works for many people all over the world and is arguably more effective.

As Speshul33 (http://14ersthruhike.com/) said "Go to the river bank. Coat your hand with mud. Now try cleaning it off with TP. Then with water. Which one works better?"



Never mind the weight, it is about the ecology, too.

Most these blossoms are probably from the fact that most do not know how to properly bury their feces/ TP. Many ULers don't take a trowel, as one example, and just use their heel. I can almost guarantee that using that method does not dig nearly as deep as recommended. Actually most hikers just don't take the time necessary to do it properly. Reference your statement, "Use a backcountry bidet and use water to mainly clean. "Polish" it off with a few sheets of TP or leaves. Then use hand sanitizer. Works for many people all over the world and is arguably more effective." It is pretty safe to assume that those cultures/countries that are "polishing" it off with leaves (or rocks) aren't using hand sanitizer. Many are romanticizing these cultures, but the fact is that they have very serious health issues attributed to lack of hygiene and water contamination. They use water for sure to clean after defecating, but it is river and lake water...... Why do you think that virus contamination in water sources is virtually nonexistent in the US?

Additionally, hikers need to be aware of "regulations/laws(?) for specific areas they are camping. Some require that you pack-out all toilet paper (or burn) and in some cases even feces. Backpacker magazine (blasphemy here I know) had an article on how to make a poop tube for just this purpose. The best thing that AT hikers can do is to use the privies as often as realistically possible.

Mags
02-12-2014, 15:31
You know I've heard about people doing this and have been intrigued, but I just don't get how it really works. So not to get gross, but I'd like to hear the details of how to do this without potentially getting feces, and more importantly bacteria all over oneself and stuff.


Ping Junaid over at the 14ers thru-hike website



They use water for sure to clean after defecating, but it is river and lake water...... Why do you think that virus contamination in water sources is virtually nonexistent in the US?

.

Not romanticizing. Giving a good example of how it can be applied to our first world, recreational backpacking. Quite a few well known outdoor people use this method to good effect. It is an option. It works.


Also, unless you are going backpacking with flush plumbing and sewage treatment, I am not sure how the US waste water treatment method for municipalities is germane to this discussion. May was well discuss western Europe and parts of industrialized Asia and how they use bidets more than we do.

Finally, read this book if you really want to explore this discussion further:
http://www.amazon.com/How-****-Woods-Edition-Environmentally/dp/1580083633

Rolls Kanardly
02-12-2014, 16:18
Thereby perpetuating the term "Gram Weenie" Rolls

Rolls Kanardly
02-12-2014, 16:27
hike naked.
Now there is a happy thought especially when doing a scramble. Rolls

Dogwood
02-12-2014, 17:34
[QUOTE=Malto;1847504]I took off my strap of my Princeton tech head lamp, actually both of them, one a Byte. And it makes perfect sense... I clip my lamp onto the back strap of my visor, often wearing it with the light in the back. When it gets dark and I'm still hiking I flip the visor around and click it on without stopping. So maybe there is something you're missing, like he clips it onto his hipbelt which is very common with trail runners. I also will do this as well. And I love you HYOH..... Meaning "if you're doing something different than me you're stupid, but go ahead." Maybe, just maybe, you can learn something if you take the time to look.


And I just learned something about headlamps from your post--thanks. The headband on my old headlamp is about shot, so now I'll try it without the band and keep using the light with a little less weight.

Same thing happened the first time I met someone hiking without TP. The first reaction was one of disbelief and revulsion, but I ended up learning something and carrying a lighter pack. A similar process happened with stoveless hiking. An open mind is a good thing.

Again, no need to do this yourself or dish the actions of individual Ulers when a couple of headlamp companies such a Petzl already offer the Zipka, Zipka Plus, Zippka Plus 2 series with a cord rather than a head band to save wt. I'm a crazy UL nut though. I did take the back off my Petzl Zipka and switched out for the headband on a Petzl Tikka tpo make it lighter. In my personal use, the width of the headband secures the headlamp around my head better than the Zipka cord system.

squeezebox
02-12-2014, 18:00
How to use a back woods bidet.
I'm gonna use the bottom 1-2 inches of a 1/2 gal milk jug, bring along 1 qt. of water.
proccess:
dig cat hole
squat & poop
use TP
squat over bowl, use paper towel or synthetic chamois, wash well inc. a little soap.
dry the area
change water
wash hands, very well.
you will smell better, your clothes will smell better.

Happy44
02-12-2014, 18:29
next thing we will here is someone cutting there manhood to save on weight, i could save 10 pounds right there, cough cough

Mountain Springs
02-12-2014, 18:56
Love these threads. Pointless, but hilarious. :)

Berserker
02-14-2014, 13:06
Yeah, did you ever notice that no one ever really teaches you in detail how to wipe your @$$. They just supply the goods, give you a few tips, and let you figure it out. You'd think there would at least be a kid's book. I doubt things will ever change much in that regard. @$$ wiping is never elaborated on. People say use paper, use a stick, use snow, moss, whatever - but they never tell you how! Take those Three Shells for example. Nobody ever tells how to use the f^(%ing things! [crap, I have just been fined 5 credits for violating the verbal morality standard again].
I just have to comment that this post was awesome and hilarious at the same time. I also enjoyed the Demolition Man reference.

Berserker
02-14-2014, 13:10
How to use a back woods bidet.
I'm gonna use the bottom 1-2 inches of a 1/2 gal milk jug, bring along 1 qt. of water.
proccess:
dig cat hole
squat & poop
use TP
squat over bowl, use paper towel or synthetic chamois, wash well inc. a little soap.
dry the area
change water
wash hands, very well.
you will smell better, your clothes will smell better.
Thanks for the input. This is pretty much how I pictured the process working. I may be overthinking it, but it sounds pretty complicated and annoying to do out in the woods. It would also be particulary annoying if not being performed in the general vicinity of a water source (i.e. I would hate to have to do this if dry camping a significant distance from a water source as extra water would have to be carried).

44terryberry
02-17-2014, 17:29
Many hikers today are a bunch of wussies.If their that damn weak that they cant carry a roll of toilet paper,stay home on the porch.

Julio
02-17-2014, 17:58
I'm considering a circumcision to lighten the load.

Odd Man Out
02-17-2014, 18:25
I'm considering a circumcision to lighten the load.

And thus gives new meaning to the term "gram weenie"

squeezebox
02-17-2014, 18:32
I'm considering shaving my eyebrows.

RangerZ
02-17-2014, 21:57
Back to the glasses. I've had "frameless" eyeglasses in the past. Not so durable and I would think twice about them for a long hike. When you rely on something like glasses or hearing aids or whatever durability trumps miniscule weight savings. I wear those flexible spring titanium frame ones now with lightweight lenses. Lighter glasses are more comfortable to wear even everyday. And with the flexible ones you can damn near tie them in a knot and not break them and they return to shape, which is a big plus on the trail and other places. I don't carry a spare pair and so I really appreciate knowing that I have reduced the possibility of breakage as much as possible. My eyesight is good enough that I could still follow the trail and walk out to a town if necessary - but I definitely couldn't identify many Kodak moments without them.

Should I wonder what the breakeven is on carrying the weight of a razor vs the weight of hair is? No. How about lightweight fillings vs. amalgam? Do I really need those two little toes?

Sometimes I think Colin Fletcher should be cursed for having cut the handle off his toothbrush decades ago. ;)

I have titanium frames and lightweight lenses. Does this mean that I have secret UL proclivities? I thought it was for comfort and style. Should I worry? I have been looking for a thinner glass strap.

fiddlehead
02-17-2014, 22:27
Yeah, people are cutting off eyebrows, saving .1 oz on lighter glass frames, going phoneless, stoveless, toeless, dickless, all to save weight.
Yet many of them could easily stand to lose 20 lbs off their gut, but have one more beer (as their changing their shoestrings to dental floss)
Makes sense to me.
By the way, I'll continue to camel up at water sources to save carrying that extra 2 lb litre of water.

Sierra2015
02-17-2014, 23:35
This thread cracks me up!

bpowell1014
02-18-2014, 00:38
What is wrong with going stoveless on a thru-hike? Some people hate to cook or are simply too damned tired for it.

Mags
02-18-2014, 01:15
What is wrong with going stoveless on a thru-hike? Some people hate to cook or are simply too damned tired for it.

Not a thing. But some people assume that if does not work for them than it could not possibly work for anyone else. ;)

Pendragon
02-18-2014, 13:52
I saved 125 lbs by MENTALLY performing my thru-hike. What's all this complaining about freezing rain, heatstroke, and lyme disease? Piece of CAKE!

ChuckT
02-18-2014, 16:34
+1 Old hiker!

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