View Full Version : What NOT to do on the trail.
squeezebox
05-07-2014, 23:44
I forget what thread it was but someone mentioned, some rude inconsiderate things he saw on the trail.
Bathing at the water source
washing clothes inc. bandanas, at the water source,
any other fouling the water source.
TP blooms anywhere,
being loud after dark.
tents or hammocks in the shelter.
Sex in the shelter
What about smokers ?
What else is there to NOT do on the trail.
Worry so much about what others are doing that you are not enjoying yourself? :)
Don't camp at established sites and you avoid all that.
fiddlehead
05-08-2014, 06:19
Worry so much about what others are doing that you are not enjoying yourself? :)
When will whiteblaze get a "like" button.
Like!
mrcoffeect
05-08-2014, 06:56
I second that like.
mrcoffeect
05-08-2014, 07:10
Don't give unwanted advice, starting with phrases like "I know what your doing wrong." or "you know what your problem is."
Josh Calhoun
05-08-2014, 08:12
Worry so much about what others are doing that you are not enjoying yourself? :)you got it mags.
Worry so much about what others are doing that you are not enjoying yourself? :)
That's all fine until what others do effects you.
I did a section in VA earlier this week and saw two thru-hikers washing their feet in a spring next to a campsite I was staying at.
Another hiker threw his left over food in the stream next to a shelter just above me while I was getting water!
Sarcasm the elf
05-08-2014, 08:28
I forget what thread it was but someone mentioned, some rude inconsiderate things he saw on the trail.
Bathing at the water source
washing clothes inc. bandanas, at the water source,
any other fouling the water source.
TP blooms anywhere,
being loud after dark.
tents or hammocks in the shelter.
Sex in the shelter
What about smokers ?
What else is there to NOT do on the trail.
What part of the A.T. were you hiking when you experienced all these problems?
bangorme
05-08-2014, 08:28
That's all fine until what others do effects you.
Yeah, this is the point of the OP.
Pedaling Fool
05-08-2014, 08:38
There are a lot of things people should just shut up about on the trail, but the trail is just proof that the majority rules. And the majority wants to change you.
On the trail the majority of people carry packs light packs, so anyone that carries a heavy pack is mocked; so when you see me the "What NOT to do on the trail" is to not ask me how much my pack weighs; nor ask me questions about how I can stand to carry such a heavy pack; nor offer advice of how to reduce my pack weight...
That's all fine until what others do effects you.
And rather than kvetch online, what did you do?
If you are just going to complain online and do nothing, then you have to move on.
If you are more pro-active and instructing the people, then perhaps it may have be more productive.
Kvetch? Is that what I did, just habitually complain online? I thought I just shared a few experiences I recently had.
How do you know I didn't say anything to the people involved?
I don't know. That's what I asked you what you did. ;)
The kvetching comment was aimed more in general as it seems to be a popular past time.
turtle fast
05-08-2014, 11:21
How about pooping next to or as I have seen on the trail and covering it with white toiletpaper. Add dogs doing the same without the tp.
Tipi Walter
05-08-2014, 11:30
That's all fine until what others do effects you.
I did a section in VA earlier this week and saw two thru-hikers washing their feet in a spring next to a campsite I was staying at.
Another hiker threw his left over food in the stream next to a shelter just above me while I was getting water!
While I agree that humans can be thoughtless in the woods, and while I have seen tourist/dayhiker turds with tp laying in the headwaters of a spring; or been bothered by loud alcohol-fueled screams and yells into the night; or have seen big bonfires with high winds---Still there are millions of places you can camp away from the bonobo humans, even on the AT. NEVER STAY AT OR NEAR A SHELTER. This is a no-brainer and yet thousands of newbies keep making the mistake over and over again.
An AT backpacker can get his water at the shelter and then hike 2 miles up the trail to find a campsite never apparently used in the last 70 years. And it's comical to see AT hikers rushing by your campsite near the trail as they jog quickly at dusk to reach the all-important Rat Box. Let it go and avoid the car ports.
Beyond all this, I went on a 19 day November trip and didn't see a soul. Then in January I went on a 24 day trip and saw no one for 23 or the 24 days. You need to get more solitude in different places---I recommend Tennessee as the resident population detests backpacking and/or walking (it's been engineered out of American society---only 13% of Americans "walk") and so you have boundless trails all to yourself.
I was thinking along the lines of what Mags said. Not aiming it at the OP, mind you, just a similar thought.
From personal experience, I generally try to be quite amicable when camping with or near others. I expect that they will sometimes do things that I wouldn't do or that mildly annoy me. On the other hand, I'm certain that, at times, the shoe is on the other foot, and I inadvertently, do things that annoy others.
I'm thinking back to a trip about a year or so ago. Camped at Graymore. A small group of us were up, enjoying a campfire and hadn't even noticed how late or dark it had gotten. Another hiker was bedded down in the pavilion. After a while, he came out, and very briefly joined the conversation, making a few contributions to the subject at hand. He then politely stated, well, it's getting pretty late, you guys mind holding it down a bit, I'd like to get some sleep. Perfect way to handle the situation. We all apologized for keeping him awake, then we all settled in to sleep and everyone was happy. No animosity on anyone's part, just a gentle, friendly reminder of what we all already knew anyway.
We can all be annoying at times, speak up politely and most fellow hikers will go out of their way to get along.
If you look for what is ugly and vile you'll likely find it. It will weigh you down. It is toxic to your psyche.
Stop this thread and hike toward something more pleasant.
Seeing some poop on the trail still beats anything else I do in my mundane office job... :)
Tipi Walter
05-08-2014, 11:57
If you look for what is ugly and vile you'll likely find it. It will weigh you down. It is toxic to your psyche.
Stop this thread and hike toward something more pleasant.
This is a strange post. Sometimes the ugly and vile will come to you, especially in reference to backpacking and camping at shelters (see my examples). Stopping this thread is nonsensical although any individual can stop it by not reading.
turtle fast
05-08-2014, 12:02
Better yet, come down the trail to find the person in the middle of doing it a foot off the trail is fun. Seeing an embarrassed panicked look is always funny,
Tipi Walter
05-08-2014, 12:25
Better yet, come down the trail to find the person in the middle of doing it a foot off the trail is fun. Seeing an embarrassed panicked look is always funny,
True story---I was on the Fodderstack trail at a sweet Nokia spot calling Little Mitten for the pickup evac date and suddenly a boisterous Turtlehead poked out and wanted fresh air in the worst way. Of course I was standing right on the BMT trail so I stashed the cellphone and dug an emergency cathole quickly with a stick and gave birth to an angry Turd about 21 inches long but folded in on itself. Sweet relief.
Thing is, in the urgent squat I left the cellphone on for the next several days (I was out on a 17 day trip) and it was dead the next time I looked. This was a stool-induced EMP---an electromagnetic pulse causing all electronics to fail and caused by a turd. I had the common sense to bury the feisty thing but by then my radio was dead and my camera stopped taking pics. Be careful out there.
Odd Man Out
05-08-2014, 12:27
This went south in a hurry.
As for the original list, avoiding shelters solves most of the problems.
The others have to do with water sources.
I'll agree that soaking your feet immediately upstream of where you are getting your water is a bit tacky. And if the only water source for miles is a small trickle of a spring that make a small puddle, leaving that alone would be good practice. But to extrapolate this to "don't bath or wash clothes at the water source" is a bit of a stretch. I'm OK with "Don't get soap in the water" as a rule. But IF the water source is a fast flowing stream, then yes I'm likely to soak my feet. And if it is a river or lake big enough to swim in, yes I might go for a swim. The easiest solution is just don't call this bathing.
Maybe the only "rule" we really need is the golden rule.
Tipi Walter
05-08-2014, 12:30
This went south in a hurry.
Maybe the only "rule" we really need is the golden rule.
So you're saying it's okay to pee in a creek? ;)
superman
05-08-2014, 12:44
True story---I was on the Fodderstack trail at a sweet Nokia spot calling Little Mitten for the pickup evac date and suddenly a boisterous Turtlehead poked out and wanted fresh air in the worst way. Of course I was standing right on the BMT trail so I stashed the cellphone and dug an emergency cathole quickly with a stick and gave birth to an angry Turd about 21 inches long but folded in on itself. Sweet relief.
Thing is, in the urgent squat I left the cellphone on for the next several days (I was out on a 17 day trip) and it was dead the next time I looked. This was a stool-induced EMP---an electromagnetic pulse causing all electronics to fail and caused by a turd. I had the common sense to bury the feisty thing but by then my radio was dead and my camera stopped taking pics. Be careful out there.
Pictures of the turd or it didn't happen.
Tipi Walter
05-08-2014, 13:01
Pictures of the turd or it didn't happen.
Ha Ha but are you sure you want to see it??
FarmerChef
05-08-2014, 13:37
This went south in a hurry.
As for the original list, avoiding shelters solves most of the problems.
The others have to do with water sources.
I'll agree that soaking your feet immediately upstream of where you are getting your water is a bit tacky. And if the only water source for miles is a small trickle of a spring that make a small puddle, leaving that alone would be good practice. But to extrapolate this to "don't bath or wash clothes at the water source" is a bit of a stretch. I'm OK with "Don't get soap in the water" as a rule. But IF the water source is a fast flowing stream, then yes I'm likely to soak my feet. And if it is a river or lake big enough to swim in, yes I might go for a swim. The easiest solution is just don't call this bathing.
Maybe the only "rule" we really need is the golden rule.
I don't mind at all when folks wash or bathe in the stream or lake. But it does bother me when I find leftovers in the bottom of the little seeping puddle I'm supposed to filter water from or in the concrete box with the pipe coming out of it for me to gather water. I like clean dishes, feet, hands, bodies, whatever as much as the next guy but I always wash mine downstream from the collection point if it's a spring and I'm at the source.
That and the white flowers are really my only two pet peeves I consistently whine about while on the trail. And I'd still rather see both than be in my cubicle all day :)
Odd Man Out
05-08-2014, 13:56
So you're saying it's okay to pee in a creek? ;)
The fish do. :rolleyes:
Pedaling Fool
05-08-2014, 14:44
While I agree that humans can be thoughtless in the woods, and while I have seen tourist/dayhiker turds with tp laying in the headwaters of a spring...
That's not something a tourist/dayhiker or any other person, regardless of how unexperienced they are in the backcountry does. That's an action of a person who is just sick in the head; they do those things very much on purpose, you have to go out of your way to do something like that.
BTW, thanks to Mags for teaching me a new word: Kvetch. I know I'm not the only one who needed to look it up:D
Wise Old Owl
05-08-2014, 15:27
Don't give unwanted advice, starting with phrases like "I know what your doing wrong." or "you know what your problem is."
You-re doing it all wrong!;)
superman
05-08-2014, 15:42
Ha Ha but are you sure you want to see it??
No "look a like" turds will do. Just sayin.
BTW, thanks to Mags for teaching me a new word: Kvetch. I know I'm not the only one who needed to look it up:D
Growing up in the northeast, a smattering of Yiddish and Neapolitan words pepper my vocabulary. :) Sometimes certain non-English words just fit so well!
mrcoffeect
05-08-2014, 16:08
You-re doing it all wrong!;)
you know it felt wrong when i was doing it. But then I said what the heck, I've gone to far to stop now. :cool:
squeezebox
05-08-2014, 16:28
2 important comments !
1 -- remember the golden rule
2 -- I'ld rather step around a turd in the middle of the trail, than deal with all the up front turds I deal with at work, or in town, all the other time.
Starchild
05-08-2014, 17:08
2 important comments !
1 -- remember the golden rule
...
(yes there was a 2nd one)
I do wish and would like to see LNT more like the golden rule, as LNT stands it is more like the 10 commandments, instead of your actions directly effect the experience of others and can we take that into consideriation and possibly strive to make it better we get the LNT 'thou shalt not's' which does not really work for humans and really disconnects the reason for LNT from the rules of LNT.
Rolls Kanardly
05-08-2014, 18:55
"Kvetching" Okay I had to look it up too. Just hope my wife does not look it up. She will have found some new fuel to add to the fire.
Rolls
Ha Ha but are you sure you want to see it??
Hmmmm. This implies that you have pictures.....Scary. :-)
Sarcasm the elf
05-08-2014, 19:03
Growing up in the northeast, a smattering of Yiddish and Neapolitan words pepper my vocabulary. :) Sometimes certain non-English words just fit so well!
As an Irish Italian New Englander who grew up with a lot of Jewish friends, I approve this message! :sun
Tipi Walter
05-08-2014, 19:37
Hmmmm. This implies that you have pictures.....Scary. :-)
I DO have the necessary pics and would post them but I do not feel like getting banned again for a week.
Reminds me of another story: I was camping on Slickrock Creek by Wildcat Falls---remote---and went on turtlehead patrol to give birth etc etc so I hiked BAREFOOT out of camp 50 feet and didn't see a load of human turds on the ground but found out soon enough when the wonderful substance squished thru my toes like Mud Butt so I ran down to the creek and did a foot washing. It was the best of times, worst of times, etc.
Lone Wolf
05-08-2014, 20:38
:cool:
While I agree that humans can be thoughtless in the woods, and while I have seen tourist/dayhiker turds with tp laying in the headwaters of a spring; or been bothered by loud alcohol-fueled screams and yells into the night; or have seen big bonfires with high winds---Still there are millions of places you can camp away from the bonobo humans, even on the AT. NEVER STAY AT OR NEAR A SHELTER. This is a no-brainer and yet thousands of newbies keep making the mistake over and over again.
An AT backpacker can get his water at the shelter and then hike 2 miles up the trail to find a campsite never apparently used in the last 70 years. And it's comical to see AT hikers rushing by your campsite near the trail as they jog quickly at dusk to reach the all-important Rat Box. Let it go and avoid the car ports.
Beyond all this, I went on a 19 day November trip and didn't see a soul. Then in January I went on a 24 day trip and saw no one for 23 or the 24 days. You need to get more solitude in different places---I recommend Tennessee as the resident population detests backpacking and/or walking (it's been engineered out of American society---only 13% of Americans "walk") and so you have boundless trails all to yourself.:cool:
MuddyWaters
05-08-2014, 22:17
While I agree that humans can be thoughtless in the woods, and while I have seen tourist/dayhiker turds with tp laying in the headwaters of a spring; or been bothered by loud alcohol-fueled screams and yells into the night; or have seen big bonfires with high winds---Still there are millions of places you can camp away from the bonobo humans, even on the AT. NEVER STAY AT OR NEAR A SHELTER. This is a no-brainer and yet thousands of newbies keep making the mistake over and over again.
I for one, am quite satisfied that so many hikers stay at shelters primarily, because then I know how to avoid them and have better campsites to choose from.
Im amazed when I see a shelter with no flat ground for tenting, and a dozen or more tents pitched on steeply sloping ground. When a few hundred yards before or after it, there are flat tent spots available. Some really prefer the shelter company I suppose.
What else is there to NOT do on the trail.
Serenade your fellow travelers with accordion music, perhaps?
I wonder where we pooped before we had agreed on pooping methods and places? I guess anywhere and everywhere.
I wonder where we pooped before we had agreed on pooping methods and places? I guess anywhere and everywhere.
Yes. That is why diseases like cholera and typhoid were prevalent.
mrcoffeect
05-10-2014, 08:30
Yes. That is why diseases like cholera and typhoid were prevalent.
Really! On the AT?
Better yet, come down the trail to find the person in the middle of doing it a foot off the trail is fun. Seeing an embarrassed panicked look is always funny,
This would make a good photo op :-)
All this talk of TP blooms, crapping in the trail and taking a dump near the water. How about all at once. this was in Maryland. The white in the center of picture was the site of the dirty deed, right where the train crossed an island between two channels of a stream. This was either done on purpose or was the unluckiest ignorant person on the trail.
A few years ago, hiking up the Ammonoosuc Ravine Trail with a group, after scrambling up a ledge to where the stream pooled at the top, we found that some a-hole had dropped one right in the middle of that pool. Of course, people fill water bottles below. I am generally not a violent man, but if I had found that guy it could have become quite ugly.
Yes. That is why diseases like cholera and typhoid were prevalent.
I wonder if other primates suffer from these issues? It is a shame that we cannot evolve a better immune system.
Really! On the AT? Actually yes. Cholera and Typhoid use to be part of the American experience before things like screens, fly swatters and people not dropping poo just anywhere.
Any population will eventually kill itself off with its own wastes in a closed environment. The Earth is a closed environment. We will poison ourselves out of existence, eventually. People taking a dump in a water source is just hastening that eventuality along. Diseases need to live and multiply, too!
Harrison Bergeron
09-03-2015, 20:20
Back on topic...
-- Eat the vegetation
-- Drink from drain culverts without filtering
-- Pitch your tent in a future mud puddle under the biggest tree you can find.
-- Criticize other people's gear
-- Ask to borrow gear you're not willing to carry yourself
-- Demand shelter space after dark when it's not raining
-- Brag about your 20 mile days and then burn out by Neels Gap.
-- Lighten your load by leaving your 3 pound baggy of cous-cous in a mouse-infested shelter with a sign that says "trail magic".
-- Beg an 18-year-old kid to carry your pack to the next shelter because otherwise you just can't go on.
-- Treat every man you meet as a potential serial rapist
-- Whine continuously
-- Feed the mice and chipmunks
-- Bath in the water source
-- Kill any snakes you find
-- Complain that women in nearby tents shouldn't fart because it grosses you out and is not ladylike
-- Brag about how many weeks it's been since you washed the cotton tee-shirt you bought at Mountain Crossings
-- Discuss politics with someone you just met
-- Hike in sneakers/crocs/sandals/barefoot and then whine about your sore feet
-- Hike until midnight and then pitch your tent in the middle of the trail
-- Use a walmart bag as your trashbag and hang it from a nail in the shelter while complaining about all the mice
-- Piggyback on another guy's tent stake (after he asks you not to) so when it pulls out in the middle of the night you both wake up tangled up in your tents.
... just a few of the mistakes I witnessed (and a few I committed) last spring on the trail.
Another Kevin
09-03-2015, 20:33
Agree with Harrison Bergeron on every item except the first. In some places on the trail, there is vegetation that it's lawful to harvest. There's very little wrong with taking berries in Harriman, for instance, or ramps on most New York state lands. The occasional grape leaf, new stinging nettle shoot, lambs-lettuce, ... also are legal to take for personal consumption in New York.
Other places, other rules.
Agree with Harrison Bergeron on every item except the first. In some places on the trail, there is vegetation that it's lawful to harvest. There's very little wrong with taking berries in Harriman, for instance, or ramps on most New York state lands. The occasional grape leaf, new stinging nettle shoot, lambs-lettuce, ... also are legal to take for personal consumption in New York.
Other places, other rules.
Thr GF and I call blueberries "hiker traps". We stop hiking and start eating. We're trapped!
Casey & Gina
09-04-2015, 15:51
An AT backpacker can get his water at the shelter and then hike 2 miles up the trail to find a campsite never apparently used in the last 70 years. And it's comical to see AT hikers rushing by your campsite near the trail as they jog quickly at dusk to reach the all-important Rat Box. Let it go and avoid the car ports.
I couldn't agree more. I stayed at a shelter once, because we were hiking until well after dark and it was rainy and we just wanted to crash without setting up the tent. It was awful. A group of college students out for a few days of hiking was there when we arrived - they camped outside but their loud conversation continued until late in the night, and the bugs and rodents crawling around the shelter wasn't exactly fun. Then most of them managed to set up their camp badly, and in the morning were up early foul about being soaked by the rain. One of them set up their hammock across the front opening of the shelter. That all said, I didn't complain, because that's what to expect from a shelter. We were exhausted and looking for a crash and chose to live with the consequences. I definitely cannot see myself doing that on any sort of regular basis.
gregpphoto
09-06-2015, 20:16
Funny yet important points in this thread! I recently completed my LNT Master Educator course so this is the stuff that gets me going! I once stepped directly into human poop, barefoot, at the Slant Rock campsite in the Adirondacks. No attempt to bury, and it was night, so I didnt see it! At least it makes for a funny story today.
As for the shelters, its a bummer theyre usually party spots or mice infested. I remember camping as a scout in lean tos, and it was always such an amazing experience. Today, it brings me back and closer to my late father. I think the historical value is pretty neat too, and so when I come across lean tos that are NOT party spots, I cherish them. Usually all that is required is a 5+ mile walk from the road. No one is hauling that much beer that far.
I stepped into someone's poop in Tellico Gap and it freaking ruined my attitude for the whole day. Between that and the roller coaster descent off Wesser Bald, I was a basket case at the end of the day. Folks, please don't "hide" your poop, bury it.
my observation: those who bitch about shelters are on WB
those who are actually on the trail use shelters
my observation: those who bitch about shelters are on WB
those who are actually on the trail use shelters
My observation as well. On the other hand, how would we know (about the folks not using shelters?)
BirdBrain
09-06-2015, 22:55
my observation: those who bitch about shelters are on WB
those who are actually on the trail use shelters
Nah. I "bitch" about shelters. You don't see people like me not using shelters, because I am often stealthing too far from your shelter for you to see me. As to bitching about things to do with shelters, I am curious about this post.
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/113498-Newbie-needs-etiquette-culture-advise?p=2001206&viewfull=1#post2001206
Come camp where I camp. You won't see all that "crap strewn around". That is mainly a shelter thing.
Another Kevin
09-06-2015, 23:15
my observation: those who bitch about shelters are on WB
those who are actually on the trail use shelters
Oh, I use them, just not as often as some. I'm always prepared to tent, and do so more often than not. My tent performs better with cold, wind, bugs, and sketchy shelter-mates.
Just for giggles, I checked my journals for the last 16 nights during trips: 10 tent, 5 shelter, 1 motel. One of the shelter nights was just after spraining my knee, when I really, really didn't want to crawl into my tent. A couple of the tent nights were near shelters. On one of the tent nights, the nearby shelter was even unoccupied. Only one of the shelters I used was within five miles of a highway, and that was in winter. I'd probably have tented if I weren't both really tired and interested in the conversation at the shelter. The combination didn't work that well. I zzz'ed out while the conversation was still going on. I might as well have tented.
I agree with Turtle Fast & Namtrag, bury it deep.
evan_rolltide
09-07-2015, 11:35
Educate people when you can, clean up when you can, enjoy everything. What else is there to do.