PDA

View Full Version : First time hiker with kids. Route advice please



Surfbumdj
05-14-2014, 10:31
I have found three options, but I am open to suggestions

Newfound to Davenport

Standing Bear Hostel to Hot Springs

Clingman's Dome to Fontana Rd

Thoughts?

Surfbumdj
05-14-2014, 10:33
By the way my kids are 10,11 and 15, it will be our first hike

Malto
05-14-2014, 10:51
Not Clingmans dome to Fontana, that is one of the tougher sections on the southern AT. standing bear to Hot springs would be my pick as a first time over the other two.

FarmerChef
05-14-2014, 11:01
How many days to you plan to hike? That will make something of a difference as it impacts your average mile per day. Also, what is your/the kids general fitness level and do you have an idea of how heavy your packs will be?

Here's my armchair hiker suggestion. Standing Bear to Hot Springs is fairly easy with a great view over Max Patch. The terrain isn't terribly difficult though you will have some climbs, especially coming out of Standing Bear.

Clingman's to Fontana is not that bad plus you have the benefit of descending to Fontana having started at the highest point in the park. Reservations can be tricky to come by and it will definitely be impacted by your daily mileage.

I'm not sure about Newfound to Davenport. Someone else with more experience in that section will probably chime in.

saltysack
05-14-2014, 11:21
Standing indian loop would be a great hike


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Surfbumdj
05-14-2014, 11:21
I am of average fitness. Not fit but not sedentary. The last day hike I did was Kalalau to the first falls. Now THAT was a climb. 5500 feet up in the first mile (from sea level)

my 15 year old runs 3 miles a day

my 10 and 11 year old are fit. The 10 year old is stronger.

I will carry about 40 lbs, my 15 year old about 25 and my younger ones will carry about 10 lbs each

cling mans to Fontana I chose because of its descent... But someone mentioned it was a tough hike? Why is that? Having zero experience on the trail I really appreciate all of your responses, thank you

Surfbumdj
05-14-2014, 11:22
Hoping to complete in 3 days, 4 max

bigcranky
05-14-2014, 12:55
The Standing Indian loop is a great three day hike. Park at the Standing Indian Campground lot at the trailhead sign, then hike a loop consisting of the Kimsey Creek Trail, Appalachian Trail, and Long Branch Trail back to the car. It's about 25 miles with some good climbs, decent places to camp, and good views.

The Smokies are tough due to the logistics of making shelter reservations 30 days in advance. Plus, the shuttles tend to be kind of expensive as they are MUCH longer than the hike itself.

As a second choice I would do Standing Bear to Hot Springs. Great section, great views, some long climbs especially the first one. Fairly easy shuttle, and good food waiting in HS for you when you finish.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

HooKooDooKu
05-14-2014, 12:56
cling mans to Fontana I chose because of its descent... But someone mentioned it was a tough hike? Why is that? Having zero experience on the trail I really appreciate all of your responses, thank you
There are several mountains to climb... some of then VERY STEEP!!!
1. While generally downhill, the hike between Silers Bald and Derrick Knob is full of ups-n-downs.
2. The climbs from Derrick Knob up and over Rocky Top is a killer.
While there is only a net 1,000' elevation change from the lowest point past Derrick to the highest point at RockyTop, there are major ups-n-downs along the way that make for a total climb closer to 2,000'... one of those being some of the steepest terrain in GSMNP.
3. After RockyTop, there are still two more major climbs that are a net 750' in elevation gain before the final drop to Fontana.
4. The 2,000' elevation drop for Shuckstack tower to Fontana is steep and relentless. This is one of those places where going down hill is as difficult as going up hill.

To date, my most difficult hiking day was the day I hiked from Silers Bald to Spence Field.

Since this is your FIRST hike with kids, have you considered something of a loop hike in GSMNP?
There are tons of 2 night loop hikes when you're willing to put in 8 to 11 mile days. Doing a loop would allow you to bail and back-track after one day, and you wouldn't have to worry about shuttling between Clingmans and Fontana.

FarmerChef
05-14-2014, 12:58
I can't say that I've hiked the section from Fontana up to Clingman's but looking at the profile map it looks "chunky." There are a lot of puds in that section and that can get tiring really quick. Now, since you're looking to do it in 3 days or 4 max I'd say you have plenty of time to slow down and smell the roses and, if you're up for it, then absolutely go for it! The hike up from Standing Bear to Hot Springs by contrast is much easier. Yeah, there's a few big climbs in there but less up, down, up, down, up, down and probably a bit less steep (armchair guess based on the elevation profile).

Based on your days on trail it sounds like you'd be averaging around 10mpd which is quite comfortable. That said, a lot of first time AT hikers start out with sub 10s while they get their trail legs (which can take a couple of weeks). My recommendation if time allows would be to gear up with your kids and go on a long day hike in similar terrain (if possible). See how you feel after 10 miles. Try it again with 15 miles and see how that goes. If it feels great you're good to go. If not, you can make some adjustments before your on day 2 of a 4 day trip and suddenly realize that you can't make it to your destination in time. Sounds like you guys have good general fitness and a reasonable idea of daily mileage/distance. Have fun spending time together as a family!

irishlover
05-14-2014, 13:07
Since your near the NC area, venture to the state line of NC/VA, hike grayson highlands. There is a 19 mile section with little inclines and declines from White Top to Elk Garden. There are wild ponies in the area that are very friendly. The area is always hiked by visitors, you would see easily 17 campsites a night from May to Sept. There is ample water supply to hydrate/eat. My daughter and I hike this yearly with a few other younger hikers (3rd -6th grade). Its a great area to visit. The nights this time of year tend to be cool at 55, days can get to 85. Enjoy your hike.

HooKooDooKu
05-14-2014, 13:19
I will carry about 40 lbs, my 15 year old about 25 and my younger ones will carry about 10 lbs each
Does your 15yo weight about 125lbs?

The general rule (especially for just starting out) is to try to limit your pack weight to 20% of your body weight.

If your younger boys are anything like mine, they should be around 75lbs and be able to carry just a touch more weight than you're listing... (unless you're not including food and water in those measurements).

Malto
05-14-2014, 14:33
How many days to you plan to hike? That will make something of a difference as it impacts your average mile per day. Also, what is your/the kids general fitness level and do you have an idea of how heavy your packs will be?

Here's my armchair hiker suggestion. Standing Bear to Hot Springs is fairly easy with a great view over Max Patch. The terrain isn't terribly difficult though you will have some climbs, especially coming out of Standing Bear.

Clingman's to Fontana is not that bad plus you have the benefit of descending to Fontana having started at the highest point in the park. Reservations can be tricky to come by and it will definitely be impacted by your daily mileage.

I'm not sure about Newfound to Davenport. Someone else with more experience in that section will probably chime in.

The section between siler and Derrick is THAT bad for three kids on their first hike with a heavy pack.

HooKooDooKu
05-14-2014, 17:03
The section between siler and Derrick is THAT bad for three kids on their first hike with a heavy pack.
I just did a quick path following the trails from Clingman's Dome Parking Lot to Derrick Knob Shelter. The distance is a little over 10 miles with a cumulative elevation gain/loss of 2,600'/4,000'.
27035

flemdawg1
05-14-2014, 17:20
The Standing Indian loop is a great three day hike. Park at the Standing Indian Campground lot at the trailhead sign, then hike a loop consisting of the Kimsey Creek Trail, Appalachian Trail, and Long Branch Trail back to the car. It's about 25 miles with some good climbs, decent places to camp, and good views.

The Smokies are tough due to the logistics of making shelter reservations 30 days in advance. Plus, the shuttles tend to be kind of expensive as they are MUCH longer than the hike itself.

As a second choice I would do Standing Bear to Hot Springs. Great section, great views, some long climbs especially the first one. Fairly easy shuttle, and good food waiting in HS for you when you finish.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Another vote the the Standing Indian Loop. I took my 3 kids on it, all girls, ages 11, 7 and 5. (To be fair these girls all dance 4 days a week, so they're not out of breath unlike their parents on long climbs) We did it in 4 days.

flemdawg1
05-14-2014, 17:47
Other advantages of Standing Idian Loop:
No permits or reservations needed
Don't have to stay in Shelters unless you want to.
No shuttles needed, begin and end at car.
Bail out trails also lead back to car.

MuddyWaters
05-14-2014, 20:17
Kids and wild ponies.
Grayson Highlands to Damascus would be easy 35 miles

Yeah, the steep rocky up and downs between Derricks and Silers take their toll, in BOTH directions.

Any hike that incorporates Carvers Gap to 19E in June would be awesome too. Kids love the Overmountain shelter. Heck, everyone does.

Malto
05-14-2014, 20:34
I just did a quick path following the trails from Clingman's Dome Parking Lot to Derrick Knob Shelter. The distance is a little over 10 miles with a cumulative elevation gain/loss of 2,600'/4,000'.
27035

Actually, my bad, it was the section between spence field and Derrick knob a distance of 6.3 miles and both a gain and loss of 2500'. I got my s's messed up. The average gain and loss is 394 feet/mile for a total of almost 800' per mile.

MuddyWaters
05-14-2014, 20:42
Yeah, now that I think about it, its between Thunderhead and Derricks Knob that has the steep rocky upndowns. There are several up and down hills between Derricks and Silers.

HooKooDooKu
05-14-2014, 21:03
Here's Derrick's Knob to Spence Field shelter. In a little more than 6 miles, there is almost no net elevation change, but the cumulative gain/loss is about 2,500'.
27037
When I hiked this, it was from Silers to Spence in one day, and by the time I got to Thunderhead, I was so worn out, all I could think about was getting down to Spence and so I didn't really get a chance to enjoy the views.

Surfbumdj
05-15-2014, 08:18
Thank you so much for all of your input! This is great.

Just to to clear a few things up: I'm actually from Florida, someone was going on the assumption that I was from NC because of the places I was picking. I don't mind driving farther though, but the hours in the car with the kids if I could keep that to 8 or less would be preferable.

My 2 younger kids are girls, the 10 year old a strong 80 lbs and the 11 year old 70 lbs. she is strong, but has a thin frame. My son is 140.

I picked the smokies because I thought the views and the sense of accomplishment paired with some great connecting family time would be a fantastic experience. Of course I know next to nothing having never set foot on the trail. My son hiked with me to hanakapai'i and did well though. But we were carrying next to nothing.

I am teetering between doing the Standing Indian Loop and picking another loop, or hiking the highlands to see the ponies. I will take the advice that the smokies are a tough hike, maybe better suited for another year when we all know what we are getting into better

bigcranky
05-15-2014, 09:35
Good additional info.

Everybody has heard of the Smokies -- it's the most visited national park, so it has a very high profile. Mention the Southern Appalachians or the Appalachian Trail, and everybody immediately thinks of the Smokies. So that's just natural. And the park is beautiful. But an AT hike in the park is something of a logistical challenge for all sorts of reasons.

The Grayson Highlands area in Virginia is also quite beautiful. And it has ponies :) which are always a draw for kids. The open highlands area isn't all that large, though -- it's easy to make a one or two night low-mileage loop, but a 25 or 30 mile loop would be more difficult. Possible, of course, but much of the time would be spent in the surrounding areas. I'd be happy to recommend some hikes up there if you want more info. Just PM me.

vzett
05-19-2014, 12:50
Another vote for the Standing Indian Loop. I did this South-Bound via the Long Branch Trail with my 10yr old last fall over 3 nights. See http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?98451-Trip-Report-Standing-Indian-Loop-Sep-13th-16th&p=1528381&highlight=#post1528381 for our trip report and http://www.flickr.com/photos/96343778@N07/sets/72157635618162545/ for photos to get an idea. Lots of camp sight and shelter choices so making a set mileage every day really isn't critical.

The ability to fully loop back to the car was really helpful. We're thinking about doing the same hike again in a couple weeks Northbound or perhaps hike Springer to Neels Gap in GA for something different.

Theosus
05-19-2014, 20:56
Does it have to be the AT? There are sections in SC along the Foothills/Chattooga river trails that make good loops. You get some varying terrain, lots of water, some good campsites, great waterfalls... and no need to find a shuttle.

HooKooDooKu
05-19-2014, 21:14
...I picked the smokies because I thought the views and the sense of accomplishment paired with some great connecting family time would be a fantastic experience...
...I will take the advice that the smokies are a tough hike, maybe better suited for another year when we all know what we are getting into better
It's not "the smokies" that is tough... it is the hike from Clingman's Dome to Fontana in three days that is tough.

There are over 800 miles of trail in GSMNP, with less than 10% of that being the AT. So if your goals are "views and the sense of accomplishment" and don't need to include "on the AT", there are many great hikes a 1st time 10 and 11 yo can do in the Smokies. I've been taking my boys there since they were 7yo.

One example of a great hike my oldest did when he was 8yo (maybe 9) was to start at Twenty Mile Ranger Station, Hike Twenty Mile Trail to the AT, take a side trip to the 60' Shuckstack Fire Tower, then head back up the AT to campsite 113. The 2nd day, climb the AT to Doe Knob, hang a left onto Gregory Bald Trail, hike over Gregory Bald (360 degree view) and on to campsite 13. The 3rd day, return to your car via Wolf Ridge. That hike will get you great views (weather permitting), a sense of accomplishment (a climb up the side of the mountains to reach the AT-crest) without the trip being too difficult for a tween.

MuddyWaters
05-19-2014, 22:19
Here's Derrick's Knob to Spence Field shelter. In a little more than 6 miles, there is almost no net elevation change, but the cumulative gain/loss is about 2,500'.
27037
When I hiked this, it was from Silers to Spence in one day, and by the time I got to Thunderhead, I was so worn out, all I could think about was getting down to Spence and so I didn't really get a chance to enjoy the views.

We went Mollies to Silers. 17.6 miles if I recall, and I was pretty worn out. I remember sitting down on the side of the trail climbing up to Silers, and resting for 10 min. I was only maybe 100ft from the shelter. I looked back down the hill and my hiking partner was down there, doing the same thing.

To the OP, the smokies doesnt have all that many views btw. Mostly a walk in the woods.

HooKooDooKu
05-20-2014, 00:40
the smokies doesnt have all that many views btw. Mostly a walk in the woods.
True statement. You might be doing a lot of ridge walking, but most of it will be surrounded by trees and bushes. Between Clingman's Dome and Fontana, there were only a hand-full of spots with a good view:
Clingman's Dome (duh)
About a mile Out from Clingman's
Siler Bald (I think)
Thunderhead Mountain
Shuckstack Fire Tower

A perfect example (and you can somewhat see this if you check out the ground cover in google earth):
The apex of Thunderhead is covered in dense brush. The only place to stand to get any sort of a view is on top of a rock at the end of a 10' long side trail. However, a short distance to the south along the AT from the top of Thunderhead does have a couple of clearings along the way with some fantastic views.